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How did you get your spouse to give you the whole truth and how did you know that you had the full truth? This is my stuck point and I desperately need to move on from this.

I never received information. I had to find it on my own. ANd then it was never admitted....I have tried everything..I left, we fought many many times, I demanded, I cried, I screamed, I pleaded, I asked nicely...Never....I have come to terms with not knowing facts...I can put together a logical story...I am convinced, even with confessions, you will never know it all..

I have to believe my own facts..ANd decide from those...It was very hard..It caused more anger if that's possible..It felt like it was added disrespect.
In the end, the details don't matter to me..They add a different pain. I had to get to a place of acceptance.. I had to move past the shock..There is a forum " I can relate "for those who never know. Iwill refuse to hear the truth now, at 5 yrs out...That's for my sanity..I will not relive this..ANd no, h is not off scott free.. H is having his second breakdown, I believe it is 100% job related...But it is ironic, ???? He has never had these issues, ever. Maybe holding it all in isn't working for him.

I am right where you are! It is really smacking me in the face that he'll never tell me the full truth, and the only things he has admitted to are things I found out on my own... The details aren't dire for me to know either, I just can't stomach the fact that he has STILL lied so much, and will take every detail that he can to his grave, its definitely like being disrespected all over again, like how little does he think of me if he can still try to keep me in the dark for HIS own good??? I will have to resort to a polygraph if I want to really know...

My wife was trickle truthing and trying to hide parts of what happened because she only thought they'd make thins worse. I downloaded a program to recover deleted messages on her cell phone and before I could use it she opened the flood gates. She told me things that were in messages I didn't even recover.

I'm still not sure I know 100% of the truth. I'm not sure you ever can be. But I think I know enough to accept what happened, forgive and move on.

I'm still working on the forgiving part.

They think they are protecting....The marriage, you, and mostly themselves..They believe if you really knew what happened, there would be no chance to R...Its fear, its manipulative, its self serving...Its controlling. Its mean. They want it to go away... It is still compartmentalizing. Its not healing...So how do you feel about A #2? Those are my fears. Its not fair to have to find your own healing in an impossible situation, then to live with the knowledge that if there was no healing, it will repeat.

There is no such thing as "the full truth". No one can remember all the details of the affair. If we are really lucky we get the truth as they see it (the WS). There will still always be the OP's version. I feel I have gotten as much of the truth as fWS remembers.

Good question. How do you know what the full truth is? WS was very forthcoming after first DD, and even after 2nd DD. We were very far along in the healing process until the 2nd DD when I discovered they had resumed contact. He claims there was never a PA, but after the 2nd DD and rethinking the opportunities he had and those "things that just don't add up", I wonder if that is the truth. I believe that he will never tell me that he had a PA, so I don't ask, but I continue to wonder (obsess?) over this. If he lied about it, what else does he lie about?

About a month after DD#2, I feel he finally made the commitment to me and our marriage and was done with OP. But if he could lie to me so successfully for so long (2-3 years at that point), can I believe him now? I desperately want to, but again, those little things that just tell me otherwise. Do I confront him again? He is so ready to put this behind us. And we do have a great relationship now, better than it ever was, if I can just let go finally. Any suggestions?

He is so ready to put this behind us

Of course he is. Most WS's want nothing more than to put it behind without admitting much.

All BSs want nothing more than to get on with a normal life, after all of their questions have been answered with total honesty.

It is bad enough to be fooled during the affair, but to be treated like fools with ridiculous answers and lies after the affair is even worse.

How do you know when you have the entire truth is an important question. After so many lies, partial truths and changing stories, how the heck do you know when you finally have the real and the entire truth once and for all.

This is something I have thought about a great deal and the only answer I can come up with is that hopefully my gut feelings will let me know.

I can almost tell a lie anymore by the following:

The answer is too long winded, to full of explanations instead of a simple answer.

The answer doesn't make any logical or common sense. I understand affairs themselves do not have to be logical or common sense, but sex itself does and always has. Sex, talking, meeting, deciding etc...all the parts of affairs still have to make sense.

The answers change too much from one day to the next.

And if she answers with too many I dont know and I dont remember

I have read that most likely the most honest answer is the most simple answer. An answer without a ton of explanation and not a long winded answer.

[This message edited by craig2001 at 3:21 PM, March 26th (Wednesday)]

I focused on getting the truth for over a year. Sometimes I did this in an angry state.

What works best is stay calm and stop asking questions when you feel anger or rage coming.

About 2 weeks ago we recently sat down and my fWH retold the narrative from start to finish. And we focused a lot on how did he feel at beginning middle and end so he had a chance to share the cheating but also how it affected him. We would table things if I start getting overwrought and pick it up later.

And now I believe his story which is a huge relief. This took many hours and a year had passed before we got there. My fWH recently told me how proud he was that I wouldn't let things go until I had a real belief. It was a process for us which I had to drive in our case. But we have been able to move forward now finally. And he has started sharing his own triggers since we now realized he was traumatized by what he did and what was done to him by a manipulative OW.

[This message edited by whattheh at 5:10 PM, March 26th (Wednesday)]

My WW had made a list of everyone her and her AP had ever had sex with. In an Excel spreadsheet. With notes and dates. She was organized, you can at least say that for her.
Geez! other than that I had her answer a list of about 50 questions, some I knew the answer to, some not. There was some she minimized or omitted for various reason, some she admitted that were embarrassing that she didn;t know I knew about or not.
I've always said that you are lucky to get, at most, about 70% of the truth. The rest is lost or forgotten. I think one just has to deal with that as best as they can.

Hi!
I have to tell you if your gut is telling you something about the full truth you are properly correct. I have been trying to R for three years. At first I built this house around me to protect me and everytime I would take down a few bricks it would sense danger ( Lies) and I would stop taking bricks down. Then eventually I would listen to my gut that was sensing danger and place the bricks I did take down back up. Well this went on for almost three years. Finally I stuck to my gut. Over a month and a Half I was talking to him and in MC about how the truth will set you free. He told us he was telling the truth and not holding back. Still my gut told me no he is lying. So I went on about a polygraph. He said no problem then a week goes by life got busy. I finally forward him the website of the polygrapher after I did the research and determined who I wanted to use. Well in our MC session that week I told the MC that this is what I wanted and why. He asked me many questions and how I would feel with certain out comes. He told me pros and cons about the test and told a story of some couple that did take one. Well I proceeded to tell him about the truth setting him free and we could never have a real marriage since he was lying to me. The MC agreed told him why it would never work if he was hiding some truths from me! Anyway we eventually wore him down until he said okay I am holding back some truths. Well he wanted to write them out before he told me so he would not leave any thing out. Then he would read them to me. Now this is supposed to be every lie he told me over 20+ years. Well since then I have been placed back to square one. Meaning I am back to three years ago. I have not been able to get in touch with my full gut since then. I guess once the dusts settles I will see if I have been told everything.

So that is how I hopefully received my full truth(knock on wood)

Is your gut telling you that he is lying about stuff old and new lies?

He is telling me that it was all EA and never met in person (internet/text/cell phone affair only). But he had too many opportunities to meet in person and I can't believe that he didn't. I guess I feel that he is lying about this in order to not hurt me further.

After the first DD, he swore he would never lie to me again, then he resumed talking with her and after 2nd DD I wonder if I can ever fully trust him again.

We have moved on in so many ways and things are very good, but then I start obsessing and get depressed. I think that having "full disclosure" would help. I don't want details, I just want to know whether they ever met in person and where (so I can avoid those places).

How do I confront him and be assured that he is telling me the truth this time?

Honestly, you're in a tough spot. I was trickle truth'ed for 6 months. Each time he swore this was the whole truth.....swore on his mother's grave type promise.

I finally made him take a poly. It helped but I'm still fuming mad he lied to me for so long. So a poly doesn't take away the pain, is what I'm saying. He passed.

You and I will never know the whole truth and we prolly won't trust again or trust for a long time. It's just the way it is.

No, we may never know the whole truth. But I did confront him again last night. Lots of tears (on my part) and swearing he was telling me the truth, that he had never met her in person. He also stated, for the first time, that it may be a good idea for both of us to go to a MC. (He has guilt issues he is having trouble with as well as my trust issues.)

I believe he has been forthright in everything except the re-establishment of contact, which OP admits she did because she needed my WS's relationship advice about her marriage(isn't that ironic?). Again, I have to admit he is great with relationship advice. (If he had only advised himself!) He hid the renewed contact from me because he thought it would hurt me, but he still wanted to help her.

Since then he has finally stated that he wanted her out of our lives for good and that it was not good for our marriage (so freeing!!!).

He has continued to maintain that he has never met her, it was an ego fed relationship, etc. And, at least as of now, I believe him. I am not saying that I won't have doubts again. But he has consistently maintained it was just EA and never PA. So, I am truly hoping that I have laid this issue to rest in my mind and that we can continue on our healing relationship.

I don't know if we will go to a MC or not. As of today, I don't feel the need, but will leave it up to him for now. If he takes the initiative to find one, I will know he is serious about seeing a MC.

Mine never would have given it to me. I found out on my own by pulling deleted texts off his phone. There was more information on there than I ever wanted to know.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 1:39 PM, March 28th (Friday)]

I don't think we ever know the full truth. It's a very difficult realization to eventually reach. What gave me peace was forcing my WXH to take a polygraph test. He passed and that gave me the peace I needed to move forward.

I have been doing pretty well the last few months. But for some unknown reason, my doubts about the extent his lying to me has resurfaced. It still hinges on whether he is telling me the truth about it going to a PA rather than just the EA.

Resentment seems to be building in my mind this week.
-Resentment that he doesn't trust me to tell me the whole truth.
-Resentment that I don't want to bring up this whole can of worms again because things have been going very well for us and I don't want to cause him more pain by doings o. After all, I love him deeply and don't want him to suffer more from his guilt.
-Resentment that it took him 3 years to finally decide that our marriage was more important than his affair.
-Resentment that I have no one to talk to about this. I am a very private person and cannot imagine discussing this with anyone (other than my best friend who is the one that betrayed me).
Any suggestions?

Trusted my gut that there was more I said I'd had enough and I couldn't do it anymore. He admitted there was more to know and told him I trusted myself to hear the truth.

Not sure if that jolted him or if he go there on his own. I suspect he got there on his own.

I still regret not throwing him out when I first heard about it - I think that would have been a good jolt into reality! But who knows - its up to them.

Tiffers: I get being a private person but you should be talking to an IC at the very least.

@crazyblindsided:]

There was more information on there than I ever wanted to know.

This. This is why I don't want to see deleted texts from 6 months ago using whatever downloaded thing. I'm pretty sure that it would kill me to see the whole relationship via texts. I saw 3-4 weeks worth of texts and that was plenty. A year and a half would literally kill me.

Not sure if everyone ever does hear the full truth.
Not sure if some WS are even capable of it... they've lived in lies, deceit, and double lives so long that I'm not sure they even know where the truth begins and the lies end.

My husband's affair went on 1 year. He had a very neatly compartmentalized life where I existed 8a.m. to 3 p.m. and they existed 12 a.m. to 5 a.m. Well, and of course full texting all day in between. Every moment of his life for a year he had to remember who he said what to whom, who he went where with whom. The easier part for him was that we live in a very different area of the city than his APs.

How do you disentangle yourself from that level of deceit?

He gave me the frame of the affair picture within 12 hours of me finding out. I'm nearly a month out and still filling in details. He dropped a bombshell on me a few days ago about the timeline not being quite the same as I had taken as a given from the start.

The ginormous data trails seem almost easier/harder than in the past where (a) they couldn't keep in contact all day every day and (b) the BS had to just accept that they'd never know all the times the WS and AP had contact or went out.

I've poured over text logs and carefully assembled pieces to the puzzle from that. I can tell when they went out by the periods of time that their texts stop. I can tell when he was out at events with me where he did *not* check his phone throughout by comparing his text logs with my own timeline of events.

I'm a researcher as a profession, so this kind of pouring over details is actually what I do for my research... which seems both a curse and a way of coping/understanding. It's awful, but it's giving me pieces of the picture which helps.

So far my husband hit a truth waterfall on day 4 where he finally began volunteering information - before that I had to know the right question, have evidence, or catch out on the misssing parts of his stories. He's hit me with a few things since that were unexpected (mostly related to who he had told about it), and he hit me with the timeline bombshell a few days ago - and he seemed honestly taken aback that I was horrified, because in his mind it was "so minor" at the beginning with the first woman, since it was just flirting, that he didn't think it would bother me.

So in our case... I still don't have the full truth. I feel I'm at a much much closer place now than I was a month ago, but I think at some point I will have to just either accept the unknown or give him a tiny bit of trust and say that there is no more there to be found.

It sucks.