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hobbeskat posted 6/12/2013 03:56 AM

Had our first session with MC yesterday and need to decide whether to work with her.

She has a psychodynanamic approach so . ts of focus on the past. What we talked about is within our first 2 months, we slept with other people (him his ex first because thought Id sleep with mine, go figure, me a ONS). We weren't officially a couple yet. He was very upset by my sleeping with someone and we ended up focusing on this more than his A. We have a slightly complex history and I'll go into more detail when not on phone.

She said it seemed tit for tat but his A was 4 years later, after we married. On a subconscious level he may have been getting me back but i don't think that excuses anything. She interrupted often and She said we needed to nurture each other instead of stabbing each other in the back which I thought was a very unfair comment. We did resolve our issues, maybe not as fully as we thought, but our relationship after the shaky start was not like that.

I felt like I was being blamed. I'm wondering if Im being oversensitive? He'd like to continue seeing her and he did open up. And she did pull him up on some stuff too. Afterwards we had a drink and some pizza, and it was nice.

What do you think?

I don't really want to lose the momentum and the other MC (humanistic) can only see us mornings and I have to work. Does it sound like Im overreacting?

circlingthedrain posted 6/12/2013 06:55 AM

If I'm understanding correctly, I call bullshit. You having a ONS before you and your WH were exclusive in no way equates to the betrayal of your WH having am A after you were married.

Your WH is wholly responsible for his poor choices. He needs to be in IC exploring that.

Find a new MC.

UKlady posted 6/12/2013 07:08 AM

My WH and I are going to see a new MC tomorrow. The first one we saw was, I think, perhaps a humanistic one - she was certainly 'client centred' and her approach was very hands off. We decided to stop seeing her when my WH started IC and also because she (a) suggested I should look at why this was happening to me....!! and (b) admitted that she personally had been the victim of several affairs by several men!! - seemed somewhat inappropriate!!

The new one my WH met a couple of week's ago to see if we could work with her and she has a more direct involvement (she did explain her philosophies and counselling styles but as I'm the reluctant one to attend here it really just washed over me). However, what we did do was state what we'd had before in MC and how it didn't suit plus we talked a bit about where we were at. Tomorrow we both intend to tell her what we feel we need to focus on and ensure that it stays on track. OK - if something comes out that is necessary to look at then fine.

I feel that you should perhaps give her another go and, on your next visit, ensure that you are straight with her and tell her what it is you feel you need to focus on. I guess that there will be things none of us want to hear in MC but it may be for our own good. If you still feel the focus is wrong or victimised then I would look for someone else.

I wish you luck hobbeskat - it's so shitty that we're in this situation isn't it

sisoon posted 6/12/2013 15:01 PM

I read: 1) before you committed to each other, but after you started up, you both slept with other people; 2) 4 years later, after you got M, he cheated because he was upset about your pre-commitment fling; 3) this new MC thought this was tit for tat (I hope I'm not the only one who sees a possible pun in that, but no pun is intended). If I've misread your sitch, ignore the rest of my post.

First, I call 'Foul!' No commitment means no cheating was possible. I have deep, deep sympathy for your H - I understand how your fling could have upset him - but he needed to grow up a long time ago and realize you were a free agent.

Besides how did he treat his own fling? If his A was an RA for your fling, he must have given himself a pass for his pre-commitment actions. That's total bull.

The fact that this MC didn't call him on his double standard doesn't bode well, IMO, but then I really HATE double standards. Maybe I'm over-reacting...but then I go back to what you write: the MC seemed to say that reasonable retribution for your pre-commitment fling is his pre-commitment fling PLUS is post-commitment A.

OTOH, a good M does require the partners to nurture each other, and IMO the fact that she said that is a positive - but how is she going to help you move from the grief, rage, and fear of the A to mutual nurturing?

[This message edited by sisoon at 5:01 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

hobbeskat posted 6/12/2013 21:40 PM

He insists that she did- he thinks that she, in fact, has pointed out that he is the one who, "started it" and the one who continued it. He wasn't correcting my perception but pointing out it might be tempered by my own shame at my actions 4 years ago, which is definitely true as I am absolutely ashamed of it. Of feeling, deep down, that I was to blame somehow, especially since the ONS happened when I was so drunk I could barely remember it (he didn't take advantage). That guy had had feeling for me which my WH (then BF) could see and was worried about but which I genuinely could not. I was so fucked up that whole time- I can't go into details because it would be identifying- but I was grieving a big loss. It wasn't the best time to start a relationship but me and my WH met again and fell back in love and that was part of it- I was so angry he was able to come back into my life and I just fell for him again, and I was already feeling incredibly raw and vulnerable and fully expected him to shatter my heart again. My self esteem was in the shit. I was terrified to commit because I knew, if I did, it was forever. So subconsciously I think I put myself in the position where I tested my own commitment, had one last stand as it were. And I didn't deal with it very well when I told him and afterwards. I totally shut down discussion about it, which now I can see was a huge, huge, huge mistake. The kind of ones WHs make, out of deep shame.

Oddly, we bumped into that guy recently- I didn't recognise him for a minute and my WH said he felt nothing about it. And that guy was innocent. My WH said he hoped in 4 years I'd be able to do the same, but he won't happen. In this case, the OW was a very close friend, so I had the awesome double betrayal. I'll never feel that way towards her.

When she asked him why he slept with his ex, he said because he thought I was going to sleep with mine. He literally could not see how odd that thinking was and she pointed it out, what possible thing would he gain by doing that? That was his, "pass". The pre-emptive strike. He treats sleeping with his ex as pretty much nothing at all as it happened very early. But on some level, I obviously didn't feel that way. (And she hates me, and was violent and cruel, too. I couldn't understand why he was with that trash).

I did dislike her judgmental way of putting things, though. I didn't like the implication that I've spent 4 years since pissing off my WH and dragging him down. And also that there was a, "for tat" coming. Because there isn't. I have been careful to not even be insulting because I feel like our relationship is a body, a wounded body, and the more wounds we make the less chance we have. I don't want to add to the wounds. But I am going to give it a second go and see how we go with her.

Today has actually been a fantastic day. I have barely triggered and my WH has actually been talking about what we discussed yesterday. And, for the first time, he spoke to someone else about what happened (i.e not via me having told them). He even told them we were in counselling and asked their advice. He has cried twice. Not in self pity but in sorrow and remorse and held me and told me he loved me and that he was sorry. He has also said, for the first time, that although he was depressed, there must be a deeper reason. Until this point, he has always maintained that his depression made him do it. It definitely had a hand in it but I have repeatedly said that's not deep enough. And he has acknowledged that during that time, he was very angry at me. He actually *exaggerated* details without thinking, to hurt me. When he told the MC this, she said, "While you were saying this, why weren't you thinking of the effect your words were having on the woman you loved, who you married?" And he couldn't answer. So that's a question.

Thank you so much for insight and advice. UKLady, it is shit, and I hope today goes okay for you and you can refocus your sessions. Sorry I can't quote, on my own.

I'm taking today as a good day, even if tomorrow is shit. Aside from all the serious talk, we've actually relaxed and had some fun today. We both have the next few days off work, too, so that'll be good. He's been very affectionate and I've been relaxed enough to be affectionate back. I feel better after talking my feelings through with my WH. Importantly, when I have shifted blame towards myself, he has shifted it away. I make it clear that I think his A was a choice and one I take no responsibility for, but then start to feel crap about myself, but he agrees it was a choice and not my fault. I hope the MC actually gets back to me, she hasn't replied yet!

Thank you guys, I'll probably be posting more about this as it goes on.

[This message edited by hobbeskat at 9:59 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

hobbeskat posted 6/13/2013 12:45 PM

How'd it go, UKLady?

hobbeskat posted 6/18/2013 18:39 PM

Dun dun dun. We start proper on 1st of July. Completely not ideal as WH has to go to work afterwards. But all we could get, fortnightly. Wish us luck.

hobbeskat posted 6/21/2013 17:47 PM

What is wrong with me :( after these positive times, I had a total meltdown yesterday. WH was great but then he had to go to work. He was lovely again today but all I'm thinking is I'm 27 and I could cut my losses now and still go on and marry someone else and have kids. And that we can't even get divorced yet because we've not even been married a year.

Argh, I hate this so much.

hobbeskat posted 6/22/2013 08:51 AM

Help please? Is this normal?

sisoon posted 6/22/2013 11:52 AM

Is being wracked by grief, anger, fear, and doubt, always going down on a roller coaster normal, 4 months out from D-Day?

I think so. IIRC, I didn't think life was all that pleasant at that point.

WRT your idea that you can cut and run now, it IS something to consider - but there are no guarantees. Worse, from what I hear, D has its own difficulties.

You just have to dig deep and figure out what you really want and whether that's attainable.

(((hobbeskat)))