The big problem arose from her answers to some questions about the type of sex they'd had - these new answers contradicted answers she'd given to the same question consistently before, and this is AFTER she told me she had nothing more to hide and was being entirely truthful with me. Actually, the sex doesn't bother me nearly as much as the idea that she is still trying to protect herself from imagined consequences by lying about details.
Later on, in the wee hours of the morning, she admitted other things she'd been lying about - that she really had spent ENTIRE nights with him, and she related new stories about two additional out-of-town luxury hotels they'd stayed at. (The hotels thing seems to be a real problem for her to admit; she admitted within months that she'd have the AP over for coffee and sex on our bed in the mornings after the boys left for school - but she somehow thinks admitting staying at hotels with him is more damaging. We've gone through several bouts of trickle-truths regarding how many hotels they stayed at, and now this latest admission really tops everything).
She also admitted lying to me about other things - she'd told me she told the AP that I would be "devastated" to learn about this affair when he asked her how I would react. In reality she told him I'd probably be hurt and sad but that I really didn't love her any more. (Which of course is not true, but I understand it is WS fog-like thinking).
I feel so down and disappointed about this. Of course, I had to assure her she was "safe" telling me anything - but learning she is still lying after all these months of saying I'm her favorite person in the world, that she's "woken up" and is an honest, authentic person now is just so difficult - I feel like I'm back at D-day +1. To her credit, she has finally admitted these lies - but how do I know where it all ends? She told me that she is just human, that people make mistakes, and that correcting a bad behavior is not as simple as just flipping a light switch. Is that right? How many more lies do I need to put up with before she learns to control that behavior? When will she value our relationship, and my feelings, my TRUST enough to be truthful with me about everything?
I told her I still loved her, but I know that I do not want to spend the rest of my life with someone who is not honest with me. I told her I thought that being dishonest was a lousy way to treat your favorite person in the world. I told I feel like we've been in false-R because of this.
Today was the first day I felt like implementing the 180. I didn't kiss or hug her good-bye; I wasn't affectionate at all, but instead tried to remain pleasant but detached and business-like.
Am I right to do this? How long do I keep it up?
Thank you all - I really need some advice.
[This message edited by Crushed15Feb13 at 11:32 AM, January 27th (Monday)]
As for the 180, you keep it up as long as you need to feel safe. Remember, 180 is about healing you, not getting your WW to "notice" you.
Hang in there.
Also, I think you are right when you say the lying is the worst part.
Another thought - sometimes because these people are used to charming their way out of trouble, they will play along, giving just enough of the truth to make you feel they are making progress, and to get it where they can have their cake and eat it too. They have the marriage relationship, but can still keep operating out of the mindset that led to the affair. In these cases, conversations about change will not have as much impact because they are still manipulating the situation effectively through their words.
I have found this with my h - he only seems to understand a behavioural change in me, words alone don't make an impact. I think that's why the 180 is so effective. But in this case, it may be about giving yourself a chance to honour your feelings and take care of yourself, letting her know you won't be willing to extend yourself so much while she continues lying and deceiving. Hold back a bit if you need to, in order to make your point. Perhaps she is taking advantage of your generous, helpful spirit.
I am sorry you are going through this. I really understand how much it hurts
At 2 years and 2 months there have been no new info or lies since the 13 month mark. At this point I can look back on it as a process. My fWS needed to grow, to change, to work to have the courage to make those admissions. To her each of those was a milestone of growth. To me it was just more pain. I didn't see it at the time but each was a step forward. It would be best to have all the truth up front, dont get me wrong. But truth in and of itself is a positive, whenever it comes.
Sending strength and prayers.
On Dday it was just text messages
At 1 week it was texts and a kiss
At 5 months it was sex twice
At 6 months it was sex 4 times
At 10 months it was sex 4 times, broken NC, 3 previous A with three other guys one of them sleeping in our home while I was away having breakfast with Our kid.
At 11 months and 13 months there were new lies about broken boundary rules
At each of these stages I was devestated. How could you keep lying to me? All I wanted was the truth. All I asked for was the truth. It felt like quare one every time.
These sort of stories literally make me sick to my stomach because I think that is my biggest fear.
(((Crushed15Feb13))) (((Chico))) (((anyone that has been subjected to TT)))
I honestly believe TT hurts worse than the actual betrayal. My WH held on to "a meeting and peck on the lips" for three years. Why? Why hold on to something so small? Why lie to me for three years about a kiss that meant nothing? The truth is so much easier....why can't we get the truth?
We talked more last night, and now W admits having a ONS with this AP one full year earlier than she told me their affair started. I feel like this is a 2nd D-Day for me!
She was afraid to be truthful about it because she thought I would see her as a slut and leave. From the story she tells about their hookup - there are definitely elements of date rape there. Even though it was almost 7 years ago, I wonder if it would help her to talk to a rape counselor? I can definitely see how guilt and shame and the mistakes she made that night could keep her from coming forward. But I wonder if she should just tell the authorities the whole story and let them decide? Of course, it may be a real problem that the following year she became his mistress. So maybe I'm being fed a false story?
I don't know whats true or false any more.
I don't know whats true or false any more.
I know how crazy making that is. Please take care of yourself.
She was afraid to be truthful about it because she thought I would see her as a slut and leave.
Also, there may be some serious issues as far as date rape with OM. She engaged in a 5 year LTA with him after it occurred. She lied to you just recently. There may be a statute of limitations. You can certainly consult with an attorney but quite frankly I don't see any prosecutor pursuing a charge short of OM confessing.
Since my ww is my xww I think you know what my advice would be. An LTA is hard enough. To expect a BS to forgive and R an LTA is huge. To continually undermine it with self-serving lies and TT would have convinced me that there is remorse or empathy. Not wanting to D is not that same as being able to engage in genuine, remorse-based R.