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The other night, just before bed, stilllovinhim looks at me and tells me she has a confession to make.

I instantly shut off my emotions, yes i still do this, dont understand why.

I immediately start thinking " i dont want to know, IDWTK,IDWTK,IDWTK" But i say "okay" instead.

She tells me that a couple weeks ago, when she was mad at me(didnt talk to me for first 24hours, then cold shouldered me for a few days) she thought to herself that she should just go out to a bar and get drunk, she said that she pictured herself flirting with a guy(s) at the bar while drinking.

Then, luckily i guess, she tells herself what a stupid idea that is, how that doing that shit never helped anything before.

I didnt say anything when she was done, other than "hmmm" as in, interesting. It bothered me to hear, but like i said i was in "robot mode" from the word confess.

Well, its been on my mind ever since. Is this a clue as to how it all went down last time? Did she cheat on me because she was mad at me?

Now look, i dont want to be the "thought police". Im realistic enough to understand and be okay with the fact people, that everyone, has shitty thoughts...fucked up thoughts.

But shit dude! Really? A fleeting thought is one thing, but entertaining that thought long enough to fantasize about flirting with joe schmoe at the bar???

IDK, i dont know where im at with this. I dont know what my question is...

But please give me your thoughts on this.

I could sure use a perspective other than my own, because mine isn't very friendly right now.

Thank you

eta: I just reread the title, I'm not asking for help from the "thought police", that was just the theme running in my brain.

[This message edited by stilllovingher at 9:15 PM, July 3rd (Wednesday)]

What do you suppose was her motive in telling you this? That's what I often ask myself often.

she felt guilty because she felt she was keeping something from me.

1. It's great she told you the truth about what she was thinking

2. Not so great that she "still goes there" when a little trouble in your relationship happens (I can see how uneasy it would make you that this might still be her "default" setting/response.

Forgive me; even though you've been on SI for almost 3 years, I don't know your story or progress, but I see you both post, and you come off as a reconciled/reconciling couple. Her statement, however, smacks-no screams, unremorseful, or at the very least, huge unresolved issues.

I also don't understand why you're posing it here rather than talking to her about it. That would be the only reason I could see for dropping a bomb like this--it's something that needs to be discussed.

I'm sorry if I've misintrpreted, but I find this very disturbing.

I'll give it a shot. I think the wayward thought process usually stems from poor coping skills. It takes a lot of work to develop new, better coping skills. Slhim is working on that, but it takes time, and determination, and practice.

She did recognize it as not right thinking, and she felt guilty about keeping it from you. I think her telling you about this is a good sign, although I do know it really sucks for you to hear it. But open, honest communication is vital not only to reconciliation, but to both of you healing as individuals.

I can see how uneasy it would make you that this might still be her "default" setting/response.

that's exactly it. made me feel very unsafe.

cross posted:

sad in AZ, I haven't discussed it with her because I don't know what to say about it I guess. I don't think she is unremorseful, though.

[This message edited by stilllovingher at 9:50 PM, July 3rd (Wednesday)]

I wonder why she has to go there?

So, if someone gets mad at her or she gets mad at them, then does she feel she has to get revenge on you? And that cheating on you would be the way to "get you back" for making her mad?

Of course, she didn't act on it - well. I assume of course. But what drives those thoughts. Why think that? Why would she want to do that?

If she were really mad at you, and she just can't take it, then maybe she should break up with you first. Then it wouldn't be cheating.

But she doesn't do that. She doesn't think that. She thinks, I'm going to stay with him, but I will cheat on him instead to get him back for making me mad.

I mean, is she the Hulk? Man make girl angry! Girl smash boy heart! Girl cheat! Arrrr!

when I get mad about something my WH did (before knowledge of the cheating) I would think to myself, "is this something I will remember a year from now? No? Then it's not worth being angry about."

And I move on.

I guess I missed the relationship 101 lesson, that when someone makes you angry, you're supposed to sleep with other people.

I disagree with Sad (sorry Sad). I don't see that as being unremorseful. I see that as her recognizing her escapist coping mechanism, not acting on it, and wanting to discuss it. But discuss it. Discuss the crap out of it. Because it needs to be turned over and I think a decent discussion will help.

Dh and I told eachother EVERYTHING that went on in our heads that wasn't conducive to healing after d-day. Some of it was very hard to hear but it was the only way it became something between us and not something we hid from one another.

I don't think remorse means you'll never have a crappy thought again. I think it means you know to expose it, analyze it and choke it out before it ever gets away from you.

meta,

I agree with you, to a point.

I guess I just really don't think its a spouses responsibility to help the other one figure out how to not cheat. I don't want to be brought back to BH mode every time she has a shitty thought.

at some point I'm supposed to enjoy life again right?

She tells me that a couple weeks ago, when she was mad at me(didnt talk to me for first 24hours, then cold shouldered me for a few days)

^^^^This is not normal behavior. Withdrawl of affection like that is emotionally abusive controlling behavior.

The only way for you to cope with it is to detach from her (robot mode?)

If you detach from her, she is going to look for affection else where. That can lead to an A.

The two of you need to work on this dysfunctional behavior. Actually, mostly SHE needs to just stop doing it.

This was the cycle my WH and I were

in. If he didn't get what he wanted, was in a foul mood or felt slighted he did the whole not talking, shunning. Of course, because he traveled a lot for work he could keep it up for a month.

Usually he would give me the silent treatment and shun me for the week before he traveled and then announce his intentions to divorce when he was leaving for the airport for a 2 week trip.

I detached. He had his A and said he thought it would make me want him more.

Literally he thought he could make me love him more by pushing me away.

Your WW needs to figure out what she is trying to accomplish by shunning you and having hook up fantasies.

[This message edited by Jospehine85 at 10:00 PM, July 3rd (Wednesday)]

Jospehine85,

yes, its not normal adult behavior. I agree.

I don't detach whenever she is mad, I detach whenever I detect affair related talk. its happened like that ever since dday.

the withdrawal does need to stop, and for a while it has, mostly.

thing is, is during this particular period she was out of one of her meds, no, two meds. so I probably WAS detached to an extent.

I kind of have to be from time to time.

sad in AZ,

what is it that you find disturbing?

I didn't say it had to be unremorseful, but at the very least she has unresolved issues, which you seem to agree with because you say it's not your responsibility to help her not cheat. What is she doing to resolve these issues, which include her stonewalling you in anger?

I find disturbing that fact that after 3 years, she still has 'wayward' thoughts at the slightest provocation.

When your wife gets angry with you, her default setting is to go use and get validation from other men. (Notice that's not an either/or, but a tandem behavior -- double escapism, or one to rationalize or give permission for the other.)

I agree that it's a good thing on the transparency and relationship intimacy scales that she felt safe to share this with you.

But I'm always left asking: when do you get to feel safe? When do yo get to stop worrying about daggers in the dark? That's part of the BS sandwich, isn't it? If we want to reconcile, we get to hear all of the ways that we might get betrayed again in a flight of pique, because healthy coping mechanisms are a learning curve.

Wonder how it would go in my house if I told my wife that when she makes me angry, I fantasize about stabbing her in the face with a shovel while she's asleep. I mean, I'd tell her it was an irrational thought and I'd never do it, of course...so then I'd just get all the honesty kudos and treat it like another brick on the trust- building highway.

If she has to sleep with one eye open for awhile because of that honesty, that's her problem, right? My job is to be honest. The only consequence to radical honesty is a deeper relationship, isn't that right?

Oh, and your shut-down? That's a PTSD reaction, and you know it.

You know it paralyzed you. You're the rabbit hoping the predator doesn't notice as long as you don't move. That gets at the core of safety issues.

What do you need to be safe? Can you wait for your wife to learn the skills to help keep you safe?

More important: do you think she can learn them?

See, because you don't want a spouse who talks herself out of taking a shovel to your brain pan. You want one who wouldn't have a thought like that in the first place. Part of the problem of having a WS is that they've gotten to learn that a nuclear option exists and that you're vulnerable to it. If you piss them off enough, boy can they put you in a world of hurt. They've got your suffering as evidence that the weapon is effective.

Bunch of stuff there, but not any answers, I'm afraid.

I guess I just really don't think its a spouses responsibility to help the other one figure out how to not cheat

I don't know that's what she was saying though. And I agree completely. I wouldn't either. I don't know that just not cheating is the goal though. I think identifying she was in a shitty place, had a stupid thought, corrected it herself quickly and didn't feel right not telling you about it is actually a healthy thing.

I wasn't there for the conversation.. it just sounds like it scared her to have thought that way and she needed to share that with you to not have secrets.

I was in agony from an abscessed wisdom tooth last week. I was sleep deprived and in pain and pretty sure that my entire life was horrible and would never be better Even as that pity party was going on I KNEW it wasn't true, kicked myself in the butt metaphorically and cut out the drama.

I guess I just don't think a stupid thought will never pop up. I think it's all in how we now identify it, deconstruct it, and put it away.

thanks for clearing that up, sad.

obviously, I agree.

unresolved issues? yeah Prolly.

we've had to put IC on the Backburner for awhile due to moving across the country, but she is now making appointments again.

but yeah, its disturbing. its disturbing that with a lack of meds and an argument... shit crumbles so fast.

I mean, is it like being a recovering alcoholic? A daily vigilance against the monkey?

I guess I expected something else.

So, this statement puts you back in a state of hypervigilence. If this is a cycle, when does it stop? I hope that IC and meds are the answer; I hope that this was just residue from a period of no medical care. But it sounds like you both have a lot of work to do--her to learn better coping mechanisms and you to find peace.

I don't see this as 'yay; she felt comfortable enough to tell you about her thoughts.' I see it as 'Fuck; she's still having these thoughts.'

Oh, and your shut-down? That's a PTSD reaction, and you know it.

dammit WAL, you know I know your right. learned it long before I met her though

and the rest of your post, well, there it is, that's pretty much it.

unsafe.