"You can survive this. Talk to others that have"

cmego posted 3/18/2014 08:33 AM

I posted last week about my gut reaction about New Guy's ex.

http://survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=525483

We did have a great date last week. A real "spark" happened on that date, with hot sex later. HE said, "How can I not try with you when you look at me like that" and "I feel like the lucky one here". I thought it was slightly strange that he said something about "when I give him THAT look" how could he "not try", but chalked it up to him giving me a compliment.

Anyway, the next day I texted him that he was "distracting me" and replied back that I had been on his mind all day. He couldn't work out for thinking about "our workout last night".

Then…a pull/back slight poof. It was also the weekend he is moving/starting his job/telling dd that he is deploying. A difficult weekend, and I chalked it up to so much emotional stress on his end.

We emailed a little through this, and he said we needed to have a "serious discussion about our relationship". We talked Sunday night for 3 hours and seemed to work it all out. But, still, something felt a tad bit "off" to me. I asked if he was going to tell his family about me as we were discussing what "being connected" during his deployment was going to look like. He said they were private, but he would give them my numbers. I tried to get to the bottom of the pull back, and I told him he needed to tell me when things were really stressful for him, I'd rather he talk to me. Overall, again, a good discussion. I felt like we heard each other, he apologized for "being a bad boyfriend" and admitted he didn't put the relationship first. There was also some confession of how previous deployments and relationships didn't go well.

Again, I felt good after the discussion.

Then, nothing yesterday from him. I sent an email telling him I appreciated the discussion. He texted at 8pm and we decided to talk.

We were talking about him coming for the weekend, but he was…"blah". So, I finally just said, "I wasn't sure if you were going to break up with me last weekend, I have been a little…confused".

Long story short, I asked about his feelings for his exgf..that I have felt I've been "compared" to her. He finally said, "I'm not comparing you to her, I'm comparing my feelings for her to my feelings for you."

Let that sink in a little.

So, a long discussion about how he holds that relationship as his litmus test. They were a typical SI "all heat/rainbows/butterflies fast moving relationship" where, one year in, she asked him to move out, they "worked on it", broke up, got back together and he found out that she was cheating on him. He defended the relationship and the multiple tries because "you don't give up on someone you love. It was a rough patch, so I thought I could ride it out and she would be back." I explained that I want a relationship where the rough patches make you PULL TOGETHER, not pull apart.

I said, "You are comparing me to a relationship where she cheated on you??? How am I supposed to 'win' if I"m battling those early feelings you had for someone that didn't love you??"

So, that is his litmus test. He said he was afraid we didnt' have enough "HEAT" for him. I asked if there was heat on the date on Wednesday, and he said "yes", but it may not be "enough heat". So, I asked how anyone can have "tons of heat" on the second time we had sex, we know he is leaving/deploying and we were just trying to spend what time we could together. Then I asked why he poofed.

He replied that he wasn't sure if heat could build in a relationship, he wasn't sure about anything because he wants the heat from the litmus test relationship. That was obviously damaged/not healthy. He said from the beginning he felt that he should be "cautious" with me, but couldn't tell me why or what that means. I asked if he was cautious because I mean something to him. He kept saying, "I really respect you. I really like you. I know that IS important. I think you are beautiful."

I told him that HEAT relationships generally are not based on much except heat and drama. He did tell me their relationship had a lot of drama, and that "kept him up at night", but the beginning WAS SO GOOD and he wants that again.

I'm

I can't fight a ghost.

I told him that a real relationship needed to be based on more. Yes, the heat had to be there, and we were beginning to feel the heat, but where we are good is the friendship/compatibility. I personally think the heat can build since we both agreed we have the spark.

We didn't really end with a decision if we are going forward. He said he needed to go to sleep, and I wished him good luck and we hung up.

I wouldn't even know if I COULD continue knowing that he expects us to have the heat of a broken relationship. He doesn't even see it as "broken" he said he guessed they "weren't supposed to be together but he knows that heat exists".

My gut was there was an issue with that ex. I should have listened.

I am sad. I don't regret this relationship at all. But, I can't see it continuing unless he can work through not comparing "us" (normal, stable, secure, happy with building heat) to (HEAT, DRAMA, she cheated).

So..I know there have been discussions about heat v. solid. Can we discuss again??…so if he does contact me, I need to get my head on straight. At this point, I"m NC.

uggg.

sparkysable posted 3/18/2014 09:14 AM

How long have you been seeing this individual?

cmego posted 3/18/2014 09:22 AM

Two months. Which doesn't sound like very much at all, but this was the most normal and healthy guy I have met in 3 years.

We knew we were going to have to "fast track" due to him deploying next month, but had handled most of the stress of this until this past weekend.

She11ybeanz posted 3/18/2014 09:30 AM

How long have you been seeing this individual?

^^^THIS. I'm no expert in relationships....believe you me. I've had more than my fair share of bad decisions and a broken picker. BUT...what I have learned....is that if you are already in the "Let's talk" or "We need to discuss these issues" or "Let's mold each other to fit what we want the other person to be instead of accepting them for who they are" stage or place....and you haven't been dating but a short while.... you need to cut ties and run.

Short-term relationships are not worth all this mess. If he was or is truly compatible with you....it would just work and it wouldn't FEEL like work! That comes in the longer term not the short-term. Right now should be all rainbows and butterflies.... I didn't have my 1st real fight with my XWH until after we had dated a whole year! (that might be extreme....) but if you guys are newly dating..... I say move on. He's got baggage and residual feelings for his ex and you don't want to compete with a cheater. His ex may end up getting jealous and find it her personal mission to break you guys up.....(which is what happened in my M) and since he obviously thinks "they were meant to be" he will be an easy sway / catch / whatever. You don't want to be his 2nd choice.

Choose to be 1st and make yourself a priority and then eventually you will meet someone who will do the same! (I'm still waiting) Good luck to you!

Iamacrab posted 3/18/2014 09:38 AM

I agree with Shelly. I get the deployment stress but this is too much angst two months in. He really doesn't seem to be in a good place comparing something building slowly to an ex disaster.
You are worthy of a relationship without so much going on this early.

cmego posted 3/18/2014 09:54 AM

Yeah, I agree that I will probably just let this go. It is unfortunate, because he is a really good man.

Mostly, I'm just venting.

I think it hit me last night that I was being compared to something that wasn't healthy, and he can't see it as unhealthy yet.

I'm not quite sure what I should say to him if he calls. We had plans for this weekend, and for me to go stay with him for a week.

He doesn't' have the benefit of SI, and is not in therapy. Overall, he seems pretty healed, I just think I'm hitting the wake of that first "post D bad breakup". Nothing I can do about it.

sparkysable posted 3/18/2014 10:38 AM

This guy is way too much work, seriously. And he is actively pursing a broken relationship? Oh fuck no.

She11ybeanz posted 3/18/2014 10:40 AM

Unfortunately.....the whirlwind romance followed by the quick doubts and concerns on his part point to a possible rebound relationship for him. I think you were his rebound after his ex cheated on him. His needs to feel wanted and loved after the rejection of infidelity are very real. I went through those feelings. The physical part was very important for some reason. But, it was not healthy or real to me or if I thought it was.....I put the guy I was seeing on some sort of pedestal and didn't see the red flags that wrapped around the whole darn thing because I was so wrapped up in the whirlwind of emotions and how great he made me feel. The first one poofed.... and Piper's father was MY real rebound.....thought I was "in love" but looking back....it was more "in lust." He was so wrong for me on so many levels and not the type of guy I would EVER date now. I just needed to feel wanted. And, he was there....to swoop in for the kill so to speak. But, I got my daughter out of it so I can't complain too much.

If he is comparing you to his ex...he is not healthy and healed. He needs to resolve those feelings before entering into any new relationships....IMHO. That's another reason why I am still single almost 2 years after breaking things off with Piper's sperm donor. Its okay to be alone. Its not a bad thing or the end of the world. As my dad says...."there are billions of people on the planet.....and that is just one!" Be patient. The right fish will swim your way!

nowiknow23 posted 3/18/2014 10:43 AM

((((cmego))))

7yrsflushed posted 3/18/2014 10:55 AM

Sorry Cmego.

Overall, he seems pretty healed,

^^^I dont't know if I agree with this. The fact that he actually said he is comparing his feelings for the EX to his feelings for you puts him on the "nowhere near healed" part of the spectrum in my opinion. Relationships are unique to the 2 people in them. No 2 will ever be the same so if someone is comparing then they aren't anywhere near ready to be in one.

Just my 2 cents but "Heat" ,seriously, my ex used to say shit like that. If heat/sparks are all you are looking for and you never look or build anything substantial then when/if they fade you eventually go looking for you next high or create drama to keep things going.

Williesmom posted 3/18/2014 11:03 AM

((cmego))

ugh. just ugh.

He's looking for rainbow farting unicorns.

cmego posted 3/18/2014 11:06 AM

Oh, no. He isn't actively pursuing the broken relationship. It ended last November when he discovered she had been stringing him along while dating another guy too. He said, "She crossed the line." And, what I know of him, this means he won't go back to her.

But, he is still stuck in thinking that euphoric feeling he had with her is what ALL relationships should feel like. So, he is comparing..and this isn't fair to anyone else.

He doesn't buy the "long slow build" that we were feeling as a more normal and healthy relationship.

I'll be able to let it go. I wasn't that invested because I knew this was not going to be easy. I think, given better timing, it could have been something good.

But, I have no interest in being compared to a ghost. He needs to figure out "euphoria" v. "normal, stable, good with heat".

edited to add:

I still believe he is more healed than most guys I have met. He is a really good man. Everything was easy and good until now…it is going to be his job to figure out what healthy looks like.

I agree, She11y, that I think he was caught up in that relationship and somehow thought it was "the real deal" and missed a bunch of red flags. I asked him if he has gone back to see those flags yet, and he gave me the exact dates of when they had problems to when she asked him to move out. Im guessing the problems were even earlier than he said. So their "all heat/all about each other" relationship really wasn't good for very long. The last 1/2 was him trying to get that euphoric feeling back, "tough it out because he loved her".

I kinda feel sorry for him now. No healthy relationship will compare to that, so he has little chance of finding something healthy until he reconciles this in his head.

[This message edited by cmego at 11:29 AM, March 18th (Tuesday)]

Crescita posted 3/18/2014 11:27 AM

I think you are right that the timing is just off. Deployment is a stressful time to be starting a relationship and looking for butterflies. Maybe you can just keep in touch and if you are both single down the road you can revisit it.

better4me posted 3/18/2014 11:36 AM

Respectfully, I disagree with this

If he was or is truly compatible with you....it would just work and it wouldn't FEEL like work!

And I know this refers to the early, feel good stage of relationships. Sure there is the oxytocin high that we get from new relationships that can make us feel so damn starry eyed, but relationships take work at every stage. There is going to be conflict at many stages of the relationship and it isn't necessarily a signal that this one will be "too much work". If we look at conflict as an opportunity to create a deeper connection it is less of a thing to avoid or be wary of. Conflict is a way of seeing the other's communication skills. Conflict can be a time to practice sharing our feelings authentically.

And guys often pull back when they are scared about being in a "relationship" and what that may mean. And in addition, this guy has a lot of changes coming his way! This discussion you are having may be partly that...his feeling scared and needing some space and using this "not enough heat" as a way of justifying that pull back to himself. If you think that is true then maybe saying something like "Take your time to figure this out for yourself. We can take a break from each other for awhile. If you want to talk more about it at sometime, to figure this out more together, I'd be open to that."

lieshurt posted 3/18/2014 11:44 AM

I had a similar conversation yesterday with the new guy I've been seeing. I'm moving on. I deserve better than to be compared to the ghosts of his past....and, so do you.

norabird posted 3/18/2014 11:46 AM

He really does not sound healed to me, at all. I'm sorry.

cmego posted 3/18/2014 11:50 AM

better…this is good stuff.

And guys often pull back when they are scared about being in a "relationship" and what that may mean. And in addition, this guy has a lot of changes coming his way! This discussion you are having may be partly that...his feeling scared and needing some space and using this "not enough heat" as a way of justifying that pull back to himself. If you think that is true then maybe saying something like "Take your time to figure this out for yourself. We can take a break from each other for awhile. If you want to talk more about it at sometime, to figure this out more together, I'd be open to that."

I kinda pulled back and listened to a lot of fear from him last night. I know I was feeling the "crap. It is over. I can't compete with a ghost" and wasn't really communicating any more. He has probably never heard this "euphoria" v. "normal healthy with a spark" before. I introduced him to the term "actions v. words" and he thanked me later for it.

We do communicate fairly well for a new relationship. We've been more honest over the last few days with the pull-back too, actually discussing it without fear or pain.

But, it was hard to hear he is comparing me, so I shut down. I was also triggering that I wasn't good at sex as I listened too…which is a trigger from my marriage to a gay man.

So, I heard "no heat=not good at sex/I don't find you attractive" and listening to him have an unrealistic view of what a good relationship was…I probably become overwhelmed.

Totally agree with you all that I shouldn't be compared. I'm not OK with it. But, because I do care for him and we were forming a good friendship, I'm open to discussing it with him and let him mull it over. He is deploying, we will end. But, maybe if I'm still single when he returns, we will have the base of a trusting friendship.

good stuff, better.

[This message edited by cmego at 11:56 AM, March 18th (Tuesday)]

LearningToRun posted 3/18/2014 11:52 AM

HEAT = Infatuation and does not equal mature love.

If he doesn't know the difference and expects heat forever you will soon be tossed aside as his next dose of heat comes along.

That alone would be enough for me to NEXT him, because my EX was one of those who thought Heat = love and no work should ever be involved.

Better you find out now than have some long distance deployment angst and guilt.

idkam posted 3/18/2014 12:25 PM

This guy sounds very immature to me.... He wants the heat in the relationship... Who the hell expresses that???.. Let this ZERO go and get someone who will enjoy a immature relationship.,,.. He sounds like drama wating to happen...

Buhbye...

caregiver9000 posted 3/18/2014 12:29 PM

(((cmego)))

1. You had "hot sex" and that is never a bad thing!!!

Now for the rest of it...

I also hear "not enough heat" and sense a comparison to "good enough in bed." I don't like this at all! I feel like he is setting you up to try harder to keep his attention which creates an imbalance that just does not feel good. Especially since he is deploying. Is he setting you up for clingy girlfriend back home?

On the chance that this is complicated by deployment emotions and new relationship figuring each other out, would you consider being friends and not committed bf/gf while he is away? A FWB but not really because there is no contact? I don't know what I mean, really I am brainstorming out loud. I trust your judgment and you say he is a good guy who has shared his insecurities with you. The fact that they involve his last relationship is triggery.

One other weakly waving flag for me is the "I feel like the lucky one." I learned here on SI to recognize the "you are too good for me" compliment as a FLAG. It really is. Again, it creates an imbalance and seeking balance later involves bringing you down to "good enough for me." Pay attention to the vibe behind that statement.

I do think him being gone is the cause of this worry. He is projecting that what you have at this 2 month stage is "not enough" to weather the deployment. Is that his fear, him knowing himself, doubting you, afraid of the work, afraid of being betrayed again (especially since a relationship during deployment involves a huge amount of trust), or something else.

I don't fault him too much for having a litmus test relationship. Honestly we all do this. I don't feel like you are fighting a ghost (he left her and everything you have posted seems to indicate no wishy washy on his part about that.) I don't feel like you are fighting a ghost so much as a "best sex you ever had." Guys and girls (in my experience) reflect on the "best sex you ever had in very different ways.

Do you feel like he is communicating that he feels like he is settling? which is the exact opposite of "he's the lucky one." Is this a conversation he is having with himself and it happened to come out of his mouth? Again, I don't feel like it is a bad conversation.

However you guys leave it, I do want him to reach out and define the relationship at this point without prompting. He has opened a lot of insecurities, intentionally or not.

(((hugs))) relationships are work. At every stage. It did "fast track" because of the deployment.

You have all the pieces. What the picture makes put together is still unclear.