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WS continued to try to "throw fluff" at me. He has been attempting to blackmail me by offering me insurance in return for me signing back over some of my spousal support. He dropped the little "HR called me on Friday and said that maybe what they told me isn't quite right...." bomb on me today as he dropped the kids off. This is after I questioned him, he called me all kinds of names because I questioned him...suddenly...gee...maybe HR wasn't right.

Anyway, I have been thinking that I have never known the entire truth of what happened in our marriage. For a long time, I've thought it really didn't matter. But, recently, as we move closer to D and things are "coming back up", I realize I deserve the entire truth. It was my fucking life he screwed with. I want all of the puzzle pieces to go into place.

So, I asked as he dropped the kids off, that I want the entire truth, the entire timeline, written out. I want to finish healing and let go. I told him he didn't have to do it until after we file for D...so he didn't need to fear me using it against him.

He said, "I'll think about it. I don't know if I want to do that".

Which, of course, means there is more. Probably a lot more. If there wasn't, his response would have been, "I've told you the entire truth."

So. Yeah. Not sure why it is coming up again, but it is. I wan't to know the truth and only he can tell me. The last of the power over me, I guess.

[This message edited by cmego at 5:15 PM, April 7th (Sunday)]

Asking a liar for the truth...do you really think you'll get it, cmego?

At the risk of sounding harsh:

You're never going to get the truth. You assume he knows the truth and is able to deliver it factually. Not going to happen.

Why drive yourself crazy over it?

I don't know. His boyfriend cheated on him a few weeks ago, he seems more sorry than normal. I know if there is a chance I might get it....it would be now.

If I really think about it, it is so odd to know nothing about my life. For 17 years, I lived with a person who led a completely separate life.

I've never asked before, for a written timeline. I've been in the "it doesn't really matter" camp. But, most of my friends KNOW everything. They know when the affair started, the who's and the hows. They can tell their story. It won't change anything if he doesn't, it would just be nice if he did.

((c))

hon, very gently here, but you're focusing your attention in the wrong direction by going back to the puzzle.

These issues are his. They're not yours. Focus on yourself. You deserve that much.

ETA: We cross posted. You said

They can tell their story.

You can tell your story. What you're asking for is his story.

[This message edited by Amazonia at 5:50 PM, April 7th (Sunday)]

XH claims that he's told me everything, but I'm sure there is more to the story. I've heard some stuff from his cousin, which of course XH denies. I have a sort of story, about the girl I know about...what else happened, who knows? Only him.

I'll never know everything, but what I know is enough. I deserve better.

As kindly as possible, how do you think these details from the past are going to help you as you move forward? I am truly asking, not trying to be patronizing in the least.

I know there is more to the story with regards to the ex; I am 99.9% certain there was at least 2 other affairs, if not more. I really wanted to know the answers to my questions, even though I ws divorcing him. After a bit though, I started asking myself why I wanted these answers and I couldn't find an acceptable answer for myself.

I'll never know everything, but what I know is enough. I deserve better.

That thinking is exactly what led me to let go of the need to find the truth. What I know is bad enough that I left him so what will change if I know the rest of the story? I lived my life as best I knew how with the information I had at the time. I decided that any new information was really not going to change my way forward.

So. Yeah. Not sure why it is coming up again, but it is. I wan't to know the truth and only he can tell me. The last of the power over me, I guess.

He may not be able to tell you the "truth". He may not even have come to terms with it himself. He may have assigned importance and meaning to things that were symptoms or false "reasons" because his shame, guilt, avoidance, has allowed him to "park" things where they don't really go.

You have power over your narrative though and you know those truths. You trusted him. You trusted he was who he represented himself to be and he wasn't.

Whether there were others, other times, other frauds, you have knowledge of the big ones.

Those, in of themselves, are very tough things to wrap your mind around. Those traumas alone are enough to work through.

Be patient with yourself. You've done some real work rebuilding and working through. You are strong and resilient. You are your truth and don't need to depend on his probably very faulty one to fuck with yours.

(((cmego))).

I understand why you want to know. I want to know what my STBX was up to all those years. He'll never tell me, though. He still won't even admit that he was cheating on me, despite the proof. Hell, he won't even admit that he was verbally abusive!

It is difficult to just leave it behind & walk away. It is difficult to heal when you don't know exactly how badly wounded you truly were. It's hard for me to know if I'm healed when I don't even know how deep the wound is.

I hope you get what you need.

Oh, ((cmego))... the entire truth?? I doubt seriously if he knows it. At this point the truth and the truth he told you and the truth he told himself and the justifications are all tied up into a tangled mess and what he believes is truth might not even be truth.

I remember prior to dday (the confession one, not the stuff I found on the computer ddays) I remember standing outside in our driveway and looking straight into his eyes and asking point blank, with little or no emotion and no threat just weary, AND GETTING EXACTLY THE SAME BODY LANGUAGE AND WEARINESS AND LIES. LIES LIES LIES.

I don't have the whole story. I have what I know. I have emails between him and other potential hookups where he refers to a time period years earlier when he had a "relationship" with a married couple. Was that a truth? or part of his fantasy or a hook to get this couple on board?? Does it matter?

Not to me. Not anymore.

I was a good and faithful wife who believed the surface picture and portrayal we lived for the outside world. It was my truth. And then suddenly it wasn't.

At this point it is the past, and I don't want to drag that into the future. I don't want his actions to define who I am today. Not anymore.

You can tell your story. What you're asking for is his story.

^ beautiful.

Don't give him power over your happiness. Like you said, he has too much influence with your emotions and trying to bargain with you over finances and giving him emotional consideration and the idea that he still has anything you need??? yeah, don't go there...

I think you give him way too much credit for having a heart, but I see it through my own perspective. I do know you are too good for his truth and way way too good for his lies.

True. I'm asking for his story. Maybe it is time I heard it.

I have no idea what it was like for him to have to struggle with being gay. He didn't let me share the story, he held me in place for his own use, "protecting me".

I am so tired of him. Just...exhausted.

OK...so here is what has been creeping in. I have been talking to the only guy I let in, G, again. He has been back, but really only in a friendship capacity while we kinda figure things out. Last week, after a few beers, he sent me a text telling me that he has been in love with me since we first dated, tried to get me out of his head and heart, but wasn't able. We are both still reeling from his confession and currently are licking our wounds. That night that "it all came out", we texted for 3 hours, and he said that he needed "all of me".

TMI...but here it goes. I can't let guys "go down there". WS refused to do oral sex on me. He said I was overweight, wasn't pleasant, smelled, whatever his excuse of the day was for not having sex with me. So, I then thought no men really liked it.

Enter SO last year....I couldn't do it. He wanted to, and I couldn't. He was referring to this in our conversation the other night. He said, "I can't be in WS's shadow, you have to work through this". I think I'm better now, I am feeling more open to the idea, I am more confident about my looks and generally just more "me". But, this terrifies me.

All the guys I've dated, only one got physical. The last guy, who was a fWS, he tried to kiss me on the last date, and I turned my head. I poofed on him after that. Sorta...he told me to call him if I wanted to see him again, and I haven't. He told me I wasn't over WS yet.

So, I asked my IC and she said, "Nope, you are over your WS."

So, why am I physically holding back? I think with SO (fSO), the relationship wasn't right at the time. He wasn't really ready to date (widower) and I knew it. Oral sex seems so....personal to me...and I didn't want to let him in all the way. Now, a year later, we are slowly, slowly creeping back to each other.

I have a feeling this is all tied together somehow. Not letting people all the way "in". Not letting men all the way "in". I've slammed most of them back against the wall as soon as they misstep, and SO, I didn't let him have my entire body.

So confused, trying to uncover this last layer.

The emotional and mental abuse that went on in my marriage was staggering. The physical rejection seems to be lingering, though. So many years of just being rejected on every level.

[This message edited by cmego at 7:05 PM, April 7th (Sunday)]

(((cmego)))

No advice on this just gentle hugs. I think this is a journey you have to make and the layers you uncover are about YOU. How you feel is how you feel, not based in what you don't know. jmo.

His partner cheating on him and he disclosing that to you does not automatically guarantee that now he will give you the entire truth. I'm not saying that in a harsh tone, just saying, er, typing.

My fSO keeps telling me he is so scared to let me in. He has a traumatic past, and a widower to boot. A lot going on. His confessing his love, then retreating is enough for me to deal with, but one of my friends pointed out to me that I ran from him too. As soon as fSO retreated, I pushed away even harder.

I know I may never get the entire truth. People hate my WS, I still have friends and family that refuse to be around him...but I have to because of the kids. *I* still have to deal. I look at him and I think, "What the hell did you really do?"

I know it is impossible for him to really look inside, but...maybe...just maybe....I'll get the story. His birthday was yesterday, a "big one". I clearly remember what we were doing 10 years ago. I threw a kick ass party complete with DJ/bartender/ singing telegram/50 people. And my prevailing thought yesterday? "All that work I did for that party...and I was pregnant while doing it....and he was having an affair." Almost like I have to repeat it to myself over and over so it sinks in. He really was doing all of those terrible things.

Maybe I"m just triggering.

(((c)))

I don't want to sound blunt, so hopefully you know how much I care about you when I say this... it sounds like you are trying to heal one wound with an unrelated cure. Like taking antibiotics for allergies.

I don't think that your reservations are an indication that you're still hung up on your STBXWH, or what he did while you were married. I think they're an indication that you're still hurting from those things. But hurting and being hung up aren't the same thing.

Look, oral sex is a big deal for you. Like you said, it's incredibly intimate. It's an issue of trust, at the core, I think. You and G have been all over the map, and I truly, truly hope that he's ready to be the kind of man you deserve. That kind of man is one who ought to be patient and earn your trust, not make demands in an area where he knows you are still hurting.

Yeah, it might be two different issues. I don't know if I will ever stop hurting over what WS did to me. The pain has so many layers.

G isn't making any demands. We haven't seen each other. Just talking about past issues while we decide what is....now. Right now....it is still nothing but a very cautious friendship. I was floored when he told me he is in love with me. Apparently it floored him too...and he retreated. We are two people with some pretty bad...hurt. We don't want to screw this up again, so just trying to figure out how to very. very. very slowly work on this. He is still deep in healing (therapy 3X per week now....), and I'm not quite done with my healing. I think that is part of the problem, G didn't push me at all over it, so I didn't get it was really a big deal to him until last week when some "alcohol truth serum" was at work.

But, not just G. The last guy, the fWS, told me that I didn't let him in because I wasn't "over what WS did to me". Of course, it made me pause. I begin to question myself.

A lot going through my head right now. Sucks.

(((Cmego))) please be careful. More information may not be the answer. Be sure you need it to get closure. There are definitely some things I wish I could un-know. I agree you need to know "enough", but that may be less than you think. Tread carefully.

he said that he needed "all of me".

Did he mean this over time or immediately? That's a pretty big pill to swallow. People unfold. It takes a long ass time to get to know all of someone, or to trust someone enough to give them your "all" when you've got a painful past that makes you cautious with that "all".

Ama...we haven't discussed it yet. Honestly, once the "I've been in love with you and can't get you out of my head for the past year" came out...we haven't really been able to communicate very well. I think he had no idea his feelings were so strong...and neither did I. So, we retreated from each other.

We are forcing it to go very slowly. He never pushed me before, and I don't expect him to do it now either. We will just talk it through as it comes up. I kinda knew it was an issue when we dated last year, we were up to talking about it when we broke up. I kept trying to confirm that "men really liked it"...he kept saying, "baby, you were married to a gay man." He never pushed me.

But, then it makes me go back to....why? Why did it scare me? AM I terrified to let a guy in? If I'm over what WS did, then why? G is the only guy I dated that "got in" at all.

(((((cmego)))))