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Newest Member: 4ever2gether (45763)

User Topic: Asking WS to break NC
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 1:57 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This might sound a touch crazy, but our anti-versary/anniversary of the first of five DDays is coming up in November. This entire end of the year has been one trigger after another, starting in August and chugging along on its merry, destructive path. The last two weeks have been hell, starting on Oct 5th when WH said something (this was one of the days he called OW) that set me off, and we had attempted to discuss it, but it still didnít sit right with me so I just brought it up again and after that, I was shut down my WHís defensiveness and anger at what he considered my misunderstanding of his intentions. Then, of course, I find out during this merry wonder two weeks that he violated one of my expressed boundaries and didnít tell me or apologize. Instead, another argument ensued in which he got defensive, tried shouting me down and proving how wrong I was about the things that I was accusing him of.

I still have not completely gotten over my anger, but Iíve managed to reel some of it in. I still donít feel comfortable around him like Iíd like to because of this past two week back lash of his anger and defensiveness (which he told me later that I was actually right about a number of my assertions, he just didnít like being told that he was wrong even though he knew he was. Whatever). So, speed it up to this week or part of this week and a few things that I told him last week:

I told him that since the antiversary is coming up I wanted him to do last year over, sort of speak. Everything that he COULD have done better last year, I want him to do right this time THIS year. I want him to have a timeline done (something that he have been going back and forth on, arguing on, getting on SI on); I want to visit the location properly instead of being lied to; I want a full confession; and dammit, yes, like the title of this post: I want him to break NC to do a Ďproperí NC like he should have instead of him arguing with me, fighting me on it and then ultimately doing the shittiest version of NC that he HAD done.

So essentially, I am asking him to break NC to do NC properly.

I want him to have a Ďdo overí in a sense, but I have to ask: am I crazy for demanding a proper NC even a year AFTER everything?

I just canít get over how many lies he told me and how much crap he put me through during the four month TT, and how when he flat out refused to give me any details that I asked for that I finally called the OW out of desperation and how he just stood aside while she and I argued, and allowed that disrespect because he just ďdidnít know what to do.Ē

This is a raw and painful time. Iím not a special snow flake that thinks my pain is greater than anyone elseís; I frequently get on SI to make sure I get the reality check to know that there are a number of men and women in my situation whoíve handled themselves with more dignity than I have. I just need advice, really.

Thank you.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
brokensmile322
♀ 35758
Member # 35758
Default  Posted: 2:15 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hugs Shocked Erica!

Truthfully,

I.would.not.kick.that.hornets.nest!

Is there no contact now? If so, calling her or getting in touch with her to tell her no contact only shows her how little you have progressed. She will know that she is still a factor, still being discussed, possibly still being argued about.

And while this ^^^ is essentially true, why on earth would you want to let HER know that?!

Listen, we all have some shitty things happen in the beginning. R is not linear. He TT'd and didn't do NC properly, probably because of the fog, but what should be important now is this....

What are his actions now? What is his thinking now? What is he doing to show that he is not still thinking in the A mindset?

Is your relationship different now than it was then? Have you progressed? Is he doing actions, not just talking about it?

The antiversary is difficult no matter what the circumstances. And the fighting leading up to it and after it are all fueled by the emotions the big date is stirring up in you.

You will be ok. Try to realize what is happening and throw up a bunch of stop signs. Try to let your WH comfort you, but try avoiding discussing these things when you are upset. Jot them down for later discussion. Discussing them now can wait....it is not make or break if it is not done right now. Just make sure to revisit them when things cool. YOu might just discover you don't need to discuss them after all. At the very least, you will be in a better spot emotionally to handle it well.

Hugs!!


Me BS 42 Him WS 44
OW Coworker DDay April 7, 2012
EA on a slippery slope...

When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves. ~Viktor Frankl

"When you are happy, you can forgive a great deal."


Posts: 1595 | Registered: Jun 2012
solus sto
♀ 30989
Member # 30989
Default  Posted: 2:22 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The manner in which he established NC is not the problem, Erica. You know that.

He's not getting it. He's not there yet. THAT is the problem.

Your antiversary pain is magnified by this. The fact that you feel you need a do-over is really worrisome.

What progress has been made?

Rather than focus on OW---with whom NC should be strictly maintained, unless she makes contact in which case, THEN a clear NC message should be delivered--perhaps it would be better to step back, and watch his actions.

What is he doing? How is he demonstrating transparency? how is he demonstrating remorse?

Antiversary time can be triggery and cause temporary emotional setbacks. But if you've never gotten full disclosure, etc, I suspect there is more to your feelings than the antiversary.

I'm sorry.


BS-me, 52
WH (Trac-fone), 53, PD
2 kids-DD25, DS18
multiple d-days
DIVORCING
Alone, most strangely, I live on~Rupert Brooke

Posts: 9044 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: midwest
redrock
♀ 21538
Member # 21538
Default  Posted: 2:23 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So essentially, I am asking him to break NC to do NC properly.

If you would like him to write a proper NC letter, I don't think he has to send it to the OW to make it meaningful to you.

All that sending it to the OW will do is provide her with the ego stroke that she is 'important' in your marriage.

Have him write it to you. I hope he takes the opportunity to humble himself to the process that he would not last year. To offer empathy and facts and effort.

I don't think the OW needs to be involved in that. JMHO.

I am sorry that you have to face this time of year. I hope that your WH gives you what you need from him at this time.


I don't respect anyone that can't spell a word more than one way:)

Posts: 3161 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: Michigan
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 2:54 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Is your relationship different now than it was then? Have you progressed? Is he doing actions, not just talking about it?

I donít want to say heís not doing anything now because he is (as he pointed out to me last night when we were arguing (and because I asked him to tell me because he has a REAL problem with opening his mouth).); he is trying. Itís just this reoccurring theme is that I can ask him to do something and he doesnít actually do the things I specifically ask for until a day or so later, a week or so later, or a month or so later, and then Iím fuming because he waited so long that he overthought himself into inaction. Then I yell, he argues back and claims heís going to do as I ask, that I never let him speak, that Iím always demanding things of him, constant defensiveness. Then he ďpromisesĒ heíll do something, do it for a few days and then stops altogether.

If itís not that above scenario, then fifty percent of the time I just donít want to talk with him about my feelings because thereís a 50/50 chance that heíll get argumentative and then the above scenario will ensue anyway. Weíve had good days of conversation, but even on those good days, where I have repeatedly told him that he should probably bring up an issue he has with me because on those days I have a pretty good control of my anger and any other emotional outburst, he really just lets issues fester and keep festering. He doesnít want to rock the boat on the good days, but when bad days surface thatís when I get accusations hurled at me about the things I havenít done for him when I am probably one of the few people in his life who has actually tried to ďhelpĒ him.

Itís not that heís not ďdoingĒ; itís that the ďdoingĒ is not sustained. Iíll tell him, ďHey, talk about the affair, bring it up instead of me always bringing it up, let me know that youíre thinking about it as much as I do.Ē

And heíll just regurgitate the same line in different ways over and over of: ďI feel so bad about my actions. I feel bad about everything. Iím so stupid and horrible and blah blah blah blah blah.Ē Itís almost like heís reading a script. But my initial request of: Talk about the Affair gets ignored. He just doesnít talk about it unless I bring it up or have a question. I have written out a list of questions that I have asked him to answer. I have asked him to inform me on when heís going to have an answer or a discussion for maybe even ONE question; he has not done it. We have been arguing about the timeline since January, when I first asked him to write one and while TT was still going on. He gave me a half-assed one that had NOTHING of what we discussed on it, and only vague references to Facebook posts and some info from cell phone records. And when I confronted him on it, of course he got defensive and shouted, ďEverything I do is wrong. I canít do anything right. Iím such a bad guy. Iíve made so many mistakes. I just canít do anything right.Ē Despite me having gone over with him AD NAUSEUM how I wanted the timeline done, even sending him SI posts about members who asked Ďhowí the timeline is supposed to be done.

Itís not that heís not doing anything; itís that heís doing things that are comfortable for him to do and not the things that I specifically ask him to do. I really try to spell out what I want without trying to leave too much room for doubt, and yet he still over thinks it so much that heíll over think himself into inaction.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:04 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The manner in which he established NC is not the problem, Erica. You know that.
He's not getting it. He's not there yet. THAT is the problem.

Your antiversary pain is magnified by this. The fact that you feel you need a do-over is really worrisome.
What progress has been made?

Rather than focus on OW---with whom NC should be strictly maintained, unless she makes contact in which case, THEN a clear NC message should be delivered--perhaps it would be better to step back, and watch his actions.

What is he doing? How is he demonstrating transparency? how is he demonstrating remorse?
Antiversary time can be triggery and cause temporary emotional setbacks. But if you've never gotten full disclosure, etc, I suspect there is more to your feelings than the antiversary.

I'm sorry.

Itís not that heís not doing things. He is. He helps with DD; he recently helped with a project that Iíve been working and he helped me coordinate. Heís good at doing the comfortable things, the things that he ďknowsĒ how to do; itís the uncomfortable things that he wonít do that I ask him to do, and I know whatís uncomfortable and thatís partially why I ask him to do those things.

No, I often donít think he [i]gets[/i] things really. I think he only does things because Iíve asked him to, but truly understanding WHY Iím asking is something that I donít think he ponders on so that things only get done half-way or with only minimal effort. Like I posted above, we argued about the timeline. He claimed he understood why I needed it done and yet when he did it, it contained NOTHING of what I had asked him to do or even put on there, and that was something I specifically asked him to do.

Iíve often told him that whenever I ask him to do something that specifically pertains to me, it feels like there has to be a ďfightĒ before he actually gets why I need him to do something because no amount of patiently explaining something to him seems to work. Only after Iíve gotten worked up and angry does he ďgetĒ that heís done something wrong, but actually understanding what the something is and empathizing with me on what could possibly be wrong, making the leap of logic for himself? Nope, sometimes, I feel like thatís a feat thatís beyond him. And when I try to explain to him (sometimes, nice; sometimes, Iím just too damn worked up to be nice), he pulls the ďIím always WRONGĒ card so that itís impossible for me to have patience with him.

And trust, I used to have LOADS of patience with him.

And then I found out he cheated. My anger at him overrides my patience sometimes. I still have it, and have to make a monumentous effort to keep it, but itís not like how I used to be. That I do know.

Iím rambling, I think.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:06 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you would like him to write a proper NC letter, I don't think he has to send it to the OW to make it meaningful to you.

All that sending it to the OW will do is provide her with the ego stroke that she is 'important' in your marriage.

Have him write it to you. I hope he takes the opportunity to humble himself to the process that he would not last year. To offer empathy and facts and effort.

I feel like if he'd even done THIS without me having to ask, it would've gone over very well. But often times, I feel like when I have to ask him to do something, he waits and waits and waits to do it untilI've gotten frustrated that he hasn't done it and then I'm demanding it, and he's angry that I'm demanding at that point.

I'm just tired.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
StrongerOne
♀ 36915
Member # 36915
Default  Posted: 3:22 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You are 26. You have a lot of years left on earth. Do you want to spend them with a man who blames YOU for making him feel bad because HE won't bother to do any thing towards R until you nag him? And then tells you, I was gonna do it... Yeah, right. That's what teenagers say about taking out the trash. Like them, he is lying about that.

If he wanted to do what you have very clearly asked him to do, he would do it.

Even aside from that, I don't see that he's doing anything much. He is *not* trying. You say he is, but he isn't. He called the OW on October 5. Only two weeks ago. He violated some other boundary within the last two weeks, one that clearly hurt you badly.

He may very well love you. But he doesn't respect you. Or at least, he is not treating you with respect.

Respect yourself, ShockedErica, because he is not going to do it, and you cannot make him to do -- can't do it by being angry, can't do it by being sweet, can't do it by arguing, can't do it by calmly laying out logical arguments. You can't. Only he can.

Go to a lawyer. Find out what you need to know and do if you decide you won't put up with this disrespect.

Hugs to you, ShockedErica. I know I sound kind of mean! but truly, you are worthy of respect and love. I just want you to believe it. Don't spend years before you get there.


DDay Feb 2011.
In R.

Posts: 889 | Registered: Sep 2012
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:23 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I mean, I get what everyone is saying. It IS a hornetís nest in that if he contacts her and lets her know that even after this time she is still a blip on the radar she might even take that as permission to stir up more trouble.

I get it.

Because honestly, yes, people have had stupid crap happen during TT days, months, years, but Iíve been angry about it for months, and the antiversary doesnít help. I donít know what he can do to make this better, to truly make me feel safer.

This might hit some FOO issues for me that are just not being addressed. I donít know. I just donít feel safe with him anymore, and there are some many posts that say to tell your WS what they can do make you feel better, what requirements you need for R, but honestly, aside from a short list that I gave him of arbitrary things (arbitrary in my mind anyway), I donít know what he can do for me. Iíve tried to think hard on this, but honestly, I donít know.

Thinking on it, I asked myself what could he have done last year that couldíve made this experience better and that was what I could think of: doing it over and doing it properly. Seriously, this entire year has been shit from since I found out. I know itís shit for everyone; I get that. But all my brain could keep re-iterating was: he has to do it over, he has to do it over, he has to do it over. I donít know what that means if thatís where my head is at. I donít know if that means heís not doing all that he can or if that means that this was a deal breaker and Iím just fighting it or if that means that the amount of anger that I have at this situation just isnít being dealt with properly. I just donít know.

It's like he'll tell me things will be done on my time and not his; that he needs to start moving at my pace, but then there are things that I ask him to do that don't get done on my pace, and then he'll pull what I consider a pity party of sorts (I guess trying to get sympathy; I honestly don't know) and claim how bad he is, how wrong he is, how terrible of a person he is and that's about as far as we'll get. Every once and a while, he'll reveal some emotions that he's feeling, but it still follows along that vein of "I'm such a bad person. I think I've done too many bad things. I'm always wrong no matter what I do or say, it's always wrong. I want to show you that I can be a good husband, boyfriend, fiance. I can never do anything right. Etc, etc."

Like I said, he's good at doing the mundane things that are "comfortable" for him: scheduling who's watching DD on the days she deoesn't go to school, paying bills on time, helping with clean up, even helping me stay up to work on projects and working on some parts of the projects that I need help with to shave off time. But the emotional things, my "love language" if you will, yeah not so much. And scored the lowest on it anyway.

[This message edited by ShockedErica11 at 3:35 PM, October 21st (Monday)]


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:26 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Even aside from that, I don't see that he's doing anything much. He is *not* trying. You say he is, but he isn't. He called the OW on October 5. Only two weeks ago. He violated some other boundary within the last two weeks, one that clearly hurt you badly.

I'm sorry; to clarify it was on October 5th, 2012 that he called her. Two weeks ago was a sort of antiversary of that phone call in which he said something stupid and it got me angry and that anger escalated and snowballed.

Sorry for the miscommunication.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
myperfectlife
♀ 39801
Member # 39801
Default  Posted: 3:33 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Itís just this reoccurring theme is that I can ask him to do something and he doesnít actually do the things I specifically ask for until a day or so later, a week or so later, or a month or so later, and then Iím fuming because he waited so long that he overthought himself into inaction. Then I yell, he argues back and claims heís going to do as I ask, that I never let him speak, that Iím always demanding things of him, constant defensiveness. Then he ďpromisesĒ heíll do something, do it for a few days and then stops altogether.

Thankfully I recognized this pattern before I agreed to reconcile. And breaking this pattern is a CONDITION of reconciliation.
This passive aggressive bullshit, conflict avoidance and always putting out fires and never being proactive.
In my opinion and from others I've spoken with on here: THESE coping mechanisms (or lack thereof) are very, very common in WS.
Personally, as far as I am concerned, there is ALWAYS the chance of another affair as long as these traits, actions, and reactions, coping mechanisms etc...exist.
This is a person who is not dealing with their issues. They are avoiding conflict, shoving things aside, not being proactive, not taking charge.
HUGE.
RED.
FLAG.
I don't think you're in true R at all until these issues are brought to the front and dealt with.
As far as breaking NC, I would not even worry about all that right now. You're shifting the real issue away from the source. If you were truly happy with everything he'd done so far it wouldn't matter HOW he did NC at first.
Trust me, NC is hard enough to come by-my WS has broken it more times than I can count on 2 hands. Don't tempt that devil.
Pick your battles. His conflict avoidance is a much, much bigger problem that will continue to affect your marriage FOREVER until it is resolved.
Just my 2 cents.


I cannot be responsible for another's personal growth.
DDay#1 of a "cheatillion" 4/1/13
Divorce final 11/04/13

Posts: 452 | Registered: Jul 2013
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:42 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thankfully I recognized this pattern before I agreed to reconcile. And breaking this pattern is a CONDITION of reconciliation.
This passive aggressive bullshit, conflict avoidance and always putting out fires and never being proactive.
In my opinion and from others I've spoken with on here: THESE coping mechanisms (or lack thereof) are very, very common in WS.
Personally, as far as I am concerned, there is ALWAYS the chance of another affair as long as these traits, actions, and reactions, coping mechanisms etc...exist.
This is a person who is not dealing with their issues. They are avoiding conflict, shoving things aside, not being proactive, not taking charge.
HUGE.
RED.
FLAG.
I don't think you're in true R at all until these issues are brought to the front and dealt with.
As far as breaking NC, I would not even worry about all that right now. You're shifting the real issue away from the source. If you were truly happy with everything he'd done so far it wouldn't matter HOW he did NC at first.
Trust me, NC is hard enough to come by-my WS has broken it more times than I can count on 2 hands. Don't tempt that devil.
Pick your battles. His conflict avoidance is a much, much bigger problem that will continue to affect your marriage FOREVER until it is resolved.
Just my 2 cents.

No, your two cents are indeedly correct. He learned to be passive aggressive from his FOO, specifically his mother. And I am in agreement that if he were handling things better that many of his prior mistakes wouldn't be such issues now.

He has a serious issue, one that he has admitted and one that makes talking to him and getting to the heart of issues extremely difficult. He just avoids having an opinion one way or another because "standing his ground" means tha he'll stir the pot and he just doesn't want to stir the pot with ANYONE.

It is a serious issue. You are right.

We're not in R right now because I told him I refuse to reconcile with him until he gets his act together. I'm not recommitting to this marriage until he shows real effort, and he hasn't, and this "do over" that I want may actually be ME sidestepping the major issue and putting a passive aggressive band aid over it myself.

I don't know how to break this cycle. Or maybe I do, and I'm just terrified.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
devasted30
♀ 39439
Member # 39439
Default  Posted: 3:47 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello ShockedErica - IMHO I think that neither of you are truly facing what has happened. The "do over" - do you just want to try to erase what has happened and go back to where you were before????? I know that's what I want. I have to talk to myself everyday and say, "this really happened....the man I trusted more than anyone else in the world, he cheated on me" He did it off and on for 7 years. He had affairs on me" He cheated on me" I can't believe it - I don't want to believe it. I keep asking him to "take it back" "make it go away". I think that is probably how you feel too but that is just how I'm reading it. And I think you WS wants to sweep it all under the rug. He doesn't get it - no doubt about that. Sounds like he's trying (a little) but hoping against hope that it will just disappear - don't mention it and it'll go away.
Well, we all know it won't and on a different level you know that but just don't want to admit to it? Could this be possible? I know you have suffered incredible pain, but have you really faced up to it. I'm almost 12 months out (in 2 weeks) and I still cannot believe that this has happened.......I still cannot face it. My WS is doing everything right - we didn't do the NC but I have asked him to write a letter to the last OW (3 years off/on) and he has started it, but has not finished it....and sometimes I wonder, should we just let sleeping dogs lie. We haven't been bothered by her in a couple of months - should we send her a letter....but, I feel she deserves to know what happened. She was heartbroken when my WS returned to me. I know I shouldn't sympathize but I know exactly how she felt. I was in her position for 11 weeks. Yes, I was with my WS for 30 years and she only had him part-time for 3, but she needs to know the WHY - even she deserves that - but does she? Am I opening a kettle of worms - would you be if you had your WS do the NC again. Would this backfire on us and let them think that this is still bothering us? That she is still a part of our lives?
I don't know. Is it worth the risk? Will this really make you feel better?
Something to think about. Hard to believe that we could go through all this pain and still not admit that this did happen but I know without a doubt, that I am still trying to deny it. Incredible as that may seem.


And remember Murphy is right. Nothing is so bad that it can't get worse!!!

Posts: 1393 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Ontario, Canada
ShockedErica11
♀ 37550
Member # 37550
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Something to think about. Hard to believe that we could go through all this pain and still not admit that this did happen but I know without a doubt, that I am still trying to deny it. Incredible as that may seem.

All of your questions are/have been running through my head. I didn't ponder on the "opening the can of worms" bit; I really have been steamrolling forward.

I don't think I'm properly addressing the issues on my end, my personal feelings on what has happened. I look at him, and I really can't believe that this is what he did. I constantly try to tell myself, "But YOU chose this man. YOU chose to remain here and deal with this. So, who's really to blame?"

I try to take ownership of my own choices and actions, but I don't think I'm dealing with the full deluge of this situation in a "proper" manner (if there is even a proper etiquette to dealing with this).

I'm trying to keep my head above water. I have IC, but I don't see her often enough. Tried ADs, but the ones I tried didn't seem to work and I'm leary of trying them again.

I think I'm avoding my own issues, even with it being a year out.


Him (31): Taurus517 (17 mon EA/PA); others
Me (27): 3mo EA/PA (kissed once)
One too many D-days
(Full story: see profile)

Posts: 230 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Atlanta, GA
StrongerOne
♀ 36915
Member # 36915
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, so he didn't call her two weeks ago. Other than that, I think everything I said still holds true.

The things he's doing that are right -- those are minimal requirements for being married and having kids. Yes, good on him for doing them, especially if he didn't do them before. But clearly he's not doing what you need to feel safe, to feel loved, to feel like the wife and woman that he chooses.

Asking him for the do-over: I see that as you giving him a GIFT. You're giving him another chance to do right. To be a good husband, a good friend, a good person. I do not think you are asking him for anything unreasonable.

When he boo hoos about how "I can't do anything right", he's making your pain about HIM. He's making you the bad guy. He's distracting you from the real point, which is that he is not focusing his time and energy in you.

What you've asked him for -- not arbitrary. Unless you're asking him to skip down the middle of the freeway at rush hour. -- you're not, right?

The only thing you want that I think is unwise, is breaking NC. I really get it, why you want him to do that. My H never sent his MCOW a NC letter or email. He did it verbally, without me there, and told me what he said. If he told me the truth about that -- I think he did -- it was a shitty not really NC speech. It's one of the few things left from his A that will not let me forgive him. It's terrible. BUT. It would be foolish for him to contact her to say NC. Even though it kind if festers between us, I can't ask him to do it.

Sorry I got kind of t/j there. Please don't doubt yourself on this one-- he needs to come through.

Hugs to you.


DDay Feb 2011.
In R.

Posts: 889 | Registered: Sep 2012
brokensmile322
♀ 35758
Member # 35758
Default  Posted: 7:10 PM, October 21st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Shocked Erica,

I just donít feel safe with him anymore, and there are some many posts that say to tell your WS what they can do make you feel better, what requirements you need for R, but honestly, aside from a short list that I gave him of arbitrary things (arbitrary in my mind anyway), I donít know what he can do for me.

Yes. Yes you do. You have asked. He delays. He SAYS he will do it and then either does it poorly, not for very long, or he never gets around to it.

You will not bully him into it. YOu have tried for a year. He has shown you what he will do. And that is...taking his time doing the bare minimum or not doing it at all.

You say

It's like he'll tell me things will be done on my time and not his; that he needs to start moving at my pace, but then there are things that I ask him to do that don't get done on my pace, and then he'll pull what I consider a pity party of sorts (I guess trying to get sympathy; I honestly don't know) and claim how bad he is, how wrong he is, how terrible of a person he is and that's about as far as we'll get. Every once and a while, he'll reveal some emotions that he's feeling, but it still follows along that vein of "I'm such a bad person. I think I've done too many bad things. I'm always wrong no matter what I do or say, it's always wrong. I want to show you that I can be a good husband, boyfriend, fiance. I can never do anything right. Etc, etc."

^^^ This says it all. He never gets around to what he says or he does it poorly.

When you confront him again, he manipulates you into feeling bad by saying he is such a bad person.

It is manipulation. And you are allowing it.

The taking care of your daughter or household chores or helping with a project or cooking a meal???!!! Those are bare minimum requirements for a relationship, let alone a marriage.

Great that he is doing them, but no kudos from me....he should be doing those things.

You can decide when the madness ends. Turn the sound off. State one last time what you need. Do not badger, do not remind, do not discuss. Period.

DONT listen to what he SAYS to you about any of it. WATCH HIM. If he isn't doing it, you have decisions to make. You may or may not be strong enough to decide now what to do....but in the meantime get yourself strong. Are you in IC? Enact the 180 if he doesn't do the things you ask. Period.

((Hugs)) I know it is so hard.

[This message edited by brokensmile322 at 7:11 PM, October 21st (Monday)]


Me BS 42 Him WS 44
OW Coworker DDay April 7, 2012
EA on a slippery slope...

When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves. ~Viktor Frankl

"When you are happy, you can forgive a great deal."


Posts: 1595 | Registered: Jun 2012
sodamnlost
♀ 37190
Member # 37190
Default  Posted: 10:56 AM, October 23rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree it's a can of worms that should stay buried. It almost sounds to me like you just want him to pick you. Maybe I am reading too much of my own WH in your post - I dunno.

I think on some level you know he is just NOT getting it. That's scary as hell a year out. I know, I am there. The hardest part for me is realizing there is not ONE damn thing I can do to MAKE my WH get it. It's on him. Totally. So the question becomes - can you live with him rug sweeping/ living in denial?


If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck - it's not a fluffy pink unicorn squirting liquid rainbows, complete with pots of gold out of it's ass.

Posts: 769 | Registered: Oct 2012 | From: Nowhere pretty
Topic Posts: 17

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