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Newest Member: Phoenix2rise (45723)

User Topic: Faithful?????
uncertainone
♀ 28108
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 10:14 AM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Meaning of words are important. I know "mistake" gets a drubbing here. For some reason it's taken as something small and inconsequential like forgetting milk. No, that would be forgetful, but ok. So everyone debates and vets the word using almost the exact same definers to impeach it that represent it. Letting that go.
How about faithful. How do you define that? I remember when I was just lurking here reading a post in general where sex was basically "ewwwwww" and why is was so important to some. Well, instantly two questions presented. "Why did them outsourcing bother you so much" and "how can you feel so self righteous about your "fidelity" if you don't partake of what you don't like anyway?"

Steadfast in affection or allegiance. Is that something that maybe a few may be in violation of that have never touched another or even thought about another?

Is being disrespectful as you run them down to others not a breach of that before anyone else is even a thought during your "private moments"?

If an ea can be something that can occur whenever any form of communication with a member of the opposite sex is not ok wouldn't airing at your spouses private failings as well as denigration of the gender they represent be considered unfaithful?

Wonder how many waywards started just that way. Wonder how many more are in every meaning of the word but just don't like the actively that brings members to this site, typically.

I don't want to cliff dive. Would hardly claim to be and advocate of OSHA as I'm dangling from Half Dome.

Wondering how many started down this path with "acceptable disrespect" before hitting the hard "drugs".


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
Unagie
♀ 37091
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 12:30 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UO I truly love your posts, I never feel quite as intelligent when I read them lol.

To respond to your actual post though I agree with a lot of it. I read a lot in General and tend to stay off the threads that insult waywards continuously. The line "guess that's just how cheaters think," or "the shit these waywards say is unbelievable" and many other broad painting lines bother me to a degree where I want to shout not all of them are like that but also generalizations are dangerous folks. They make you believe you are better then those you are making the generalization about and the higher you place yourself the further you habe to fall imo. Now I'm not saying people will cheat but I feel the practice of saying horrible things about waywards and then in that same line saying you are better then them is you being unfaithful to who you are. Insulting a group of people because of their actions and saying you are better then them makes you look worse in my eyes and always has. I've always felt you are who you are and carry your head high no matter who you are but the moment you need to put someone else down on to feel good then you're not being faithful to you.

Some might disagree here and some might get angry. I have wanted to state this many times and don't because I don't wish to offend. I have been in general and JFO and the pain in some of those posts are so raw and I 100% feel they should feel their pain and work through it but others just seem to turn into a wayward bashing thread where everyone gets a turn to take a swing. Those are the ones I close and move on from although lately its been annoying me more and more. I don't get the I'm better then you concept and how it brings anything to anyone let alone how it brings anything to a relationship. Perhaps I overstepped my bounds here and I feel I didn't articulate as well I wanted to. I do not wish to offend anyone and UO sorry if this seemed like a t/j but your post reminded me of these things.


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"There are times when our reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind." Patrick Rothfuss


Posts: 2798 | Registered: Oct 2012
tired girl
♀ 28053
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 12:54 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As you have stated many times, wayward and unfaithful mentalities can happen without the actual "stepping out." It is just not widely recognized or acknowledged.


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5155 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
Fidelia
♀ 38345
Member # 38345
Default  Posted: 1:08 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No stop sign so....

UO I agree that denigrating your spouse to others can be part of that slippery slope, better to air it with your spouse than others. Although sometimes we need to let off steam and have someone help get it all back in perspective BEFORE we have that talk. But it needs to be a same sex friend of the M, I feel.

"Why did them outsourcing bother you so much" and "how can you feel so self righteous about your "fidelity" if you don't partake of what you don't like anyway?"

Ok, I'm going to give an honest personal perspective on this. Firstly, for many women, they only feel able to have sex in a long-term relationship when they feel emotionally safe. My WH had been withdrawing from me for years, I just couldn't put my finger on what was wrong. He was also pretty awful in bed (that has changed ) but too repressed to cope with talking about it (I did try). So it didn't meet my needs and I didn't feel close emotionally. So I didnt really feel like doing it much and mainly did it because I love WH and wanted to meet his needs.
Then we decided to have children. The fact that he felt ready made me feel closer emotionally and so I wanted to have sex with him. Then I got pregnant and a few weeks later had a series of bleeds. I was advised not to have sex during pregnancy. Then I was ripped apart and badly damaged by the doctor in childbirth (leaving permanent damage). I was scared of having sex. I didn't know how to admit that to WH because I was finding it hard to admit to myself. He was finding being a dad difficult and he started withdrawing again and we were both so tired...so by the time our eldest was 9 months, W was having an email fling with a friend of mine (not that I knew). He became more distant, I felt less safe, still very tired and flung myself into being a mum.

He changed jobs to somewhere nearer where we could start to connect again (at my nagging) and eventually felt safe enough to try having sex. Oh I was so terrified that it would be awful for him, that the damage would mean that I was baggy and rubbish. That was my fear you see, that he'd reject my body. Thankfully it seemed ok. And after a while we decided to try for our other child. But I got a bleed again and again had to abstain while pregnant.

This time I had a caesarean - and it took 5 months to heal up. During that healing time, WH had moved back into the city and old job. He met OW2 and they immediately started flirting and I had no idea. I wasn't even capable of sex at that point. And of course, he distanced himself from me again, even further than before. I felt unsafe. I was tired. I hated the way I looked after the caesarean. But laos, I'd been told by the doctor not to have any more operations, so no more children. But I get pregnant very easily and I couldn't face an abortion. So we talked about WH getting a vasectomy and us abstaining until then.

He put it off for almost 2 years. And during this time he got closer to OW2. By the time he had it and we started having sex again, he'd already kissed her.

Ironically, it was at this point that he worked on his technique and got so much better and also that my libido went through the roof because of hormonal changes and....because I was suspicious that something was going on and wanted to make sure he knew he didn't have to go anywhere else. But it was too late.

So please tell me, where do I fit into your questions? Sex is about both people and it's usually more complicated than it first appears.


Me: BW 36
Him: WH 36 (randomusername)

"lift your drooping hands and strengthen your weak knees, and make straight paths for your feet, so that what is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather be healed" Heb12v13

"Oh God give me


Posts: 296 | Registered: Feb 2013
Fidelia
♀ 38345
Member # 38345
Default  Posted: 1:13 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sorry, reading that I sound angry at the end. I wasn't meaning to. I just was trying to say that sometimes we use shorthand on threads and don't go into the detail of our complicated lives, but often things aren't as simple as they first appear.


Me: BW 36
Him: WH 36 (randomusername)

"lift your drooping hands and strengthen your weak knees, and make straight paths for your feet, so that what is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather be healed" Heb12v13

"Oh God give me


Posts: 296 | Registered: Feb 2013
aesir
♂ 17210
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 2:38 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fidelia, you are relatively new here, so I guess we should tell you, UO has a habit of hiding these little treasures in Wayward when they are really life lessons for all that could easily go in General, or possibly in New Beginnings for those with a chance to start over.

Also a shame that such a philosophical post as this gets made at the same time as a real life example of just one form gets posted in the same forum.

As for the endless argument about mistake, all I can say is that despite all the careful and deliberate planning, and the horrific consequences, most historians will call Napoleon's invasion of Russia a mistake. Comparing the two, my STBXWW's A doesn't seem like such a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

Not even going to touch on the sex part. The rest is very fascinating. If you bash your spouse to a friend of the opposite sex that is an EA, but to constantly bash your spouse to a friend of the same sex is okay? I can remember one time complaining of this behavior, and it being blown off with the excuse that "that's what women do, we bitch", I answered with "No, that's not what women do. That's what bitches do, they bitch." Do I really care who my spouse is telling that I am a fucktard and a son of a bitch and an asshole and... or is it more important that she is saying that at all.

Wondering how many started down this path with "acceptable disrespect" before hitting the hard "drugs".
I don't know if this is a gateway drug type of thing or not, but even so, if your children are hungry, does it matter if you are passed out on the couch from heroin, or from smoking a couple bowls too many of "just pot".

Sadly, there are a lot of people who are married to a spouse they show no signs of respecting, and there is a whole industry built around catering to one genders fantasies by denigrating the other gender and vice versa.


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
uncertainone
♀ 28108
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 5:13 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So please tell me, where do I fit into your questions

You may not. Not everyone does. I think enough do to, at some point at least, do some internal inventory.

I have seen more than just one or two post, yes I was an addict or alcoholic but I didn't cheat. This is met with much agreement. Really? You didn't? Why? Because you didn't actually touch or hide another just a drug?

The way I've overheard some people describe their spouses, the contempt and disrespect that just drips. Talk about defiling a martial bed. Hell, I feel I should call them and tell them to get a food taster. Talk about sleeping with the enemy.

Should we inform the "BS" their ws thinks they're worthless pieces of shit that can't walk and breath at the
same time?

That is a far cry from "faithful".

I'm obviously not talking about BS's after d day or for quite some time after. At some point, though there needs to be reflection for growth.

The "any complaints the wayward has is bullshit" is in itself bullshit for quite a few.

I've posted this before and been told by some that while they agree this is a site to recover from infidelity not shitty marriages.

Well, my possition is "this" is infidelity as well. Not fucking someone else is not, in and of itself faithful, not even if you masticate that definition as well.

Like Aesir pointed out (thank you
) there was an example just posted of this very thing. The lying and disrespect of spending putting their family in jeopardy and being very disrespectful of their spouse.

Unilateral decisions aren't a way to support and contribute to marriage. While frustrations with your spouse are bound to happen in any relationship those belong safely within the confines of the relationship not spread through your work department along with their dirty laundry inviting all to laugh and add to the derision.

Taking care of each other doesn't mean a shovel, chloroform, a hole in the back yard, even metaphorically.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
ophelia24
♀ 38438
Member # 38438
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is great UO. I have been talking recently to my BF about the denigrating, sarcastic, sniping comments that my sister is making about her SO. He may have his faults (as we all do)but there is something really ugly about it. I refuse to participate in it, and am resented due to this.

'Faithfulness' as you so eloquently point out, is not just about physical fidelity (you gave me a 2x4 about this and I was happy to receive it) and I also think does not just involve bagging the SO, but also 'selling them out'. An example I will use just happened between me and my BH this Saturday.

I was sitting with my father and my BH watching our son play cricket, and Dad and I got into a discussion about our oldest son (19) who dad has taken in once again, despite my H and I being willing to have him with us, but only if he abides by the rules we have in our house. Our son does not want to agree so goes to my dad, and dad takes him in. This is has occured numerous times over the last 4 years (the last time after our son stole our CC and took 2500 dollars out of it). Basically Dad is saying to our son he agrees with HIM and treating us disrespectfully is actually OK with him.

Anyway, long story shortish, dad and I were having a heated discussion as I told him how this was not good for our son and also that it was hurtful to us. My dad is stubborn so we went back and forth for a bit. My H said nothing, which I was glad of as it would have been like we were ganging up on my dad if he had chimed in. BUT! What really hurt me is that my H obviously felt uncomfortable with mine and dads conversation and turned to me tersely and said "yeah alright Ophelia24 your repeating yourself". My stomach felt like he had punched it. I was so fucking hurt and angry that he sold me out, as he knows it is not easy to be honest with my dad ( I was shaking as I was telling dad how I felt) and he knew I was telling the truth, for him and me. He in fact agrees with everything I was saying. I just wanted to tell my dad to his face, rather than whine behind his back. Because that is what we do when we love someone, we bring it to them so they can respond, or just to express ourselves.

I screamed at him when we got home and he tried to get angry at me as he fucking knew he had been a coward.

I am giving him a pass for his betrayal this time, due to recent disclosure, but I will not accept this disloyalty from someone I love and who claims to love me. And there will be serious consequences if he continues to show weak boundaries with loyalty and support of me. Which I have shared with him so he knows where I stand on this.

Sorry so long, but I thought this was a good example for how we let people down majorly, that doesnt involve physical unfaithfulness, but is unfaithful nonetheless. Because how can we trust them to have our back when we cant hear what they are saying, when they drop the ball right in front of us?

Thanks for your post. Always love reading your insights UO.


“Love does not begin and end the way we seem to think it does. Love is a battle, love is a war; love is a growing up.”
― James Baldwin

Posts: 283 | Registered: Feb 2013
silverhopes
♀ 32753
Member # 32753
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wouldn't airing at your spouses private failings as well as denigration of the gender they represent be considered unfaithful?

I agree. That's selling them out to someone else for cheap entertainment. That's made me more cautious of who to talk to about stuff over the last few years because of that - disrespect. Sometimes I wonder if being here on SI might be hurting my H as well with some of the things I have posted.

I think speaking hatefully to your spouse right to their face is being unfaithful in a sense as well - it's showing them that you're not part of their team. It's made me aware that if I am going to argue with H about things, I need to find a more respectful way of doing it. One that doesn't involve contempt.

[This message edited by silverhopes at 6:22 PM, March 18th (Monday)]


Find peace. Or sleep on it.
Sometimes my monkeys, sometimes my circus.
Infidelities are like icebergs - they may take many different shapes and sizes, but they all damage your ship.

Posts: 3920 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ 21761
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 6:11 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I always think there are more vows than fidelity. If you have vowed to love, honor, respect... Well, many people break those vows too easily... even before DDay.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6115 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Unagie
♀ 37091
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 6:19 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My SO has told his family and friends my actions and as far as I know if they insulted me he never defended me. I am guilty of complaining about my SO pre-A to my girlfriends because I would complain to him and get nothing in response so I vented to my friends. I remember doing this to one of my G/F's one day in front of SO's BFF and his friend told me to stol complaining about him because that was wrong. I looked at him and said SO already knows all these things but does nothing to resolve them, she is my friend and I need to vent. After A he told SO this as proof of what a shitty person I always have been and of course SO used this often in fights. SO has called me a slut, a bitch, a whore, has told me he hates me, has called me horrible and I have little doubt he said these things to his friend and family and little doubt that he defended me if they said anything.

He'll I found out after DDay that there were things about me he'd complain or talk to his friends about but I never knew any of them because he never told me...I have to go think some more.

[This message edited by Unagie at 6:20 PM, March 18th (Monday)]


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"There are times when our reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind." Patrick Rothfuss


Posts: 2798 | Registered: Oct 2012
knightsbff
♀ 36853
Member # 36853
Default  Posted: 11:02 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UO,
Great thread! This subject has been rattling around in my head lately. We are supposed to limit our friendships to those who are "friends of the marriage", but what about us? Shouldn't we (BS and WS) be friends of the marriage if we want to keep it? R-E-S-P-E-C-T

I always think there are more vows than fidelity. If you have vowed to love, honor, respect... Well, many people break those vows too easily... even before DDay.

^^^This!!!!

Way before there was an EA or a PA I betrayed my H, my marriage and myself by the way I spoke to and about him. No cursing or name calling but such disdain. I think that was the beginning of the slippery slope.

It saddens me when I think of the years I wasted flailing around like a child because I was uncomfortable with myself and I didn't know how to help it.

[This message edited by knightsbff at 11:04 PM, March 18th (Monday)]


FWW 40's
D-day August 27, 2012
3 kids and 2 dogs

I edit often because I make a lot of typos. ☺️


Posts: 1509 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Deep South, USA
veritas
♀ 3525
Member # 3525
Default  Posted: 11:28 PM, March 18th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think this highlights why every situation is so individual. There are varying levels of infidelity and unfaithfulness, but sexual infidelity hits on at least two levels, right off the bat, and that's why it's so potentially devastating. There's a visceral core with another layer on top: dishonesty, spite, resentment. Many infidelities in marriage have only one layer: some kind of character flaw, FOO issues, etc.


Actions unmask what words disguise.
Love many; trust few; and always paddle your own canoe.
When you win, you teach; when you lose, you learn.

Posts: 10168 | Registered: Feb 2004
uncertainone
♀ 28108
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 1:52 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't believe any infidelity has only one layer. In order to disrespect another you have to first trash yourself.

Financial infidelity hits two right off the bat as well, as does addiction. It's the layering of expectations, resentment, finger pointing, score keeping, lies, avoidance, lack of communication, lack of courage.

Just the focus so many have on "happiness" like it's a third member of the marriage and needs to be catered to or there is "something wrong"...a precious and demanding pet.

Yes, it's very individual as well as varying in degrees. I don't feel that it's ever minor, though, just subversive in it's lethality disguised by excuses and justification.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
LosferWords
♂ 30369
Member # 30369
Default  Posted: 1:57 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Very thought provoking post, UO. It makes me wonder how many times I have been unfaithful to my wife, friends, or family throughout the years in different ways. I think I've done pretty good, for the most part. I also think I have some work to do. This is a post that I am still digesting, and it makes me look inward, and I appreciate that. Thank you.

Posts: 7998 | Registered: Dec 2010
UnexpectedSong
♀ 21761
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 3:19 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

but sexual infidelity hits on at least two levels, right off the bat, and that's why it's so potentially devastating. There's a visceral core with another layer on top: dishonesty, spite, resentment. Many infidelities in marriage have only one layer: some kind of character flaw, FOO issues, etc.

I'm with UO. Abuse (emotional, physical...) and addiction are absolutely multilayered.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6115 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
isadora
♀ 29130
Member # 29130
Default  Posted: 5:57 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A co-worker gave me advice once about speaking negatively about your partner to others. Because generally what you say about your partner is all most people will know about them.

FWH has done a lot I don't agree with, or just plain pisses me off (infidelity aside), but I have always stopped to think before I said anything. It was something that really hurt me after DDay, is the amount of
time he spent trashing me to justify his
cheating.

[This message edited by isadora at 5:58 AM, March 19th (Tuesday)]


Me: BW Him: WH
Married: 12 yrs
2 DDs and DSs all under 10
2 Affairs - 2010 year long PA/EA, 2008 2 month online EA
Multiple D-Days

I can only control myself, no one else. I do not have that kind of power.


Posts: 4513 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Back home again in Indiana
AnneOther
♀ 38368
Member # 38368
Default  Posted: 7:32 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Steadfast in affection or allegiance. Is that something that maybe a few may be in violation of that have never touched another or even thought about another?

Is being disrespectful as you run them down to others not a breach of that before anyone else is even a thought during your "private moments"?

wouldn't airing at your spouses private failings as well as denigration of the gender they represent be considered unfaithful?

I hope as a BS I am allowed to post on this as there is no stop sign.

This post is exactly what I needed to read right now, it articulates thoughts I wasn't quite able to articulate myself. Like Unagie I find myself at the “wanting to shout out loud” stage at times in the general or JFO forums as it all just seems TOO unjust and far too onsided. Also like her, I don’t want to tread on the toes of others who are obviously in a very bad place emotionally, so often just keep my mouth shut. But it really does too often feel that people (BSs) do just line up with a bat to take any old swings at waywards, yet BSs get carte blanche to dis waywards in any and all ways, no matter how healthy or accurate or fair or violating of boundaries that dissing may be.

I have even had a few swings taken at myself personally when I have tried to highlight that the broad strokes being used were far too broad and full of stereotypes and overgeneralizations. In fact I was even accused of having adopted my WHs maladaptive thinking and being in denial, all because I took a rational and logical view (instead of an emotionally charged rant) of my (f)WH for using a prostitute.

I have a LOT of trouble getting to grips with sheer amount of denigration that is directed at waywards or their "EVIL" affair partners. That SOME waywards and APs may deserve that level of hatred is a given, but really it is far too widespread and hate filled to be healthy. The people filled with this amount of rage and hatred for their wayward partners, do in my own personal opinion, really need to look inwards at themselves and discover why they need to take part in these hate fueled rants so often.

Thank you for starting this post UncertainOne.

Oh and just to clarify, I do realize that people who have JFO or are if the direct aftermath of dday do go on hate filled rants and that is to expected and I don’t count them amongst the posts that irk me.


Posts: 72 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: U.K.
tryingmybest2011
♀ 32584
Member # 32584
Default  Posted: 8:14 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"Why did them outsourcing bother you so much"

Because it wasn't just the "ewwww" sex that was outsourced. Affection, attention, and everything else that went to someone else. And apparently, it was much easier to give those things to other people, than it was to give them to me. Is that a deficit in me?

For myself, a lot of the frustration about the situation is that I could feel my WH withdrawing for quite a while before, could feel the contempt, tried to address it directly with him, and was rejected. At times I do feel self-righteous, and I suppose that's where it comes from.


BS: me - 37
WH: him - 37
DD: 8
DD: 11 mos

Married over 9 years, together for 18.

DD#1: 12/12/10 - LTA of 3 years, 2 mos.
DD#2: 02/02/11 - 2 EA/PA with coworkers, a month after the LTA was ended (by OW).

In limbo.


Posts: 323 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: Ontario Canada
Dance4Me
♀ 26284
Member # 26284
Default  Posted: 9:38 AM, March 19th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In my FWH's case, he didn't bad mouth me at all to his many young female coworkers and so called "friends" (I had no clue about.). In fact, he didn't even mention me at all...over a course of seven years. All during my time working in a professional setting, I spoke well of my H almost everyday to my coworkers. Many even knew him and liked him very much. When I asked my H if the last young female coworker he had a year and half texting/calling friendship with knew my name...his answer was - "I am not sure!" To me...this has caused me great pain and a feeling of being insignificant - and I defintely feel his actions were unfaithful despite there being no emotions/love/sex involved with these so called female friends.

I also agree that these unfaithful gestures were a slow progression into his two time physical sex act with his last and only PA/OW - the ultimate betrayal for me.

Even with all of my Hs betrayal behind us...I still don't disrespect him to others with harsh and nasty words. If that was the case, and he wasn't acting in a loving and remorseful way, I would have had to leave by now. I can't live everyday with a spouse I don't want to remain faithful to - as you suggest. My kids and I deserve peace after all we have been through...

[This message edited by Dance4Me at 9:40 AM, March 19th (Tuesday)]


On Dday -BS-me 41 FWS-him 42
Married 19 years 3 kids (16,13,9)
D-Day 10/2/09- TT til Feb. 2010

“To love at all is to be vulnerable. Love anything, and your heart will certainly be wrung and possibly be broken.” -CS Lewis


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