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spinoff: birthday clause

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Nature_Girl posted 8/28/2013 01:26 AM

All these final divorce decrees with clauses in them about seeing the kids on their birthdays and on your birthday are making me mightily depressed. Why? Because there's nothing like that in the wording for what's being drafted as my final decree. Nothing. I've asked about this over & over. Been adamant that I want to see my kids on their birthday, dammit, not some other day of the week when it's not their birthday. I want to see the kids on my birthday. We celebrate birthdays on the actual birthday, not days later or before.

But no. Not happening. The lawyers won't even entertain the thought. WHY NOT???

Is it because STBX is such a freak? Because he's like a NPD on steroids? Why? Why don't I get to have language that lets me see my kids on birthdays?

Anyone else run into this? Not getting to put language in that lets them see their kids on birthdays?

SBB posted 8/28/2013 04:00 AM

I thought kids birthdays and Mothers/Fathers day were standard? Parents birthdays not so much.

By "the lawyers" do you mean yours and his? If yours too I would not be impressed.

These things are agreements - you agree you sign - you don't agree you don't sign and you take it to court. Find out what the standard is and go for costs if it is standard and he pushes you on it.

I know it doesn't feel like it but you do have a voice here. He can try WTFever he wants to but it doesn't make it happen.

You won't get everything you want and neither will he. The courts here don't look favourably on parties being unreasonable and he is being unreasonable if he won't agree to you both seeing them on their birthday.

I don't get their whole birthday and not should I (in the spirit of shared parenting) but damn straight they are going to get to see both of their parents on their birthday whether the sad clown likes it or not.

He is a bully bullying you. It only works if you let him.


Nature_Girl posted 8/28/2013 04:06 AM

I've gone round and round with my lawyer about this. He just shakes his head at me & tells me that it isn't going to happen. We're at the end of this horrible process, and I don't understand why I can't have it written into the decree that the kids get to see both parents on birthdays. I realize life changes due to divorce, I'm not stupid. But can't we keep anything that's always been "sacred" and special for our individual family unit? I know that *I* have been completely obliterated by STBX's cruelty & abuse & infidelity. Is it necessary to entirely dismantle the things that made our family unit special, too?

Nature_Girl posted 8/28/2013 04:20 AM

I'm upset because people here share stuff that seems to be common amongst many regarding what's in their final decree. Birthdays are entirely out. I had to FIGHT to get Mother's Day put in (and of course it follows Father's Day, too). People here talk about stuff put in their decrees like no alcohol or underage drivers - not happening for me. People talk about having certain dates that the non-custodial parent has to notify the custodial parent for summer vacation dates - not happening for me.

I don't understand.

Maybe it's because I'm getting sole custody, both physical & legal? Maybe it's because he doesn't have ANY overnights for the time being (and never has so far) because he's such a sexual deviant and abusive asshole that he has to have therapy first, and the lawyers are assuming that once the therapy takes place we'll have to renegotiate the parenting plan?

I don't know.

Right now I'm just hurt about the birthday thing. And I'm pissed, so very pissed, that our lives are decimated because of him. Just today I was talking with the kids about how I pray that God will put friends & adults in their lives that will help them walk the right path in life, one that will keep them on the path to God (see, I told y'all that I actually am religious). And in response to that one of my kids said that God has put good grown ups in their lives, "You're a good person, Mom, and so is Dad!" Said with that innocent smile & assuredness. And inside I'm just dying because NO! Your father isn't a good person, he's a freak, he's a monster who likes to watch girls being raped and urinated on and destroyed. But I can't say that to them, oh no. So I excuse myself from the table and go into the other room to let the burning tears fall away from the little innocent eyes...

That bastard didn't even want me to have children. He wanted me to abort them. He used to tell me AND everyone else (friends, neighbors, family members) that his life was RUINED because of the children. He'd tell me he'd never forgive me for burdening him with the children. So no, I do not want to miss out on the children's birthdays. He didn't even want them to be born.

clba317 posted 8/28/2013 06:09 AM

I believe if you have both legal and physical custody and he doesn't have them overnight due to his behavior then you have final say as to when he sees them. He doesn't get to see them on those special days. Keep them and cherish every moment.

Weatherly posted 8/28/2013 06:24 AM

Do you have state guidelines? My divorce decree doesn't say anything about birthdays, but, we are supposed to follow the state guidelines if we can't come to an agreement. And, the "default" is one of us gets part of the day, the other one gets the other part. Maybe that is why they aren't putting it in your decree?

I tried to get more specific wording and kept getting told birthdays just went with state guidelines. Which is lovely and all, but, one of my sons has a Christmas eve birthday, so, I have never been real clear on whether holiday or birthday time is the one we are supposed to follow that day. We ended up basically moving both Christmas AND his birthday to about a week earlier.

MovingUpward posted 8/28/2013 07:28 AM


I hear your frustrations. My state doesn't cover birthdays. In fact my state's guidelines says this "No adjustments to the schedule shall be given for birthdays of the child(ren) or of either parent."

I can't have clauses about alcohol or overnight guests. The courts here just don't care about it until it becomes a CPS issue.

SBB posted 8/28/2013 07:41 AM

I understand why you are pissed off. I mean I empathise, I don't think anyone can really understand what it is like for you - just imagining it is a nightmare for me.

I get pissed off when I read on here about it being a business transaction - it makes me feel like my girls are chattels. The financial side I can put a business hat on but I can't just switch of the emotions. and that's with NOT having to deal with the NPD, psychotic deviance you're dealing with.

I don't understand why your L won't just do what you tell him. Push him on it. WHY THE FUCK NOT. He may tell you something that makes not having birthdays in not seem so bad. The lesser evil so to speak. If not then MAKE him do it. You are paying him. He does what you tell him.

People have stuff put into their decrees that is about as protective as an RO piece of paper is against an abuser. Very difficult to prove they are not doing what the decree says and even more difficult to enforce.

What is the arrangement ATM? Does he get certain days - have you looked on the calendar to see whether it impacts any birthdays? Would he get more time with them if you share birthdays? What is the downside in getting birthdays put in?

Whatever way this turns out you know you will need to integrate it. I'm pissed off along with you. I'm shit scared along with you. I hate it with you.

It doesn't change it.

Change what you can and start thinking about releasing the rest. I don't have the fortitude for it myself but I would find it if I had to. Just as you have. Just as you will about this.

The written word here doesn't convey my facial expressions or emotion as I say these things to you. I say them with rage and indignation for you and for your children.

None of it is fucking fair. None of it should be allowed. It is so fucked up I don't even know what I would burn down first if I could.

I want you to know you have been heard. I think that is the only comfort I am able to give you right now. You will reach the rest in your own time and in your own way. Not because you were born to or supposed to. You will do it because you just have to.

((NG)) I wish I could do or say something to make this easier or even bearable for you my friend. I don't think I can.

What I can do is tell you I KNOW you will persevere. I know you will prevail. You will overcome this in the long run. One way or another I know you will.

[This message edited by StrongButBroken at 7:43 AM, August 28th (Wednesday)]

hexed posted 8/28/2013 09:30 AM

NG- I understand how frustrated you are with this but step back for a moment.

Is this really a problem? Does he have overnights? If not you will get time with them no matter when their birthday is.

In our state standard language is basically whoever has the kids on their birthdays gets them on their birthdays. My SO seldom gets his kids on their birthdays b/c they almost always fall on weekdays. It kind of sucks but the truth is that we would have their party on a weekend anyway so we plan for that.

If you have primary custody this is probably not going to be an issue as often as you think. Its most likely going to be to big of an issue with an NPD freak and your lawyers know it.

7yrsflushed posted 8/28/2013 09:41 AM

Maybe it's because I'm getting sole custody, both physical & legal?
Ask your lawyer but having sole custody both physical and legal means YOU get to make the rules unless something is explicitly written into the decree/agreement. Does he have visitation at all in the decree/agreement? If not then he gets to see them when YOU say he does unless he files to change the custody arrangments. Again check with your L, but if he asks for them on their birthday you tell him NO and offer another day that he can see them.

EvenKeel posted 8/28/2013 09:44 AM

My visitation and holiday schedule (as well as CS details, etc) was done up prior to the divorce in the form of a 'marital settlement ageement'.

The veribage is not part of my actual decree at all - it was signed a good five months prior to the actual divorce.

Is all your settlement details (who gets what) actually in your divorce?

stillstrong posted 8/28/2013 10:49 AM

FWIW, my custody agreement says that the non-custodial parent can have custody on child's birthday during the time the custodial parent is working or otherwise away from the child, until such time as the custodial parent is available.
So basically I can see my kid from after school to after X's workday on every birthday. No provisions for weekends.
It's all a moot point for me anyway as I have had unofficial full custody since February. MSA was signed in November, so the custody agreement lasted all of 3 months.
Maybe, NG, just maybe your stbx will drop out of the kids lives too.
But I agree with the others. Your L works for you. Unless he can give you compelling reasons why this should not be included, I would push. It pisses me off for you because it sounds like he's dismissing you.

betrayedfriend posted 8/28/2013 11:22 AM

Since you have sole legal and physical and he has no overnights, I don't think you need to worry too much. You will get to see them on their birthdays, and you will get to wake them up and put them to bed, If anything I would make sure that in your parenting agreement, that you have a time that the kids must be returned to you on any day that visitation occurs (say 5:30 pm so that if you do want to make evening plans for a party or event, you can. I'd also put provisions that visitation can not start before 10 am so that you can have a relaxing morning and not rush around like crazy, or if you need to do a morning activity you can.

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