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I have been doing 180 and am at end of day 4. It is making my FWH very uncomfortable. He came to me and asked if we could start "dating". I told him maybe after he returns. He is going to sister's for a week starting tomorrow.

He told me he feels distant and that he loves me. I had no response. He told me I could ask him any questions I want and he will "try" to answer them.

I have since beginning this, made a list of things that I need from him to help us heal. He seems completely clueless. Thinks it is all about the timeline & details of the A, which is just a part of it. He can't remember the things I have told him over & over and has gone back on most of the stuff we agreed to in the beginning. However, we never wrote any of it down on paper, so my question is this: Should I give him my list for him to process while he is gone? and try to start over when he returns, depending on his response? Should I accept his calls while he is gone. In trying not to obsess & take care of myself, I am still obsessing. Need help, PLEASE!

You say he can't remember what you have discussed. I would let him go and see what he come back with when he get home from his trip.

Do not make this easy on him. If he really wants to make it work, then find out if he will do the work.

Keep focusing on yourself. The last thing you want is a false R. Rushing back to soon and falling for a mirage from him is a sure fire way to get one. Slow down and take your time. He has to earn it.

As for the list, I wouldn't do it. But then I got tired of the roller coaster and got the point of letting him know I was done and he knew I was done. It took him about 8 weeks before he figured it out but from then on he was all in and here we are almost 2 years later and still going strong. I am not sure we could have avoided the roller coaster ride we went on , but I am sure it could have been shorter if I would have found this place sooner and became tougher sooner and been a bit more consistent about my limits.

Each situation is different, I am sure others will be along with their opinion.

He actually had the nerve to take a cialis pill after his shower and asked me if we could try to make love! I guess because he is leaving tomorrow he thought I would, even though I haven't touched him in 4-5 days and we've barely said a few sentences to each other. I said no.

So do I take his calls while he is gone. Also, I want to delete my "friend's" number from his cell phone before he leaves. the phone doesn't work up north and if he talks to her it will be on his sister's phone, so I won't know. She also has not contacted me since I've been home. I called her & went to her church with her Sunday. She lied about how many times she talked to my H while I was gone and played it off like nothing & would not tell me anything that was said, but I didn't grill her. I know they spoke at least 3 times - he told me he talked to her once, then after I came home he slipped up in conversation & came out that it was twice. (he deleted his call log & txts halfway thru my trip because he got "MAD".) Which was the last straw and final reason that made me do the 180 for real. When I checked his phone he had talked to her a third time for 20 min and her boyfriend for another 20 min. after he deleted the other 2 calls & before I came home(if that was even the truth).

I don't believe there is anything going on. I think he has just been talking to her about me & us & our marriage. He has justified his relationship with my soon to be XBF, saying he is not attracted to her & has no intention of going there or hurting me.

I had to remind him, (which he would not hear) that is exactly how the A started with a "friend" who was my best friend - befriending her with no intention of hurting me.

You could ask him to make a list of what he could do. See if it has anything on it that you actually told him.

But seriously, you could ask him to make the list, then talk about what else needs to be on the list. And have HIM write it on the paper, and sign it. That may seem small, but from working with students and dealing with my own H, having to write it down, in their own handwriting, and to sign it as a sign of a commitment, is pretty powerful.

Worth a try, anyway.

Stronger, thank you so much. That does not seem small at all. Actually, to get him to write anything down is huge. I will do that when he calls later tonight, unless I decide to not take his call & wait until tomorrow.

Well, made the mistake of taking the call. I explained to him that I had been trying to protect myself from being crazy & being hurt anymore from him & so had been trying to take care of myself (180). I then asked him to write the list of what he is willing to do. The conversation got more involved and as it continued his voice became more defensive, angry and DONE...

I felt worse after talking to him than I did before. He also asked me to make the list of what I am willing to do (which angered me, like I am at fault for what he did!!!) But I said I would do that, which I already have. And I can bet that he will write down a couple of sentences the night before he leaves there to come home - a half-assed attempt. I am getting closer to done every day.

I feel like he doesn't think it is worth the effort he has to make to fix things and is not willing to put me & our marriage ahead of everyone & everything else in his life.

So if that is how he feels, I don't know why I want to stay with someone who disrespects & discounts my feelings so easily anyway.

[This message edited by broken0912 at 2:14 AM, September 18th (Wednesday)]

oops - don't know what happened.

[This message edited by broken0912 at 2:13 AM, September 18th (Wednesday)]

sorry it was a duplicate

[This message edited by broken0912 at 2:12 AM, September 18th (Wednesday)]

IMO he is not in any shape or form ready to commit to R. He is angry that you are holding his feet to fire and want him to man up. He would much rather sweep this under the rug and go forward as if it never happened. Problem with that is that he did it and there is no take backs. . He F'd up in the biggest way possible with you.

I say 180 hard and protect yourself. Don't put any investment in any future conversation with him. It's all lip service now. Until you see action, don't buy into it. He will either explode in anger at his inability to control the outcome/you or he will finally get it.

I think that having an A give the wayward a taste of total control over all of the juggling

they have to do to keep the fantasy alive. The longer the A, the better they were at it (in their mind) When it all comes crashing down around them, it takes them a bit before the accept the lack of control they have over life and other people. Not sure this is going on with him but maybe.

In my case we had to separate for 18 months before he truly got it. That was almost 2 years ago. We are going strong now, weathered and wiser.

He has to want you more than anything else in the world. He should move mountains to make that happen. Doesn't sound like he is there yet.

[This message edited by standingonmarble at 5:53 PM, September 18th (Wednesday)]

Since this post, I have spoken to him every day. Don't know how i missed that last one from, you, Standing. I was continuing to feel worse after every time we spoke and he told me it made him feel better because we were talking. However, he has not volunteered any info, or mentioned writing on the A timeline I asked for or anything else. He has told me he has been watching a certain preacher on t.v. that we watched in the beginning, but quit after 1st few months - (the guy talks about M & how to make it great.)

After Day 3 or 4 I explained to him that speaking to him was making me feel worse and told him why and asked a few questions about what was said to his daughter & my friend while I was away. He didn't tell me much, but gave me a couple of brief sentences. It seemed that just telling him what I was expecting was enough for me. I also spoke to my friend and she has went over their conversation with me. Which was pretty much what I expected, that he was Done (I already knew that he was feeling that at that point, because he told me, also, but has since changed his tune.) He also told her all the things he had been doing for "his part". She said this included him being resentful that he had given up his t.v. for me and I now had all my shows taking up all the space on his t.v. and he just wished he could watch sports once in awhile. This wasn't true. I have told him over & over that he can watch whatever he wants & I can go in the other room & watch t.v. other than that, he didn't mention anything else he has done to help in this healing process, because he has done nothing else. He then proceeded to tell her how demanding I was, etc., most of which were lies involving his daughter - and am sure he told his daughter the same lies.

Anyway, I have gained so much clarity and peace of mind since the first few days he was gone. He says he is praying and that the t.v. preacher has openned his eyes to some things he needs to be doing for me & has gained some much needed humility and has regained his relationship with God. Believe me, I am not holding my breath.

I am awaiting his return to give him my list of needs, after I receive his list of "willingness". I have a feeling he thinks there will be a negotiation, but he is WRONG.

He tells me he loves me each time we talk & I usually reply in same. However, he has started telling me he misses me and I haven't said anything in reply except, "Good".

I am not holding out any expectations and just a pinch more hope than that. I am taking care of myself and preparing for the end of my marriage. We shall see how his behavior and attitude has changed after he returns in a couple of days.

Ok, I may be missing something big here.... but how has this "friend" not hit the chopping block???

He should not be talking to another woman about your marriage. Period.

It's something. It's a "thing." Not Just Friends outlines how inappropriate their conversations are really well.

I know it's hard because you can't tell him what to do and obviously this "friend" is enjoying the rapport as well. I just want to tell you what your gut is likely screaming - it's wrong. You don't have to be ok with it just because the perpetrators are trying to make you feel badly for not going along with it.

I don't believe there is anything going on. I think he has just been talking to her about me & us & our marriage. He has justified his relationship with my soon to be XBF, saying he is not attracted to her & has no intention of going there or hurting me.

Blah blah blah meaningless words. He doesn't get to "assure" you of anything with words right now. COMPLETE respect. COMPLETE faithfulness and attention. "Dating?" Oh hell no.

Take care of yourself. Dial up that 180 to 10 because he is not getting it.

(((broken0912)))

Just in the lasgt week my wife wrote somethings down. I asked her to so I could have them and use them. Not to remeber but to help and think about. So I can help her heal and also maybe get back some of the things my A took from her. it is comforting to me to have them to look at. If that makes any sense. I think its a good idea. Jmo