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Newest Member: Dilbert (46033)

User Topic: Awful Goodnight Call
SBB
♀ 35229
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 3:37 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just had my goodnight call as as my girls are with the POS for their week on week off between us during holidays.

My hysterical almost 6 and 3 year olds have been tidying up their room for hours now after being left alone with a bunch of playdoh during their day sleep (she doesn't fucking need a day sleep every fucking day anymore!) and have predictably made a terrible mess. I heard him say 3 hours.

No dinner until it is done. Most likely no dinner because she's so hysterical she is beyond reason. She kept crying "I'm hungry" and is upset her 3 year old sister isn't helping.

Parenting 101 from his own parents - set them up to fail and then 'teach them a lesson'.

She is having an epic tantrum and he is doing nothing to bring her down - he's decided to have a mantrum instead.

I calmed my 6 year old down by doing some breathing exercises with her over the phone. I told her I love her and I asked her to please calm down and tidy her room as quickly as she can so it doesn't get worse. I told her whilst what they did was wrong I do not agree with how it is being handled but there is nothing I can do. Her dad's house, his rules. I told her I was sorry that this is happening. She told him I am angry at him (she can't express her own feelings to him) and he blew up.

I've basically asked her to eat shit and be the grown up. How do you explain to a 6 year old that their father is fucked in the head and his idea of discipline has everything to do with him and zero to do with her?

She KNOWS there's a difference. She plays up to him because there are no boundaries over there. They do what they want until they cross some invisible boundary and the consequences depend on how hung over or strung out or pissed off he is.

I will hug them so tight when they get back. I will shower them with love and affection and kindness whilst also keeping them on track with a firm, gentle hand. It is all I can do. I feel so fucking helpless. Yes, I still feel responsible. The brain knows I'm not but my heart doesn't believe it. XMILs words ring in my head "You never know what kind of father they'll be until it is too late". I knew he couldn't handle stress - why did I think it would be different with his own children? I envy her that their fathers skipped town ASAP.

How the fuck am I going get them and me through this 50/50 for the next fucking 15 years? I want to beat him until he is a stain on the carpet right now. They are good kids. They are so easy. They're not purposefully destructive but you DO have to watch them. You also can't feed them too much sugar or fruit as it makes them crazy. It is not that fucking hard.

I have documented this and will talk to my L first thing tomorrow. I know there is nothing I can do legally so I sit here bawling my eyes out instead.

This is the ugly side of disney dad. The EOW-ers can keep up the facade for a few days but when the longer stretches happen this is what happens.

I will not contact him. I won't fuel whatever sick satisfaction he is getting out of this. I'm getting it out here instead.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5734 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
caregiver9000
♀ 28622
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 4:39 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((SBB))))

I am so sorry. I have been through this. I know what it feels like to be so helpless.

I understand feeling like to dress him down will have consequences for the girls. Likely this is true.

Can you address him (after some time has passed) when you are coldly calm, and say something like the therapist (do the girls have a a therapist?) or school counselor has requested some anecdotal examples of your parenting styles. That you will be documenting to provide this information.

Sometimes putting Stretch on notice that the "authorities" have an interest in his behavior restrains him. At least he does believe that any physical contact with the kids will be reported.

I have also addressed bullying and how to deal with a bully in general terms. After a few of these conversations, the idea that their dad is a bully came up. The girls have to figure out how to stand up for themselves and how to stay out of the line of fire. They are still so young..... This may be a better strategy in a few years.

I don't have answers. I confronted Stretch one time because at that point I felt like I had to speak up or I was a "bystander" and allowing the bullying. It happened in front of me at a pick up. So I told Stretch that he was not being kind and that his behavior was hurting DS. He sniped some complaint and I reminded him of his age vs. the age of his son and walked away.

Not much you can do with them there and you at home. I am so sorry.

I hate your ex.


Me: 44, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 13 DS 10
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5946 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
Bluebird26
♀ 36445
Member # 36445
Default  Posted: 5:00 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((SBB)) I am sorry you and your girls are apart and that they have to endure their FT Father.

My kids are wit their FT Father this week too. It breaks my heart.

Yes it is true you never know how bad a father they are going to be until it's too late.

(( hugs to your girls too))


"Loving someone should not mean losing you. Love empowers you. It shouldn't erase you. - Thelma Davis.

Posts: 1408 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: Australia
SBB
♀ 35229
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 5:35 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

@CG, interestingly we've had the bully talk and you're right, what he is doing is bullying. I can't take him to task because he would take it out on them. I learned that the hard way.

@BB, I hope the week passes quickly for you. In the early days just being away from them was hard, so hard. These days I can cope with it except when they are hurting or upset. That just kills me. It just feels so.... unnatural.

Thank you for listening. Just being heard gets some of this sad/angry out of me. I don't want it bouncing around inside or I won't sleep at all tonight.

They've seemed to have a nice time until today. The last few calls have been lovely. Typical that he fucks out when things get hard. She had one tantrum with me last week and it was a doozy but it only went for 20 mins. My lovely little big girl was so drained at the end of it and asked me to cradle her in my arms "like you did when I was a baby". I did and it was lovely.

They cope with all of this so well that it is easy to forget that it is rough for them being shunted about like prized cattle and basically leading double lives like this.

I hope she calmed down. I hope they had something to eat. I hope they went to bed happily and with hugs and kisses. I hope tomorrow is a better day.

I can't wait until 9am Wednesday. Best New Years present ever - another full week with my girls.

Thank you for the support mammas. I'm just about cried out now so I'm hoping that will help me sleep.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5734 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
confused615
♀ 30826
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 6:03 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know the laws are different in Australia, but here in several states in the US, withholding food as punishment is considered abuse.

I saw the title of this thread on the forum page..and I knew you were the OP before I even opened it. Your ex makes a habit out of making these phone calls difficult..for you and the children. He knows it upsets you..and this sick bastard is getting off on it.

I hate him.

(((((((SBB and her sweet baby girls)))))))


BS(me)42
FWH 45
4 kids
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Reconciled.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 8085 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
lifestoshort
♀ 18442
Member # 18442
Default  Posted: 9:51 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

id agree. if the kids say he is withholding food... i would report it. and I would probably call cps today


6/07 EX had MANY affairs.
FALSE Reconciles. cheats again. D 5/09

Posts: 716 | Registered: Mar 2008
BAB61
♀ 41181
Member # 41181
Default  Posted: 10:34 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((((SBB & girls)))))

Have your girls tell you about their visits to Shithead when they get home, and record their discourse. Don't ask leading questions. Just ask: What did you do at Dad's? What did you have for dinner? Did you watch tv? Normal questions and remain calm and cool. Let them vent to you. Record it .. and maybe you can use it against him in the future. I'm not sure of the legality of this, so you may want to talk to your L first.


Boss A** B*tch
BS/52 Me, STBXpos/56, dd's 16&14
1st D-day 10/19/2013 EA/PA
2nd D-day 12/7/2013 LTA/Rendezvous
S 12/7/2013 No-fault state, 6 mo S, counting down the days.

Posts: 1271 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: DE
KJac
♀ 21332
Member # 21332
Default  Posted: 11:05 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have no advice just want you to know I feel for you. ((((SBB and kiddos))))

Those kids are so very lucky to have you. Sending you strength...


Me-BS38
Him-WS/STBX39
M 16yrs Together 18+
Cheated our whole relationship Multiple Ddays, Multiple OW, Multiple EAs and PAs
DS17, TwinDSs16, DD11

Posts: 288 | Registered: Oct 2008
HurtsButImOK
♀ 38865
Member # 38865
Default  Posted: 11:46 AM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((SBB & DDs)))

what a fuckwad he is.

Well done you for not taking the bait and being the awesome momma you are for your DDs.

At least 50% of the time your darling girls get to experience good parenting (cold comfort for you though I am sure).

FTG


Me: Awesome - 35.... ummm, not anymore

"I’ve learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel". –Maya Angelou


Posts: 756 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Australia
peridot
♀ 18334
Member # 18334
Default  Posted: 9:40 PM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would be calling CPS. What he is doing is abuse. This is one of the reasons my ex lost his visitation rights.


I think...therefore, I'm single.

It is what it is.


Posts: 4801 | Registered: Feb 2008
Pass
♂ 38122
Member # 38122
Default  Posted: 10:43 PM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Holy shit! You are an amazing mom, and handled this the best way you could, SBB. There is probably little else you can do that won't make it worse for your little girls.

I'm so sorry that you and your girls have to deal with this shit.


Loyal spouse: Me; Disloyal spouse: The Princess
Two sons: Now 11 and 14
DDay: Nov 15, 2012
Separated: Mar 2, 2013 after 17 year marriage, now divorcing!

The best thing about hitting rock bottom is that everything after that looks fucking fabulous


Posts: 2157 | Registered: Jan 2013
PhantomLimb
♀ 39668
Member # 39668
Default  Posted: 10:43 PM, December 29th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Any updates??? I hope they (and you!) are okay...

((hugs))


BS / D

Posts: 863 | Registered: Jun 2013
SBB
♀ 35229
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 5:10 AM, December 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all. Goodnight call tonight was lovely. I casually asked and they did have dinner last night. DD6 said they were still tidying up their rooms today but that daddy helped which is good.

They both seemed happy and healthy today so I feel a whole lot better. 2 more sleeps. Just 2 more.

L is on holidays but I will talk to him about this. I called our CPS body and she asked me a bunch of questions about whether this happened all the time. It doesn't. It shouldn't happen at all.

I called another body which is where I'd need to go before taking anything to court (Relationships Australia) and asked about it and they've suggested I sit down and have a conversation with him. I also got a lecture about different parenting styles and they suggested I suggest one of their courses to him.

Yeah right. Not at all helpful but did confirm what I suspected.

Australia is a little behind some places in regards to children's advocacy. It was one meal - that isn't considered deprivation of food. We reserve our right to be shitty parents.

He is bullying them for sure. It is abuse but not the kind anyone can do anything about. The girls haven't been in IC for some time now as I can't put them in without his permission and I also need help with the cost. He took them to one session then dropped it like a hot spud because he was told they were fine (IC didn't speak to me).

I've been using some community services aimed at helping parents and kids communicate. The things I learned in our group play therapy sessions have helped me in almost every difficult or tricky discussion I've had to have with the girls. For their shitty advice today Relationships Australia do have some great courses and resources too.

I was upset last night because it is so unnecessary to terrorise them like that. My big girl especially is very very sensitive. She bursts into tears whenever she drops or spills something or does something 'wrong'. She was beside herself last night. Not just because she was hungry and having a tantrum but because she had displeased him.

I have to hope that she learns how to stay out of the line of fire and also learns that the problem is not her, it is him. I'm not sure if that is possible because right now she adores him in the way some kids adore the parent who is the least interested in them. DD3 isn't so much of a people pleaser so I'm not as worried about her.

Time will tell. They only need one good parent and I'm working my arse off to be a great one. They may always love him - I'm OK with that, what I don't want is for either of them to measure themselves by the kind of love he gives back and how/when he gives this love.

I don't just love them because I made them - it has nothing to do with DNA. I love them for a million reasons - to name a few: they are fascinating, amazing, sweet, kind and downright hilarious.

I wasn't even tempted to contact him beyond that first flash of anger last night. I'm happy about that. I did unfortunately lay awake half the night listening out for the phone in case he asked me to come and get them. I'll sleep better tonight.

Thank you again for hearing me out. I hate this part. So much. It burns me the most too. This is the only part of my life where I don't think I'll ever reach indifference - not while I still have to send them over there anyway. I can't let it make me crazy. I won't.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5734 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
TheRealDeal
♀ 39560
Member # 39560
Default  Posted: 7:26 AM, December 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((SBB))))

I was upset last night because it is so unnecessary to terrorise them like that. My big girl especially is very very sensitive. She bursts into tears whenever she drops or spills something or does something 'wrong'. She was beside herself last night. Not just because she was hungry and having a tantrum but because she had displeased him.

I have to hope that she learns how to stay out of the line of fire and also learns that the problem is not her, it is him. I'm not sure if that is possible because right now she adores him in the way some kids adore the parent who is the least interested in them. DD3 isn't so much of a people pleaser so I'm not as worried about her.

^^^^This^^^^
At the age of 45 I am your 6-year old daughter; I had the same type of relationship with my dad. I tried my entire life to please him and it never worked. Never. from a toddler I chased after him trying to get him to like me, love me, notice me, anything but keep rejecting and abandoning me emotionally.
Only during IC this year have I come to realize the problem lies with my dad, not me. But for decades I felt *I* was the problem, that I wasn't good enough. I was ashamed of myself...my thought process was "if my own dad won't accept/like/love me, unless I do exactly what he wants, then who would?"
I've made great progress in IC since June but its been a long journey...hopefully one your daughter won't need to take years down the road.

Do the group therapy sessions have certain topics that are discussed? One can only hope she learns that she shouldn't feel ashamed(feeling bad about herself as a person) regardless of her dad's poor decision making. Her reactions are a direct result of his emotional abandonment of her feelings...I was her at her age.

I so wish I had a solution that would magically make it better for you and your daughters. The writing is on the wall for what he is doing emotionally to them...and of course he doesn't see it. May never see it. You are doing exactly what you need to do by loving them to pieces and being there for them in all the ways he can't be. Your daughters will know to come to you and that you will accept them and love them unconditionally. Believe me, they will know its you who holds it together for them.
I wish you and your girls peace. ((((())))))


Me: 46 him: 54
together 18 years
DDay1, DDay2, Dday 3: March thru June 2013
We are in R and trying to make it
Never lose yourself trying to hang onto someone who doesn't care about losing you.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Northeast
SBB
♀ 35229
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 8:02 AM, December 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

^^That makes me ache. I'm so sorry. I'm sorry your dad missed his opportunity.

These people are so incredibly wasteful. He only gets one shot at being their dad. I'm sad that he is squandering this remarkable opportunity. As it stands we both miss out on 50% of their lives - I sure as hell want to make the most of the time I do have.

I've spoken to many of my friends who had the same experience. What scares me is when I asked about the supportive parent (many times the dad is the attentive one and the mum is not) they say they didn't really value that because they felt that parent loved them blindly, no matter what - and that was not a good thing in their eyes because unconditional love was a currency they did not value.

That makes me so sad.

I fear my big girl will lean more towards that just by virtue of her innate sensitivity. He can be affectionate but then aloof. His love and affection is conditional. He believes shaming is an effective tool.

In the M I remember his quality time with them being one eye on them, one eye on the cricket or whatever show he wanted to watch or activity that he deemed more important than 20 mins undivided attention to his family. We argued a lot about this. We both worked full-time and the weekends was the only big block of time we had together. Even then he was either working, hungover or wanting 'down time'.

Cats in the Cradle - so very wasteful.

The play therapy is more about communication and interaction than actual topics. I guess the topic is more of a launchpad than the destination. They do have 'themes' like "what makes me happy", "what makes me sad", "what do I like about XYZ", "what don't I like about XYZ". They use role play, art and we write stories together. I do lots of the exercises at home. My big girl loves to write stories.

Most of them are single parent families. Some of the kids seem to not be very expressive or sociable. My girls are super expressive and sociable. I'm there because I'm keen to learn more about this parenting caper as I didn't have very good role models myself. I read a lot too - not for direction but ideas, guidance. "How to Raise an Adult by Being One Yourself" is an awesome book.

Unfortunately this is who he is and he is a significant role model in their lives. I can't carry his water. I won't. My job is to love and support them and help them learn these adult lessons far earlier than they should.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5734 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
TheRealDeal
♀ 39560
Member # 39560
Default  Posted: 8:38 AM, December 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unfortunately this is who he is and he is a significant role model in their lives. I can't carry his water. I won't. My job is to love and support them and help them learn these adult lessons far earlier than they should.

Absolutely agree...it is his to own.

It sounds like you are doing everything possible for your girls and you will reap those rewards with a loving, fulfilling relationship with them forever.


Me: 46 him: 54
together 18 years
DDay1, DDay2, Dday 3: March thru June 2013
We are in R and trying to make it
Never lose yourself trying to hang onto someone who doesn't care about losing you.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Northeast
Topic Posts: 16

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