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There's no universal answer to this and I know every individual and every crisis is different, but are there ways to detect whether your WS might want the M back eventually?

On D-Day, my wife blurted out that her A went on for a year and 1/2. I know it was true because of a text I spied on from her close confidant which said "ya'll had sex for two years"

Now the other day, I was trying to get answers from her and now she's changing her story. She made it sound like the A only went on for a couple weeks or so; (like it was more of a fling than a long term A).

Could she be lying just to make it look less bad and to make herself look less contemptable? Or, could it be she wants me to believe in a short A because she might want me back eventually and she knows that the shorter the A, the more likely I'd want to be intimate again?

(I know....this might just be my desperation doing the thinking.)

hmmmm...

(I know....this might just be my desperation doing the thinking.)

Unfortunately, I think you've nailed it.
A truly remorseful, R-ready WS does not lie to increase their chances with you. They get that lying is dynamite and they avoid it like the plague.

Two things:
Either she is doing as you said, and by doing so, demonstrating that she is not R material AT ALL, or she is protecting her butt by minimizing.

I'm gonna vote for #2 - 99%, hands down. It's standard WS behavior.

(example - my WH's 15 month+ A was described by him as a "one to four night stand". And I'm not alone. Out of the 37000 of us here you'll get 36500 other examples)

Sorry you are here! Take care of you - she's no where near "there".

2x4

Don't look for clues. There are no fucking clues. She either waants to R or she doesn't. If she does you will know. Listen to your gut, it's right and you know it, if you really listen.

I don't want to seem harsh, I'm just trying to save you a lot pain.

You're right. My gut has never been wrong up til now I guess.

But then, do you all demand disclosure from your WS when they've not even decided they're ready for R?

I've begun asking her questions because I deserve the answers but I'm starting to wonder whether I should wait until she's out of the fog

You can demand , beg, plead, sweet talk her to disclose info. All you are going to get is lies at this point. She is protecting her ass right now.
However, if she talks enough you will start to pick up bits and pieces. Give them enough rope they will hang thrmselves.

(I know....this might just be my desperation doing the thinking.)

Sadly, I think this is the case.

If she wants to R, you will have no question. You will not have to look for clues, because she will make it clear to you.

She should be offering full disclosure. The willingness to do this ( and anything else you might need) is an indication of remorse.

That beng said, even if she doesn't "want" to, she owes you truth. That doesn't mean you'll get it, but go ahead and ask. ( after three months my WS still hadn't told me anything beyond "yes I was intimate with MOW". Claimed he wanted to R, so I told him 100% honesty was a basic requirement for it even to be on the table. He cautiously agreed to questions. He scored 25% truth, 25% lies, and the other 50% was I don't remembers and I don't have any ideas. FAIL. No R for you.

I looked for such clues from my WH for months, and it nearly killed me. Please believe what others say. If she wants to retrieve something from your marriage, she'll say exactly that, and fall over herself trying to prove that she can be worthy of you. If she doesn't, she doesn't.

and there's no point at all in thinking you can demand anything from her... in her head, she's gone. Just protect yourself and remember you're not to blame. Wishing you strength. There is a point where all this gets better.

I haven't posted on SI for quite a while. Maybe I've been supressing this part of my life to just get a break from it, IDK. We've been separated for almost five months now and I've just really been feeling that it's time to end it all. I gave her a copy of the divorce complaint in Jan without actually filing yet. She hinted like she still wanted to try the separation for a while and finally try counciling, etc.

I was about to give my lawyer the green light last weekend when she started mentioning to me about how she's applying for other jobs. Now I'm all confused again because I feel like I'll be a POS for filing for D when she actually might be trying! Aaarrrgh!
I let the smallest things hinder me from the big picture. Is she looking for a new job because she actually wants to stay in the M? IDK. She could be looking for a new job JUST to move on to something different. However, she made it a point to make sure I knew about it. Was that to send the message that she wants to R eventually (or at least buy some more time so I don't file)? Probably. But would she even be doing that for the right reasons? I mean she has made it clear that she wasn't in love w/ me anymore.

Even if she wants to R, she would need to do WAYYY more than just get away from working with that little boy of her's. She still won't go to counciling or even have lunch with oir pastor's wife who wants to help. She says it's all too embarassing for her to discuss. That just tells me that her ego is more valuable to her than her marriage. Apart from verbally accepting blame for her A and (reluctantly) submitting to a few of my Q/A sessions, she hasn't done anything to try to heal things with me.
I'm pretty sure I need to just file but that little voice tells me "no, deep down she wants you back and she's trying to show it with her job apps". Another part of me says that if I file against her, it will kill any little bit of her heart that may have softened.

Gosh that sounds really tough.
If I was in your situation I would feel that jolt of hope too.

But I'm not so I can be objective

You know the answer deep down. You want to save your marriage. But there doesn't seem to be one left.

Go ahead with the divorce, move on with your life. You are worth so much more than she is treating you. Look at the drama she's caused you just by saying she's LOOKING for a new job.

You are better than what she is treating you.

[This message edited by lauren123 at 10:18 PM, April 12th (Friday)]

do you all demand disclosure from your WS when they've not even decided they're ready for R?

No. You demand nothing. You 180 her.

popitdaddy,

I believe solus sto said all you need to know right now...

If she wants to R, you will have no question. You will not have to look for clues, because she will make it clear to you.

So don't ask, beg, plead or demand anything. Most of all... detach and as gonna said above run the 180.

Last but not least, please stop mourning your old marriage. That ship sailed bro the day she decided to cheat on you and subsequently kill it. There is no old M. It's dead and gone, never to return again. Cheating is like "Raid" for marriages. It "Kills M's Dead!" And you can't go back and unf*ck the donkey bro. You can only move on and create something new. AND... ONLY if she does the heavy lifting required. The more you begin to believe that, the sooner you'll detach from your old M and begin the process of healing.

ETA: Sorry for all the cliches. Must be the Valium kicking in again.

Actions, not words.

A WS show they want R through their actions.

R is a gift you can choose to give her and she can choose to give you.

I'd say most of us went down the demand path - its no way to live. A gift is not a gift if it has to be demanded/asked for. 180. If her head is somehow removed out of her arse you might be generous enough to tell her what you do/don't want in your life going forward.

do you all demand disclosure from your WS when they've not even decided they're ready for R?

Ready for R? She doesn't want R friend. If she did you'd know it, you'd feel it but most of all you'd see it.

I know you don't want to see what you're seeing but you really do need to see it.

Let.Her.Go.

Work out what the hell is going on in your head that YOU are doing this to yourself.

You can love her all you like there's nothing you can do to change her. Right now she gets the best of both worlds (in her mind) - OM and you waiting in the wings. Why on earth would she change anything?

Find your anger friend and channel it into evicting her from your life. As I said, if she happens to remove her head from her arse you'll know it. The 'fog' isn't a passive thing IMO - she is choosing to be in it.

OM doesn't have magical powers nor is he controlling her mind. If it wasn't him it would be someone else. It will be someone else soon enough.

Please please please - love yourself more than this. She is still lying to you. Don't accept these rancid breadcrumbs.

Brother, just stop. You are volunteering to be her plan B. Stop guessing what she wants, or is hinting at. As said previously, actions, not words. Best case, the road to hell is paved with what again?

Strength

He scored 25% truth, 25% lies, and the other 50% was I don't remembers and I don't have any ideas. FAIL. No R for you.

I just died a little.

My FWW not only denied everything (100%) but she even said PI evidences were fake and doctored (not even false) and email evidences were created by someone.

Epic fail on R. Back to kindergarten even.

Lots of good advice given you here. Your WW sounds a lot like mine. She lied so many times about the length of time to minimize how much of a shitbag she looks like. She would give semi-hint-ish bullshit possibly pointing to reconciliation. Problem with that was she was still giving sex to the affair guy at the same time she was hinting of reconciling. She just thought I didn't know about it.

Honestly, it seems like she may still be in the affair and has gone deep underground or is laying-low for now but is still in communication with the affair guy.

I strongly advise this:

Let your anger come forth. Use it. Use it in a controlled manner but be fucking angry - you should be. Become steely-cold and deliberate with her and FILE FOR and AGGRESSIVELY PURSUE divorce.

Why? Because it sends her the message that you are done fucking around and done with her fucking around on you and with you. It sends the her the message that you are flat-out rejecting any blame for HER decision to fuck-around. It sends her the message that her value to you has plummeted - she really won't like that. And, most importantly, it sends her the message that you value yourself far more than this Jerry Springer bullshit she has brought into the lives of your family and children. THAT will really shake her.

It wasn't until I filed for divorce and had her served with the papers that my STBXWW gave me the tearful call asking if we could reconcile. I declined. She then broke it off with the affair guy. I'm still divorcing her.

Some things I simply cannot accept in my world and I won't compromise my values with.

It wasn't until I filed for divorce and had her served with the papers that my STBXWW gave me the tearful call asking if we could reconcile. I declined.

Funny how that works eh? The only difference in my case is she didn't really break it off with OM. She was still with him as a guardian. A guardian who broke her family in the first place.

Great post from Keptmyword. Just read it over and over again and understand that being tough and not sacrificing your principles is the way to go.

You not only allowed your wife to walk all over you, you created a four-lane highway to make it easy.
She has no respect for you whether she comes back or not. Divorce is the sensible option.