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wert posted 5/13/2013 09:11 AM

and I am feeling pretty good about my life. My kids are doing well, work is good and even though life is currently too full of expectations and responsibilities - I chose them. It will balance out soon.

My W continues to learn a great deal about herself, the way she has treated people and her view of the world. I am impressed with her progress given her starting point. She shares, tries not to avoid things that are hard and communicates better than before the A. Most importantly for me, her internal dialog (she shares much of that stuff with me) is improving as is her self and outward perception. She still tracks downward at times, but she has words for those things now and works through them.

Our M is stressful at times. I would say I get most of what I want out of my M. It's not betta-then-evar, but if I am honest with myself I don't want it to be and really don't view things that way. Happiness is a sham. The search for contentment and understanding are enlightenment for me.

I don't believe that people become 'healed' from infidelity anymore than you do from many other types of loss. They are ingratiated into who you are as a human and who you are as a couple.

A few things I have learned along the way. Take all of this with a grain of salt because each of us, throughout life, with pain and loss - joy and success, needs to find our own path.

1) At first, after discovery, turn away from your partner. Separate, disconnect and figure out what you really want. I don't mean that you need to make any decisions at all. From my observation, both in my own life and the stories from people I have read here, WS's simply talked a bunch of nonsense after d-day and what they say is worthless. After you find out, tune them out and make a call for yourself. Get yourself ready to walk - then give them the time of day.

2) Expect a lot, but expect it slow. It normally takes people a long time to get messed up like people who have A's, it takes a while to get their stuff straight if they chose to do it.

3) Get into you. Nobody, I repeat nobody, will do it for you. It's not selfish, it your responsibility to yourself and those you love. Eat, drink, sleep. I am not talking days at the spas. I mean really figure out, if you don't already no, what is missing in your life and go and get it. Take responsibility for yourself. Make is so you can stand on your own.

4) Tell people you trust. We all have sorrow, pain, guilt and shame. Talk about them with the small amount of people you love and trust. If you don't have anyone like that, find someone. It will make you healthier.

5) Learn from all this. If your life can't teach you lessons what can?

6) If and when your WS starts to or does turn around - turn towards them. Get into MC if needed, learn to be vulnerable to each other, learn to turn to each other especially when you feel apart.

7) Decide what kind of M you want and make sure your S wants that also. It can be practical, loving or even just an understanding. Make sure you are on the same page, playing from the same play book. Is your M, good enough? really good, great and are you OK with that? Good enough may be just fine depending on the sitch.

take care...

rachelc posted 5/13/2013 09:33 AM

I've been thinking a lot about #1 lately... I'm thinking everyone who finds out about an A. should do the 180. It's so hard! But it seems healthier for all involved.

kiki1 posted 5/13/2013 09:42 AM

nice post wert!! it should be front and center. excellent advice. ty

reallyscrewedup7 posted 5/13/2013 10:19 AM

WERT!! That may not have been WAL like in epic length, but that was WAL like in wisdom, especially

1) At first, after discovery, turn away from your partner. Separate, disconnect and figure out what you really want. I don't mean that you need to make any decisions at all. From my observation, both in my own life and the stories from people I have read here, WS's simply talked a bunch of nonsense after d-day and what they say is worthless. After you find out, tune them out and make a call for yourself. Get yourself ready to walk - then give them the time of day.

If I could prescribe anything for new BHs that really want to try to save their marriage is to GET THE EFF OVER TRYING TO SAVE YOUR MARRIAGE. If your hand was stuck in a shredder, would you really first worry about damaging the shredder blades with your bones???

How many of us delayed or crippled real healing thinking that we had to cling to our waywards to save the marriage and protect the kids when that was the WORST possible decision to make?

Oh well, human nature. We cling to thing we think we are losing when in reality, we already lost it. We might be able to build it back (see your #6), but trying to plug the dam with your finger while the foundation has collapsed is just crazy.

Bravo sir!

wert posted 5/13/2013 12:05 PM

Rachel -

Thanks. I would hesitate to say everyone should do anything. Context matters - a lot. But in general I think stepping back and taking inventory for yourself when you are faced with a cheater is a good idea.

RSU7 - WAL is in a class of his own. :)
I did make that observation mainly about BH's. It can hold true for anyone, but for whatever reason I have observed a lot of BH's who want to love their wives back into the M - and I have not seen it work. It can I am sure, but that was not my experience.

I really stopped loving my W (whatever that means) after her A. I was just done with her. We had a lot of things in common - kids, family, money, etc and that held it together long enough for her to change. I love her again. It's nice.

take care...

numb&dumb posted 5/13/2013 12:15 PM

Good stuff man.

Everybody has their own path to take.

The detaching stuff is spot on. Trying to nice them back into the M never seems to work. Despite most of us trying.

Turning towards the WS is hard stuff to do too. A whole for me depends on what and wasn't my W willing to do. Actions matching words, etc.

Anyway good stuff. You have come so far, keep going.

tired girl posted 5/13/2013 23:49 PM

This really should be mandatory reading for every BS coming in. Great post.

wert posted 5/14/2013 06:12 AM

N&D - Thanks man. This stuff is all highly individual. Yes there are general truisms, but context does matter as do your personal histories. Example - My W never thought she was a women in the traditional sense. Didn't want to talk about 'feelings' and avoided what she called drama. In building this narrative for herself she denied somethings that were true in herself. She really is more emotional than she thought. She just never knew how to communicate it in a way that made sense to her. For the WS, the ones who want to be healthy anyway, this stuff is really just about figuring out who they really are. It a tough, be interesting journey later in life!

The turning back towards part I am still working on. It kind of surreal. I see her there and can type all these fine things about how she is changing, but letting her get fully tucked back into my heart is not that easy. For me it is mostly about self talk and opening up again.

I truly hope things in your life are turning brighter....

TG-

Thanks for the kind words. Hey I have a warm fuzzy for your hubby. A while back he brought a topic up in the Mens thread about why BS's call there WS names. Slut, whore, etc. It really had an impact on my self talk about my W. Those things are how she behaved and who she became, but not who she is not. Stopping that type of self talk, even outward talk has really helped me turn towards her and open up. Many props to him. He's a good egg. You have both helped me a lot.

take care all...

tired girl posted 5/14/2013 09:41 AM

He's a good egg

Yes he is!

sportsfan posted 5/14/2013 09:55 AM

Very well said, wert - great perspective!

lordhasaplan? posted 5/14/2013 11:14 AM

WERT,
So happy for you and the work you both have put into rebuilding. but I want to comment on this:

Most importantly for me, her internal dialog (she shares much of that stuff with me) is improving as is her self and outward perception.

Man , I thinkwe married the same woman. when they realize the negative internal dialogues and address who they are. It makes a world of difference.

May the two of you continue to move toward each other. I am very happy to see you "feeling pretty good about Life"

SuperDuperWonderboy posted 5/14/2013 11:26 AM

Good on ya, Wert.

FightingBack posted 5/14/2013 11:36 AM

1) At first, after discovery, turn away from your partner. Separate, disconnect and figure out what you really want. I don't mean that you need to make any decisions at all. From my observation, both in my own life and the stories from people I have read here, WS's simply talked a bunch of nonsense after d-day and what they say is worthless. After you find out, tune them out and make a call for yourself. Get yourself ready to walk - then give them the time of day

I wish I had had this advice at the time. I literally threw myself at my WH and begged him to love me.

It might have been disastrous but fortunately he threw himself at me too in a way. He was beside me every possible moment, comforting and loving. It was weird that dday brought about such a transformation.

On the other hand, I don't think he was ever truly worried about losing me. I had been advised to throw him out so that he realizes just how close he came to destroying our family. But I didn't want to play games and at the time I needed him with me so much.

In retrospect though, I think our healing in terms of dealing with the A would have been accelerated if I had done just that. Or maybe not. But I think there would have been less chance of him taking me for granted.

broken123 posted 5/14/2013 12:11 PM

Very good post, I am almost 5 year out from final DD, and my path seemed to follow your list, pretty much to the 'T'. I still trigger about some things, but they are far and few in between. Both WS and I have learned with the help of our MC, the skills that we need to communicate, in healthy positive moving forward way. I completely detached, separated, figured out who I was, what I wanted and then decided to R and rebuilt from scratch. WH and I have a better M, and can communicate about anything now, resulting in a positive resolution, no matter what the subject. This road has been rough, but I have learned, and I can say now, that would have it any other way, its made me who I am today, who my WH is today, and what our M is today. For me it has been worth the battle.

Wonderingwhy11 posted 5/14/2013 12:14 PM

Great post. I am also 1 Ĺ out and has been a rollercoaster. Successful R takes both spouses wanting to heal and work on the problems at the same time and time to heal and learn to trust. In our case we spent almost a year going back and forth trying to deal with and resolve the underlining problems until we made the equal decision to go to MC. It canít stress enough that both spouses need to be willing to work on the M. Your first point is crucial to begin successful R. BS needs to be willing to leave the M and WS needs to realize they want the M to do what it takes and do the work. Today we both realize we have a lot in common and same goals we did when we first met and got married. It is amazing how easy it is lose focus and allow outside stress and pressure effect our family.

wert posted 5/15/2013 07:05 AM

lordhasaplan? -

Funny about M'ing the same woman. There are a lot of common ways to be messed up aren't there? Best to you and yours.

Fightingback -

I had been advised to throw him out so that he realizes just how close he came to destroying our family. But I didn't want to play games and at the time I needed him with me so much.

I would make a clear distinction between kicking them out and turning away from them. No reason to kick anybody out (unless they are a real asshat). What I mean is to tell them you are considering your options, don't be mean but be distance and non loving. The optosite of love is not hate or being mean - its indifference. Getting to that point was critical for me starting over with my W and seeing her objectively. I didn't like what I saw and told her to get busy fixing her shit or I was going to kick her out. There wasn't any, working on the M. She wasn't even in a place to do that until she learned the skills.

Thank all.

take care...

sisoon posted 5/15/2013 11:26 AM

when they realize the negative internal dialogues and address who they are. It makes a world of difference.

wordwordWORDwordword.

(BTW, that applies to all of us....)

wert posted 5/15/2013 11:41 AM

BTW, that applies to all of us...

Completely agreed. That said, for some it rises to the level of pathology...

take care..

tired girl posted 5/30/2013 14:33 PM

bump

crazyblindsided posted 5/30/2013 15:44 PM

What a wonderful read thank you

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