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Newest Member: Phoenix2rise (45723)

User Topic: What's the big deal?
wario
♂ 20338
Member # 20338
Stop  Posted: 4:48 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know this post is going to be flame-bait but I want some insight.

My BS and I have been trying to deal with my infidelities for the past 7 years. We recently had a baby and both time and energy is precious and few. My BS is adamant that I haven't "done the work". She refused to do marriage counselling with me stating it was a waste of time. During our last heated debate, I asked her a burning question that I wanted to ask a therapist just to get a sense of scale. Just to clarify, the infidelities I had were single dates, flirting and no-sex involved, they would be considered EAs.

The question I asked was "How can someone be so mad for something like this for so long?". My BS challenged me to post, to see what the community has to say about this.


Me: FWH 40
BS: 42
Married: 12 years
Together:19 years

Multiple EAs from the beginning, 1 EA after marriage


Posts: 186 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
WishingForLethe
♀ 34805
Member # 34805
Default  Posted: 4:57 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How can a blister or small cut kill someone? It is left untreated.

If you have not figured out why you had EAs, how do you know you won't do them again- maybe they will even turn into PAs this time. Sure you say you won't- but um...didn't you say that when you got married?

MC is something best done AFTER a WS gets through some of the "whys". It is not worth the investment of her time if you aren't doing the work on you.

If it has been 7 years and she is no better from rugsweeping and ignoring the situation...I am gonna go out on a limb here and say it will NEVER get better until you do a little soul searching.


Don't look at how far you have to go, but how far you have come

Posts: 350 | Registered: Feb 2012
hardlessons
♂ 35025
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How can a blister or small cut kill someone? It is left untreated.

Exactly.

Just to clarify, the infidelities I had were single dates, flirting and no-sex involved, they would be considered EAs.

And this makes it better? Easier? If you are already coming from a justified space why do you need the insight?

You BS knows like mine that MC is worthless if we are not Individually getting healthy.

Might wanna check your scale, mine gets a little jacked up too. Then I remember to put both feet on.. Ah Shit!


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 880 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
ReunitePangea
♂ 37529
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 5:14 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How can someone be so mad for something like this for so long?

I'll answer a question with a question - How can you be so insensitive to what your wife is dealing with?

Every BS, every WS and every A is different. Maybe some BS can deal with your EA's easier than others but all of that doesn't matter. You did what you did, you very well knew it was wrong at the time, no man up and deal with the consequences of your actions.

I for one agree that if you haven't dealt with your own issues going to a MC is probably a waste of time for you. Your BS doesn't need to listen to you try to manipulate a MC to talk through more blame-shifting issues you are likely to want to ask. Stop working so hard to minimize your actions and put that energy into fixing things instead. You will get where you need to go a lot faster.

ETA - sorry I lost which spot I was in. I thought I was in general and not wayward. If my post needs to be deleted please do so.

[This message edited by ReunitePangea at 5:24 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday)]


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 489 | Registered: Nov 2012
Deeply Scared
♀ 2
Member # 2
Default  Posted: 5:23 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

***As a member***


"How can someone be so mad for something like this for so long?

If your attitude towards your wife is anything like the attitude I'm reading in your post, then it would be easy to see why she's still angry.

What I've learned over the years is pretty simple. Be humble and grateful that our spouses didn't pack our shit up and put it out on the front porch.

Even the title of your thread is crappy.

What you did is a big deal and I hope one day you will look hard and long enough at yourself and your actions to help bring your wife some comfort and security.


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 198816 | Registered: May 2002
Deeply Scared
♀ 2
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 5:31 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And we are adding the stop sign.

Just the fact that you said this post was "flame-bait" indicates you did this just to push buttons and we're not going to punish BS's because you want to pick a fight.

***Please note that this thread is now closed off to BS's***

[This message edited by Deeply Scared at 5:32 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday)]


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 198816 | Registered: May 2002
Aubrie
♀ 33886
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just to clarify, the infidelities I had were single dates, flirting and no-sex involved, they would be considered EAs.

And??? That is supposed to mean what exactly? Do you think your wife should be over it because it's "only" an handful of EAs as opposed to a handful of PAs? Who are you to dictate whether she should be over it or not?

Do you view EAs as less hurtful?

My BS is adamant that I haven't "done the work".

So what work have you done?

[This message edited by Aubrie84 at 5:36 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday)]


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6426 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
uncertainone
♀ 28108
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 6:14 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, you'd have no problem or much hitch in your giddyup if she has single "dates", flirts and no sex?

If the answer is no, my follow up question would be, do you not find those actions disrespectful?

Depending on how you answer those is where you can start the work you probably missed.

If you would have a problem with her doing the same thing then your post confuses me.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
heartbroken0903
♀ 27879
Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 6:33 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Succinctly: if it's a big deal to your wife, it's a big deal. You may not agree with her or understand why it 'still' bothers her, but the fact is it obviously does.

Left un-fully dealt with, this stuff festers and grows into a bigger monster than you can imagine. Take my word on that.

And in my humble opinion, I agree with your wife...just giving your post the title that you did seems to indicate that you have more work to do.


Me: XWS, 30s, 5-month EA/PA in '09-'10
Husband: XBS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

We remarried in 2014.


Posts: 2316 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
Aubrie
♀ 33886
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 6:41 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What matters more Wario? Being right, or being married?


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6426 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
stilllovinghim
♀ 29971
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 6:43 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Death by a thousand cuts. Your attitude makes it now one thousand and one.


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1942 | Registered: Oct 2010
hardlessons
♂ 35025
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 7:05 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wario, come on back. If you are right "whats the big deal" then you should have no problem debating it.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 880 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
wario
♂ 20338
Member # 20338
Default  Posted: 1:20 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Whoa, I knew it was going in for some serious feedback. Thanks for posting all that did.

The work done so far has been been many hours of individual therapy. At the end, yes I am screwed up, yes, a lot more than I thought. Am I sorry I screwed up my marriage and hurt my wife, of course. Did I find out why I did what I did? I think did. What have I been doing for the last 7 years? Dealing with the fallout? For the first 5 years I was getting thrown out constantly, at least once a week. All night, marathon sessions, being left on the roadside on car trips. Trips to the hospital, cops, the list goes on. The only reason this isn't happening now is because of of our new baby. By the way, I'm posting while she's sleeping next to me, I'm trying not to wake her (this android tablet is driving me nuts). I not gone to IC since the baby because I can't spare the time until lately.

With each fallout comes, "I'm not doing THE WORK" and that I'm at square 1 or 0 because I'm showing anger and frustration. Well wouldn't anyone be frustrated if this was the 300th time you were being thrown out of your home and told you have gone nowhere. So when I ask how long can you be angry about something like this, it is out of frustration and a need to know what exactly is the reason that I'm not getting.
I know a lot of you will say wah-wah what a baby, and oh man up. I'm too tired for the cliches, please just tell me what you've seen as the WORK and be specific as possible.

By the way, my wife did tell me the reason, it was the betrayal and living each moment not knowing I was telling her the truth and the incredible stress she was under because of it. Maybe she said this in the past, but I was not ready to hear it until now, after I so plainly put the question forward.



Me: FWH 40
BS: 42
Married: 12 years
Together:19 years

Multiple EAs from the beginning, 1 EA after marriage


Posts: 186 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
disgracetoh.race
♂ 33491
Member # 33491
Default  Posted: 3:16 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Wario,
I must say that I find your story a bit confusing, and, that might be an obstacle for anybody on this site to give you an advice.
I can see that you are in constant fight for 7 years. I might be uninformed, but I haven’t seen unresolved conflicts that last that long on this site.
Also, what makes no sense is that you guys, as I understand, living in unresolved conflict for a while, decide to have a baby.
So, I think there are a lots of pieces missing in this puzzle. For a starter I think you should add more to your profile.
As for the “work”, doing this, and laying out yourself in front of the group of people that are seriously interested to help you, would most definitely be a start
Good luck

[This message edited by disgracetoh.race at 3:17 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday)]


WH 50 years
BS 48 years
Married 24 years
Son 16 years
DD 1 - 15.11.10
DD2 - 18.2.11
DD3 - 25.4.11
Desperately trying to hang in tiny space left for me. Sober since DD1, no relapses, not even close.

Posts: 100 | Registered: Sep 2011
Aubrie
♀ 33886
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 10:43 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did I find out why I did what I did? I think did. What have I been doing for the last 7 years?

Methinks that if you aren't sure if you've found your why, then you haven't. As for what you've been doing for 7 years? Who knows. Walking in circles? Working with an IC that isn't a good fit? Do they push and challenge you? Or do they sit back and listen to you drone about how sucky life is and charge you $75 at the end of the session?

Get an IC that specializes in infidelity.

With each fallout comes, "I'm not doing THE WORK"

What prompts these "fallouts"?

What "work" does your wife want? What "work" do you do?

If if your marriage is so crappy and miserable, why in God's name did you bring a baby into this? I'm not understanding how if your wife is leaving you on the side of the road and kicking you out all the time how you'd want to bring a baby into that kind of environment.

What are you doing to make your wife feel LOVED?

What are you doing to make your wife feel SAFE?

What are you doing to make your wife feel HEARD?

Have you given her everything she's asked for? All truth, a polygraph, a time-line? A true blue apology? Transparency? Honesty? Consistency?

And have you given those to her with a huff and a 'tude, or have you given them to her with a humble and happy heart. There is a difference...

If you are portraying any of the huffy vibe you've got here towards your wife, I totally get why you're 7 years out and in no better shape.

What books have you read? Have you been reading on SI? You haven't been posting here, and I suspect your post yesterday is a PA last ditch effort to appease the wife and show her "See, I posted. I'm trying. What more do you want from me!?"

please just tell me what you've seen as the WORK and be specific as possible.

If you are a reader of SI, then you have more than enough info to know what the work is. If you are listening to your wife, you know what the work is. The map is right there in front of you. Open it up and look at it.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6426 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
hardlessons
♂ 35025
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What have I been doing for the last 7 years? Dealing with the fallout? For the first 5 years I was getting thrown out constantly, at least once a week. All night, marathon sessions, being left on the roadside on car trips. Trips to the hospital, cops, the list goes on.

What do you think your role was in all that? The impression I get is that you think these actions occurred all on their own or solely due to your wife..


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 880 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
tired girl
♀ 28053
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 11:06 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have to agree with aubrie, I would like to see those questions all answered individually.

And as my H said, it seems you keep looking at your W as the issue here. At what point do you look internally? You seem to lack the ability to do this.


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5155 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
Aubrie
♀ 33886
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 7:33 AM, April 5th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Where ya at wario?


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6426 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
wario
♂ 20338
Member # 20338
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, April 5th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for your replies. I spent the last few nights doing some serious talking with my BS. We actually discussed a lot of the questions you presented to me.

Although the question I presented was extremely insensitive, it was a real question in my mind. I believe that our conflicts were extremely heated. When things get that hot, it is very difficult to see things clearly.

I realized that in the heat of the moment, I did not really hear what my BS was saying, through all that anger. Due to my own issues, I don't deal with angry women very well. So my mind really closed up and got defensive. Its only now that I understand that with every blow-up she was telling me she could not accept me the way I currently was. Meanwhile, my defense was that "Hey , I know I'm screwed up, I went to therapy and found some ways to stop the bad behaviors. Isn't that enough? Just trust me from now on. okay"

For some, that might have been okay, but my BS was not going for it, so I pushed even harder to make her accept my position. Although I didn't say it, my actions said "Hey, I don't want to change my pattern, but I patched up my old pattern and now everything is under control. Look, no more porn, no leering, no lying no cheating, for now".

But I now realize that these shallow Patches were not going to make her feel safer. I have to genuinely change my very fabric. What I have been trained to do ever since I was born to survive has to be demolished so I can be that honest person that will make my wife feel safe about me. What was really sad was that I told my BS this while watching my baby girl sleping on the monitor and realizing that I've really fucked up her chances to have an intact home. I've f**ked up my wife's life, I'm going to f**k my kids life up as well and I've definitely f**ked mine up, like who's life is left.

I start my IC session next Friday with a buddhist-based therapist, he was actually my first therapist, I stopped going to him because hew as getting tired of helping me through all the fights as opposed to helping me grow up.

It is time to grow-up and build a safe and honest home for my wife and daughter.

Thanks for all your help,

Wario



Me: FWH 40
BS: 42
Married: 12 years
Together:19 years

Multiple EAs from the beginning, 1 EA after marriage


Posts: 186 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
wario
♂ 20338
Member # 20338
Default  Posted: 8:53 AM, April 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aubrie84, I'll try to anwer your questions. Sorry I didn't get back sooner.

"Methinks that if you aren't sure if you've found your why, then you haven't."

I believe I do know why, its that I didn't want to really heal or look at the deeper problems I had, like with honesty and my sense of morality. I agree that I was and probably still am, pretty screwed up and I think that is what I'm going to try to find out (Soul-Searching you might say). As for ICs, yes I went through several ICs. One did push me to question my sense of honesty and morality, however, he was less concerned about the infidelity part of my life. I guess he saw it more as a by-product of my unhealthy life or attitude towards life. Other ICs would just try to make me feel better after the fall-outs an collect money. One came up with strategies to help me not to re-offend again, but was not equipped to help me dig deeper. I guess you can't have it all in one IC, I guess.

About the bringing a baby into this, well let's just say my wife and I weren't getting any younger. I am glad we did, she really shows the best of both of us.

As for making my wife feel loved, safe, heard. These are what I failed at when I tried to push onto her my shitty excuse for healing. I did finally hear her the last few nights and I have a long road ahead.

Yes, my post was very venting to say the least. Thanks for letting me air it out and hear for myself what an ass I am.

Wario


Me: FWH 40
BS: 42
Married: 12 years
Together:19 years

Multiple EAs from the beginning, 1 EA after marriage


Posts: 186 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
Topic Posts: 22
Pages: 1 · 2

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