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Well, it just never ends....

I can see that the poor communication we had in our marriage is only about to get a lot worse now that I hate his guts and he has gone nearly insane.

Last week I told him AGAIN to stop calling the kids when we are getting ready for school and trying to get out the door. It is disruptive, and sometimes it really upsets them. They are reminded that he doesn't live here and everything is different. He believes that the good morning good night calls are beneficial for children and that is the established routine that they must continue....i think it is just for him and his guilt. I tried just ignoring it, but he just keeps calling and calling.

So, the dumb ass doesn't reply to my note where I layed this out AGAIN for him, but instead he decided to go to the school for lunch to talk to our 8 year old about it.....ummm how inappropriate to put her on the spot like that at her school with her friends at lunch...

He wrote the entire transcript of their conversation. Mr. Asbergers Integrity is a very logical, black and white thinker- so this is how he rolls...

He asked her if she likes when he calls. She says "yes" Do you like when I call to say goodmorning "yes" Did you finish your breakfast "yes"

He said You know you have to get ready for mommy and not be late for school...she says "yes"

So, his conclusion is...."she says she told me she likes it when I call and she didn't tell me that she was upset."

Emotional f**tard

Then He said to me "For the girls' best interest/healing/well being, we can only share exactly the experiences that are actually occurring and work together" Well, that sounds like he is saying that he thinks I am lying!!!!

I simply can not deal with this shit from him. I am already trying the NC thing and yet even that is not working. We go to the divorce therapist who is becoming like a parental interventionist for us because I simply can not talk with him directly without a third party there to validate what I am saying. He will only back off his point of view if the therapist tells him to. And then, sometimes, he still hears what he wants to hear and alledges that she concurred that his calling every morning and evening is fine as long as it is brief. She did not say this at all!!

He also said that the reason our 8 yr old is so upset (she has reflux, stomach aches, fatigue stress related health stuff) all the time is because she wants to have a sleep over at his apartment. Really? He is not getting it that she is upset because HER FATHER LEFT US and our family is BLOWN APART. It is not about a friggin sleepover. I have already agreed to the first one, and he is trying to develop this story line that I am preventing this and I am not. He simply can not see the emotional tsunami he has created. OMG....what do I do with this???? crazy crazy crazy

What. Do. I. Do???

Don't answer the phone in the mornings (and don't allow the kids to either).
If you need to, put the phone on silent or, if it is a landline, take the extension in your bedroom off the hook so that it is just a busy signal to the person calling in.
As long as he has access/ability to call the kids after school or in the evening when it is convenient, he cant claim that you're keeping them from him.

As for the other behaviors, unfortunately, it is going to be an ongoing battle. You can't control him, but you can enforce your boundaries (and show your kids by example how to do the same).

[This message edited by GabyBaby at 5:32 PM, September 23rd (Monday)]

Don't answer the phone in the morning. You need to shut that shit down. My STBX also uses the phone to abuse & control. I had to sic my lawyer on him regarding the phone calls. He still abuses the phone, but it's not as bad as it was before. He also majorly emotionally & mentally fucked with my kids in the beginning. He still does, but has backed off to some degree because I had to sic my lawyer on him several times.

Just FYI, as soon as you try to manage the phone call situation he's going to claim parental alienation. Just be emotionally prepared. No judge is going to agree that your children need to have a phone call in the morning while you're getting ready for the day. I suggest you or your lawyer send a note to your STBX's lawyer & let him know you will not be allowing the morning phone call any longer, however, he is welcome to call the children between xx:xx and xx:xx in the evening. Pick whatever time frame is convenient for YOU. Don't have it be during homework time, practice time, chore time or dinner time. Don't have it be right at bedtime. Lock in a half-hour time frame for the call to start and end and be done.

I know it sounds ridiculous, but with this type of person you have to really come down hard and establish firm boundaries.

ETA: I also suggest that you have your lawyer insist that STBX stop showing up at school and emotionally manipulating your child at lunchtime. He is putting your child in the middle of a power play. This is very emotionally damaging. It has to stop. This is what lawyers are for.

[This message edited by Nature_Girl at 5:43 PM, September 23rd (Monday)]

I doubt these phone calls will last too long. They usually start to gradually stop calling. Then nothing at all. The standard phone calls for my state is two during the week and one on the weekend. I would give him a time and day that works for you and the kids for him to call. It's good for the kids to have structure, especially during a divorce.

Thank you!

I have tried the not answering thing, and that doesn't seem to work. I am going to try and get into Divorce therapist and hash this out this week. Good advice from you about setting the boundaries. If that still doesn;t work I am going to have to sic the lawyer on him, which may push him to try and put a temporary custody plan in place and here in this state...that won't be so good for me either. I am trying to let the therapist tell him what her expert opinion is, he listens to her and won;t listen to me, but GEEZ is this frustrating.

He bought the 10yo a new phone so he can call her directly. Guess what, she didn't answer his call this am as she was running around getting ready and then didn't return it....maybe she texted him. I don't know. I checked her phone and ipad, which I monitor to make sure she isn't doing or saying anything inappropriate anyway...and I saw that he texts several times a night and several in the morning in addition to his calling....

Oh my, the note he sent me is soooo crazy. He really believes that I am making this all about me. I don't answer the phone because it upsets me. They haven't slept over there yet because it upsets me. What can he not understand about this...he left the family...that is upsetting for kids.

I like the idea of one phone call in the early evening, that way it is not when they are getting ready for school and it is not right before bed.

I wish he would just run away with his Skankhole and realize a hefty parenting plan won't work with his lifestyle choices. OMG what a dooooshhh

Because of similar abuse of the telephone (early morning before school, and repeated calling if unanswered) I had it written into our parenting plan

ALL calls between the children and non custodial parent are to be initiated by the children. ONLY if there have been two consecutive days without contact can the non custodial parent call between 8 and 8:30.

We observed this religiously for a few years. Things are more relaxed now, and boundaries are firmly in place.

This is a boundary for both of us, but since the boys are seldom away from me for more than two nights at a time, it doesn't impact me really.

I have always allowed the children to call spontaneously if they want to share a report card or special honor, or even a silly joke they heard. If the children are in control of the amount of contact, it seems to be less stressful for them.

As for the texting and emailing. I would make sure that the kids understand that they are not obligated to respond to every message, or even every time the doorbell rings. That what they are doing, whether it is homework, daydreaming, watching tv, or having quiet time does not have to be interrupted. Help them to establish their own boundaries and let the lines of communication remain open but not intrusive.

Good luck!

Have a 1-1 visit with the school counselor after you meet with the divorce counselor. Bring him/her up to speed on what your husband is doing to your children.

Be totally factual, not emotional about what he's doing. How he calls night and morning, and shows up at the school and manipulates your children into saying yes to his strategically worded questions, so that he can legitimize his NPD behavior.

Most of all do not use any psychological labels to describe his behavior. Let him/her come to that conclusion and coach you on how to protect your children.

YOU have to run interference on this. Your 10-yo isn't old enough to establish & maintain boundaries with an egotistical Narcissist. Just because he gave that phone to her does not mean you don't have rules about it. It's your home. YOU decide if she has access to that phone and when. She's ten. She doesn't need a phone 24x7 so some paranoid baby man can contact her constantly to get ego kibbles from her.

Shut. It. Down.

You will seriously regret it if you don't.

Rules in my house were that ALL PHONES were in their chargers in the kitchen by 9 pm every night. XH would still try to call after that, ALL PHONES were turned off, even the land line was unplugged. It took him a year but he got it!

Why do these guys that made the choice to bail on the family feel so obsessed with contacting the kids??

Is it guilt? Is it his own lonliness? WTF, what is wrong with these people...

He wants to justify his actions and be right.
He cares more about being right than making the morning transition easy for his kids.
Isn't it moments like this you think how were we ever married?

This was hard at first also, until I created a routine and asked my lawyer to speak with his a few times. X doesn't care what I have to say, but does care what the law has to say.

At the beginning, he was calling very close to DD's bedtime and creating emotional trauma for her on top of the rest of what we had to get done each night, so one thing that helped, FWIW, was setting the time earlier for the calls. Then she had time to adjust her thinking again, watch a show or read and settle down in her head a little before getting into bed. It really helped us both a lot to do this.

One thing that worked for me also, was making sure that I never make it about me -at all-because he truly doesn't care. He does show some care about DD, though and seems to want to make that smoother, for in his best interest, he would have less to deal with me.

The other POV is really true, for I've found the hard way that if I say the least little thing to L about him that's negative about his parenting, I get the SH kicked out of me and L says I appear bitter. So I've learned some more and one thing is to never, ever, ever react to him or contact him when my emotions are affected. It really helps and we can't take back words, right? But they can be held against us.

For the morning, it can take time, but maybe if you keep repeating at various times how disruptive it is to your kids to have the phone calls, that they may stop in the morning.

I give a time limit, also, and it helps DD with structure and we can plan our routine for her night better this way. Comments from authority went further than comments or complaints from me ever did.

I'm sorry for my long post and I wish you well.

Thanks. My IC gave me a good pep talk today and told me how to respond. Basically the same advice as you Ashland, don't make it about me, don't show any emotion.

So hard to be dealing with a F**Ktard and it is going to be a looooong road having to continue to deal with it moving forward.

I need strength. I am holding the cards. I can do this!!