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Finding the courage to 180

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CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/26/2014 09:11 AM

I need some advice. I've discovered my H is having an EA with OW from another country. I've found evidence of emails, messages and skype calls.
Over the last 3 years my H has got a new car, two tattoos and almost left his job. He is mid 40s, I'm 35. I'm sure he is classic mid life crisis and this is the part where life must be greener on the other side.

But how can I let this pass, without being seen as weak, inviting permission for it to happen again?

He is defiantly in the fog right now. I feel im left with nothing else but 180. His only way to find out if the grass is greener is to start walking in it.

My inlaws have offered my son and I to stay with them. Both my parents passed in 2003.

What are people's experiences of 180 living with H and way from H?

My primary concern is my 3year old son. He deserves stability and love. He is due for an operation in just 5 weeks.

I'm writing this feeling numb, knowing if I let the walls down, I'll be a mess. I refuse to let my son see me so distressed and to let my H see me so vulnerable.

jjct posted 4/26/2014 09:57 AM

(((CantSeeInTheDark & DS)))

I would think that "away" would be an aid to the 180 (you can read my story - that's what I did).

Keep in the front of your mind, while reading and implementing the 180:
- it is about getting into you. Your healing. Not about getting your defiant WH to do or see anything (not a manipulative tool)...

Sending strength, hugs, and prayers sister, keep posting.
We got your back.

devastated23 posted 4/26/2014 11:33 AM

Hugs to you. I personally would have went insane trying to detach in the same house as my WS. You know yourself best and are, rightly so, thinking about your DS. He does deserve stability and shelter from the pain and madness is all of this. If you are able to give him that emotional stability while living with your husband, maybe its worth a try. You could try and stick it out until DS's surgery. However it's probably more painful for him to see you emotionally crumble than to be separated at times from his dad. I'm wondering why YOU have to leave, and why he doesn't go stay with his parents? If you do choose to stay, I would encourage you to be very mindful and reflective of how your WS's presence is hindering your ability to provide the stability that your soon needs. Stay strong.

4everfaithful83 posted 4/26/2014 11:44 AM

Sorry you are here! But glad you found us!!

The term "the grass is always greener" always pisses me off.

Guess what? The grass is greener where you water it!

Most Waywards quickly learn that ALL relationships take work! (and watering! ) and once they get what they "think" they wanted, they realize it's not all its cracked up to be.

You are right to be thinking of doing the 180. It's for you, not for him. You need to focus on only you and your son.

You can't "nice" your WH back into the relationship. You are definitely right that if you give him what he thinks he wants, he will surely see that he's in La-La land right now.

sending you strength!!

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/26/2014 12:04 PM

Devastated -
To cut a long story short, Hs parents are so disappointed, well his mum is furious, that they have told him in the event of a split they will look after me and their grandson first. "After all, he's caused all this himself." His mum point blanks refuses to pamper to him and sees that he needs to snap out of it.

I'm not sure if putting myself in the middle of this is a good idea, but their emotional support is attractive. Suddenly finding myself alone from 7 every night once my son in bed feels like it could become a very dark place quickly.

[This message edited by CantSeeInTheDark at 12:05 PM, April 26th (Saturday)]

devastated23 posted 4/26/2014 13:35 PM

Can'tSee, take all of the support you can get. What a coward to see his own family turn on him and still not get it. That being the case, the inlaws might help provide the stability he needs. You are broken for now, but by detaching you will get stronger. Sending you my support as well.

12yearsloyal posted 4/26/2014 21:10 PM

My WS is with an OW from a foreign country as well. He thought the grass was greener until he found out his OW was now fucking his boss. He has more money than my WS so the OW went for the boss. Mid life crisis as well. Sad that so many fall into that trap. Yep the grass is definitely greener with an OW that has been married twice and has now betrayed the betrayer for the boss. Sounds like a good plan...NOT. Maybe 3 is a charm?

We all have a different story on here but they all seem to start with one selfish spouse that does a major screw up!

NeverAgain2013 posted 4/27/2014 07:01 AM

Good lord, I wonder if the sun is always shining and the unicorns are always flying for your husband and his pen pal in Fantasy Land.

I think your MIL is a grand lady for not turning a blind eye to your husband's stupidity just because he's her son; instead, she's calling him on it. Good on her.

I don't know that going to stay at your MIL's and essentially 'ganging up' on your husband is the right answer. I really don't think you'll get the respect you deserve by doing that. It just looks like you two would be taking 'sides' against him, and that's not how you want to get him to pull his head out of his ass - because everyone's turned against him. He should pull his out because he realizes how ridiculous he's been acting, and because he wants to get back into the marriage. Not because he was forced to do it, you know?

If he can't do it on his own because it's the right thing to do, then you need to sit him down and tell him you won't allow this utter disrespect for even ONE more day and he needs to find another place to live.

Don't run to your MIL's to gang up him. Stand up for yourself and command the respect you deserve and to which you are entitled. I think we're much more respected when we stand up for ourselves, keep to our word, and show them that life can and WILL go on without them. Only then, do they realize you're a force to be reckoned with.

Skan posted 4/27/2014 11:33 AM

Hey there. I'm glad that you found us for support.

Listen. He needs to experience the full consequences of his decision to go outside of your marriage. That means that HE needs to leave the house, not you. You and your child need the stability of being at home, especially when your child is going to be put through an operation soon. He wants to be a free agent? Then he can go couch-surf elsewhere and find out what a pathetic sight a middle-aged loser presents to his buddies, when he decides to act like an arse. And if his parents mentally beat the heck out of him, well, actions, meet consequences! In the meantime, 180 him, finances and child care the only subjects you speak about, and start detaching to figure out what you need to help you and your child.

The only plus that I can see for you living with the MIL is that you'll assumedly, have some help with your 3-year old, especially post-op. But I would be rather leery about leaving your WH alone in your house when he's shown you that he is on the prowl for some Magical VJJ to make him feel young and OhSo special.

Bigger posted 4/27/2014 11:45 AM

Have you asked your WH what he wants?
It sounds as if the affair is out in the open. Does he see this as an inappropriate relationship or is she “just a friend”? Does he realize that he risks losing you?
Has he offered to do any work to save the relationship?

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/27/2014 13:39 PM

Never again - I'm certainly not looking at staying with my inlaws to create sides. I was just thinking about the emotional support, but I take your view that it could be seen as sides, and I have to admit that's putting me off.
Sian -I take your point about leaving in the house. No, I don't bloody trust him.....funny that!
However my gut instinct is that he will refuse to leave....which leaves me having to be ready to do 180 in the same house. NOT looking forward to that.

Bigger - yes it's out in the open as much as I and his parents know about it. His response??? Ugh. Where to start. Last may I caught him in the early stages of an EA. H did all the right things.
The response this time is totally different. H admitted, but I've seen no regret, never mind remorse. That's the first time I've admitted that to anyone. This time I think he's well and truly in the fog.
I've sent first messages out to local MC and IC, but being the weekend I'm in limbo. I figure agreeing to MC could hold off 180, but only so long as I get NC and full access to his phone and iPad.

Daddo posted 4/27/2014 14:24 PM

first, I'm so sorry you are going through this. It is terrible and devastating. I'm glad you found your way to this community - you will find a lot of help here.

A few thoughts:

1. I think it would be better for your child if you both stay in the house. He needs stability.

2. The 180 doesn't require you to move apart. It does require you to refuse to treat him like a lover or a friend. You need to show him and yourself how strong and calm and independent you are. You need to remind both of you of who you are - under or before all this crap. You need to be the strong, wonderful woman he wooed and pursued. That is very hard when you feel broken and stressed and destroyed - but it will help both of you get perspective.

3. I would reach out to the OW - and let her know that she is shattering the life of a precious 3 yo child of of a woman who never did her any wrong. Remind her that a relationship build on lies and hurt won't last.

4. If the OW is in a relationship, her BS needs to, deserves to know.

5. If you don't know how to contact the OW OBS, a bit of investigation is in order.

6. Above all, try to contain your anger and pain around your WS. It does no good for every interaction with him to be fraught with anger and emotion. Cool and calm is the order of the day.

I know you are in pain, but it will get better. Even when he starts to come out of the fog, your marriage will suck for a long time - there is too much pain and anger for it to be otherwise. But given time and strength, marriages can survive, love can return.

Both of you need to set expectations that the next 2 years are not going to be much fun - but it can get better. Don't let him give up too easily - let him know there is light and the end of the metaphor.

Good luck.


Avoid the temptation of a revenge affair - but start working out and going out with friends - get out of your shell and your grief and give yourself a chance to breath. The working out is very important - use your anxiety as a catalyst.

[This message edited by Daddo at 2:27 PM, April 27th (Sunday)]

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/28/2014 01:47 AM

Daddo -
I would love to contact to OW, but she is in another country. I'll have to admit, I was too hurt and angry to copy her details down off my WS phone when I saw the messages. I've regretted it ever since.

It's highly unlikely that I'll get the info from WS, even if he does give me full access, I'm sure she will be wiped prior.

I'm requesting call records. I've checked FB and other obvious sources, so that's all I've got left.

Thanks to everyone so far their advice. I'm hoping to hear back from IC and MC today. I'll see what his response to that is tonight.....

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/28/2014 13:34 PM

Why is IC and MC so expensive???

yearsofpain25 posted 4/28/2014 13:39 PM

Hey CantSee, I know the NHS can be difficult to deal with, but can they help with the IC side of it at all? Or do you still have to pay for that with the NHS too?

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/28/2014 13:53 PM

The NHS will only offer free counselling if one partner is seriously depressed.
For the regular Joe Bloggs, we have to pay private.

I know MC and IC are important, but when a family are already on a low budget, I'm left wondering what else is there to give up every month?!?!

CantSeeInTheDark posted 4/29/2014 14:45 PM

Finally found someone to do both IC and MC.
I'm defiantly doing IC....I'm still here waiting if WH will come to MC.

I thought I'd kept it together well around my three year old, but now he's in tears whenever I walk out the room and I'm having to rapid return him at bed time.

This sucks.

crazynot posted 5/2/2014 00:08 AM

I can't imagine how much worse it must be to be looking after a small child while dealing with this special kind of hell... and massively sympathise regarding the cost of counselling. Also, there are good ones and bad ones. Mine had a PhD in psychology and taught other therapists - and she absolutely turned my life around. I went on seeing her even though we had no money to speak of. I wonder, do you have a good friend in real life who you could turn to? When I JFO, I was absolutely determined that no-one would know... for about three weeks, until I realised that everyone in the village had known for months. I told my best friend everything and for the next 2 years she was my absolute rock.

betrayedpregnant posted 5/2/2014 21:55 PM

The grass is always greener on the other side because it's fertilized with bulls--- : ) I haven't tried the 180, but my understanding of it is that it's not supposed to help win back your spouse, but help you heal from this difficult ordeal by making your self - not him- be the focus of your life. i know how confused, mad, & sad you feel and i'm wishing you the best. I'd also like to hear your progress if you end up doing it.

CantSeeInTheDark posted 5/3/2014 02:39 AM

Thanks everyone for your advice.

I do appreciate that the 180 is for me, not him.

I've started a new thread, the denial if wearing off, as I felt I needed to share my full story. I'd been quite reserved when I said what was happening. I think perhaps I was still at the stage of nit wanting to hear it myself when I started this post.

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