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User Topic: No respect/ being judgmental
cmego
♀ 30346
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 8:34 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dating a new guy. He tells me last night that he was married as a 19 year old, had a son, and walked away from the son when they D'd 2 years later.

He now has 2 more sons that he is very involved with, shared custody. No contact with son from his first marriage.

I shut down a little when he told me, and he said I am "too cautious and will miss out on a good guy…"

Blarg. I just have little respect for someone that walks away from their kid. Otherwise, he is a decent guy…no swooning on my end…but that is typical for me.

I don't want to "judge him", but I also think I can't handle that choice. Hmmmm…..


me...BS, 44 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced


Posts: 4279 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: South
Chrysalis123
♀ 27148
Member # 27148
Default  Posted: 8:45 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I couldn't handle that choice either.


Don’t get to the end of your life and find that you lived only the length of it; live the width of it as well. 

Posts: 2819 | Registered: Jan 2010
NaiveAgain
♀ 20849
Member # 20849
Default  Posted: 8:54 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he said I am "too cautious and will miss out on a good guy…"
Yuck. Any person that feels they have to convince you that they are a good person and you are missing out is someone that raises red flags for me.

I just have little respect for someone that walks away from their kid. Otherwise, he is a decent guy

No he isn't. A good guy (or woman) doesn't walk away from his/her child. (Although I might be missing something here and maybe that isn't the entire story....it is different if he paid child support and tried to see the child once in a while to let that child know he is cared about....or if he had a mental illness that prevented him from being a caring parent.)

No losses here and you are right to get a bad feeling in my opinion.

Oh wait....I just registered that he was married and a part of that child's life for 2 years. Okay, I'm not missing something...he has a character defect.

Oh! One more thing! He is trying to make you feel bad about your choice by telling you that you are too cautious. That is manipulative.

[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 8:57 AM, November 24th (Sunday)]


Original WS D-Day July 10, 2008. Kept lying, he is gone.
New WS (2 EA's, no PA) 12-3-13
If you don't like where you are, then change it. You are not a tree.

Posts: 15543 | Registered: Aug 2008 | From: Ohio
tryingagain74
♀ 33698
Member # 33698
Default  Posted: 9:02 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah, icky. As far as I'm concerned, we could all stand to be a little more judgmental in this life. We should judge people who betray their wedding vows, abandon and abuse their family members, etc. I don't want people like that in my life, and I fail to see how I'm being judgmental by feeling that way. It's one thing to say, "I stole a car when I was 16 and got busted for it," and then move on to live a decent life; I think someone like that shouldn't be judged. But to say you had a kid and walked away from him? Next.


FBS; now happily liberated!
Two DS and One DD
It matters not how strait the gate,/How charged with punishments the scroll./I am the master of my fate:/I am the captain of my soul.--"Invictus," William Ernest Henley

Posts: 3659 | Registered: Oct 2011
Dreamboat
♀ 10506
Member # 10506
Default  Posted: 9:39 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You are not being judgmental, you are being realistic.

My X abandoned DD and so I have seen first hand the damage that is done to a child when a parent walks away. (note: X will say he did not walk away because he emails DD every couple of months )

It would be different if this man walked away and then saw the error of his ways and made every effort to get back into his child's life. Then you could chalk up his walking away to being immature and selfish, but he was able to redeem himself. But to walk away and never go back says that he is still selfish. He does not want to face the guilt and shame he will feel while trying to get back into his son's life. He does not want to do the hard work to gain his son's trust and does not want to feel the rejection he will likely face while trying to regain his son's trust.

He is not a good guy. He is selfish and unwilling to face the consequences of his actions. Hmmm, that theme should be very familiar to all the divorced BS's on SI!

Next


And it's hard to dance with a devil on your back
So shake him off
-- Shake It Out, Florence And The Machine

Posts: 17695 | Registered: Apr 2006 | From: A better place :)
cmego
♀ 30346
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 9:50 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He clearly said he walked out of the child's life and had no contact, I don't know if there was financial support. His "current" kids are 11,14 and he also said he feels like he "over compensates" with the 2 younger ones for how he treated the older child.

But, yeah. I was taken aback, because for 3 weeks he has talked about his "two boys". So to find out there is a third grown son was…kinda a shock.

I think I'm going to hurt him when I tell him I can't deal. I want to be kind, because I do think that he is carrying some guilt. He also seems to date plenty of girls, so he hasn't hit one that "cares" until me.

I might just stick to the "we aren't a good fit" and leave it at that.


me...BS, 44 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced


Posts: 4279 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: South
wildbananas
♀ 10552
Member # 10552
Default  Posted: 10:07 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ex-asshat has walked away from all four bananas, one by one, with a different rationale for each situation. And he will be the first to tell you he's a great guy and it's their fault.

I would never choose to be with a man who was capable of doing such a thing.  The damage and hurt it brings to the kids is horrible.


Travel light, live light, spread the light, be the light. ~ Yogi Bhajan

Posts: 15448 | Registered: Apr 2006 | From: Now an AZ girl
cmego
♀ 30346
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yup, I agree it is very damaging. What threw me was telling me his Dad walked out on him, and then he did the same thing to his first son.

Seriously, up until this point, he seemed like a good guy. Steady, respectful, he didn't jerk me around or "poof", commutes 2 hours each way so he lives close to his "boys", coaches their soccer league, has 1/3 custody. I really thought he was a really involved Dad, he talks about them constantly, is going for 50% custody when he retires from the military in a few months. Like, everything pointed to a good, involved Dad.

So strange. Not something I can understand, or have much sympathy toward. Pretty sure he noticed. I think he wanted me to say, "Wow. That must have been sooooo hard for you!!". Well, that is not me. I just went silent.


me...BS, 44 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced


Posts: 4279 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: South
AnnieOakley
♀ 13332
Member # 13332
Default  Posted: 12:12 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a work friend that I have known for years. He has a 6 yo from a relationship. No marriage, no intent to be long term on his part, probably would fall under the FWB status.

She was intent on him no longer using condoms. Thinking with his penis at the time, he went along with it.

In the end of course the decision was up to her whether to go forward with the pregnancy. But he begged her not to, told her he did not want to be a father in this situation. Did not know how involved he would be able to be.

It appears that child should have been adopted to a loving home that truly wanted him. The mother parked him with her parents to raise in Hawaii. Seems to be involved at a minimum. My friend regrets ever meeting the child. Feels a huge sense of guilt, when he does see him 2-3 times a year. He feels nothing. He describes it as caring for your neighbors child. No emotional connection.

In the end he feels he should have never been involved. He realizes that the child will eventually (if not already) understand he was not truly loved by either of his parents.

He feels he is lying every time he is with the child.

I guess I speak from knowing that my friend is a good person. Your new guy has gone on to have two sons that it sounds like he loves dearly. The first son did not deserve to be raised without a father, but would it have been better to be raised by a father that did not feel invested, connected, etc?

I am not a parent-so I can't speak from experience. I hope that his son was raised by a loving mother.

[This message edited by AnnieOakley at 12:18 PM, November 24th (Sunday)]


Me= BS, now 50
Him=WH, now 51
M=23+,T=27+
dday=7/06, 8/09 (pics at a work function), 11/09 VAR, 6/12 Sep'd, 10/14 Divorced.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill

Posts: 1293 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: West
Sad in AZ
♀ 24239
Member # 24239
Default  Posted: 12:18 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wasn't there, so I can't speak to the timbre of the conversation, but based on the text, my take would be he was 19, immature, not ready to be a father and did the only thing he could do at the time. Not a good choice, but he appears to have changed his spots with his later two.

I understand about the judgmental part; I would have a hard time with his having been married twice. We all have our prejudices.


Hallelujah! Holy shit! Where's the tylenol?

Posts: 20548 | Registered: Jun 2009 | From: Upstate NY
inconnu
♀ 24518
Member # 24518
Default  Posted: 12:23 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

my take would be he was 19, immature, not ready to be a father and did the only thing he could do at the time.

That was my take too, at first. But hey, the guy isn't 19 any more. He's admittedly over-compensating with his younger 2 sons, but what's he doing to rectify the situation with his oldest son? Sounds like....nothing. And that says a lot about the kind of man he is now, and not the boy he was at 19, imo.


Say what you wanna say and let the words fall out...honestly
I wanna see you be brave

Pretty pretty please, don't you ever ever feel
Like you're less than, less than perfect


Posts: 12187 | Registered: Jun 2009 | From: DeepInTheHeartOf, TX
cmego
♀ 30346
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 1:36 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah, I think that is where I got lost. I can kinda understand being 20 and not ready to be a Dad. Kinda.

But, why not go back and work on that relationship? I don't feel like asking him, I'm not sure there is an answer that would suffice.

He had 3 weeks to tell me. That also kinda bothers me. We talked a lot about kids because we have that in common, both have boys that play soccer. We've been texting almost every day, and talked several times by phone. We were supposed to meet a week ago, but he ended up with his boys and we had to reschedule.

I can kinda understand waiting until meeting me to tell me. But, I told him about (gay) ex, knowing it is a possible deal breaker. I seriously think this has not been a deal breaker for anyone else he has dated. I don't think he expected me to have..an opinion?

Anyway. It's done.

Sigh. I had hopes for this one. He was very consistent, and very interested in me.


me...BS, 44 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced


Posts: 4279 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: South
NaiveAgain
♀ 20849
Member # 20849
Default  Posted: 1:44 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some people are never fully mature and able to be good parents. Age doesn't have a whole lot to do with it...even if you are 19, it is possible to understand responsibility and have some empathy. I know some wonderful young parents and some awful older ones that never did get it.

To me, it shows a character defect to get someone pregnant and then walk away. And especially this....

But hey, the guy isn't 19 any more. He's admittedly over-compensating with his younger 2 sons, but what's he doing to rectify the situation with his oldest son? Sounds like....nothing. And that says a lot about the kind of man he is now, and not the boy he was at 19, imo.

If he actually matured and "got it", he would understand what a chicken shit selfish thing that was, how damaging it is for children, and he would do everything in his power now to make it up to that child, including dealing with the child's anger, hurt and pain. He isn't doing that. Instead, he is trying to rope you in by making you feel there is something wrong with you that you are too cautious about him.

he also said he feels like he "over compensates" with the 2 younger ones for how he treated the older child.
So he isn't raising them well either. He is not being a good father even now. Over-compensation out of guilt is also damaging to his children. Everything screams "me me me" on this one. It isn't about parenting these children well, it is about him assuaging his guilt.

He also seems to date plenty of girls, so he hasn't hit one that "cares" until me.
Yeah, most probably these other girls are seeing the warning signs also and running far away.

Being a mature and emotionally stable parent means that you do what is best for your children, not what is best for your own emotions and feelings. It involves putting your children first. Coaching soccer is great, but if he is doing it because it eases his guilt, that isn't the greatest reason.

My dad was my softball coach. He did it to support me in my sport. If I found out that the only reason he did it was because he felt guilty about something else...OMG. Yuck.

I might just stick to the "we aren't a good fit" and leave it at that.
I think that is a good idea.


Original WS D-Day July 10, 2008. Kept lying, he is gone.
New WS (2 EA's, no PA) 12-3-13
If you don't like where you are, then change it. You are not a tree.

Posts: 15543 | Registered: Aug 2008 | From: Ohio
newnormal
♀ 21925
Member # 21925
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You've gotten some excellent advice above.

Xwh didnt see his DS when we started dating. Yes, he tried to overcompensate with my two kids. yes, I got him to be involved in ds life. BUT HE STILL HAD THE SAME CHARACTER FLAW THAT ALLOWS HIM TO WALK AWAY.

Next this guy asap.


BS 43 (me)
FWH 48
D-day 9/07

Dont retreat, reload.
"Pull that knife out of your back - and sever the fuel line to that bus you got thrown under" Bufffalo


Posts: 1033 | Registered: Dec 2008
Grace and Flowers
♀ 34431
Member # 34431
Default  Posted: 7:47 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just to play devil's advocate...

I don't know if you asked him, but it could be possible that he DID regret it and tried to get back in the child's life. It's possible the mother wouldn't allow it at that point. It could also be possible that he tried once the son was an adult, but the son won't allow it.

My WXH walked away from his kids...but they were 18 at the time. However, he did begin texting and/or calling every single day shortly thereafter. From that day to this (2 years), one son has NEVER returned a call or text, and will not speak to his father. They may never reconcile.

So, maybe he did try at one point, and was shut down by the mother, or the child himself. I'm a firm believer that there are usually three sides to every story.

The main thing for you though is to go with your gut. You're the one who has met him, talked to him. So only you know what your gut is really telling you.

[This message edited by Grace and Flowers at 7:48 PM, November 24th (Sunday)]


I'm Happy, not Sad!

Posts: 1217 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: US
persevere
♀ 31468
Member # 31468
Default  Posted: 8:08 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I shut down a little when he told me, and he said I am "too cautious and will miss out on a good guy…"

So, he clearly expects you to agree with whatever justifications he's made in his life, and if you don't, even if they indicate fundamental core differences in character, then you are "missing out". Give me a fucking break.

My first XWH was very young when we had our two kids, and he left me. Broke my heart. But he never left the kids - he provided CS and has been a constant in their life ever since. They were 2 and 4 - they are 19 and 21 now.

Go with your instincts cmego. It sounds like this is only the first crack in the armor...and it's a big one. ((Hugs))

[This message edited by persevere at 8:08 PM, November 24th (Sunday)]


Me: BW-44
Him: XWH-44
Together 9 yrs
DDays: 1/10/2011
Status: Divorced 4/27/11

Above all, be the heroine, not the victim. - Nora Ephron

It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.
- J. K. Rowling


Posts: 4714 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: Texas
cmego
♀ 30346
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 9:07 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah, I know I'm not interested. I didn't really respond to him this morning, and he hasn't asked me out again. I think he got the hint. If he asks directly, then I will answer honestly and as kind as I can.

He made no indication that he attempted to stay in this boy's life. I would think that would be one of the first things you would say, "I attempted to stay in his life, but his Mom didn't want me to, so I felt it was best to let go." or "I did try to stay in his life, but he didn't want me." Or…whatever. He made no attempt to explain except to say he walked out and probably overcompensates with his two younger boys. What kinda got me was the way he didn't refer to him as "his son". He just kept talking about his "two boys".

I don't know, I'm uncomfortable, so therefore I'm done.

My…defense mechanism is, well, slamming doors on guys. Not giving a lot of "chances". My IC says I make sure guys don't come back. So, his comment about me being "too cautious" stung a little, because there probably is an element of truth.

But, it is what it is. I can't change what happened to me. I'd rather be too cautious with men than not cautious enough.


me...BS, 44 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced


Posts: 4279 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: South
GabyBaby
♀ 26928
Member # 26928
Default  Posted: 9:12 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would never choose to be with a man who was capable of doing such a thing.
I agree.
It says a lot about his character (or lack thereof). Not only that, but if he walked away once, it shows that he's more than capable of doing it again...


Me - 42
SorryInSac (STBX WH#2) - 47. DDay 7/12/14
Married 4, together 7yrs total
Status - Done

DD(21), DS(18, PDD-NOS)
6 Furkids - 4 dogs, 2 cats

WXH (serial cheater, 12+ OW) - Legally married 18yrs

I edit often for clarity/typos.


Posts: 6736 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: California
Sad in AZ
♀ 24239
Member # 24239
Default  Posted: 9:22 PM, November 24th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I still think you're reading too much into this without having all the facts. You've just started dating; do you really expect an in-depth conversation on all of his life's decisions that early in? Even the enlightened, emotionally mature guys I know are reticent early on; if they weren't, it would actually be a red flag to me.

But, you have to do whatever makes you most comfortable, and obviously, it wasn't this guy. I think you're smart to move on, whether he's a cad or not.


Hallelujah! Holy shit! Where's the tylenol?

Posts: 20548 | Registered: Jun 2009 | From: Upstate NY
fireproof
♀ 36126
Member # 36126
Default  Posted: 12:10 AM, November 25th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think his comment about you struck me more than his relationship or lack of one with his first child.

It is early in dating and in one sentence HE made a judgement of you and then made a compliment to himself.

I also think I don't understand why people in general need to comment early on in dating. Take the higher road- quite frankly there could be a multitude of reasons why he did what he did and you don't know.

You aren't interested let it just be that you aren't interested.

As far as advice on being cautious the right ones will want to make it through Be yourself and cautious in my opinion is key!


Posts: 1108 | Registered: Jul 2012
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