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cantaccept posted 8/2/2013 05:06 AM

H and I were talking yesterday briefly about some specific actions of his during his a that cause me pain, memories.

He listened as I talked, nodded in agreement with, that is what happened, that is what I was thinking (wanting ow with him on our vacation, sharing photos, being happy, excited, talking to her, texting her constantly, even after being intimate with me but mean to me)

His response was I am sorry that this happened. I will never do this again.

My feelings to that, flat, empty, alone.

Why can't I feel that he is trying? WHy is this not enough for me?

I know I want to hear it more personalized, like he understands, takes responsibility for his actions.

Is it me? Am I expecting too much? I get that expressing these emotions are difficult for him, new to him.

He was not very supportive last night when I came home from work. He could see the sadness all over me.

He said he is waiting for me to be happy just one day. He keeps asking why am I not reaching you.

He knows, I have told him.

Last night I wanted to read with him, wanted to ask.

I did not, I have told him that I need him to initiate. I am tired of begging (that is what it feels like).

Instead he avoided me all night.

MC says that my request for reading is my test. If he cannot follow thru on this then how can I trust him to give anything more. If this small request is not honored then it is not safe to expose other, deeper needs.

I hate this pain.

TrulySad posted 8/2/2013 08:05 AM

(((Can't accept)))

It's so hard to know what is real, and what's an act to save themselves. I was in a 22 year marriage and never saw what I needed to see from my ex-WH. After five years of hoping, pleading, and looking...I finally gave up and walked away.

Your WH does seem to have some signs of remorse. But I think only time and your intuition will key you into it's sincerity, or lack of. Once I was able to get away from my pain, and look at my ex-WH's actions, I saw I had healed on my own, and realized he never really got the trauma and devistation he inflicted upon me and our marriage. You husband seems to at least be showing signs of wanting to help. That's a positive thing!

I almost wrote that he needs to do more...but that's not true. Its not about telling him what he needs to be doing. I think remorse is shown in the tone they take when talking to you. In the thousand ways they WANT to be transparent. In the fear you see in their eyes when they realize they could lose you, and how horrible they feel for hurting you. In the way they make you feel when around other women. In the way they understand your emotions are all over the place. And in the way they take the iniciative to search for more ways to make things better.

These are all things that can't be faked. They may differ from one person to another, in how they are performed or delivered....but you, the one who knows them so well, you will know if it's sincere and real. Eventually.

Take care and I hope you can find some peace in all this.

mepe27 posted 8/2/2013 08:20 AM

I can only share my experience with this, it may not be everyones.

My H was not remorseful for the first few months, very foggy, trying to convince me of is crazy logic, it was horrible. Once I left and the fog started to dissipate, he was remorseful but not like some other spouse we hear, he wasn't crying, begging, doing everything for me, but my H was never like that and thats ok for me. However, I had my requirements for R, I needed to see the phone, I needed to know where he was, etc and after I came back he did all of those things without question. Once he saw what was helping me, he'd try things to see if they helped, he called me and talked to me the entire ride home so I knew he wasn't using that time to talk to anyone else, that did help and I didn't as for that.

But the comforting part was very confusing for him. One night I triggered and ran out of the living room into the bed room, what I wanted was for him to come to me, apologize and tell me how much he loved me, and just hold me. Instead he came in, looked at me and walked out. I just freaked out!!! I couldn't take it anymore and I screamed that he wasn't helping me he wasn't making things better and he very honestly told me he didn't know what to do. He said he saw me there so sad and knew it was him that caused it, he thought that the site of him was probably making it worse and wanted to give me some peace some time to not see his face.

I realized then that he wanted to help me but I needed to give him instructions. I totally resisted that b/c I felt like if I had to tell him what to do it wouldn't mean as much but I will tell you from experience when I said "I need you to apologize and hold me" the next time and he came over and did that for me I felt 100 times better than I did when he walked out that other night. And as I explained what I needed he sort of got the hang of it and tried stuff on his own, but he needed the instruction initially.

My last point here is if I had said I need you to hold me and he had looked me in the eye and said no, or held me for 30 seconds, I think I would need to start evaluating that and not true remorse. As you know, actions speak louder than words and if you directly ask and explain what you need and they say no, they are sending you a clear message that they don't want to help you heal. So if you explain to him that you need him to read with you, that you are hurting and in order to heal you need him to do this with you ( be clear or else he might not see the connection to healing ) and he says no, you'll know right away how sincere he is. imo.

cantaccept posted 8/2/2013 08:37 AM

It has been 8 months since first dday, 6 months since he moved back home.

He is just beginning to express remorse, just beginning to try to help.

I have asked so many times for a couple of specific things. Expressed how they help me and my believ that they will help us.

He seems to do it, if I remind him, which makes me feel worse.

Now I will no longer ask, he knows what I need, he knows I am in pain, he knows he is the cause. It is up to him.

I do have to admit that he apologized for being "emotionally unavailable" last night and not helping me when I needed it.

I did ask him if he was aware that we had not read together for a week. He said yes, he said he is avoiding it, it hurts.

He will either realize that going through the hurt, working towards healing is what he wants, it is his choice.

My choice is do I trust him with my heart? Do I feel that he is committed? Is it enough for me?

I guess it's hard to admit that there are consequences to your actions.

shatteredheart7 posted 8/2/2013 08:49 AM

I agree with MePe. My Dh has told me repeatedly during our marriage that he is not a mind reader. I always thought that sounded harsh, but now I understand it. How can someone know what you need to make you feel better or what you want to do or just simply what is going on in your head, if you don't tell them? I don't look at it like begging, but communicating. And lets face it, some men (and women too) need to be reminded over and over again before they "get it". Our love language use to be total opposites of each other. One thing we found out in MC is that we had a problem communicating our feelings, thoughts, problems, needs, etc with each other.

If you both haven't taken the quiz to find what your individual love language is I highly recommend doing it. Our MC recommended the book to us and it really helped us both to understand what the other needed.

((((BIG HUGS))))))))

heforgotme posted 8/2/2013 09:21 AM

WH told me not long after DDay that it was hard for him to know how to act around me. For example, he might want to hug me, but then he wouldn't be sure if I wanted him to, so he wouldn't. And what I told him was that he needed to be BRAVE. If he hugged me, might I have pushed him away? Yes. Too bad. Do it anyway. If he said I love you, might I have rolled my eyes? Yes. Too bad. Do it anyway.

An A is cowardly. Someone is too lazy or scared to deal with the real issues/problems, so they go do this. It is completely cowardly. So now, they need to be brave.

It is not brave to HIDE your emotions, it is brave to SHOW them. It is brave to make yourself vulnerable to another person when you don't know how they will react. We BSes have to be brave every day. Attempting R with someone who has already proven they are willing to hurt you is brave. The least the WS can do is be brave too.

He keeps asking why am I not reaching you.

There is a book called "When Sorry Isn't Enough". I think another version was also published under the title "The 5 Languages of Apology". If he is sincere about "reaching" you, then perhaps he should read this to give him ideas as to how to do that more effectively.

Good luck. I hope he will be the brave man you deserve.

TxsT posted 8/2/2013 09:35 AM

Truly...what a well written post. I feel very much like you do about this.

When I was still suffering in my initial fog, I had no idea what was true and what wasn't. My WH liked to couch his info about the A because he knew how much it killed me. He is a people pleaser, he want's everyone to be his friend and the fact that he had to look at me day to day literally disintegrating right in front of his eyes because of what he had done was worse then going straight to hell for him.

He was remorseful from minute one....and I can honestly say this because the affair was already dead in his eyes and he had a good amount of time to realize for himself what a shit he had been. I certainly didn't need to tell him.

My problem was I didn't have the foggiest clue what I needed from him in the beginning. You go through so many stages and different levels of pain during the first 6 months that my needs changed sometimes hourly. I would ask for something and he would comply without hesitation but nothing seemed to be the magic pill.

I find the most comfort in the smallest little things. A tentative smile, helping around the house on his own, thinking to make dinner reservations and just surprising me. Cuddling me in the middle of the night when he thinks I am asleep. The little things people do that they don't have to do....those are what bring me the most comfort. Those are also the things that make me sure we will survive this.

T

[This message edited by TxsT at 9:53 AM, August 2nd (Friday)]

shatteredheart7 posted 8/2/2013 09:42 AM

"I find the most comfort in the smallest little things. A tentative smile, helping around the house on his own, thinking to make dinner reservations and just surprising me. Cuddling me in the middle of the night when he thinks I am asleep. The little things people do that they don't have to do....those are what bring me the most comfort. Those are also the things that make me sure we will survive this."

I couldn't agree more!!!!

TxsT posted 8/2/2013 09:59 AM

shattered...

:o) !!!!

At some point in time we BS's just have to make a leap of faith that what we are seeing, consistency and honesty in my case, is exactly what the WS wants to give.

I will never forgive him 100% but I can give him the gift that I respect his continued attempts at making things right by positively acknowledging his efforts as well as his own pain. Some WS's hurt too and in my case he hurts real bad.

My most recent positive step was reaching out my hand at dinner the other night and telling him that he has come a long way in making me feel better and now it is time that I help him through his pain. The tears in his eyes told me everything I needed to know!!

T

cantaccept posted 8/2/2013 10:03 AM

I am trying so hard to be appreciative of what he is able to do.

I believe that so much damage was inflicted, first by discovery and abandonment on the same day, dealing with this alone and his blaming me for it through his texts and emails, sucking me back in twice and betraying me the next day (my fault for not protecting myself). Then allowing him back, still blaming me, saying cruel things.

Honestly I feel as if I have been fighting a battle alone until just about 2 weeks ago.

Touch is wonderful, sleeping in his arms.

I guess I am looking for more. Do things for me, just for me in a caring way.

Make dinner for me, so it's ready when I get home, not there's food, go get it if you're hungry.

Maybe I want to be pampered for a bit.

It was so very hard this winter alone.

So many things I had to deal with alone.

I was accosted by a man in a parking lot, I was terrified being alone at night after that, of going our after dark.

I got lost in a blizzard, he took the gps.

I spent hurricane Sandy alone, in the dark, no phone, nothing.

I just felt abandoned, peripheral to everyone.

I want to feel special for a while, feel like I and my heart are the most precious thing to him. At least for a while.

Kind of like when you have had an injury (physical) and you are pampered, soothed.

I know how to do that for others, sad but I have never received it. Never even knew until recently.

Talking in IC, I have realized no one has ever taken care of me, I have always been abused, I never recognized that this wasn't the way life should be.

Maybe, that is why now, I crave so much. I feel like inside I am screaming.

confused615 posted 8/2/2013 10:19 AM

I think true remorse reveals itself in time.

After dday,many WS's are scrambling. They tell us they will do anything to save the marriage,help us,etc. And,for awhile,that may be true. But, then their anger pops up. We hear,"Why aren't you over this??" and "Nothing I do is enough,why try?" "Poor me!Poor me! Poor me!!"

Or they start blameshifting and gaslighting.

Or you find out they're still lying.

I think a lot of the time,many BS's are in a fog of our own. Our worlds have just been blown apart,and we desperately want to believe what our WS's are telling us. So we mistake regret for remorse...their tears as tears of shame and remorse..not tears because they got caught and now have to deal with the fallout.

I think it takes time.. lot of time..to figure out if your WS is showing TRUE remorse.

[This message edited by confused615 at 10:20 AM, August 2nd (Friday)]

TrulySad posted 8/2/2013 11:45 AM

I feel so sad for you Cantaccept . You've been through so so much. I know how alone you must feel. And honestly, you shouldn't have to appreciate what your husband's been doing. It's his place to make you feel safe and loved and wanted and whatever else you need from him. He put you in this horrid position.

I've been where you are, and at times I still find myself in it. Seven years ago I left my abusive cheating ex, and had to deal with five children, protective orders, police, lawyers, and all the responsibilities of a home and family. I had no support, and it was beyond difficult. BUT I did make it through, and amazingly well.

You're clearly trying to R, and I wish you positive thoughts. I was never one who could just let myself cry. Because my ex wasn't remorseful and compassionate, I buried my pain. I cried quietly and alone. I never told people I had kicked him out, till six months after the fact. I wanted to be strong. As soon as my oldest was old enough to watch my other kids, I would take drives at night, to look for clarity beyond my four walls at home. It helped. Cranked the music up, and just drove.

In my most recent relationship, since DD almost 6 months ago... I've slowly found myself crawling into a hole. It's exhausting and you just want someone to step in and take care of you. This is hard to admit, but on a couple of occasions I had too much wine to drink, and found myself crying, sad and angry with my WBF. He would hold me, and just listen... one of the things I kept repeating was "I just want to go home". I had this strong need for a "mom" to be mom to me. I don't have a mom who is there for me... But I am that type of mom for my children, and it's so hard to feel the pain of needing the comfort of someone to take care of you, and not having it. It's so hard and almost painful.

Have you tried expressing this to your WH? It may take you letting these emotions out with tears, to get him to understand you need this like you need air right now.

Please know you aren't alone. And even if none of us know each other, there are so many who know and understand your pain. I hope your WH is the man you want and need him to be, and finds a way to comfort you.

If this doesn't happen, stay strong, and look into yourself for that comfort. It's possible, and it can work. You just need to love yourself and know you're worth taking care of...

crazyblindsided posted 8/2/2013 14:12 PM

I think it takes time.. lot of time..to figure out if your WS is showing TRUE remorse.

Yep I think so too.

one of the things I kept repeating was "I just want to go home". I had this strong need for a "mom" to be mom to me. I don't have a mom who is there for me... But I am that type of mom for my children, and it's so hard to feel the pain of needing the comfort of someone to take care of you, and not having it. It's so hard and almost painful.

I totally relate to this in my early days of DDay I hollered for my mom to come hold me and save me. I felt like ripping my skin off it was so painful.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 2:14 PM, August 2nd (Friday)]

sleepless34 posted 8/11/2013 16:42 PM

My WS is very remorseful. But it doesn't seem to matter with me. All these posts, people are working so hard to try and work it out. I feel dead inside. I don't think I could ever forgive him because the trust is gone. I don't think I love him. Certainly I could not imagine a scenario in which I ever let him touch me again. I haven't seen any other posts like this. Is it me? Is it too early? 6 days since DDay. I am sad like in mourning of our life and sad for our kids and confused about how my life is going to move forward, but I don't think I want him back. Who else is with me?????