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LearningToFly posted 7/30/2013 20:50 PM

Why is it that I am always in the way of my husband doing the respectful thing...?

I let it slip a couple days ago that his affair partners father died. He acted so devastated. (This is the man who was IMing with his girlfriend all evening while I made a story board for my sisters funeral). Today he gives me a poem about his indecision about us and how he wants to make a commitment to just us, not other options. HE " has hope for our relationship - we are going to make it." THEN he tells me that he plans to send a card with a poem he wrote to his affair partners mother expressing sympathy for the loss of her husband. His AP was a girlfriend 40 years ago and he hadn't seen or heard from her up until 2 years ago. Why does he feel the need to send a card and especially write a poem when our marriage is so broken over her daughter and his affair? When he snuck up to see her last summer, he met her at the parents house. The mother could tell that something was going on yet asked my WH to be a facebook friend. (This woman is in her 80s). I almost started crying and asked him why he felt that he needed to get involved anymore. He said again it is to pay his respects. I said what about respect for me. He did not act sorry that I was hurt. He expects me to understand and appreciate that he told me instead of just doing it.

I have been thinking about it all afternoon. He is busy...he knows that I am hurt and I think he is avoiding. He was going to go to a concert near the area that this AP mom lives. He is going alone. I can't go. (He didn't even ask me at first, then I suggested that I go but tickets are sold out - He already bought his). I didn't think he would be seeing her. I did make it clear that it hurt me that he even considered going after all that happened in the same place, at the same time, while also doing something without me. He insisted that it was for the concert only...I didn't feel I could ask that he not go. He bought the ticket. I decided to let it go. If he cheats, he cheats I can't stop him. BUT, now I am not comfortable. If he thinks that it is okay in anyway to have any contact with her mother (which of course the AP will hear about and be encouraged) then I don't feel safe.

Our marriage counselor met with him today. According to him, she asked me not to contact the husband until after we meet. (We have been fighting about this a lot in the past several weeks.) I am thinking that when we go together on Thursday, I will say that I am willing to show "respect" for the loss of this woman's husband and GFs father but I don't want him to send the poem he wrote for the guy. He and she spent lots of time writing poetry to each other and he promised her he would write a poem for her sick father. To me he is just reaching out again. I saw on face book her subliminal messages reaching out to him also. I told him this. It didn't affect him as far as being sensitive to me. I am willing to send the card with BOTH of us signing it and ME writing in it. I will also bring up that I am no longer comfortable with him going to the concert. It doesn't matter what he says...he has SHOWN me through this experience that he is still not over her. And I still feel I have to contact her spouse. I can wait a few more days. I tried early on and she was blocking me. I gave up but it hangs over my head and I feel guilty for not doing it. I could call with him listening if necessary. I just need to do it. This may mean the end of my marriage. I have a hard time telling my husband that I don't want or do want him to do something. I learned early on that he will punish me with the silent treatment, do it anyway, or get back some way. I tell him how I feel about what he wants to do but my feelings don't affect his decisions. He does what he wants.

As I write this I think that I am so stupid to stay. He shows no concern for my feelings. Its all about what he wants or thinks he needs. I am afraid if I make an ultimatum, he will just give up. He is like a spoiled little boy. His childlikeness is endearing to many and it used to be to me too. Now I feel like I live with a selfish, entitled spoiled brat with the power to ruin my daily life and future.

Tearsoflove posted 7/30/2013 20:59 PM

You have to set boundaries and you have to decide what the consequences will be if he chooses to step over them.

My boundary would be:

No card to her mother.
No concert in her area.

Choosing to do either sends a very clear message concerning what his priorities are and my consequence for not putting me first would be filing for divorce. He gets to make the choice. Period.

You will have to decide if you are strong enough to enforce the consequences of a boundary that you set.

summerain posted 7/30/2013 21:06 PM

Learning to Fly

I remember when you first came on how devastated you were. From my recollection it seems things have definitely improved. You already know these demands are completely bullshit. I think now it's just what you are going to do about it.

Do you have any ideas?

brkn_heartd posted 7/30/2013 21:08 PM

I agree with tears of love. The other thing I would add it do NOT tell him that you will be contacting her husband or when. Decide to do it and then do it. If he still has feelings he will try to protect her and they will make you out to be the crazy one. Keep your cards close to your chest before you make a move.

If your marriage ends, remember you did not do it. HE did it. He is making his choices now and every day that he does not take care of you.

Tearsoflove posted 7/30/2013 21:23 PM

I second brkn and raise removing "Mom" from his facebook friends, too. And anyone else involved in that friendship but not with your marriage.

womaninflux posted 7/31/2013 07:45 AM

You, like many of us (especially those of us who are partners/spouses of Sex Addicts), are probably co-dependent. This is probably due to how you grew up in your own family.

This is what I have learned in 4 + months and a few thousand dollars of therapy.

NeverAgain2013 posted 7/31/2013 10:06 AM

TearsOfLove is absolutely RIGHT.

Why is going to a concert - supposedly ALONE - in a town close to her???

Were there NO consequences at all for his betrayal?

And now he's going to write a poem to his OW's mother in honor of the death of her husband?

What is wrong with him?

You're going to need to start doing some heavy lifting if you want your marriage to work. This guy is just doing whatever the heck he wants and you're just reacting to it.

But he's doing it because he knows he can.

Please reach down deep and tap that inner strength you didn't know you had.

TxsT posted 7/31/2013 11:15 AM


The best sentence spoken to me in the great fog right after our Dday was:

Figure out what makes you safe and ask for it!!!

You have identified several things in your post that I can tell don't make you feel safe....face book, returning to an area the affair happened alone, not thinking of inviting you to the concert...etc

Any of these things would have sent me packing. Is your husband showing you any consideration for the hurt, pain, and instability he has introduced to your life?? Do you see shame in his eyes?

I am behind the others when they say these things need to be addressed. Right now his actions are showing me he doesn't care about how he hurt you. You deserve more then that.


solus sto posted 7/31/2013 11:24 AM

No card to Mom.
No poem to Mom.
No contact of ANY kind with Mom.

These all breach NC. Every single one of them.

OW's husband needs to know. This is not something to be negotiated in MC. It's not something to discuss with your husband. (If you do, NC ---if it exists---will be broken, as he warns OW that the message is coming.)

The man has the right to know the truth about his life. He needs to be tested for STDs.

And OW does NOT need to be given the almost-certain heads-up she'll get from your husband, whose priorities are still horrendously skewed (and who seems to be clinging more to OW and her family, at this foggy, foggy point, than to you and your marriage.)

Tell OBS. Do not tell your husband in advance. If possible, contact him at his place of business. (I sent a letter requiring OBS's signature to his office so that his wife ---who HAD been warned, as it turned out, by my "NC" husband--- could not intercept it. I was kind, I was gentle, and I gave just enough information to make it very clear I was telling the truth--with an offer of more if he wanted it.)

Your husband is not in the game yet. I hope he gets there.

Frankly, I would not go to MC with a man who had not yet shown real remorse, empathy for me, or commitment to the marriage. That he's talking about you with the MC shows a lack of boundaries. Delivering the "wait to tell OBS" thing is sheer manipulation.

MC with a WH who is not yet occupying the right headspace can be emotional suicide for the BS.

In your shoes, I'd find an IC. For you. I'd perhaps consider the current MC as WH's IC. But I would NOT see that person for MC, because she's already aligning with your husband. (Besides, I think it is usually a TERRIBLE mistake to have an MC who is also IC to either partner. It very rarely works.)

[This message edited by solus sto at 11:25 AM, July 31st (Wednesday)]

TxsT posted 7/31/2013 11:39 AM

Solus...thank you for reminding me that I didn't speak about telling the other hurt spouse.

Tell him immediately. It will be the most awkward conversation to start but it will take on a life of its own once you get that first hurtful sentence out. Your husband is afraid of this guys reactions and possibly some of the information the OW might have to say. He might be exposed as a liar.

I didn't hesitate to call the OS. I felt that, until he knew what was going on, the A was not going to stop. I will never forget that call but the OS was so thankful I alerted him to the situation because he feels now he would never have known otherwise. In our case we are dealing with an OW that does not have the faintest clue what she did was wrong. She is in LaLa land still and repeatedly says I have taken her true love away from her. I constantly feel like I am in the bunny boiler movie fatal attraction....she just won't leave us alone. I feel so sorry for her husband at times and I am extremely angry that she has pissed all over mine. It wasn't until she was very recently demoted at work that she has finally started looking at the fact that she might need to change. This is 10 months after Dday!

Call the will NEVER regret it and too bad for your hubby. He just wants this to be easy for him. Well it's not going to be and the sooner he gets that the better for you.

LearningToFly posted 7/31/2013 15:57 PM

I think the hardest part about all of this is finding out that the man I loved and believed in so much, gave myself to in every way and brought and raised children with could be such an unfeeling monster. Either that or I am just plain crazy and don't see what the counselors that are telling him to speak up and tell me his needs (even when they involve the OW and reestablishing contact with her) are trying to do to help us. I want them to tell him that he is being so unkind and destructive to me. He says he wants our marriage yet he is crushing me with his priorities and attitudes.

Tearsoflove posted 7/31/2013 16:10 PM

IC counselors often give advice to "speak your needs" without regard for how those needs affect the spouse. An IC counselor's priority is the individual, not the marriage. If your MC is telling him this at your expense, it's time to get a new MC.

But I agree that a remorseless man is not going to benefit from MC and his IC is obviously helping him to be even more selfish than he already is if his advice is "speak your needs" even when it relates to the OW.

Learning, read about the 180. You are not in R. R involves two people making each others needs top priority and working to heal together. You are working all by yourself with a man whose "needs" trump yours at every turn.

Lay down your law and then 180. He'll either do it or he won't. Start working on getting the strength to stand up for yourself. If he comes around while you're working on yourself, great. If he doesn't, you'll be strong enough to decide that you don't need this bullshit in your marriage.

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