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We had a talk last night about the last 18 years, our marriage (and of course how boring i was as a wife) and WH just insisted on telling me how he misses OW and sees her all over town on her bike, or walking and as a result is now "haunted" by her and her memory.

But he does still want to work on the marriage. He said "why cant I have these feelings inside me for this other person and still work on my marriage with you?"

He says over time he will get over his feelings for her.

I didnt need to know any of that and I hate that he discussed something I asked him not to. That is something you work out on your own.

He then said if the situation were reversed and he was with OW instead of me, then he would be missing me instead and be haunted by me.

I know couples in R deal with OW and OM withdrawls but I dont think I'm up for it.

I've followed your posts.

Why are you trying to R with this man? He has cheated and lied..and lied..and lied. And now..after you told him you do NOT want to hear about his missing OW..he does just that. It's cruel. It's torture. It's abusive.

This stops when you say it stops. Do you really want to be with a man who has to fall out of lurrrrve with OW..while he "tries" to make your marriage work?

You deserve far better than this.

You are right confused615.

I've reached the point where I have no energy left for this relationship and told him so. I told him I would schedule a divorve appraiser to come to the house in the next few weeks.

He's gone silent today.

Spelljean,
I don't know your story, but my STBX was in this same place last month.
I told him that it was his problem, not mine.
If he says he would miss you, then let him have her.
I told my STBX that I would not R with him as long as he was still in that affair bubble.
I told him that evrything he was saying about her was TYPICAL and to google it and see that what he was feeling was not special at all, that all people who have affairs are stuck in that frame of mind and that it is not real.
Eventually he came out of that. Now, it's not even about her anymore. I don't really think it ever is.
The question you should be asking yourself if why be with a man who is emotionally with someone else?
I told myself I would never fight against another woman because the issues in my marriage are more than enough issues to fight against.
I think it's time to 180 him until he gets his head out of his ass at the very least.
This is not your issue and he should never, ever bring it to you. He should be in IC that has nothing to do with R at all, but working on his issues of why he went outside the marriage.
It was his choice no matter how "boring" you are. (What a load of shit.)
There is a time when you will believe who he is by what he has shown you. As many said about my STBX, he sounds weak.
Find your strength inside yourself and ask yourself what you truly want out of this marriage. I don't think you have it, will you ever?

Is he in counseling? If he is, what are his goals there? Can you talk with him in the presence of a MC or his IC and tell him what you need and how you feel? I have been where you are. It sucks.

He shouldn't talk to you about this if you don't want to hear it. If you want to hear it to ground yourself in the reality of who he is and what he is capable of- then listen to it and ask for it.

Maybe you are done, as you say. It is uo to you. take care of yourself. You deserve better.

[This message edited by OnAnIsland at 10:05 AM, August 11th (Sunday)]

I'm sorry but that is such a load of shit you're getting from him. Life is short, hideous and magical at onece... get rid.

(((Spelljean)))

I don't know your whole story, but I have read your recent thread about your WH's panic attacks.

Gently,

In light of him announcing that he is haunted by her and that he misses her, do you really think that his having lunch in her neighborhood and accidentally running in to her, was not planned on some level in his mind?

His panic attack brought on by stress from you?

Actions, not words. IMHO, the only hope you have of him pulling his head out of his a$$, is you clearly defining, by YOUR ACTIONS, what you will and will not accept.

Are you willing to be in limbo with a man who seems to be pining away for OW? I know many WS's are fogged, etc...
But this sounds like he is wrestling with his feelings for her so then he casually makes it so he can run into her...Why? To see if there is a spark? To see if she is still interested? Why? Did the panic attack not come from YOU, but from OW's response to him?

Either way, he is still in contact in his mind. There is nothing you can do, you can't stand on your head, plead, beg or make him change. You can only control you.

Start taking control back. Hugs Spelljean! It is so hard. Start focusing on you,

Thank you myperfect.

I know many WS after dday are thrown into reality. Then many here I read about are stuck in the fog still and dont come out quickly.

I understand how many BS file for D when faced with unremorseful WS and to me, this situation...telling me how he is haunted by OW and misses her, this does not show remorse. Nor does it demonstrate respect for my feelings.

He said he feels the need to be totally honest no matter how much it hurts me. Where was that honesty during the A? If his version of being a better man is telling me the truth about what he feels for OW while wanting to R with me at the same time, I can't ever fall back in love with such a "better" man.

Gurl you need to put on your bitch boots and 180 his Ass real hard. Work on yourself, develope outside interest and let him have his little trollup. His is very much in the fog and it will continue as long as he has contact with her.He is an idiot! If you give in to this man whilst he is pinning for her, he has no reason to change.
Right now he feels he has you in his back pocket. If you want to be with him, don't settle.

My H was pinning real hard. I tried reasoning and all sorts of sh!tz...makes me want to barf. Well I started being me, left his Ass alone, separated, had a ball... Miss Sparkle Pants wasn't so sparkly anymore. My lecturing only made him more sure of their destiny to be together, cause I was "insert trite term here" wife. The last time he saw her, without me in the back ground adding fuel, she looked bad. I won't say what he said, cause he still screwed her. Needless to say pop! We are separated but he is working real hard to win me back. Just be the best u, you can be regardless and don't settle.

He said he feels the need to be totally honest no matter how much it hurts me.

Whereas honesty is 99.9% a good thing, I feel that he is abusing it in this case to exonerate himself from guilt.

He DOESN'T care if it hurts you, and he doesn't want the thoughts to eat himself alive while he is pretending to be in R so he tells you he has feelings for her, and that he's seeing her.

He doesn't want to work on the marriage, Spelljean. He wants cake from you and cake from her, and he's getting it.

I know it sounds like you're going ahead with D, but it also sounds like you're confused about his intentions. This is why I'm responding and reiterating that he does not want R. He wants you on speed dial. That's different.

Also, there are no accidental lunches with former AP's. They don't just run into each other in random towns. He thinks that if he tells you he accidentally saw her, at least he's given you the info that they met, and therefore is putting the ball into your court for action. It's cowardly and cruel, it's not a step towards honesty.

I know it feels like you lose if you cut him loose, but truly you will be the winner here once his emotional hold on you is released. We're here to help show you that you deserve so much more than someone who thinks that consistently hurting you is the "right" thing to do.

If he loved you, he'd get the fuck over her.

(((Spelljean)))

[This message edited by Jrazz at 10:41 AM, August 11th (Sunday)]

My husband was remorseless. Still is, in fact.

When I read your posts, I see so much I've experienced.

The "I'm being HONEST because HONESTY is important" bullshit? That's the passive-aggressive way of intentionally inflicting pain.

The panic attacks? That's not because of stress from you; it's an internal temper tantrum. (If he has conscience, which my husband lacks, it might demonstrate a battle between that tiny remnant of conscience and actions that are contradictory to its dictates.)

Please, SJ, 180 this man. Your conversations are not productive; they are HARMFUL to you.

You've been hurt enough.

180. And follow through with the divorce appraiser.

You do not deserve to live one more minute this way, SJ. You really don't.

Life is too damn short.

Thanks so much for the responses and helpful insights.

WH mentioned last night that he did more with OW in that year then he did with me in 17 years.

And he was ADAMANT that I refused to do literally anything with him.

Wasn't true at all and wouldn't matter if it was rrue. Still blameshifting.

Then he said "it took me having an affair to get you to have sex with me"

Also a load of crap.

He feels I was competing with OW and I tried to explain HB to him but it fell on deaf ears.

I need to be deaf now.

He is such an idiot.

Spelljean,
Hugs to you. It's ok to get mad. FTG.
Even getting mad doesn't mean you can't give keep your options open down the line if he comes to his senses.
This is a guy who took it upon himself to ruin something that should have been a team effort.
Think about you for a minute. How long has it been since you've really thought about yourself? Just you. Just what you want?
I bet it's been a really long time.
Take a few days, or weeks...maybe months and think about you. Get a haircut, new clothes, go have lunch with friends, forget about whatever he is doing.
180, bitch boots, etc etc.
He took all that time for himself, why can't you?

A couple of random thoughts...

He wasn't being honest; he was being cruel. He was probably sabotaging himself as well. He also sounds like he's playing the Victim. Any one of those characteristics make him a lousy candidate for R. All 3 together ... yuck!

If the 2 of you led a boring life (and you don't sound boring to me, although he does), both of you are responsible. Blaming you is yet another indication he's not a candidate for R.

You're doing the right thing for yourself by going forward with your D - that's just so likely to be less painful than sticking with this guy.

He also might be playing a bit of the "let's see how much of an asshole I can be before she kicks me out... Then I can make her the bad guy." going on.

SJ, your DD is one day after mine. My wH is fully remorseful, and I *still* think about divorce. I can't imagine what's in it for to carry on in this relationship. He's giving you nothing. I've followed your story - you've pretty consistently painted him n a negative light. Read over your old posts. I think you've given this a good shot, and it's time to cry uncle.

Thank you, yes my WH has yet to do anything since dday that has shown remorse. I cant think of a single positive or proactive thing he has done to save the marriage. Everything he has.done has only been to save the option of staying married to me. Giving me just enough to not toss him away totally and keep some tiny crack in the window open to sneak back in. And while I have been living separate from him, he has managed to keep me on the hook enough to think that R might be a possibility eventually.

Truth is, I like living alone now. I like not seeing him all the time.

Just why I held out that shred of hope that he may come to his senses...don't know the answer to that. What I have been doing though by acting this way is allowing him to cake eat.

And the cherry in top is I get to know how he is torn up inside over OW. Just so he can be honest with me.

I can calmly move on. Actually was offered another job in Seattle! Two states away.

,

(((SJ)))

I agree w/others. Honesty isn't the same as deliberate cruelty.

I'd carry forth on the path to D. If there is any small modicum of sincerity to R in your WH, that may be the thing to light a fire under his ass.

Keep taking care of you.

180 immediately. No more conversations.

The X said almost the same thing to me--he said I should just have put up with him & the OW until he got over it; really?? I told him I don't share.

Just turn this around and imagine what he would say if you approached him with this scenario; ludicrous, right?

Oooh, I LOVE Seattle!

I know it is gut wrenching to think about pulling the trigger on this relationship, but it's going to save you.

If it makes sense to move to a new place for a new job OUTSIDE of all this A business, I say go for it. A change of venue is a wonderful way to get a fresh start and to slough off old feelings and triggers. It doesn't fix everything, but it does allow you to breathe some fresh air.

(((Spelljean)))

[This message edited by Jrazz at 4:48 PM, August 11th (Sunday)]