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Relevant background - WH had an A with MOW coworker with lots of issues that gave him an opportunity to be her KISA. He loooooves to be that nice guy, that helpful guy, you got an issue, he's there for you...

So yesterday we are home and he makes a phone call. He is in the next room and I think I hear him say Amy. Then he hangs up after saying to call his cell phone. He gets a cell phone call, takes it in front of me. Instantly I am all on alert. Who was that, I ask. He says, someone from work, "they(note:not she)" needed a small piece of drywall to patch a hole in the wall and I had some leftover, but now they don't need it b/c they hired it done. I said, who was it? Her name is Amy, he says. Says he doesn't know her last name. I start questioning him and he acts annoyed, says if he was being sneaky he wouldn't make/ take the calls in front of me, then says she is married(so was MOW, duh!), then says she's not even pretty(don't even get me started on homely skanky slut AP)

I freaked out. WTF! 3 mos after you are caught cheating and it's ok to talk to female coworkers outside work, give them your cell, offer to help with their problems? What. The. Fuck. Doesn't matter what your intentions are, you crossed a line, you opened a door that should be tightly shut. I am just in disbelief that he would do that without thinking twice. I know old habits are hard to break, but this makes me feel so unsafe.

After he stopped trying to justify why it was ok and I saw the realization on his face, he did understand how unacceptable it was. I worry, though, that he thinks "but it would have been fine because I had no bad intent." Dangerous thinking!!! A setup for the slippery slope...

I guess I know the topic I want to talk about at our next MC session.

X is bad with boundaries, too. I have to keep repeating them and sometimes get very angry at him before a boundary will stick.

A's seem to be largely about lack of boundaries and so when we try to instill them, it's extra hard to make them "stick".

I've had to get downright ugly about boundaries, sometimes with the police's help, and almost jump up and down in anger like a kid to get him to follow them. It didn't matter that to him that he was bringing the A into my home that he gave up-he thought it was still his home and he could do whatever he wanted-no.

Sometimes A's are about defiance, too, as is an angle in the case of Perv.

OW in the case of Perv is ...is...positively indescribable, but I can assure you that it's not always or often about appearance. It's about other things...availablity, willingness to help defy boundaries, and so on. It's a strange concept at first but when I finally saw a picture of OW, I could not believe it, nor could other people I know who had the nerve to look. Gag.

And you know, during confession, X Pervert had the gall to tell me how large she is. Like he found a fault and had to share it.

He also told me, "it was only supposed to be a fling." Yet he's all moved in and we're divorcing. Jusfifying as you had to hear.

I'm sorry.

I'm sorry for your hard time.

Thank you, Ashland. It makes me so angry that he would think this is ok. I just want to scream at him. His A started by pushing boundaries on FB; how, how can he not see the issue here?

I shall commence with the angry jumping up and down. If that's what it takes, so be it. I will persist until I KNOW he fully and completely gets it. I will not accept the alternative.

Double post, sorry

[This message edited by iwillNOT at 8:29 PM, November 23rd (Saturday)]

Is he in IC or are you in MC?

I ask because that is what it took for my husband to get it.

His 2nd affair was with a student (not a young one, my age 34). Then after DDay and while things were so terrible, he got a new student, this time a young one, and somehow got to the point with her where she was inviting him to join her co-ed soccer team! I FREAKED when she sent him a text to his pager something like "Great. Can't wait!" about the first game. He got so mad that I thought something of it. I got even madder that he actually didn't get it. I told him to just ask his therapist. And his therapist told him that if he went, he should bring me.

Then for years after that he still thought flirting was ok as long as nothing came of it. Dumbest thing I'd never heard as twice his flirting led to him cheating on me.

It was the MC we finally started seeing 1.5 years ago who finally got him to understand that.

I am still all WTF that he is an adult, an intelligent enough man and he can't get that?

iDeserveMore,

It's crazy scary, how clueless they are. Things have to change.

Yes, we are both on MC and IC. I love our MC, and she is not afraid to call either of us on our bullsh*t. Though mostly it has been WH she is calling out lol.

So does helpful guy want DS1,DS5,DD7,DD10 or does he want to be there for these odd women who will always be around needing help or a shoulder or whatever. As my mother used to say, "men, they are good for moving stuff." (no wonder I married a cheater). And really, there will always be a mademoiselle in need everywhere. We always need help with moving stuff, you know?

He can't be the hero anymore.

He can only be the hero of DS1,DS5,DD7,DD10 and his own wife.

You (WH) are never to speak to a woman unless it is for business/work related stuff. Fixing stuff for a woman in her home or her car is not work related. Talking to a waitress or flirting back to her when you are at lunch is not work related. You are there to eat and she there to give you the food you ordered. You are not to have fun with cashiers if they are female. This is not work related. You are not to talk to females unless they are your mothers or grandmother age (God help him if that works too) for any personal issues - only work related.

Do you want to be personal with other females or be personal with DS1,DS5,DD7,DD10 and your wife. Stop being a hero to women who you are not married to and be my hero only.

[This message edited by mychild at 9:35 PM, November 23rd (Saturday)]

If she's married or has a SO, let that guy deal with shit.

If she's not married, let her hire a handyman.

Your husband's assistance is NOT required by any other woman except his mother. Done.