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WH said "Why shouldn't we talk? It's dumb not to"

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Iamacrab posted 9/27/2013 09:44 AM

We've been separated for many months, serious NC now except house stuff for 1 mo.
He "thinks" he wants a D (this is time 3 since DDay that we're at this turning point), after our yr-ish of hell after DDay, lovely 7 mo of false R, that in his mind wasn't false bc although he told me he loved me and wanted to grow old with me, the fact that he doesn't love me or want any life w me, is irrelevant, bc he was "trying to" and "thought he would love me by then".

-- Would have been nice if he told me that's what was going on. --

Today he texted me about something work related to me (we don't work together). I ignored that, texted back about only the house bc I had a question. He texted "why aren't you answering me about (work related thing) "

I texted, "we talk about house things only, you know that was the choice you were making" and nothing else.
(I said in MC over a yr ago that if he wanted D, I couldn't be in his life at all. He said he understood)

He said "that's dumb, why can't we talk, we should help each other, I'm trying to help you, asking for nothing from you, because we know each other better than anyone else"

-- well of course we do! We've been together since my age started with a number 1, over a decade.
But WH is choosing to believe whatever feelings he had w her then (says he doesn't love her now) are real love, and he'll never feel that for me, and haven't ever before either. Despite our decade plus together. So really, what is he expecting me to do? If that's what he wants, that's what he wants, nothing more I can do, I'm finally learning that after close to 2 yrs since DDay --

Ugh. I'm simply angry today, anxious re the tenants in our house, anxious re paying off marital debt.

Really struggling to see the positives in life, though I know they are there.

Cookie7088 posted 9/27/2013 11:15 AM

we know each other better than anyone else

Ironically, I've heard that before...and my response was,

"Uhmm, no..I thought I knew you..but you cheated, and I thought you would never do that...And if you knew me so well, then why would you do something that you knew would hurt me?"

Well...we never had that conversation again...

[This message edited by Cookie7088 at 11:16 AM, September 27th (Friday)]

gonnabe2016 posted 9/27/2013 11:27 AM

"that's dumb, why can't we talk, we should help each other, I'm trying to help you, asking for nothing from you, because we know each other better than anyone else"

So he starts off by basically implying that you're dumb.
And then gets all disingenuous by telling you that he is trying to help you and "asking for nothing from you". Really? Sounds to me as if he's expecting you to talk to him and be friends with him -- I wouldn't describe that as asking *nothing* of you.
The "we know each other better than anyone else" is nothing but pure manipulation.

He's a butthead. I hope that you have continued to stick to the *house-only* conversations......

Iamacrab posted 9/27/2013 12:06 PM

I didn't respond.
I think I'm finally getting that I must must be firm for my own good w NC except the house.
I know I just keep talking about this topic, specifically my surprise (why was I surprised?), anger and disappointment over what I believe was false R, but it's made me realize that I didn't really understand how much time this was taking up in my life, and not in his. Monitoring, wondering, hoping is what I mean. And before that, cleaning, making lunch, snacks, bills, coordinating vacations...I have had so much more time to just be me. It would have been one thing if in more instances he also lost "his time" to do xyz as needed, but that was so rare, that I think I didn't even realize how limited my own time was.
I'm still struggling w so many aspects of this, but one realization is better than none. Slight progress maybe.

Williesmom posted 9/27/2013 12:12 PM

He wants to be "friends" because that makes what he did to you and your marriage less horrific.

Yeah, fuck him.

gonnabe2016 posted 9/27/2013 12:21 PM

I didn't really understand how much time this was taking up in my life

And that is so true. I didn't understand that either -- it took a direct question from my IC for me to *get* it. I was showing her some of the recent text/email exchanges between stbx and I and saying "can you believe that is what he said and how he thinks, (etc...)?????"

And she just looked at me for a minute......and she said "gonna, what *I* can't believe is how much TIME you are wasting with this." That was a really shocking discovery for me, to be honest.

Good job on the *crickets*.....

cmego posted 9/27/2013 12:29 PM

"....but...but....YOU are my best friend!"

I got that line several times when I instituted NC.

They don't understand, or respect boundaries...obviously.

I was called "ridiculous", "bitchy", "mean" and others when I instituted NC, and now he says I "control the relationship..." because I have no interest in being friends with him. I really think they live in an alternate universe.

Hang tough!

sleepless34 posted 9/27/2013 13:38 PM

Oh, that is so hard. But seriously, why would anyone want to be "friends" with someone who F**Ked you over so badly? That is not what friends do to eachother. I am so sick of these people. It is so unfair, so crappy. I hear you sista!

Take2 posted 9/27/2013 14:02 PM

I like the idea of responding that you don't know him at all as it turns out, and apparently he doesn't know you either.

But any response re-engages, and you are better off demonstrating NC by remaining NC.

Strength!

Iamacrab posted 9/27/2013 15:25 PM

He texted "I am sorry"

Of course he's sorry. Sorry for what, is really the crux of it. At some level I think he's sorry he hurt me and my family, but the majority of it, is sorry for himself, for whatever those reasons are.
I guess the baffling thing is that he just doesn't seem to have enough empathy.
He says I just don't see how he feels the way I want to see it, so I assume it's not there. Maybe he's right.

I really thought after she dumped him initially that through his deep hurt, he'd feel what it was like in some manner, and finally even just through that would have some lightbulb moment.

Clearly not. Or even if he does, that doesn't mean enough to him to really fix.
He said at one point months ago "love is looking across the room and knowing you'd do anything for that person" (or something like that) - I don't necessarily disagree but after over 10 yrs and marriage our relationship wasn't ever that to him? How didn't it grow, like my feelings did for him, as we went through life?

What does he value? I feel I definitely do not know, so then I feel like him being sorry is really all about him.

Rant over, sorry. I've gone far enough down this rabbit hole today.

gonnabe2016 posted 9/27/2013 16:22 PM

He says I just don't see how he feels the way I want to see it, so I assume it's not there. Maybe he's right.

I doubt that he's right. I think your *sight* is probably just fine....

HurtsButImOK posted 9/27/2013 16:31 PM

Speaking for myself, I couldn't be 'friends' with my abuser. That is, in a nutshell, what he has done with his cheating, lying, minimizing and blameshifting.

Friends don't actively try to destroy each other, that's what enemies are for.

HurtButHopeful? posted 9/27/2013 16:37 PM

Imacrab,
I'm sorry he can't make sense of reality and keeps engaging you.

You once thought you knew him well, but then he became someone you didn't know.

But don't bother telling him that, he cannot hear the truth, or deal with reality.

((((Iamacrab))))

Iamacrab posted 10/9/2013 20:12 PM

WH is making me insane. We've had some house issues, so talking about that.
Then he texts me about his credit score vastly improving and says "There isn't anyone else I could tell that would understand it was a big thing like you would" - well eff you WH, you have that improved score bc I wrote the checks from your account for your fines, I set up the payment plans for your taxes, I still ensure the mortgage is paid.

Then he says
"For whatever reason I just haven't loved you the way you deserve. It doesn't make any sense to me, there is no reason I shouldn't be able to and plenty of reasons I should. I want to and I've tried to, but for whatever reason it isn't the same for me as it is for you. that's probably the biggest reason I keep trying, my brain says what's wrong with you, you'd be dumb not to want this"

I said
"Find those papers please. I'm sick of this limbo, I want to change my name. I want to erase you from my life, I'm so angry. " (he's had them for a yr, the other day texted that he was looking for them, wasn't sure where they were.)
I know I'm supposed to not engage. It's not far from our anniversary and I'm handling it badly. I know he's done and is just dragging his feet. I know I have no other good options. I'm just so angry.


Artemisia posted 10/9/2013 20:29 PM


I guess the baffling thing is that he just doesn't seem to have enough empathy.

Ugh, how could you not be angry. I am angry with you. Him philosophizing to you about why he doesn't love you makes my blood boil. It illustrates your quote above. He can't see beyond his so-interesting!!! self to understand the effects of his words. I think I am especially angry because this is the kind of crazy crap I kept hearing. Back when we still spoke. NC, NC, NC.

Nature_Girl posted 10/9/2013 20:34 PM

"Find those papers please. I'm sick of this limbo, I want to change my name. I want to erase you from my life, I'm so angry.

What a great response! Good job!

SBB posted 10/9/2013 20:39 PM

There is an emotional bakery as well as a physical one.

Time to close the bakery. The fuckers will cake eat for exactly as long as we allow them too.

Too bad he lost his soft place to land. The sad clown told me he missed talking to me about his day, discussing office politics, getting my POV on things. I am awesome at all of it but he is no longer in my circle of trust. He's not even on the same page, same planet. He doesn't get any of the benefits of being in my life. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

My girls are my only gift to him and I give up my time with them quite unwillingly.

Please read about 'Hoovering'. They all try it at some stage whether they want R or not.

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=480828

The sad clown has also expressed a wish that we not just bear each other whenever I am forced to see him in person. "I would hope we could do better than just ignoring each other" or some such bullshit. I guess he expects a "Good morning Sad Clown, nice weather we're having!".

Yeah, nah. This is as good as it gets dude. Get used to it.

If we have them back in our lives even a tiny bit then what they've done isn't so terrible. "See, we're friends!"

I am more than happy to remain civil. I do this for my girls. Friendly, no.

courageous posted 10/9/2013 21:00 PM

My ex said something similar when we were in the divorce process about being friends..... I told him

my friends don't treat me bad and if they did I wouldn't be their friend. Why would I want to be friends with some one who lies to me, steals from me, and continues to hurt me?

Iamacrab posted 10/9/2013 21:20 PM

I think my major problem is that this plays into an insecurity I've had our entire relationship. I always said he cared more about his friends than me, and he always always said it wasn't true.
We did nearly everything as couples with his friends. When we were first dating when I was in college, he'd eat dinner w them literally every night of the week at an Applebee's type place, and I'd go along as a part of the large group when I could. That weekly dinner time weaned as we got older, but we still saw them each weekend and for nye and picnics and get togethers.
When we got married I thought ok, he's finally showing me that I was wrong, I am his priority, as we didn't see them nearly as much (though he still talked to them often), and finally we had more of a life as us.
Now from what I can tell without talking about it, he's back to a similar schedule w those that are still single (the married ones don't go anywhere now) and in one text I didn't copy and paste after the one I mentioned above he said "I do want more".
I just feel like maybe I deluded myself for over a decade because I wanted to be more for him and because I was useful to him, and really, I was never his number one.
He was my favorite person in life.
I just feel so angry, at me and at him, and on top of that, so dumb.

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