It seems impossible to me for a person to be able to forget so many occurrences in their life, things that they themselves did. I can see someone forgetting what color socks they wore on a certain day, unless there was something significant about those socks.
For example, the WW admits that yes, she remembers on that day, her and the OM sat in a bar. Months later it becomes, I just remembered, we were really in a motel that day. How can a WS forget that and then suddenly remember something so very different?
Or a question is asked like, where were you really the night you said you were working late and didnít come home until 10, but the extra hours werenít on the paycheck and the answer is I donít remember.
I am asking because I am interested in opinions on how a WS can simply forget so many things and answer so many questions with I Donít Remember or are they lies.
But the energy and deception and planning of trysts? The acts of physical connection. The sex? Remarkable clarity, which lingered and lingers like a stain.
Hence the wayward fog and wayward withdrawal.
I only speak for myself. Perhaps this helps some.
Like I believe that they might not remember the exact date (or even month) they went to... a motel, a bar, a restaurant, a show, for a walk along the beach, a weekend away, a movie show etc., or exactly when they did... a,b, or c, but I don't really believe that they don't remember doing it - unless it was an affair that spanned years.
So I think a lot of 'I don't remembers' are really just, 'I don't want to own up to what I did' ..but maybe I'm just cynical.
ETA: I was writing when JustDesserts posted but Wow. Thank you for your honesty JD.
[This message edited by sinsof thefather at 12:43 PM, February 21st (Friday)]
But by a large margin my wife lied and trickle truthed with a proficiency some criminals would kill to possess.
I also believe the deception and lying pre and during the affair confuse even the WS themselves....but, just like while in her affair, she WANTED to believe she wasn't "that person"....so her own mind was very open to being mislead by her....just like she was very open to believing her AP was something special, unique, warranting of the risk she so fervently wanted and did take.
So memory gaps are all natural, intentional, and subconscious in nature.....IMO.
"If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything."--Mark Twain
Radical honesty is one of my regs for R....from both of us.
God help us all.
[This message edited by blakesteele at 1:27 PM, February 21st (Friday)]
But I do believe there were times when he was so concentrated on her and them, that the date, surroundings and circumstances didnít matter. It all faded into the background as they gave their full and undivided attention to each other. Everything else was irrelevant for as long as they were together. Sad but true. It was a hazy background.
My spouse can't remember when they first had sex. "March or April" was the answer. As we sleuthed, ie, "had you already had sex when we went to seattle together?" - yes - "ok, that was April 5, so it was March or earlier." That kind of work was helpful. I think we deduced it was probably late February, but hard to know for sure because he didn't keep track of his trips. I don't think he was lying, he really didn't know - and he didn't WANT to know because it was shameful and terrible.
Once I got to really believe I had enough info, I had to stop asking for details. There is a great descriptor on another site that explains the more you use your memory, the more those memories become ingrained. At this point, I don't want to talk about that stuff any more because I want him to forget it. I want all of those memories to disappear forever.
Right after DDay, I had my WW figured for an evil, lying bitch. I'm a little bit more charitable today.
First, I think waywards spend so much energy lying to themselves, and their spouse, that truth and fiction get mixed up. Separating them later is like getting the fly poop out of the pepper.
Second, once the shame kicks in, as it did for my WW and many, there is an unconscious but very deliberate process of forgetting that takes place. I now think the mind is engaging in a form of self-protection, too bad it hurts the BS so much.
And last, I think the Fog is real, and chemically induced by dopamine and other related neurotransmitters. When we ask "What were you thinking?" the hard truth is they weren't. And, you don't remember what you didn't think.
[This message edited by MoreWould at 1:40 PM, February 21st (Friday)]
We'll go over our past, I'll have one story. Then some information comes to light and she may not remember that part, but something else may be remembered. It sucks. With what I know and remember, it doesn't make sense to me that she can't remember the issue at hand, but does remember a similar issue at the same time.
I said that a whole lot better and different when me and her were talking about her memory. Usually, I can count on my memory, this just appears to be one of these new wonderful days where my mind is muddled. I'll ask her about it when she gets home and hope that triggers something (something good ) so I can write something better later.
Of course just recently he hid/lied to me about something pretty important so now I have a hard time trusting anything he says.