I read somewhere this week where a BS said that their spouse's EA was way more painful than any PA. And that their spouse was extremely remorseful even so. I'm sorry but I don't nor will I ever see it that way. And it angers me sometimes. The mind movies and suicidal thoughts are so great some days with a PA that all you can do is hold on like you're in a hurricane. And it's harder when they don't care and never apologize. Guess it still makes me angry at the world.
Having an unremorseful WS who turns and files for divorce on you is probably the lowest of self-esteem killers I probably know or will ever experience. It's the ultimate of "being thrown out with the trash." And I still carry the burden of it. It's humiliating that she left me. And I think my friends and family look at me differently now. Most could really care less I think. And I still blame myself for something I don't know what I did to deserve this.
Like I said I never want to downplay anyone's pain, but I am very jealous (in a twisted terrible way) that people in here have remorseful WS's and/or get to make the decision to stay or go. Guess I just wonder if any others with unremorseful WS's feel this way sometimes and I'm curious how you've handled things since they left you. It's a very lonely feeling still. But I know better than to judge others without walking in their shoes first.
I hope I didn't offend anyone. If I did I apologize. But it's difficult still to get your head wrapped around.
[This message edited by SeanFLA at 2:23 PM, February 6th (Thursday)]
"You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have." ~ Bob Marley
I totally understand your pain. To just be abandoned like that without a second thought is humiliating and shredding. We don't get the benefit of seeing the person we love even attempt to win us back, even if it's not the most sincere.
However, I do think our situation has its benefits. I didn't get to delude myself for one second that our M could be saved. The roller coaster was different for me because I never had any hope that he would "come to his senses." So I think it was easier (with some major help from IC) to come to terms with my situation and move on.
I can hear the pain in what you've written and I'm truly sorry for it. I hope you can see the gift in her honesty (for once, right?) of leaving you so you can move on with your life without her, as painful as it may be. Betrayal is the worst kind of emotional pain, but at least ours was quick. Other people have to deal with it over the long term, whether they R or not.
Take care of yourself and remember you don't owe anyone an explanation and you never did anything wrong. Some people are just assholes.
My XH was quite remorseless, especially after I left him. He never wanted to try to R. He did want me to stick around as Plan B. Got really vicious when he realized that wasn't going to happen.
I don't think anybody looks at me as the weak one in this equation. I think everybody that knows us now sees what a broken, messed up person XH is.
You did nothing to cause it, you can't do anything to fix it. Sometimes, the most loving thing you can possibly do is walk away & let fate take it's course. Maybe then your WW will fix herself.
Even if she doesn't, it's better for you to be away from the train-wreck. You don't want to step in somebody else's crazy, so to speak.
I filed and we got 6 weeks of in house separation left before our 61 day waiting period is up.
My exWH had zero remorse. He walked out on me and our two young children without ever really telling me why. His fictional reasons were all my fault, of course. He hemmed and hawed a bit but once he was caught with her, which was after he moved out, it was all over. There was not one apology for what he put us through. I had to see him at DSs school right after I filed and he never said a word to me about it. He essentially forced me to end a 15 year marriage without giving me the courtesy and respect of one honest conversation. He actually flaunted his A in my face. We work about three blocks from each other and I didn't go outside for months after I was told that they would walk around my end of town holding hands. He made sure to let me know that they took an exotic vacation together even before I filed the papers.
I always saw myself as strong, but he turned me into a paralyzed infant. I couldn't eat, sleep, or focus. I could barely breathe. I never knew that emotional pain could be so intense and actually turn into physical pain. The fucked up part is that he was still in the house for part of it and he witnessed my extraordinary pain. I would be curled up in the fetal position crying and he would stare straight ahead as though I wasn't even there. He went on about his daily life while I was dying more and more every day. I wouldn't treat a stranger like that, yet this was my own husband. The husband that I poured into every ounce of trust and faith that I had. It was if my mother or my father had turned on me - he was my family and he tossed me away like I never mattered.
Some days it still gets to me. Some days I can't even believe it happened. He's a complete stranger to me now who is an EOW father and who lives this fucked up dysfunctional life with his fucked up dysfunctional OW.
I've dealt with it like we all do - some days not very well. Other days, I'm ok and very thankful for what I have in spite of what was taken from me.
With time, and a lot of therapy, I've started to truly pity him and the choices he's made. I wasn't the best wife in the world - who is? But, I was loyal and caring and I loved what we had built together. I feel sorry for him most days because he will never know that sort of love. He will never have his children trust him completely ever again. He will never have their faith and loyalty like I do. He will be forever lost.
Sean, we were very lost for a very long time. I suspect that no matter what, we will still occasionally lose our way. But, it's over now and the true loss is theirs. They tossed away the best and most genuine thing they will ever have. He wil never get another me and she will never have another you. They will be forced to find the same empty souls to match their own.
Humiliation is all theirs. No one feels sorry for you. You walked through a war zone and came out the other side. There is a lot of life left to live and we can't ever let them steal that from us again. No more.
I do read some posts in reconcilliation and get pangs of wistfulness, sometimes. Like, why couldn't that have been me. But I know now that my ex is a sick person, and that I am better off without him. Doesn't mean it still doesn't hurt like a bastard sometimes.
Sorry you are struggling with this.
"Diamonds aren't a girl's best friend, freedom is."
But I see his remorseless selfishness as a gift. I am no longer in that toxic relationship, and grateful for that! I refuse to let his brokenness define me and my future without him. I am still truly sad my marriage did not last till "death do us part," as I had always wanted, but it is what it is and I will continue to move onward and upward in a positive direction. Him? Meh...whatever. I will not dwell on that which I cannot change. Nor will I kill myself trying to understand it. Normal people cannot understand crazy, and you will never wrap your head around it fully. There comes a time when you have to just let it go (big difference between that and forgiving and forgetting) and move on to bring new, better meaning to your existence.
This above all: to thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man ~ Shakespeare, Hamlet
And if I click on a thread in JFO or General and it looks like an R or false R or some other situation that doesn't mirror mine in some way, I don't read very far.
I didn't venture out of D/S for nearly all of my healing. Maybe down to F & G.
Are you picking at the "scab" to the point you can't heal?
I feel your pain. My WH is also unremorseful. He PRETENDED to be. He has emotionally tied to me to him for he last 18 years... Making me believe he would hurt himself, hurt me, our kids, if I ever left him. He said he would fight D to the point of bankruptcy. In some ways I wish he did just turn his back on us and go. Maybe your WS leaving you like that spared you additional pain? I know it has to be hard to recover from that rejection. You have to know you are a good person of good character. she wasn't. You didn't do anything wrong. She did.
I hope your pain ends soon. Keep working toward the sunshine. Find joy in your family and friends that will support you.
I have come to see my ex's lack of remorse and her abandonment as an unintentional act of mercy. I will never have to be dragged through false reconciliation. I'll never convince myself that we're reconciling while she's buying time until she finds her next "soulmate".
For a long time I had a very difficult time with understanding why we weren't worth fighting for to him, it was very difficult for me, but it no longer matters. One day her lack of remorse will no longer matter to you, in that it will no longer affect you. However, she will never escape who she is, and neither will my XWH. There's some poetic justice in there somewhere.
And you have absolutely nothing to feel humiliated about - suckstobeme completely nailed it. ((Sean))
[This message edited by persevere at 4:23 PM, February 6th (Thursday)]
Status: D 2011
Above all, be the heroine, not the victim. - Nora Ephron
It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.
- J. K. Rowling
I, too, have a totally unremorseful WS who moved in with the OW (secretly--swore our MINOR CHILDREN to secrecy) before the divorce was final and has done countless things to be disruptive and downright cruel to me. It continues to this day.
However, at some point you decide if the pain you are wallowing in is really worth it. What are you getting out of this?
Seriously, what is the benefit to this.
I realize we cannot always control our emotions but after years, we should be coming to grips with what is now our reality. At some point we stand at a crossroads and determine either we are going to let this continue to be a major issue in our lives and we re-live this pain frequently OR we choose to sort it out, package it up and put it on a shelf. Just like physical objects you store away on a shelf or in a little used closet, you come across them and may have feelings and memories associated with them. But it's not a daily thing when you deal with it, package it up and pack it away.
With all due respect to those couples who have had successful reconciliations and healing of their damaged marriages, reconciliation is not necessarily the Holy Grail. There is a reason why nearly 70% of all marriages that experience infidelity end in divorce. And I choose to believe that a lot of that 70% has to do with people who are flawed and either cannot or will not deal with their own issues.
One person cannot make a marriage work. It takes two. It takes effort from both. Once I divorced and was in the process of the sorting out and packaging up, I realized that *I* had carried our marriage for years. Once *I* jerked the rug out from under it and kicked him out, everything crumbled. Looking back, I did so many things in our marriage that were truly a disservice to it. I carried the damn thing myself for years, walking on eggshells and catering to his NPD whims.
I discovered I deserved better than that. And while I truly and deeply regret the loss of a marriage for my children (deeply affected, FYI) and in many ways for myself, ending the marriage was, ultimately, the right thing to do.
Otherwise, I risked modeling behaviors I did not want my daughters to emulate. I risked continuing to sacrifice myself and my career for his never-ending demands and whims. I was slowly killing myself and never realized it.
Like you, I never received an apology. And truly, it doesn't make a difference. I know what he did. I know it was terribly and horribly wrong and cruel. He doesn't have to be "sorry" for me to see that.
Sean. this is going to eat you alive until you take matters and start dealing with them. While it does take 2-5 years to heal, your obsession with reconciled couples and your anger should be noticeably abating by now.
If you're in therapy, I would talk this over with your therapist and try to start work on the packaging and putting away. If you're not in therapy, I suggest you start.
For someone who is as far out as you are, the rawness of your emotions is of concern. Yes, everyone heals at their own rate. I get that.
Look at survivors of totally senseless tragedies. The Holocaust. The 9-11 attacks. School shootings. The people we admire and look up to don't discount the effect the events had on them, but they choose--choose!--to overcome them. They still have nightmares and questions. But they found charitable foundations, work for legislation or other changes in the fabric of society, devote time to helping others in similar straights.
We stand at a crossroads many times in healing from this. Where we go and how we cope is our choice. We basically have three choices: We can ignore things, we can wallow in our grief and pain, or we can process it (with or without help) and move forward in our lives.
Ignoring things doesn't work. I have seen this with my ex. He moved in with the OW and they had less than 4 years (and several separations) before he kicked her out. Don't know details, but when two very damaged people who are more keen on ignoring problems and rug-sweeping try to make a relationship, this is the predictable result.
Wallowing is equally ineffective. We cannot hold on to our pain as a shield or talisman, continuing to reach out to it to reassure us that we are indeed justified in our hurt feelings. Wallowing keeps the pain fresh, but at the expense of freeing ourselves to move forward in life. We tell ourselves that we are wallowing because we hurt and someone hurt us. True, but at some point, it hurts us more to marinate in our pain. Sean, your pain may have outlived its usefulness to you. Letting go can be scary, because we've conditioned ourselves to reach out to that pain. If we move forward, we don't have an excuse anymore.
Processing it allows us to feel the pain we need to feel, to work through why it hurts and to give ourselves better tools to manage our feelings and learn from our experiences.
I think you need to look at why you are holding on to these feelings and perhaps moving forward to acceptance and indifference. A new life starts when we rip out what was planted before, turn the soil over and plant new seeds in hope and anticipation.
Even though your ex wasn’t a drug dealer, the same applies; her brokenness was not about you. There is no justification for infidelity, in any form, whether someone chooses to acknowledge that or not.
I imagine a truly remorseful spouse is a blessing if infidelity isn’t a deal breaker, but that is also not about the BS.
Don’t let her actions define you. (((Sean)))
Instead, he is unremorseful, likes to rub my face in every day how I am not good enough but at the same time tell me how he is so stuck and has no where to go and no one who wants him and blahblahblah....
So even though this is all HIS doing and he likes to shove XOW in my face EVERY day plus other "chat" women now too I still get to "be the bad guy" and had to file myself.
From a therapy stand point I was so f'ed in the head thinking I don't want this but I HAVE to do it and its tearing me up on TOP of the betrayal and rejection BUT I've since turned it around into a GET to do this for me just like I GET to work on a new degree to get into a field I love vs. staying in the job I hate.
It was very twisted. I think if he had combined his unremorsefulness with a quick filing I might have been spinning and flailing but it wouldn't have been like a slow torture.
Then I think - eh, no matter how it goes down, its gonna suck and thinking of all that just sucks too much time and energy.