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My thought process now is that if I am truly doing what is right for my kids then I would stop the D. They are suffering so bad. I can see the ruin of them. Any kids from a divorced home that I know didn't fare well at all.

Also, it really falls on me. If I were to stop talking about the A and made the choice to go back, I would have more financial security. Also, to be honest, he has those qualities that are rare for me. He does want to R, I know he does love me. I do love him.
Its going to kill me to see him with another. He does stuff that I don't see other men doing. I mean he did everything for me, the laundry, the cars, the cooking, groceries; I did not of that. Not even my sisters husband does that.

Its like the state he is in right now, I can order him around a bit amd he will do it. Recently he picked me and the kids up from the airport at 1:30am. Our flight got in late. I was going to have a car pick me up. I asked him why he did that...he said because you wanted me to.

Its like he is wallowing in shame and a little puppy dog. I know I would be guiding the relationship.

Thoughts?

Are you going to feel secure in this relationship? Or will you be waiting for the next "mantrum" that he throws... Followed by bouts of unexplained time away from the house, mysterious phone calls and copious amounts of time spent on his computer?

Just because he does things for you doesn't mean you'll be living a happily married life. Will you be fulfilled in other areas? Emotionally? Mentally?

Basically it sounds like you are asking if its ok to rug sweep. The answer is sure! You can do whatever the heck you want- its your life. How do you want to live it?

I don't know your story.. But most of us have a similar script. I'm not interested in living my life with a liar and cheater. You?

[This message edited by PurpleRose at 8:15 AM, August 12th (Monday)]

What PurpleRose said. The wallowing and shame won't last forever. Eventually reality sets back in and if they don't truly do the work on themselves it's just a matter of time before some black hole filling activity starts up again.

Doing the work on yourself applies to the BS as well. For me I didn't start to heal and move on until I let go of the outcome and focused on myself. It gave me enough strength to see that my STBX wasn't really putting forth any effort at all and I was in for another DDay at some point so I chose to D. If you focus on you then the FEAR goes away and you can make better decisions.

IMO, staying for the kids shouldn't be your main reason for staying. For me and my 2 children I found that the kids are fine if YOU are fine. Yes it will be an adjustment, it is and was for my 2 children but they follow your example. If you are miserable in the house right now with your WS then they feel the tension and anxiety coming off of one or both of you. I am not pushing you one way or the other just letting you know what I went through. Once STBX moved out after inhouse S things improved greatly for me and my kids. They do great when they are with me and so far seem to do great when they are with their Mother as well.

If you act like S or D is the end of the world then your kids will act accordingly. If you show them strength, it comes back eventually, along with love and attention they will be fine.

Is your husband actually changing or going through the motions because of guilt? Have you taken time to actually figure out what you want out of life and the M? You can't answer the first question your WH has to do that for himself but the 2nd question is all about you and what you choose to do with the rest of your life. You listed some qualities/attributes your WH brought to the table but the things you listed are things he is supposed to do. I do it and there are other men out there that do it as well. Yes it can be shared between spouses but what about the other things he was suppsoed to do as well like honor and cherish you and forsake all others. What is he doing to work on and resolve the issues he has with those attributes and how will you feel if you decide to stay and he can't figure out how to get those parts right?

Its like the state he is in right now, I can order him around a bit amd he will do it.

Well that certainly is a good reason to R....not.

Your kids probably aren't doing well because you are keeping them in limbo and they don't know how to adapt. Kids can do well after divorce, but only if their parents set the direction for them.

Do not make decisions about divorce based on "the good of the children."

Read that again.

As the child of parents who "stayed together for the kids," I can write volumes about the burden that placed on us.

It's a cop-out.

I say that as one who told herself, for several unfulfilling years of marriage (during which I was not yet aware that I was with a serial cheater), that it was better for my kids.

Oh, sure--I can fake cordial with anyone. Indefinitely.

But marriage isn't about enduring awful "for the sake of the kids."

If your husband were willing or able to do the work to R satisfactorily, would you have filed for divorce in the first place?

Ask yourself: is this really about the kids? Or is it because you are scared of the changes that separation/divorce bring?

I'm going to wager it's the latter. And I'm going to tell you that unless you believe you can create a safe, HAPPY, healed and affirming marriage, you most assuredly will NOT be helping your children by putting the brakes on your divorce.

[This message edited by solus sto at 9:12 AM, August 12th (Monday)]

Torn, if you are actually thinking you might want to get back together and you think he is truly remorseful, tell him to go to IC. Then you go to IC. Then you go to MC. THEN, if everything is still good, then you move back in together.

If you do just go back and rugsweep the A because of the reasons you stated above, you will never truly trust and he will probably do it again. I know. In 2003 or whatever it was my XH had a EA. I was clueless, until he told me he was going to leave me for her. The only reason he told me was that he confided in his sister, she told his parents, and they were on their way to smack him.

We R the same day. We did go to about 5 MC sessions, but they were lousy. I rug swept it. 6 years or so later, he's out the door for the next one.

I wanted to just make it disappear and get on with our lives. But it doesn't work that way. Now I wish we had either done more work back then, or I had let him walk then...the kids didn't deserve to have that happen twice, I didn't deserve to waste those years.

If you truly want to possibly R, do the work FIRST. You and him. Make sure you aren't just going to close your eyes until he does it again. IC, MC, him showing you over TIME, without living with you.

Rug sweeping definitely is a short term solution. I did it for years and am just as bad off as before with wh. I say try ic and mc if he's committed to changing or you commit to leaving. Of course that's easier said than done I know

You know how when you fly, the attendant says that if you are traveling with small children that you need to secure your mask first?

You have to save yourself first, they will be fine when you are.

Well, I'm a kid from a divorced home and I turned out just fine. I was in high school when it all went down. My parents' divorce was anything but amicable and they honestly handled it horribly - bad mouthing each other in front of me, not hiding the details, etc.

I still managed to graduated from a prestigious high school and good college with nearly straight As. I have an awesome career and am financially secure. I've never done drugs, smoked and I was well into my 20s before I ever even drank to excess. The only area I would say I have been unsuccessful in is relationships, given my WxSO that brought me here - but that is more his failure than mine. I was just too young to see he was wrong for me.

My parents' divorce was very difficult and emotional - there is no way around that. But your kids will not be doomed for failure because of it.

It kind of sounds likes you are looking for reasons to stay. What you have described sounds kind of terrible to me - marriage should be a partnership. Not a relationship where you can boss someone around because they feeling guilty and ashamed. And honestly - how do you know that will continue once he woos you back? I would be willing to bet that within a few months of "reconciling" all that behavior goes away and you will be right back where you were before.

My ex was great at taking care of stuff too. People outside looking in were so jealous of all he did.

However, just because he was great at taking care of the house did not mean he was great at taking care of the marriage.

If I were to stop talking about the A

How are you to heal by rugsweeping? If you need to talk about it to heal - then it needs to be addressed.

We rugswept for year - does not help a darn thing.

Any kids from a divorced home that I know didn't fare well at all.

Neither does any kid that is living in a home with a broken marriage.

I am not saying you should not try to R....but the reasons you have stated here are not holding water. Please dig deep to find what you really want and why....then proceed.

Seriously? You want your kids to grow up in a home where their mother is constantly manipulating and pushing around their father, while he runs around and sleeps with other people?

Do you really think that's a healthier environment for them than two stable homes with divorced parents?

[This message edited by Amazonia at 10:55 AM, August 12th (Monday)]

Change is scary. I think this is a case of the "devil you know." But let's look at that picture a little more closely...

I called the police on him in July because he was pushing me.
He is passive aggressive.

has been telling everyone lies about me saying I am crazy and that I need professional help.

He gets violent and angry.

He is very cheap and its all about the money. I am hearing that I am abusing him.

He called the police on me Dec. 2010.

6/2011 We go to the store together and he left me there and told me to walk home. I had to take a cab home.

Make sure you look at all the things you are calling "future comfort." Do you want to walk on eggshells so you don't have to walk home because you made him mad? Do you want that to be the dynamic your kids learn?

If your kids are suffering now... maybe the D will change things for them for the better? My kids thrive in the stability of a one parent home.

Do you doubt your ability to run the home? To do the cooking and the laundry and the groceries? You can do those things! If he has you convinced that you "need" him then that is a form of gaslighting. I am telling you right now, you can do all of that and you will feel good about it.

(((hugs)))

My mother did it until I was 14 and I actually TOLD her that she should leave him (when I found out he was cheating with her best friend!) I'm fairly certain that I would not have been with my POS ex if I hadn't grown up being groomed on how to deal with a man like my father.

I grew up under the roof of an alcoholic and callous man who repeatedly cheated on my mother, treated her poorly, ruined us financially and made me cry on a regular basis because it made him feel better to treat his family like shit.

OP.. whether or not your ex does a better job than my father at pretending to be a good husband and father, you aren't doing your kids any favor to stay with a man who does not have respect for his family and is not healthy enough to maintain a healthy home. If he is willing to work on what is wrong with him so he can be a better man that's wonderful. If not, I think you will be doing more harm to your children..

If the choice is between a dysfunctional "intact" family and a functional "broken" home, what makes you think the dysfunctional home would make healthier kids?

I was "comfortable" when I grew used to living in a dysfunctional mess. That doesn't make it better than any alternative that would have been unpleasant to adjust to but would have given me a chance to grow up in a healthier home with at least one parent who could get themselves together to be the parent they needed to be.

If your children are in pain, you all need to be in counseling for 6 months every week. You can have the D during this time, or you can put it off, the choice is yours.

You only get one childhood, there is no do-over for your children. Parents who get along, are functioning adults, created a very good environment for children to grow up in whether they are married or apart.

Bottom line is to get your children help. Our counselor had my H in on some meetings with just me to work on parenting skills to help our children in both homes.

She said the best indicator of how children will come thru a divorce is how well the parents get along.

I might add my XWH ditched the counseling when we started getting to the "tell the truth" part! We divorced and he won't even try to get along for our children's sake...I meant that IF you WS is willing to go to some type of counseling, I feel it will help your children come out on the other side alot better..

[This message edited by homewrecked2011 at 6:12 PM, August 12th (Monday)]

I think you've reached "bargaining". The next stage before "acceptance" is "depression".

If you work through this and consider it from all the angles, you'll see it's not a viable option.

I've been there, bargaining is a bitch because it calls you like a siren song saying "Oh, it'll all be OK again just like before."

Thing is it's just a mirage, there's no reality to it at all.

Difficult to resist, I know, so much easier than taking the hard steps to break through to a true new beginning.

It's depressing to realize you even thought of going there, so be prepared to work through that stage before you reach acceptance of what is.

Big hugs.

[This message edited by FaithFool at 11:29 AM, August 12th (Monday)]

(((((honey)))))

You are all so wonderful! I appreciate the candid replies.

He and I have been in IC. The both of us for about 2 years now. We are on our 3rd MC.
I have been living on my own for 2 years in my own place with the kids while he is in the marital home.

Faith I think you may have hit the nail on the head. I didn't see myself as divorced. I have fully moved on with my life. I go out, I bought a new car, I have met other men, etc. I have gone on vacations alone and with my children.

I just look at my children. They are angry with me for moving us out of the house 2 rs ago. They are all and have been in counseling for over a year.
So yes, lots of therapy for the whole family.

As far as my husband, I mean that he is in a place where perhaps all of you are correct, his guilt may be eating at him now. I don't believe he will cheat again. I believe this in my gut. I believe if I got sick, he would take care of me. I did get into a car accident earlier in the year, he drove me to mediation!

I am in the position to work on the marriage or stop the D. No moving in together yet, but I have seen large changes in him in the last 6 months..

Why in the WORLD would you want to offer that kind of dysfunctional marriage as a role model for your kids?

They are angry with me for moving us out of the house 2 rs ago.

Your kids are a little older. Do they understand WHY you moved out? I am not talking about the gory details but the general concept of cheating and how much their dad hurt and betrayed their mother. They will reach an emotional maturity level at some point where they will understand and not be angry at you.

((T2B))

I hear what you are saying. You may have a shot at saving your M, and so what's the harm in trying?

Only you can answer that. Take what I say with a grain of salt, as after 5+ ddays I'm afraid I might be a bit jaded, and perhaps have lost my faith in love.

I worry that when you are close to being free from the cluthces of your abusive husband, he is turning on the charm, as he isn't finished with you yet.

Harsh words, I know. Put the breaks on the D, or not, but don't lose sight of who he has shown himself to be. He called the cops on you and bad mouthed you to others when it suited his purposes. No amount of icing can cover the bitter taste of that cake.

He must reform himself, a long and arduous journey for any man. Acts of kindness are a good sign, but they do not necessarily indicate insight, self awareness and a changed outlook.