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Swandart posted 2/22/2014 04:26 AM

This is obviously still excruciating. I feel like I am going to explode at any minute.

We have talked every night since DDay Tuesday (after me initially getting so angry and telling him to leave, I said he could stay for the sake of the children). It pains me to say they are now part of this having seen the tears and the screaming. I am trying so hard to shield them from it.

For those that didn't read my initial post my H told me Tuesday he had been seeing someone that he used to work with on 3 occasions in December and January and they met in a car park each time. After drawing up a list of questions yesterday, last night I sat down in order to find out the full truth. I read the questions to him like I was interviewing him for a job and stayed so calm throughout just trying to take in what he was saying (very unlike me). It was actually 4 times they met, twice in a car park and twice at her house. They did everything and I mean everything other than have full intercourse. I think I actually laughed at that point as I thought why stop there when you have done all the other stuff.

He has admitted that he was the pursuer and it kicked off from there. Our marriage was in a terrible state before this happened, constant arguments, no sex, no cuddles, no kisses before leaving for work. I hate to admit but there was just nothing. I felt resentment towards him for constantly putting his job first over the last few years over me and the children. He has a good job after years of studying and I know he works hard but I work bloody hard too looking after the children, house, 2 part time jobs and everything else that comes with being a mum of 2 young children. I admit most days before this happened that I did actually hate him that he wasn't conforming to my idea of the 'perfect' family where he would work 9-5 then be with us 100% the rest of the time meeting mine and my children's needs and wants. Now I am writing it down I was so unrealistic in what I wanted him to be. I was horrible to him, I verbally abused him, I was attacking him for being a bad father and husband and flew off the handle if he left a dirty coffee cup on the table and left the room. I was horrible to him I admit it, so much resentment towards him caused it I believe.

It may sound like I am justifying what he did and by no means at all am I, because cheating is never the answer but I can understand why it got to this point. The hurt and pain is that he choose to take this route rather than us get help or him just leave.

So having said all this, why am I still clinging to the fact that I want this to work out? I do love him, I do love our family, I do love our life in the simplest of terms. How could I want to make something work with someone I said I hated?

We have had talks over the last 18 months when things haven't been good and we have said we both have to change and yes we might have done for a week or 2 and then just slipped back into it. Him having this A is maybe the actual wake up call I/we needed. I can't believe I am saying that but I don't think anything would have hit me like this to make things change.

I know for him this happened, because he wanted to be held, wanted to be close to someone and wanted to be liked because he wasn't getting any of that from me, just venom.

So I will say once again, I am not condoning what he did whatsoever but can understand how it came to this. I am disgusted and hurt and I'm dying inside that he has done this to me but I can't help but think this is what we needed?

This really does sound so wrong? I hope it makes sense to you. Thanks for reading, it really does help to write it down and get my thoughts across

norabird posted 2/22/2014 09:07 AM

If you feel that this can kick start your M to improve all I have to say is more power to you. Does he feel the same?

As long as you still love him and want to try and he feels the same, then of course you can work on things. Find good counsellors for IC/MC, make a plan, and see if you can heal and grow together. Old habits are hard to change so I can see a shock to the system might be in a way a good impetus.

Hope you are strapped in for the roller coaster though, I'm sure your attitude may swing wildly!

Swandart posted 2/22/2014 09:34 AM

Thank you norabird.

I know my thoughts change every hour, every minute. One stage I am thinking this, the next I just think but he did this to me, no going back. But overwhelmingly over the last day even when I am thinking the latter, it always comes back to my part in this which I have to try and accept.

When he told me he thought that was it as we had both said if either of us ever had an A that would be it. This is what hurt the most for the first 48 hours that he had done this horrible thing and wasn't even going to fight to try and save our marraige.

When I shouted and cried and text (when he had gone to work) how could he just give up so easily? He said I thought there is no way you could ever get over this so what is the point in fighting. This made me more angry so I just ignored him when he was texting me. He then text 'if there is even a small hope we can get through this I will grab it with both hands'. After that he came home from work and we talked more. It was only after this initial upset of him not fighting subsided that the enormity of him having an A hit me.

I just feel like we need to address the problems between us to make this better BUT first he needs to fight hard to get to that point. In reality that isn't going to happen as he has so many barriers up and is very defensive with me because of the way I treated him, so how can he try to make this better. But I need him to to help me heal. I just don't know how this is going to work, I feel I have to put in the fight too at this stage to make it work. Do I? Is making things better all about him making me feel better? And then work on the other things? Or do I need to try and have compassion too to get through this?

The only time he has cried since this has happened is when I asked him what he wanted from me and he said 'just to be nice to me'

Skan posted 2/22/2014 13:29 PM

(((Swandart))), welcome. I'm glad that you found us.

Listen, your story really, REALLY resonates with me. Because that's where my FWH and I pretty much were at the point of his ONS. Both of us withdrawn from each other, each of us resenting each other and allowing resentments to leech away the love that we felt. Both of us essentially living separate lives while married. Him feeling like he was not loved, not respected, beaten down, disregarded. Me feeling like he was leaving me mentally & physically, feeling humiliated that he was seeking pleasure on-line, feeling intense resentment that his work was always SO bloody bad for him and changing jobs only meant that after an upswell of hope, more complaints, more depression, more "whining" from him. I disconnected, he disconnected, and we were heading for a divorce or an A. And that A rocked our world to the core of the earth.

If you both want your marriage. If you both are utterly committed to R, then I very, very strongly urge you to both separately get IC to face your individual deamons, and go to a good MC to first deal with the A, and then to explore your marriage. You were both under the same pressures in the same house. You definitely had a marriage that was on the rocks. But only one of you chose to have an A. That needs to dealt with and needs to be a priority of your MC, but then you do need to keep exploring those marriage fissures.

I don't normally give this sort of opinion in this forum because frankly, most of the time the BS that is admitting that there were marriage problems is also facing a WS that is not facing up to what they did nor interested in fixing things. You both seem to be seeing things with your eyes open. That's an amazing leap. So I gave you the above speech which I normally save for later on in this recovery process.

Please feel free to PM me if you want. (((hugs)))

Swandart posted 2/22/2014 15:24 PM

Ah Skan, I'm glad you did write in this forum, it is so nice to hear your reply and know i am not alone. My emotions are all over the place and just hearing someone say such things really does help. I have no one to talk to about this really as I dont want to get anyone else involved in our issues although My mum knows we were having problems and he did go outside the marraige. But I don't feel I can really open up and break down to her.

I am finding just reading and writing on here is just so helpful.

His job is to find a MC for us which he has done and we are just trying to get some diary space for it. Neither of us has any idea what going to see one involves but both agree we need to speak to someone. We did also say we may need IC also. Would you recommend the MC first?

I have just read your profile and really hope that things are still going well for you in R as your last post was December. Thank you for being so kind

standinghere posted 2/22/2014 16:18 PM

I'm sorry that you find us here. I remember those first few days and it was just as you put it, "excruciating", I never want to be there again. I had gut wrenching emotions that I'd never felt before.

You will find a lot of good advice and comfort here. When you feel like you are going to go totally crazy, writing out what you are experiencing, and getting feedback from others who have been there, can be immensely helpful. I didn't get here until nearly 2 years out. I wish I'd found it sooner, and in fact I did, but I simply didn't trust anyone in the early period and certainly not any online site, when I couldn't even trust my wife who slept in the same bed with me. Over time, and observation, I think I have found this site to be the most trustworthy.

Hope you find this place helpful. I'm 4 years out from DDay in 3 weeks and 13 years out from the affair, and I find it the most difficult thing I've ever faced, by so much that everything else seems laughably insignificant, even my first wife leaving me over religion issues (although that was hard, it was nothing compared to this, probably because I was so close to my wife after 9 years).

It may sound like I am justifying what he did and by no means at all am I, because cheating is never the answer but I can understand why it got to this point.

Yes, your marriage had problems, and you were part of that. You took your issues and did what you did. He took his issues and did what he did, which in his case includes cheating. This almost always seems to involve Family of Origins issues (FOO). However, when you get to the cheating part, there is usually a lot that you don't know about your partner, a lot, that leads to that cheating. Marital problems do not cause cheating. Personal psychological issues lead to cheating.

My wife and I were no exception, I was sex starved, rejected, and had plenty of opportunity to stray, and the privacy when I was working during the day and didn't have the children around, plenty of single and seeking attractive women around, but didn't. My wife, who had the sex drive of an 80 year old, was constantly deferring sex because of noise from the kids and distractions at home, and was a stay at home mom with 4 small children, had an affair that involved full on sex in our house, with someone she hardly knew, with the kids watching TV down the hall, and giving him a blow job in the garage while the kids played in the yard. How could she do that? That was the "rest of the story".

why stop there when you have done all the other stuff

It is a slippery slope, and people progress, breaking one boundary, then another, then another. In my wife's case, that actually began months before she met the OM, with friends, breaking seemingly unlinked boundaries, secret keeping, gossip, putting me down when I wasn't around, telling people that she thought I didn't like her instead of talking to me about it, and suddenly someone arrives on the scene who is willing to listen, tell her how wonderful she is, and commiserate their problems with their spouses.

However, usually, as sincere as the WS may look as they talk to you, they usually are lying their ass off when they first answer the questions. They are in full self protection mode, not thinking of the truth and being remorseful, but being in the mode of "I got caught and need to minimize the damage to me".

How could he do this to you? How could he give up so easily? Why? That is where the FOO and other past issues start to surface when someone works on it, and not just "for show" but really digs into their own issues.

Good luck.

Skan posted 2/22/2014 17:06 PM

Swandart, it's always recommended that IC be first, especially for the WS because they need to do some really deep digging. We actually saw our MC one week before my FWH saw his IC, and that had the potential to be a HUGE disaster! Luckily, our MC took no shit about marital issues being the "reason" for the A. He pinned the A right on my FWHs chest with a spike. We dealt with the A before the marriage problems. Had the MC been a "well, what do you expect when a marriage is in trouble" sort, we could have been in deep trouble mainly because of the havoc I would have caused while walking out of counseling.

Mind you, my FWH seemed to do everything right too. The first words out of his mouth when he met his IC and was asked why he was there were, I'm here because I betrayed my wife and I want to do everything possible to save my marriage. Divorce is not an option for me. He supported me during my triggers, was there for me when I needed him, and endured my rage without flinching. And with all of this, and all of the desire he had to R with me, he still lied HUGELY to me twice. At one point we were in-house separated and I had an appointment to get legal separation papers drawn up and served when he started a new job. We were that close to not making it.

I tell you this because this is a hard, hard road. Even if you both fully commit. Even if he is the one person in the entire history of the board that tells you absolutely everything the first time and never, ever, puts a foot wrong. This is going to be the hardest thing that you've ever done, trying to R and to save your marriage. I was so very, very cocky in my first year because we were doing so very well. And we were. And then year 2 hit and we almost divorced. What year 3 will bring, I don't truly know. But I'm glad that we hung in there and we did and are doing the work. I anticipate that we'll be doing "the work" for the rest of our lives.

Keep posting. Be strong. Keep your eyes open, and do not settle for less than the potential for a truly wonderful marriage at the end of his hell-road. Because if you can't have that, you already know what a shit-marriage looks like, and why in the hell would you want to go back to that? (((hugs)))

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