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the 180 "program"?

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needfriendshere posted 5/12/2014 11:35 AM

Hello again,
So today I am determined to become pro-active in making my marriage work. I am finding a good MC, since my H has agreed to go to counseling with me. He is also in IC, as of Saturday. Yay! I am looking into retreats for us to attend and received some great advice.

But I can't find anything on the "180" that so many people have told me about. I looked in The Healing Library and some of the other links on the side-bar and it wasn't there. I really, once again, appreciate your help. Thanks!!

MovingUpward posted 5/12/2014 11:39 AM

In the healing library you will find the 180 under the BSFAQ link at the top. It is question/answer 11

ButterflyGirl posted 5/12/2014 11:48 AM

I would add that I don't suggest doing everything it lists in the 180 if your WH is being remorseful. I think you would do this more if he were un-remoreseful.

Like asking about his whereabouts? You absolutely want to do that if you are in R, meaning he is giving you FULL transparency of his whereabouts, cell phone, GPS, email, etc.

It says in the 180 to not ask his whereabouts, and that is what you would do if he is NOT being remorseful and you don't think he is dedicated. I definitely recommend learning the 180 so you can implement it as soon as you need to protect yourself. Keep your eyes wide open, and don't let him gaslight you or manipulate you. If he starts being disrespectful or blaming you at all for his affair, you 180.

LostSamurai posted 5/12/2014 12:24 PM

I don't think she should ask for his whereabouts period.

IMHO - if they don't volunteer that stuff then they are not working to build trust. They have to demonstrate the work/action and if you have to say something, I consider that red flag. If they ask you, that's different.

DepressedDaddy posted 5/12/2014 12:44 PM

I do agree with BG as well. When I was going through R with my STBXWW, some of the things were not very appropriate to recovery. However, the second that he becomes unremorseful and shows no regret, then it is strict 180 with no exceptions.

Hopefully, your WH will offer up a lot of this information without you having to request it. Hopefully, you guys can work at it and become one of the lucky few that are able to fully R.

needfriendshere posted 5/13/2014 08:45 AM

MovingUpward, thanks for telling me how to access the 180. There are a lot of good points in there - some of which I have been doing; others that made me laugh because I am doing exactly what I am being told not to do. I didn't realize I was following my H around the house until I read that I shouldn't be doing it. What makes us want to do that? When he comes home from work, I follow him upstairs and keep him company while he changes. I never did that before. Why am I doing it now??

Both LastSamarai and DepressedDaddy said not to ask about his whereabouts. That's a tough one. Would that extend to his cell phone conversations? That is how his A started. For a few months, WH and OW wrote each other enticing texts so that when they finally were able to get together (she lives in another state that he travels to on business), their physical connection was electric. He texted her so often, that on my last birthday, all through dinner at a romantic restaurant, he was arguing with her about why he wasn't breaking up with me that night as she had demanded he do. Yup, he confessed that to me after their affair was discovered. On that fateful birthday, he kept telling me he was trying to solve a serious work issue. Now, whenever he clicks a conversation off when I glance over at his phone, I ask (nicely) who he was talking to. And he shows me. Every time. And it is always harmless - always a guy friend. Should I stop doing this? Please advise....

DepressedDaddy posted 5/13/2014 09:06 AM

Hi needfriendshere

Both LastSamarai and DepressedDaddy said not to ask about his whereabouts

I would say that if he is remorseful and is committing to you, he should offer up anything you ask from him. If you feel you need to see his text records, conversation history, emails and anything else you need to make yourself feel better, go for it. There will come a time, where you will start to ween yourself off of those things, but if you feel your heart is needing that right now, go for it. However, differentiate that need for it now, with pain/punishment fishing. Don't go looking for things just to hurt yourself.

Now, whenever he clicks a conversation off when I glance over at his phone, I ask (nicely) who he was talking to.

This stuff started to drive me crazy. Every time my STBXWW would look at her phone, or a text alert came through, or she was calling someone, I became my own private investigator. I would also ask 1,001 questions.

With all this being said, if your WH is not remorseful, shows dishonesty, or is still interested in keeping up contact with the OW, then you need to do strict 180. You can be his "probation officer" for only so long...eventually he has to make the choice of following the rules of probation, or he violates probation. Either way, the choice is up to him no matter how much you intervene. It is a shitty feeling, I understand, but you can only do so much.

needfriendshere posted 5/13/2014 10:01 AM

Gosh, thanks DepressedDaddy for making me feel like I am not losing my mind! That cell phone of his is probably the last point of pain and potential point of contention between us. He has given me his FB and e-mail passwords, but his cell phone is an extension of his body, so it didn't even make sense to ask for access to it. I am not kidding. It is his alarm in the morning, so he keeps it above his head on our backboard when he sleeps, and he wears it the rest of the day. I could feel through your words that your W's cell phone has a similar effect on you. I sometimes really hate the cyber world we live in. So-o much potential for abuse...

ButterflyGirl posted 5/13/2014 10:53 AM

As a warning, that cell phone is serious weapon used in affairs.

After getting access to his GPS, calls, texts, etc., I learned he took the affair underground by downloading a scrabble app and using the chat feature on there to communicate with her.. Of course that doesn't show up on the phone bill..

Seriously girl, LEARN THE 180. If you feel he's holding back, being defensive, being mean, not being honest, trying to manipulate you or make you feel crazy, DO THE 180, meaning turn yourself directly in the opposite direction of him and walk away.

He broke the marriage you had. It's gone, buh-bye. Now he has to work his ass off to get a new one with you if he wants it.

He's a stranger now, and start asking yourself if you would even date a guy like him.. You guys can't go back. You have to start over.

And please, be willing to 180 and walk away when you need to. Don't hold onto him being afraid to let go. All that tells him is that he is ALLOWED to disrespect you and you will STILL continue trying to work on the marriage. And F that girl! There's a new you in town, and he has to work his ass off if he wants you.

hopingforhappy posted 5/13/2014 11:34 AM

You will not want to ask about his whereabouts and his cell phone forever, but in the beginning, it really helps to know that he is willing to be transparent. So ask. After a while, you will stop, because he will have rebuilt the trust to a point where you don't feel the need to ask. But it takes time.

hopelesslydvoted posted 5/13/2014 11:59 AM

I started doing the 180, for my own benefit. Gut is one thing you should always listen too. But, paranoia gets a hold of us and changes us into something we never were.

My WH who deceived me while I thought we were in R; who refused transparency and lied pathologically about the silliest things, (I told him it was time for D) now can't help but tell me where he was or what he was doing. And, that is because it's hitting him that I don't care enough to ask.

It almost sounds like a game when you first hear it, and I didn't want to play games. But, when you start doing 180 it actually takes any kind of game WS is playing away from them. And, now they are left with the truth of what happened. Don't get me wrong, he still tries to play it, but it's only been a week of 180 and the change in me is I'm stronger, and he's appearing to have a glimpse of reality.

I realize now 180 is to bring you back to you.

needfriendshere posted 5/13/2014 15:32 PM

Hopelesslydevoted, I see the 180 that way too. It is a way to redefine "me" and to rebuild a part of me that is permanently broken. We are doing pretty well in trying to R, but I still feel that some of the 180 steps are needed so H will think twice about doing anything remotely close to what he did again.

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