Now, he tells me that is all there is to know, yet he still does not want to go through the polygraph. He says it s the "principal" of it all. He says, I have to trust him. Really???
He loves me, I love him. still, I know there is more. I should just let it go, let the digging go, otherwise, it will ruin us.
We both want to move on, there is still a bit of doubt in my heart. Can we forgive each other completely and move on? I am trying ...
I think it's pretty apparent to you as well as the members here that his reluctance to take a poly is clearly indicative of even more horrific behavior that he wants to continue keeping from you. You don't "owe" him anything, not even forgiveness. Considering that you are willing to reconcile, he should be on his knees THANKING you, not demanding your instant trust which he doesn't deserve.
Your desire to 'let it go' when you know he's still lying to your face is going to fester inside you and eventually erupt down the line. You need to consider your emotional, physical and mental well-being and not be willing to sacrifice it simply because you 'love' him.
What do you mean, can we forgive "each other?" What do you need to be forgiven for?
Please be very careful that you don't lose yourself in the process of 'forgiving' him.
There is a phrase here that comes to play a lot. "Trust but Verify" Means you can trust but cover your bases, and that phrase is most often used after being in R for a bit. I am so sorry you are here! If he doesn't want to do the poly, then he might be hiding something else.
He says it s the "principal" of it all.
He is not in a position to be spouting anything about principles... He has just violated the most basic marital principle.
He says, I have to trust him.
He has just proven that he is not trustworthy and it takes a long time to rebuild trust.
Can we forgive each other...
Can we forgive each other...
And what exactly do you need to be forgiven for? Sounds like you have maybe bought into being responsible for his cheating...? Whatever the state of the marriage Pre-A, he made the choice to cheat, rather than work on repairing the M.
That is on him! Lack of trust is the obvious consequence!
Rugsweeping is not recommended, it does not work.
If there any hope for a future with this man, you MUST insist on the poly, or you will be haunted forever.
Tell him that is it. If he refuses the poly, you will walk. And then do it.
If you wait, if you vacillate at all, he will control the situation. NOW is the time to be insistent about your requirements for R.
If he still refuses, then my dear, you'll have your answer. Then file for D.
Also, please go get a consultation from a lawyer so you know your rights and understand what would happen in the event of a divorce/separation. Knowledge is power!
[This message edited by womaninflux at 8:26 AM, June 27th (Thursday)]
During our marriage, having 3 children, businesses, work etc, oh ya, stress from finances, I was physically and perhaps mentally there for him. When, I guess, he needed "love", I was either too tired, upset, stressed ... whatever. He tells me this ... I was not there for him. I know, I fully understand, that he chose another route, not taking me, and letting me know how hurt he was, how much he needed me. He chose to deal with his needs in another way. He is completely guilty of this. He does not want to go to counselling
Classic blame shifting. There is no reason that justifies cheating. None, zero.
Marriage is hard work. No one has a perfect marriage or an affair proof marriage. We know that by the 40,000 members here.
That being said, you might not have always been there for him but I am going to make an educated guess and say he wasn't always there for you either. It is a two way street. But you chose to remain faithful where he did not. Please do not allow yourself to take ownership of any of his infidelities. You did not cause him to cheat. He chose to.
IMO, he doesn't want to go to counseling or take a poly because he doesn't want to face reality on how selfish he's been. He wants to pretend it never happened and move on to life previously in progress, right?
What is it that will prevent him from finding comfort elsewhere in the future?
If he loves you and is committed to making your marriage work then he will do WHATEVER it takes to make you feel safe. ANYTHING. That includes counseling and a poly.
You are worth that much, you are.
Sending hugs and strength your way.
he still does not want to go through the polygraph. He says it s the "principal" of it all.
To follow it with, "You have to trust me" demonstrates that he does not yet get it. How long out of the affair is he? Are you sure it has not gone underground?
No. You don't have to trust him. In fact, it would be foolish to do so at this point. You will trust him when he's proven himself trustworthy. You will open your heart again when you know it's safe.
Trust and "moving forward" occur when, knowing the truth you make an informed decision to move on, together, in life.
It's not possible when there are secrets and lies.
Secrets and lies erect barriers to emotional intimacy. If you don't know the truth of your marriage, the truth about the person to whom you're married, then you can't establish or maintain emotional intimacy.
So, he's guarding his secrets at the expense of you and your marriage.
You say, "there's still a bit of doubt in my heart." With this statement, you're not being true to yourself. As much as you want this to be true, there is FAR more than a "bit of doubt." Your life has imploded, and the man you trusted has shown himself to be a liar and a cheater.
It's completely normal and natural to wish it weren't so, and to try to return to the safe, pre-discovery feelings. (One of the most confusing--and sometimes frustrating!--things, for the BS after d-day, is the sense that it only feels safe in the arms of the person who's caused so much pain.)
But it's a mistake to rush back to that. A big mistake. No, not a mistake to be in his arms. But it's a mistake to interpret your normal and natural wishes as reality.
What you have is a man you do not trust. He has not told you what you need to know. He is choosing to protect himself, his affair, and his affair partner at your expense.
And as good as it feels in his arms, and as good as it feels to think, "I now know most of it," the fact remains that as long as he is harboring his secrets, he's not all in.
You and your marriage NEED for him to be all in. I hope he emerges from his fog and becomes the man you need him to be before it is too late.
Maybe you could pass on to him one bit of SI wisdom: It is not infidelity that kills most of the marriages that end. For most, that's not the real deal-breaker.
What makes most of us who throw in the towel do so is the protracted dishonesty that follows discovery. The little bit told here, the little bit withheld for later. Starting to feel better, then having the rug pulled out again. Learning, the most painful way possible, that your spouse values his secrets and lies more than he values you or your marriage.
As long as there are secrets and lies, there can be no emotional intimacy. As long as there is no emotional intimacy, there is not a real marriage, IMO. Further, there remains a very real vulnerability to repeat or continued infidelity.
Millions of hugs to you. You will get through this. I know it seems impossible now, but you will.
ETA: That you have been manipulated into absorbing responsibility for his infidelity is really worrisome, when combined with his, "I've told you the important stuff, so now you have to trust me."
Life involves work, and stress, and sometimes not having, to give, what others need.
Loving and mature partners know this. They give latitude for it. When their needs are not being met, they do not blame. They do not cheat. They do not lie.
They find solutions within the marriage, with the person they've promised to love and protect and cherish.
They don't, when their infidelity is discovered, say, "Well, you didn't do x, y, and z for me. So I cheated. Now we have to forgive each other."
You do not have a remorseful husband. You do not have an empathetic husband. Without both empathy and remorse, you cannot have a real reconciliation.
[This message edited by solus sto at 10:06 AM, June 27th (Thursday)]
let the digging go, otherwise, it will ruin us
Trying to get the truth won't ruin you, the continued lies will!
And please, whatever you do, if he DOES agree to the poly, don't drop it because now you think he's told the truth. It's right out of the cheaters manual to agree to a poly, give some phony parking lot confession of something that "you would never have found out on your own", and then hope that that will cause the BS to call off the poly so the rest of their sordid secrets can remain hidden forever. I've seen it countless times here on this board alone, it's a classis WS tactic.
The only thing he is sorry for is being caught. He is playing all the top records from the Cheaters Hits.
1. Blameshifting - oh if you had been more into him he wouldn't have had to seek out love someplace else.
2. Rugsweeping - I promise I told you everything, now lets get back to life the way it was.
3. Controlling/threatening - If I push I will ruin us.
All of this is BS. HE has ruined your relationship. HE made his choices, and now you get to deal with the aftermath. He is manipulating you into complacenecy.
It's really up to you. If you are content to live a life of incomplete truths, fear of doing something wrong that he will leave, always trying to be exactly what he thinks you should be instead of you, then feel free to proceed.
However if you want to be happy, and unincumbered by this BS of his, then you need to, heck you GET to lay the rules for R. He no longer gets to call the shots, and if a Poly is something you need, then do it.
Go see a lawyer, find out what your rights are, and what to expect should he threaten to leave again, because "you are ruining" things. Knowledge is strength, and I say about 99% or WS's are shocked when the BS stands up and says NO MORE. And it allows the real healing to start.
Real the library if you havent and let him know it will be a Long damn time befroe you will ever trust him again.
He chose to cheat. He chose to devastate you and now doesn't want to take responsibility for it.