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WH Skewed Boundaries.. Harmless flirting?

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LiedtoLucy posted 9/21/2013 13:33 PM

I was responding to Inca's earlier thread about flirting but it turned into a thread jack.

My FWH was/is/has always been a flirt. I used to think that it was harmless, like so many others.

We are now recovering from a 4 year LTA and I have been going back and reading his FB private messages. He was in school at the time...went back to change careers in his 30's.. There were A LOT of messages to and from female classmates discussing getting lunch or grabbing a drink to "catch up". When classes would end for a semester, there would be several messages to females with the same line, "I miss your smiling face. Hope you are well. We should catch up sometime soon. Take Care"

BAIT

We stayed up til 3am on Wednesday night discussing his boundaries and my issues with how he feels the need to be validated by other women...searches for it. He justifies his actions..just friends...just joking around. But the truth is that I feel like he is always "fishing." Seeing who might be interested. For a long time, I think it was enough just to see who was interested..it stroked his ego.

He agreed to work on himself and figure out why he tries to make it ok with himself..justifies it. He can see why it is wrong after the fact, but feels it is harmless when it is taking place.

The.Next.Day.

Thursday night he went back to work and Friday morning, when he came home, I checked his phone and there was a text thread from a female co-worker (they work in a hospital):

FWH: Where you at? My patient needs_________.

CW: Who is this?

FWH: WHAT? you don't know who I am? I'm hurt.

CW: Ha Ha sorry. broke my phone. got a new one. guess I haven't worked with you in while. didn't have your number in contacts. and...

I want to know you

FWH: N E Time

CW: :)

So, I confronted him. He said, we were just cutting up.. it didn't mean anything. There is no attraction between us.

And then he drops this bomb.. "If I had thought anything of it...I would have deleted it."

OMG! Really? That makes me feel so much better. idiot.

I think that it is so deeply ingrained that he needs this validation and attention that he can't even see the line he crosses and how dangerous it is. I don't know how much more I can take.

Our MC referred him to an IC and he is supposed to be making himself an appointment. If he doesn't follow through I think it will be my deal breaker.

gonnabe2016 posted 9/21/2013 13:47 PM

And then he drops this bomb.. "If I had thought anything of it...I would have deleted it."


The man that I married had this same type of mindset. The whole shoulder-shruggy, hands out palm up "What? What? What did I do? What is WRONG with you?"

That's why he's now called STBX instead of fWH.......

uncertainone posted 9/21/2013 13:55 PM

So, I confronted him. He said, we were just cutting up.. it didn't mean anything. There is no attraction between us.

And then he drops this bomb.. "If I had thought anything of it...I would have deleted it."

Any questions? Seriously? He's not an idiot. He knows exactly what he's doing and accepts what he's doing.

Actually, so do you. You don't establish boundaries for others and expect them to adopt them, no matter how much you want them to. Just yourself. What are your boundaries? What are the consequences when others violate them?

LiedtoLucy posted 9/21/2013 14:37 PM

u.O

You are right... I didn't want to be a naggy wife and check up on him or say he couldn't have female friends. I wanted to trust him.

I am struggling with establishing boundaries now. I am sure that I made it clear in our discussion Wednesday night that I wouldn't tolerate ANY inappropriate behavior including texts, emails, phone calls, etc. I told him that I would not continue to be married to him if it he could not comply.

SO I guess now is when I am supposed to say you failed...and I am done.

Tearsoflove posted 9/21/2013 15:09 PM

I didn't want to be a naggy wife and check up on him or say he couldn't have female friends.

Me either and that's how my second dday happened. You can bet we addressed it then and there are NO female friends anymore. That doesn't mean I believe that no man can handle female friendships. It means I believe that my husband is a KISA with terrible boundaries so one of the "rules" for staying married to me is NO female friends. My consequence for his breaking that rule will be divorce. I'll never tolerate something that eats at me again just to keep the peace.

[This message edited by Tearsoflove at 3:09 PM, September 21st (Saturday)]

AML04 posted 9/21/2013 18:47 PM

I don't know how to quote from my phone but this:

"That doesn't mean I believe that no man can handle female friendships. It means I believe that my husband is a KISA with terrible boundaries so one of the "rules" for staying married to me is NO female friends"

is exactly how I feel. WH's need to feel needed and need for validation almost ruined our M. He became friends with COW because he "felt bad for her". NO more women in his life ever unless they're our friends and friends of the M. F that!!

nomistakeaboutit posted 9/21/2013 19:47 PM

CW: Ha Ha sorry. broke my phone. got a new one. guess I haven't worked with you in while. didn't have your number in contacts. and...

I want to know you

FWH: N E Time

CW: :)

Well, this is disturbing, huh? Not even an LOL in there anywhere?

The fact that your husband has cheated on you and he does this....I have no words. The fact that you had talked about it until 3:00 am the night before and he does this the next day?.?. I just let out a huge sigh.

Sorry, but to me, "N E time" is an invitation. It's just SO beyond the pale. I'm sorry you're having to be tormented by this BS. He needs to STOP that Bullshit. Full stop.

whatlysbeneath posted 9/21/2013 20:23 PM

L to L,

My WW was also a "harmless flirt"...she was "just being friendly"

Single people flirt to test for mutual attraction...hmmm...wonder what a flirting married person is testing for!?!?!

Married people flirting is just WRONG 100% of the time!!

simplydevastated posted 9/21/2013 20:31 PM

If you're hurt or upset by this then it's not "harmless" flirting. Married people don't flirt! Period!

I'm sorry he's doing this

(((Hugs)))

OldCow18 posted 9/21/2013 20:38 PM

I posted on Inca's thread about this too. I am married to a flirter. He says it's just "his personality." I put up with it until his A. After becoming super sleuth in the wake of his affair and scouring FB to find just how many women's pics he commented on with "Gorgeous as ever!" or "You're so pretty!" or "I'm so sorry your bf is an ass, I'm here for you anytime, here's my cell number..." I'm fuming just thinking about it. He was fishing, he was throwing out bait and just waiting to see who would bite and he had an affair with the first one that did (that I know of). This flirting BS is a hurdle that he needs to overcome and understand fully. When I talk to him about it he tells me I'm turning him into a eunuch . Me thinks he has much work to do in therapy. I wonder if someone who so desperately needs other women's approval/validation is even able to over come that. He's a 48 year old man and still needs this shit? Grow.the.F.up.

Dreamland posted 9/22/2013 09:53 AM

To ..Old Cow.. Hmm interesting thought..
So tell your H that if he really is feeling the eunuch role cuz usually they have no balls .. So if he is volunteering you will be gladly to castrate him if he gets closer to and women

thenon-goddess posted 9/22/2013 13:22 PM

SO I guess now is when I am supposed to say you failed...and I am done.

Correct. Or at least start thinking about a list of conditions that you'll need met to be able to continue with the M and at the top of that lust should be some MC and IC for him.

FWIW, my ex is the same way. He sees absolutely nothing wrong with those kinds of exchanges because he doesn't PLAN on doing anything. The only problem is, he also doesn't plan on saying "no" if his flirt partner DOES plan on doing something. He's a KISA and he has to be there for everyone, including those poor women who just need a man to show 'em some loving. I'm all set with that.

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