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Springanew posted 4/11/2014 07:10 AM

Hi everyone-
I wanted to post this somewhere else so it gets the responses from BS but am still unsure if i'm allowed to post in 'General'. Any matter- I just read about the 180 and the list for BS and I have to say- I am a bit confused by it. I understnad that the BS has to take care of themselves and do whatever they need to to get through the stages. But there was a lot on the list of 'Do not' that appears like rug-sweeping and plain out ignoring the problem. Is this 180 behavior for a set period of time until the BS is ready for the next stage? How are you supposed to communicate or work on R with someone when they aren't being real with you? Dont get me wrong- there is plenty there that makes sense...but some of the other things just seem like avoidance..? any calrity on the subject would be helpful as I feel like I'm missing it.. but my BH has and is just naturally doing some of these things already even without reading about it so I'm happy for that as if it is part of the healing process (as many say it is) than I want that for him of course.

LosferWords posted 4/11/2014 08:23 AM

Hi Springanew,

This is the right place for you to post, and leaving the stop sign off allows BS's to reply as well.

The 180 isn't what I would consider something to be used for R, or on the other side of the spectrum for avoidance, either. A lot of it has to do with detaching from a toxic situation, so the individual can heal themselves. Oftentimes I have seen a BS put a monumental amount of effort into reconciliation with an non-remorseful WS. They end up running themselves into the ground. Eventually they have to shift their focus away from trying to single handedly fix the marriage, and work on healing themselves.

Even in situations where couples are trying to reconcile, there may be brief periods of the 180, where the BS has to take some time to focus on them.

Also, I don't think I've ever seen a situation where someone follows every bullet point of the 180 down to the last detail. Usually it is a modified version of their own, based on their own situation.

I'm sure others will reply with their perspectives. Hopefully this helps shed a little more light on the subject.

ETA: It could be that your husband is having to take a couple of those bullet points in order to take some time to work on himself. This can be a good thing. Didn't want to make my reply sound all dreary and such.

[This message edited by LosferWords at 8:37 AM, April 11th (Friday)]

Aubrie posted 4/11/2014 09:28 AM

Yeah. What Losfer said.

The 180 is a tool for a BS who's WS will not/have not done a rectal-cranial inversion. A BS cannot R with an unremorseful, unresponsive WS.

Like Losfer mentioned, your BH could unknowingly be doing his own version of a 180 in an attempt to heal himself. Three things have to heal after infidelity has taken place. You, him, the relationship. You have to do your own healing. And he has to do his own. You can support one another thru your perspective processes, but ultimately your healing is your own. The relationship is on both of you.

Make sense?

ETA: Stupid spellcheck turned Losfer into Loafer. Sorry man.

[This message edited by Aubrie at 9:29 AM, April 11th (Friday)]

LosferWords posted 4/11/2014 09:30 AM

TJ

Stupid spellcheck turned Losfer into Loafer. Sorry man.

That's awesome, actually. Thanks for the correction.

/TJ

painfulpast posted 4/11/2014 09:39 AM

BS here,

The 180 isn't about the relationship, it's about the BS regaining strength, confidence, and to start the detachment process. If a couple is in R, and the WS is remorseful, there would be no need for the 180.

However, if the WS is cake eating, fence sitting, still lying, withholding facts, etc (in other words, not remorseful), then the BS needs to start detaching from the situation. Talking about the relationship, the A, asking again for something from the WS, etc all can keep the BS 'stuck' and it's very unhealthy.

The 180 is to begin the process of detaching from the situation, the A, the WS, the relationship. Again, it's not for R.

Now, one side note - there are thousands of cases where the 180 has actually snapped the WS out of 'the fog'. You see, as the BS begins removing themselves from the life of the WS, and is no longer obsessed by the behaviors of the WS, or the details of the A, the WS is forced to realize that this isn't going away, that the BS will NOT be treated like an afterthought, that there is a very real chance that the WS will end up in divorce court, BS gone from their lives, kids seen part time, etc. In other words, it shows the WS exactly what they are losing because they begin to lose it. In these cases, the WS that 'gets it' based on the BS detaching will often begin doing what's necessary to heal the relationship.

I mention this because many believe the 180 is a tool to snap the WS to their senses. It's not. It is 100% to help the BS begin to see that there is a world outside of the A, the marriage, the actions of the WS. Can it have a positive affect on the marriage? Yes, but that is NOT the goal, and it shouldn't be the goal of anyone that is using this very effective technique.

I hope this helps to clarify what the 180 is and why someone would begin using this program.

Cheers!!

Springanew posted 4/11/2014 13:25 PM

Thanks everyone.... Yes. This is all very helpful. Albeit somewhat frightening bc now I don't know if BHs actions are bc he doesn't want to R and he is doing the 180 stuff or if it's just that he is hurt and dealing with it in his own way

Skan posted 4/11/2014 16:05 PM

^^^^ This doesn't matter. It really doesn't at this point in time. He may be doing a healthy detachment to try to figure out how to breathe again and to find his footing.

That has absolutely nothing to do with what YOU need to do right now. If your goal is to R, you need to proceed in an all-in fashion. No matter if he responds or not, you need to offer transparency, honesty, accountability, and to get whatever counseling you need to figure yourself out and become the best person that you can be. This is your responsibility and the actions that you can take to show your BH, even while he may not seem to notice or be interested, that you are committing to him no matter what. I guarantee you, that even if he seems like he's not interested, he is watching you very closely to see exactly what you are doing and if your words are matching your actions.

As an example, there were many nights that I simply could not share a bed with, or even the same room with, my FWH. My loss of security and anguish were far too great. So he would sleep elsewhere. However, I was also having crazy night terrors, something that I've had for most of my life except, ironically, after he and I were married. So, he'd sleep on the couch outside of the bedroom in guard mode. If he heard me heading into a nightmare, he'd get off of the couch, come in, stroke me awake gently, and talk to me until I came awake and aware. Then he'd leave again to go back to the couch. Many night he did this over and over, while I never said a word. But you better believe I noticed it and it helped to bring me out of my detachment towards him.

So while it seems discouraging, please don't stop reaching out. It ain't over until it's over. It's far too soon to give up hope.