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So my WW recently took a trip to Europe and was on a "train" trip for a few days. She wasn't. She was with the OG. I knew in my mind they went physical, but now I have discovered erotic poems that broke my heart and confirmed that they had fantastic sex (they are old flames that always wanted sex but were too young). When she got home, I had confronted her and she denied mostly (I think to protect his marriage/divorce process from collapsing and losing custody of his kids). Trying the 180, but my heart isn't in it. Meantime I can't get my mind off a compulsion for hysterical sex. Any attention from her and I can barely restrain myself.

Am I nuts?

No, you're not nuts. It's called hysterical bonding, and it came over us too, after dday.

Brother, I am sorry you are going through this. You will have to make some decisions, but you don't have to make them right away.

I can't tell you what to do, but I would focus on the 180. It is to make you strong, not punish your WW. Whatever you do, you will need the strength you will learn from it!

Good luck!

Many thanks. Sex didn't happen and I am begrudgingly thankful. I now keep seeing the two of them in my mind having sex. It is painful, but true. And it is what she wanted. She chose it purposefully. She is not the woman I married. I can see how the 180 strengthens. I am working on it.

Post often as you go through this, it helps!

Had MC yesterday. The counselor basically said I would have to make it through this with my supports and IC--basically to stay tough. I could tell looking at my wife sitting there guilty but unrepentant that I would have to walk this road on my own. It left me feeling a sense of deep sorrow for where my 25 year marriage has gone. This can't be taken back. There is no redo. My WW asked the counselor if she thinks we are bound for divorce. I was stunned. She is clearly in so many layers of fog that she can't see anything. Even though there are so many people here and in my life at home helping me, I still feel profoundly and utterly alone.

I'm so sorry you're going through this. Know you aren't alone. I know that it doesn't feel that way, especially when things are quiet at night and you're left to your own thoughts. This place is a godsend during those times. I'm new here, but the members all seem so great and like extremely useful tools to have in your tool belt right now.

It breaks my heart for you that your WW seems unrepentant and not sorry for this pain she's caused. I sincerely hope the fog lifts for her so she can realize her true desires.

PS - I had never heard of hysterical bonding before, but it's definitely a real event. I feel that way fairly often and try so hard to fight the urge to cling to the person that has always been my strength in bad situations. I also wanted to reclaim what was mine in the beginning. It's natural instincts, it seems. Having clear-cut rules/steps to follow with the 180 is the best for now.Stay strong . You can do this. You can come out on the other side even stronger.

I am so, so sorry you've here, and are hurting.

As part of the 180, I would suggest that you table MC for now.

There is nothing to be gained (but pain) from MC with an unremorseful wife. Until and unless she's all in--remorseful, willing to do the hard work---there's no point in spending your time, money, and soul on it.

Far better to focus on yourself.

I know the 180 is not intended to change the WS's behavior--but a side effect is, sometimes, that it does. Telling an unremorseful spouse you see no need for MC at this time---and WHY--can be powerful.

It will empower YOU. And it will protect your heart from further damage.

You need to do the 180 and file for divorce. Now your wife is faced with the loss of her marriage and all she will be left with is being a mistress to a married man. Make sure the OM's wife finds out about his cheating.

Your WW needs to face reality. If you don't file then she has no reason to emerge from the fog and give up this affair. She can cake-eat while you go to endless MC sessions trying to nice her out of this relationship. She may give it up voluntarily, but she has lost respect for you and you need to get it back by confronting her with the loss of the marriage. If that gets her to be genuinely remorseful you can drop divorce proceedings. Until she understands how much pain her romantic fantasy has cost you and how much the loss of the marriage will cost her, you will get nowhere.

I also get the impression that the fantasy was so enjoyable she is highly likely to repeat this adventure; as an occasional treat, for instance. This is where being threatened with divorce can cause a hasty readjustment of her priorities. Otherwise repeat adultery is on the cards.

[This message edited by OK now at 8:20 AM, December 18th (Wednesday)]

I hadn't even thought about a repeat of their sexual encounter, but I'm sure that is right. Divorce is being planned, but with 4 kids and the prospect of many years of alimony I am trying to put my needs secondary to theirs. They are all adjusting, but we have a wedding of the oldest in 5 months, and I just don't think it is fair to divorce at the same time. WW is moving out, that will have to be good enough for now.

I am always sorrowful in revealing the affair to friends and MC is my place to warn WW that people are going to find out (whether I tell them or not). She is in the fog. She doesn't listen. She is following her heart. I now try to think of her as a poison and I have to not pursue her to make my pain go away. It doesn't work that way.

Thank you all for reminding me I'm not alone.

Welcome, and sorry you had to join us.

Your wife is moving out? She cheated and now shes is leaving, and you are left to clean up the pieces.

I know you are hurt and heart broken and aghast at what has happened, but you HAVE to protect yourself financially, and emotionally. Get yourself to an attorney immediately, while she is still in the land of unicorns and rainbows. There is something to be said for how you come out financially if she chose to abandon her marital home and kids (if you still have some at home). You need to put yourself, your future, and your kids futures first.

The fact that she is "following her heart" more like following the magical mist of unicorn farts, but leaving and so forth really gives you very few options. Your kids are gonna know what's up so delaying protecting yourself because of a wedding in 5 months, doesn't make any sense. There is a million things that can and will happen between now and then.

Keep reading, keep posting, and remember you have to put yourself and your kids first, because she no longer cares to or is able to.

((((and strength))))

My sympathies for what you are going through and I agree having 4 kids makes a big difference.

Are you sure the OM is actually filing for divorce, or is this a tale he told your WW to get sex?

If we assume he is getting divorced then it looks if your hair brained wife is waiting for the OM divorce so she can join him in unicorn land. How ridiculous. Between them they will have probably over 6 kids and she thinks that going to work-out? The kids alone will strip romance out of the affair in no time at all. How will he take to raising 4 kids from another man, plus his own? All the problems with extended family? Friends? Money?

This silly fantasy is ultimately doomed, but your wife is so deep into never never land she doesn't have an ounce of commonsense left. All you can do is file to put some pressure on the affair, let all members of your family know and make sure everyone sees the erotic poetry. I'm sure she's proud of that!

You should stop being Mr. Nice Guy; at least until after divorce. In the case of divorce nice guys really do finish last.

My getting tough is about 1/4 of my WW's. It's not that I don't have my own version of smarts, but my real strength is kindness and integrity.

So, right now I am focusing on staying healthy and away from WW while she moves out. It would be more dramatic to throw her clothes out the window into the snow. But I don't see the point. Our kids are 16,18,20, and 22. They are very smart and will figure out what happened in good time.

In the meantime, I don't like the manic rush of accelerating this thing along. I think I have made my line in the sand: having affair? move out--Divorce will follow. Before the affair I had already been thinking of divorce because of our longstanding incompatabilities.

In terms of tough, I just keep all the proof of the affair in case we have to play that card in the divorce. I find it disgusting to think of, though.

Just had to write down my strengths and weaknesses. It takes all my effort to get through this. For the most part, the 180 is becoming a way of life. I want a divorce, but I don't what my WW to act out too much on the way there. Plus I am lonely. So there are times when I am affectionate to her even though she is in love with and had sex with another man. She is not interested in leaving this affair. She says it is her life line. And still, there are times when I think about the old ideas of our marriage I used to have. It was 25 years, after all, that we have been married. I try not to judge myself too much for wanting her affection. I imagine it might take some of the mind movies away. But when I remember that she is devoted to him, I feel I am setting myself back. At the same time, I feel stronger than her since I am dealing with reality, not some fantasy.

I just finished reading 'Not Just Friends' and the good Doctor who wrote it quotes that only about 10% of WS end up with their affair partner. Of that number, only 10% end up staying together.

Tell your wife her odds of ending up completely alone once her unicorn fantasy ends are looking a lot better than average.

She's deep in the affair fog now. Have you outed her behaviour to family and friends? Spoken to the OM? Fight for your marriage and your family mate! But only if you want to if course.

[This message edited by Hurthalo at 5:14 PM, December 29th (Sunday)]