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Ds5 was diagnosed as ppd and adhd. The adhd Ive not paid much attention to because he is an active kid who needs to run. Ive rebuffed IC's request to medicate my son. Ive always said if he was bipolar okay but my ds needs to learn skills and run off his energy. Im there for ppd not his excess energy.

Well, in the 2 or 3 wks since we went to the IC he went to a seminar by a person named Sandwell (he, of course, wrote a book). What this Sandwell said makes sense to both IC and myself. The wounds of the family are passed down to the kids.

My dd7 puts herself down constantly. I do this, also, but never verbally and never in front of the kids. I have always been horrified and saddened to hear dd talk about herself the way I silently talk about myself (honestly my family and extended family always talked bad about me so I started doing the same thing to myself) I spend time trying to change her self thoughts

My son was born at a difficult time. I was four months pregnant when wh began whoring. I spent a total of 7 wks in the hospital. I was sad, angry and felt helpless because I couldnt fight back.

I felt a lot of hate

I will also admit for five minutes I didnt want my son. I was pregnant at the time

When ds was born, I felt no connection. I had a csection. Wh was texting her while he was in front of me in the prep.

While I was in the or I didnt exist for him. The csection was the worst bc I could feel people touching me but I couldnt move. He didnt even aknowledge my presence...when I needed him. (Keep in mind this comment)

I didnt see my son for two days. He was on the otherside of the hospital in nicu and I had lost so much blood I had a bad fever and had to be transfused.

Wh bullied me to leave the hospital. He dropped me off with dd and that was it.

The next day I drove a hour in snow to see my son. I had my husbands pregnant niece and her h with me but I drove

The ic and I figure out that ds saw in my face what was not meant for him but he didnt know that. He saw pain and anger and felt it was for him. He saw me frustrated and crying when I couldnt calm him in the middle of the night

I had asked the hospital for help and explained the situation. They wouldnt help me.

Weeks later wh niece gave birth and the hospital tripped over themselves to help her (different hospital). Family came from costa rica to help her

Wh was told by family, friends and ow and her people I was being a drama queen asking for help.

Recently I was told of a dream where the person saw my son drown in a pool. This person described accurality the description of the location.

Later, after hearing about the dream I asked my son if he knew Mami loved him. Initially he looked at me as if I had two heads then he finally said yes, he knew but the look on his face told me its not what he believes

My sweet boy has come to need to sit on my lap. He needs to have all of my attention and acts up badly if I try to have a conversation with someone. Im the only one he does this to.

During graduation from preschool I could see his suprise and happiness I was there...even tho its me at those functions. Usually not wh. Wh was there, too, that day. Ds came to me to put his straw in his juice box not wh.

Ds ppd ic asked me about my family. Well, I walked away after dealing with years I was told I was a whore, theif etc and for making repsoonsible for them and xyz. I mentioned I was at least eemotionally seperating from wh. Even tho he comes home and wants to take us out, he puts me down in regards to my job (fact I work 2 hrs a day free while I get paid for 8), I cant count on him to support us (when I needed him after csection and then back surgery he was not there...he has never been there when I needed him. My opinion is this: he is maderesponsible for everyone Iin his foo. The fact I am self sufficient. he feels I should remain that way. He feels if he pays the rent and car insurance that is good enough. Asking him to drive the kids to school interfers in his sleep. Asking him to drive the kids **to** (not from camp) interfers with his landscaping side job which doesnt benefit the kids nor myself. Same as in past yrs. We get bare minimum bc I am self sufficient and how dare I interfer with his life and his responsibilities.

To go back to ic I said I was detatching. He pointed this out. Not a good thing im teaching my kids. True, I thought later that night but what else can one do when dealing with toxic?

Ic did say what I thought for a longtime, if I walked out on wh wh would just use the kids to mess with me. Go against what is good for them just to get back on me. Why? Im not like his two baby mamas...I wont drool and fawn when he walks in.

Two other things I realised I married someone with all the same characteristics as my foo. I married my foo.

Another thing I realised...mentally I have been ready to leave for the last year I have to learn money disciplin im working on that now.

Before I end, this family wound thing....it can go back 20 generations. To cure the kid, the family must be healed.

Oh Sully, there is so much in that post. I'm sorry you were dealt with a lot of crap and your self esteem is shot because of it.

Your kids know you love them. I hope you don't think that the love you show them isn't evident to them. They act out because they are kids and they have been exposed to a lot of toxic behaviors from you and your WH. But...I truly feel that it can change.

I hope you continue going to a good IC and learn to love yourself. I hope you can get the strength to leave him once and for all and stop being afraid. Your insight is there, that is huge. Now you just have to take the steps to make the changes happen.

Please stop doubting your strength and self worth. You can start the healing right now, with you, and change the legacy of dysfunction that your family gave you. You don't HAVE TO leave the same legacy to your kids. You have the power to let it end with you.

(((Sully)))

AN my dd knows I love her. Her birth was different. When she passed through me the feeling I experienced was huge and indescribable. To call it love is a down play on words.

My ds...totally different birth. Very lonely. Detatched. Aweful.

Leaving wh can no longer be an option. We had a fight today because he was out from 730am to 1130am cutting grass and I didnt make food for him.

Well first that job does not benefit us. Second last night I questioned if he was at work because the background sounded exactly like when he was at ow's. I wasnt rude. I didnt yell. I calmly and quietly said I didnt think he was at work. Also I didnt hear his walkie talkie which is always on. He did what he always did when I called him out on a lie: he got beligerant.

So no, I didnt want to cook for him.

Then he used the text I sent to him last night but shouldnt have: he said I should just write a book and leave him alone. Those are someone elses words Not his.

He also said I use the kids against him. Why because Imistakenly thought he would step up. At the time he blew the gasket on big green, I mentioned camp. He at the time said a) I need to get off my ass and start doing things (I have been doing all things kid) b) He felt that taking them to camp interfered with his working out. When I fed his words back to him along with months of complaints about having to get up to take the kids to school, he then said he didnt have an issue. Its the truck he is using is not safe for the kids. True but that has not been the words coming out of his mouth.

He says everyfhing that comes out of my mouth is an excuse.

I finally said what ive felt for years: I cannot depend on him. I cannot depend on him as a father or husband

He will eventually conceed where the kids are concerned. He will think its better he step up but not until we have had words.

If I need him he is never there. I got locked out of my car two yrs ago and he wouldnt help me. He had the key and worked 20 mins away but wouldnt help me. But when I had his truck bc he needed it at the house by 6pm he came to help when it didnt start.

When I had back surgery he want there...and berated me because I couldnt reach anything that was waist high.

After the csection he was not there.

Anytime I need him.

Recently two teenaged boys in town died in an accident. One boy lived down the street. In the few times I saw him I thought he was a great boy. But upon hearing this childs passing I felt guilty bc last yr I had issues with their family. They have a way of turning a good dog mean and said dog came down to our yard and almost bit my kid and two other kids. Twice. When I told wh what happened to the boy and the guilt I felt he said then next time I wont go arguing unnecesarily with the neighbors.

Recently I met up with a coworker who retired. She was telling me about her new boyfriend. He would drive with one hand one the wheel and the ofher hand around her shoulder or on her knee.

I may not feel I will ever find what my former coworker has but I cant continue wifh what I have now. I dont know why, but after the argument where he stormed off, I feel a huge amount of guilt. I feel as tho I did something wrong or didnt do it right. At the same time my brain is saying wash rinse repeat. He is a bully and manipulator.

Now to connect this why Ive not left him thiz year. Financially.

When I was a teen I was saving money to buy school clothes and for a future house. The egg donar would take my money. So I did as she did...I spent it (before she got it). Now im struggling to practise financial responsibility which is more than making sure the bills are paid. If I can get that part together I will be lat the courthouse

If I can get myself together maybe I can heal some of those family wounds.

Maybe

While I believe that we do teach our children all manner of things (and transmit a million other things, genetically), the notion that a mother's fleeting thoughts of not wanting to be pregnant or her pain/unhappiness after the birth of the baby somehow imprint and determine the tenor of a child's life is simplistic and, IMO, potentially harmful for all. Especially for you, Sully.

You have spent your life taking responsibility for others' feelings. Your IC should be helping you to recognize that the only thoughts, feelings, and actions for which you are responsible are your own.

Certainly, you have a duty to protect your children's feelings. To cherish them and love them. But no, a thousand times no. You are NOT responsible for your child's disorders. Your thoughts and feelings did NOT create them.

You love your son. Yes, you have responsibility for parenting him well, for getting him appropriate care, and so on.

But "care" does NOT translate to accepting, "My thoughts and feelings created his disorders."

Why is this an attractive explanation? Is it because it fits in with your tendency to self-flagellate?

What real understanding of your son's issues or needs does it offer? How does it help guide you? (IMO, it reinforces the notion that you should not have your own thoughts and feelings--which is a profoundly harmful message for someone in your shoes to hear.)

Your children really are not an extension of you. They are individuals. And this line of thought...well, it doesn't align with that at all.

I am SO glad you're in IC--really, it's something many of us have long hoped for.

But ---not to put too fine a point on it--I think this line of "explanation" for a child's developmental delays is absurd, and I would not go down that path. It will not help you parent more effectively. And worse, it send YOU a dangerous message--one that feeds into the immobilizing self-esteem issues that have trapped you in a life you do not want. It says, "Sully, if you have negative feelings, you will harm your son."

Yes. Your moods, behaviors, methods of coping, and so on DO affect your son.

TODAY. And tomorrow, and for as long as you are together.

They affect him. They did not create PDD and ADHD. They may affect how you respond to those disorders. And certainly, as parent, we moderate our behavior to promote our kids' well-being.

However, this modification does not require assuming responsibility for the causation of your child's neurological conditions. Would you believe this IC if you were told that your child had appendicitis because you were angry at your husband yesterday? Because being told that your facial expression shortly after birth created a "wound" that determined your son's neurological status is about as ridiculous.

You did not pass your wounds on to him in utero, or by the look on your face when you visited shortly after birth. You did not damage him---and will not damage him--by respecting and expressing your feelings, as long as you take reasonable care to express them in a responsible manner.

Honestly, I think this was quite possibly the WORST message you could possibly have been given in IC, Sully.

Would it not have been more constructive to look at how your choices NOW impact your children psychologically? Because THAT would be a very valid concern. Your feelings didn't cause your son neurological damage. Your choices now DO impact your kids, psychologically.

Only, now this IC's got you thinking that your feelings and thoughts and facial expression can literally physically harm your kids. For a woman who's had tremendous difficulty even admitting the abuse she endures, this kind of message is horrifying. It is exactly the kind of thinking that has kept you in this toxic marriage.

All that said, regarding FOO: I married my father. And I was with him for well over 20 years before I saw my husband's resemblance. I would have laughed at anyone who suggested it earlier. The resemblance is not there, superficially. But I did, indeed, place myself in a position to live what was "comfortable," if very harmful to me. So I really get that.

That's why a good IC is so important---because it can help you learn how to model healthy relationships to your kids. You can learn how to more positively direct your life, and empower your kids to do the same in their lives. (And who says that teaching your kids to detach from toxicity is a bad lesson?! I wish someone had taught me!)

I really hope that this IC will help you find ways to make constructive changes, rather than find ways to evade your feelings and rein in constructive actions, lest you "pass wounds" on to your children.

ETA: I'm glad to read your last post, Sully. Keep the momentum. Find a way out of that marriage. You deserve better. The trick is BELIEVING you do.

[This message edited by solus sto at 2:29 PM, July 7th (Sunday)]

((Sully))