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Patchy posted 6/23/2013 01:24 AM

What's normal at 6 months out? If there is a normal. The reason I ask is I read a reply on the Wayeard Side forum that mentioned at 6 months expect anger to possibly surface from the BS.

On my roller coaster ride I've certainly been down a lot lately. This is the time of year things started up with the A last year so I figured that was one of the main reasons. But that post got me wondering if there's more to the 6 month mark that I'm not aware of, and we're at 6 months from second Dday now.

It sucks. It so sucks. I hate this depression and sadness. I celebrated my birthday yesterday and for the first time ever couldn't care less about my birthday. It just made me sad at where my life is these days.

When I can't shake my depressed mood it makes him depressed and then I feel bad and worry that I'm losing him, that he won't hang in there and see this through cause its so hard. I can't get him to read anything about what I'm going through so I don't think he really gets it. I have to "teach" him based on what I learn, which is so not right. He says he wants to do anything he can to fix this and make me happy, yet I can't get him to lift a finger to understand me. He's willing to move to get me away from all the triggers but he's basically doing it kicking and screaming, so I fear he'll build up resentment over time and we'll be right back where we were when he was lured into her lair.

Okay, done rambling. Thanks or letting me vent.

Knowing posted 6/23/2013 06:57 AM

Up until 3 months i raged daily. Concurrently, until 6-7 months, I had a lot of sadness/numbness. In retrospect I can say that I only started coming out of shock around month 6. The anger has come back since then, but not daily.

I suspect, since you are already aware that there is a lot he can do to help you heal and isn't doing it, that you will likely experience anger around that, and soon, which is perfectly normal.

If you two were in MC you would have a safe place to bring up your needs on a regular basis, plus hopefully learn some communication techniques that will help protect the M while you negotiate this journey. Also, it would be best if you both of you were in IC, if you're not already.

It is absolutely his responsibility right now to help you through this. The bare minimum would be to read "How To Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda J MacDonald. It's a short read, a manual of sorts, and will really open his eyes to his responsibility.

Actions speak louder than words in R. If you need more, so be it. He created this mess, not you. Truth is you can heal on your own or with him, which would he prefer?

LA44 posted 6/23/2013 08:25 AM

((Patchy)) I am at 6.5m now.

To answer your first question. We are all going to move at a different pace based on all the other stuff going on around us - mainly if our spouses "get" it by expressing remorse and doing the work.

I have had two fits of anger/rage that passed after a great discussion and MC. But for the most part things have been going well and I believe this has everything to do with my H's remorse.

I can only suspect that hearing how your H would do anything for you - except read about how you feel - would be a HUGE disappointment!

I am with Knowing. At least reading the book suggested would be a good place to start. I have to say tho...as the BS, I found the book a little....sanctimonius in tone BUT, I think it is PERFECT for men/women who don't have a sweet clue what their spouse is feeling.

As per the book After the Affair (he bought/read it), one of the High Cost Behaviours from my view point was that he needed to attend IC. Or else he had to leave. He booked an appt. that week.

See where this is going? He has to do the work. HAS TOO. And you MUST insist that he does it. Your mental well being is at stake here. You have already suffered enough. Would you consider IC - would help relieve you to be heard?

LA

LA44 posted 6/23/2013 08:28 AM

and frankly...I don't even think you should be in a position where you MUST point these things out to him. But it seems you have come to that place.

And after TWO D-Days...he should be doing all that he can to hold on to YOU. Not YOU worrying about whether he going to leave you bc this is hard.

It is hard.

1Faith posted 6/23/2013 09:13 AM

Timeline of Recovery

Good timeline I found on another site...Hope this helps..

Q: How Long Will It Take Me To Heal From This?

A: There is no set time line. On the average it's 1-2 years to heal from betrayal. 3-5 years is not out of the norm.

Below is a general guide, not everyone heals in the same amount of time as others, there are variables to consider in each individual's situation. It's a rollercoaster ride, emotionally and physically, but I promise you - you can and will survive. But, you will never be the same and that's not always a bad thing.

D-day to 6 months is devastation; you're done with life, in shock and sick at heart. You are raw emotionally and never knew such despair could be felt.

6-9 months are full of mood swings from "it's going to be okay" to "Why am I even trying." Your thoughts are emotion driven and not dependable.

9-12 months you can actually go about 15 minutes without thinking about "it." One morning I stepped out of the shower and realized that I hadn't thought of the affair yet. But sadly, those times were few and far between. You're still up and down emotionally.

Then at 12 months, sobbing again with the disappointment in your spouses selfishness

14 months you are able to have a heartfelt happy moment.

18 months the incredible crush of despair is gone. You wake up one morning and realize that the A was something that happened, not something that is happening.

20 months you no longer feel like your world is in danger. Trusting again, with your heart if not with your brain. Constantly questioning your own feelings but you realize it is fear stalking you now, not danger.

22 months you can see a future. You don't cry at the drop of a hat. You can watch television without falling apart at a love scene. Actually feeling almost back to your normal self. You finally loose that sense of being "outside" yourself. The phases can trick you, you think you're doing great at five weeks and then you hit the bottom of the well at 12 weeks. You can be raging at 10 months with a horrible anger that never appeared early on.

One day at a time...keep moving....

LoveActually posted 6/23/2013 10:42 AM

(((Patchy)))

For me, six months out was when the really tough healing part began. The first six months I was so wrapped up in discovery and we just lost ourselves in each other talking for hours and hours about every possible detail of the affair and timelines and the whys, the hyper bonding stuff, etc. By six months it was like all of that stuff was done--no more to find out or discover so then I was left with myself and all of the pain of what he had done. Major anger definitely set in for me at that point. I totally get what your saying because I remember holding back at first because I thought I should be over it by now...don't want to keep bringing it up and the possibility that he might get sick of my anger or rages and yes, I was afraid he would leave me--I felt extremely needy and fragile. BUT, the more I stuffed down and tried to handle it on my own, the worse I got. I finally set him down and said it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better and I was no longer going to handle this on my own--he didn't want me to handle it on my own--he just didn't know what I needed--I had to tell him so we could have a plan in place for getting through it. I'm 4+ years out and I still have to reach out for support and comfort on some days--your husband has to be your support system through this--there is no other way. It's a long road and unfortunately, you're just scratching the surface of what's to come. Time to get your husband on board and hold on tight. You're going to be okay--just take it day by day and at times moment by moment.

SAR681 posted 6/23/2013 14:38 PM

Patchy, I'm also 6 months out and feel a sudden bout of anger and what I would describe as apathy. It sucks.

I had to tell him so we could have a plan in place for getting through it.

LoveActually, do you mind elaborating on this? This is where I'm at a loss. I don't think *I* know what I need. This was a topic one day in MC. FWH has gone above and beyond anything I've asked as far as being accountable, being transparent, minimizing/helping me through triggers, or letting me unload my feelings on him. But it's not enough. In MC we talked about how it's my job to figure out what I need. But I don't know what *it* is, I just know that I'm not getting it.

My fear is that *it* doesn't exist. :-(

LoveActually posted 6/23/2013 18:38 PM

@SAR681--I sent you a PM!

tushnurse posted 6/23/2013 20:28 PM

Each of us is at a different place at 6 months. We were on our way to R and I was pretty sure we would make it. He owned his shit by that time. He wasn't sorry he had been caught. He was sorry for what he did. He would have moved the moon and stars if I said that was what I needed. If he isn't doing the work. If he isn't owning it then you are not really R ing and real healing cannot happen. You get stuck in this limbo land where you feel lost and unsure what you need or how you will ever get to happy. You need to figure out what you need and make it a priority If you don't you won't get there. You may be able to rug sweep and fake it but it's not getting to healed.
Sit down and really think on what you need then tell him and make him follow through any push back means he doesn't get it.

(((( and strength))))

Patchy posted 6/24/2013 01:11 AM

Thank you for all the replies. I think this is the most beneficial post and set of replies I've experienced so far on SI or anywhere so far.

Your replies have helped me process some and really think through some things. One consistent thing several people said was that I have to figure out what I need from him and let him know what that is. There is one big thing that I've already told him I need from him and that's to read a book or go to counseling or do "something" to help him understand what I'm going through. A couple of you mention the book "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair". I believe that is the very book I purchased on Kindle and had sent to his iPad about a month ago. Well he flipped out when he saw the email with the title because his Kindle is the same one our girls use and they could have very well been on class using their iPad and seen the book title. Or one of their friends could have seen it.

While I partially understood his frustration, and had forgotten his kindle was the same as theirs (mine is not) ... it also seemed he was way over the top with his response. Primarily because he had told me that he told our teenage girls about the affair the same night he told me (2nd Dday) after I had taken off in tears and in a rage not knowing what the heck one as going to do.

We got into a huge argument over the book and why it was such a big deal to him. Why they couldn't possibly know that he was reading a book about helping me. He said he told them. Did he not tell them? I asked him this and he said that he did. I'm sure, however, that he did not use the word "affair". He basically had told me what he told them and it was something to the effect of getting to close to the OW and getting things ftom her that he'd been needing from me, yet it wasn't my fault at all ... blah blah blah.

And to clarify, he didn't have sex with her and I believe him. I don't want to debate that point here and left another forum because people wouldn't leave that subject alone. He had a deep emotional affair, kissed her, hugged her, held her, said I love you to her and thought about leaving me for her. After a month they ended it and he told me about it. And then 5 months later told me "again" .., it had never really ended until then. And all of that hurts like hell. I can't even imagine if he had had sex. Just kissing him is hard enough, feeling his lips on hers and the movies that play in my head.

But I digress. The book subtitle is "A Compact Manual for the Unfaithful". It was apparently those words in particular that threw him. I think he just feels so accused all over again and it just keeps him from even thinking about actually sitting and reading a book that will make him feel that way the entire time he is reading. He already hates to read I less its an engrossing novel. He has a hard time physically grasping and comprehending the information. So that's part of it, but not an excuse I'm willing to accept.

At any rate, he deleted the book from the Kindle app immediately. After things calmed down, he made it sound like he'd figure out how to put it on my Kindle and still read it, but never did. The subject came up again about a week ago when we got into a massive argument (we really haven't had many) ... but I eventually asked him why he won't read the book, ANY book on the subject. Or do "something" to understand what going through beyond me telling him. I finally got him to agree that he would but I could tell by his tone he never actually would.

I do want to say that in a lot of ways, he's been wonderful. He has done a lot to work things out. He set up counseling right away after 2nd Dday and he fell madly in love with me again. While on one hand I was in massive misery, on the other hand we were sort in a honeymoon phase for a while. I was so happy that he was loving me more deeply than he ever had. He was clearly done with her and has done a lot to try to rebuild trust and make sure I know where he is, etc.

Where we are stuck now is in relation to my ever continuing triggers and pain and depression. The roller coaster ride of good and then bad. And he clearly doesn't get it. While he is sometimes very comforting when I get upset, sometimes he gets angry and/or depressed himself. I am afraid to tell him what is triggering me because I don't know how he'll respond.

So ... I know I need to figure out more specifically what I need from him and figure out how to get it from him. I think I may tell him I need I spend a few days at my parents house and maybe he can use that time to read. Maybe this will be the only way to make it clear how important this is to me. And he needs to know that I'm not going to apologize for my triggers anymore. Not that I really do ... verbally ... although I think onhabe on occasion when I see how it affects him. But I need him to understand I didn't ask for all the zillions of triggers. He created them and he needs to man up an deal with it. He WAS "unfaithful" so get over it and read the book.

Okay, I'm done rambling. Thanks for your input and thanks for bothering to read all of this.

Raptor posted 6/24/2013 04:13 AM

dear patchy,

I'm 3 months out from DDay and to be honest I didn't like what you wrote - from the POV that I'm hoping to feel better ASAP but I guess your story reinforces that I'm dreaming.

My WS has done very little to help R. She did display some remorse initially but that was it. However I did detect that she freaked out a bit when I said I was looking for a place to move to.

The thing is, I give my R about 50 50 at best. WS's owe us a hell of a lot of action. It is crazy that you are having to do the heavy lifting but I understand because that's what has happened to me. She can't face it and has given very little detail about her A.

This man of yours is a real piece of work screwing with your emotions because you fear losing him. It will never change until you make a stand.

And by the way, who was lured into who's Lair? Don't buy that BS from any cheater - ever!

tushnurse posted 6/24/2013 08:11 AM

Patchy this may seem a bit harsh or a bit of a 2x4.
But I think you need to hear it.

He is not owning his shit. He doesn't get it. He is doing nothing to help you heal. He is only focused on himself. His depression is not remorse for what he did it is regret that he did it, and got caught. Quite honestly I don't think it really matters if he had sex or not. What he did do is put someone, other than you first. He chose to lie to you repeatedly. He was willing to loose his family over this woman, or how this woman made him feel. I firmly believe A's are more about stroking ones ego than about the sex. (although I always recommend to get STD tested this is a safety issue for your future health).

A remorseful WS looks to his BS and asks what they can do to help. A remorseful WS doesn't mind snooping, doesn't mind the distrust they have created. And definitely is welcoming to you sharing your triggers.
If you can't feel safe, and not worry about hurting his precious ego when you are at your most broken, then you are allowing the dysfunction to continue.

My H made it clear from Dday that he wanted to R. He also didn't own his shit for a while. He was doing what he could to help me, and making me a priority, but if I questioned or snooped I got a lot of anger. You know why? He was still breaking NC. I too was afraid of his reaction of sharing the triggers, and was working hard on dealing with them on my own, but what finally broke the smoke and mirrors for him was when I had drawn my line in the sand, and he didn't stick to it, yes one more broken NC. I threw him out. That's when he had the OMG what have I done to my wife, my family, and me moment. This was the sobbing, snot running down his face boo hooing moment. I can honestly say from that point forward the dynamic of R changed dramatically. He no longer met any of my concerns with anger, frustration or guilt. He met them with welcomeness, and offered ways to help. He told me to snoop all I wanted, because I would find nothing (I did, and he was right). He encouraged me to share things with him that made me upset. He also worked on himself, and figured out what was broken within himself, and fixed it. No he didn't go to counseling, he read a few books, but honestly he understood where the issues stemmed from and changed those things in his life.

This is long, but my point is to share how I found my way out to a successful R.
You will find many of us in R that have R'd with similar stories. Sometimes, a LOT of times unfortunately it takes being willing to loose the realtionship to save it.

((((and strength)))))

1Faith posted 6/25/2013 13:15 PM

Patchy

So ... I know I need to figure out more specifically what I need from him and figure out how to get it from him.

(gently)

Uhm, no you don't. You can't because you don't know. Your emotions are all over the place and rightfully so. You can't put the plan of recovery into place on your own. You can't fix this. You have to heal from it.

HE needs to figure out what YOU need and behave in a constant remorseful manner.

You are taking ownership for the recovery and at 6 months out I don't think that is possible. You still have to reconcile that this actually happened. Happened to you and your marriage.

I can't get him to read anything about what I'm going through so I don't think he really gets it. I have to "teach" him based on what I learn, which is so not right. He says he wants to do anything he can to fix this and make me happy, yet I can't get him to lift a finger to understand me.

He is not committed to reconciliation if he is not willing to take the reigns of helping you heal. That is doing whatever you need. Read a book, see a IC. Say he's sorry, show remorse.

You can't over compensate for his lack of effort. It won't work.

I am sorry you are hurting but if you are afraid he won't see you through the hurt and despair he's caused you, you must question why would you choose to be with him? That is the least he can do.

Moving may help a bit but the fact that he chose to betray you will go with you wherever you go.

I hope you are both in IC. You need help understanding how you got here.

I am proud of your spirit but weary that you are trying to figure this out on your own.

Keep moving.

(((hugs)))

[This message edited by 1Faith at 1:17 PM, June 25th (Tuesday)]

forgivenesswins posted 6/25/2013 14:17 PM

For me 6 months was anger, sadness and depression. There were days that he could have been the most perfect prince charming in the world, and I would still feel completely depleted of grace and devoid of hope.
I knew it was a stage, and so I pressed through it.
After some time, I just stopped feeling so bad. No rhyme or reason.