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clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Default  Posted: 8:21 PM, May 17th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi,
I have never been part of a forum before and am unsure how this works. I am struggling with my husband's infidelity for nearly a month now, since Easter to be exact. I have had a nagging feeling that something wasn't right for months now. He suddenly became very attached to his phone and laptop. Sometimes ignoring the fact that I was sitting right next to him. We have been married for 13 years but have dated on and off since I was 17. I am now 44. We have a beautiful 4 yr. old daughter. I walked into the kitchen on Saturday 4/19 and he was texting (not unsual) but there was a certain guilt about his actions that perked my suspicion. I checked cell phone bills online and I found countless text messages sent to a number in California. Then I moved on to phone calls. I counted over 17 hours in about 5 months. Not wanting to believe this was possible I checked his phone the next morning while he was in the shower. And long and behold I found the one text message from OW that said "[I wanna suck your c...]Unable to control my anger I went into the bathroom, handed him his phone and told him I couldn't believe he was capable of this. He denied it saying it was just friendly banter and that the woman was a lesbian and that she liked me more than him. Imagine that. I was devastated. I couldn't eat, sleep and still can't really. We talked that evening when he came home from work and he told me he was not solely to blame for this. He felt invisible in his own home. I wasn't paying enough attention to him and that he'd felt this way for years. He said he'd tried letting me know by telling me all he wanted was to be loved. I asked to see his phone a few days later and he gave it to me. He'd already deleted the most incriminating ones. I asked for his fb account and again he gave it freely. She was his friend on fb, but he'd deleted her. But something told me that there was much more to this so I did some more digging around. well, I found a separate e-mail account and was able to get some of those messages. he'd told me that this was all role playing as he was trying to find his way back to me, back to the marriage we'd had. well, the messages I retrieved told a more intimate connection. they shared their romantic histories, their likes/dislikes both physical and emotional. there were very explicit messages between the two that would make anyone blush. they even exchanged [I love you]at the end of their emails. he went as far as to give her his work schedule and work phone number. he insists that he doesn't love her nor could he ever since they have never met. this was all done so that he would find a way to communicate with me to get me back. in the emails I saw there were plans for her to come to NJ in January. he insists that it never happened. though there were plans made they never came to fruition. And the reason being that he and I made a breakthrough in our relationship which gave him hope and lifted his spirits into getting back to us. I called OW and she was apologetic, claiming that their emails had gone too far but that they in fact had never met. she's a struggling single mom in California and she didn't have the money or time to come here. I asked her to forward me the emails so I could see. She said she'd deleted them. how convenient. neither one of them can produce a piece of proof that could exonerate them he definitely had an EA with OW and I don't know how to handle this. WS is apologetic to no end, he says he only meant I Love you as a friend because he feels she truly helped him find a way to communicating with me. He claims that once he and I had a breakthrough in our communication those explicit emails stopped. they only spoke on the phone as friends, advise on work, home etc. he is willing to do anything to save our M. We went to a counseling session last week and we're going again next week. I need some advise on this. is he believable? do we have a chance? please help


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
DepressedDaddy
♂ 41521
Member # 41521
Default  Posted: 9:28 PM, May 17th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi clueless,

Sorry that you have found yourself here. We are the best club in the world that no one ever wants to willingly join.

First, Take care of yourself.

Second, save everything you have. Back it up and/or make copies. If you ever go down the D route, theis proof with be extremely beneficial.

Third, Don't believe anything that he says. If he is being truthful (or wants to change), he will show you through actions. You know something was there. That's all that matters,

Fourth, Take care of yourself.

Fifth, come here as much as you need to.

We're here for you.


Since D I have become DDaddy 2.0 - or better known as DevotedDaddy

“Optimism is a strategy for making a better future. Because unless you believe that the future can be better, you are unlikely to step up and take responsibility for making it so."


Posts: 897 | Registered: Dec 2013
kansas1968
♀ 32214
Member # 32214
Default  Posted: 9:46 PM, May 17th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Of course you have a chance, but no, he is not believable. He is trying to protect you and himself. There is much more to the story than he is admitting to.
Do not believe for a minute that any of this is your fault. He could have spent all of that time he was dirty texting and emailing to talk to you and work on his marriage.

You may have to get really tough with him for him to really tell you the truth. Also, IC and MC would be a very good idea. Lots of books out there that can help you both. Hugs and sorry you are going through all of this pain, but many of us have and have managed to make it.


Me - BS
Him - FWS
DD - December 14, 2010
Married 43 years 1/14/2011
Affair lasted 7+ years
Affair had been over for 2 years before I found out. OW sent me a letter.

Posts: 1320 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Kansas
Allornothing
♀ 42354
Member # 42354
Default  Posted: 9:48 PM, May 17th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((hugs)))

clueless, welcome to the best forum that nobody ever wanted to join. There are lots of us here who have been where you are now.

The first thing I want you to know is that no matter what, you will be okay.

Please try to eat small amounts and drink plenty of water; you need to look after yourself in the coming months.

Read the healing library in the yellow box in the top left hand corner, there's a wealth of help and information in there.

It's very early days for you, and if you read posts from some of the more experienced here, you'll see that what your husband is telling you has come from what we call the "Wayward Handbook". Telling you that he felt invisible in his own home, you weren't paying enough attention, etc. Most of us heard this stuff in the beginning.

But honey, the truth is, HE is responsible for what he did, not you. His affair is not even 1% your fault. Yes, you had an obligation to own 50% of your marriage, and to fix any problems that existed. He was obliged to tell you how he was feeling, and give you the opportunity to work with him to the satisfaction of you both.

Instead, he chose, yes CHOSE, to talk to somebody who had no business knowing anything about you, or your marriage. He chose to communicate with somebody other than you. The time he spent talking to her was time that he could have spent talking to you, his WIFE. Please do not accept responsibility for his choices.

Your marriage can be saved, but only if both of you are in for the long haul, and are prepared to work. And it's hard work. It takes time (a word that many of us dislike).

Individual counselling for both of you will help. He can figure out his issues, and what led him to this behaviour, and you can let out all of the emotions, thoughts, and crazy-making stuff that enters your head. Marriage counselling will also help a bit later on; you can work on communication and conflict resolution, and how to deal with issues that come up in most marriages from time to time. Keep posting here, get it all out, it really helps, we understand, and you will come to realise that what is happening to you has happened to us, in one way or another. You're not alone in this.

You will receive lots of advice here; some will work for you, some won't. Take what you need and leave the rest.

Sending strength honey, we've got your back


Me- BS 43
Him- FWH 43
Married 19 years, Together 26
Kids- 23,21,15,14
D Day- 7 Sept 2013
OW- Irrelevant

Posts: 255 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Australia
Strangefacade
♀ 43394
Member # 43394
Default  Posted: 10:05 PM, May 17th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm so sorry you are going through this.
Let me gently tell you that he is a liar. No man says I love you and means it as a friend.
Even if it wasn't physical, are you comfortable with the fact your husband was best friends with someone else? That he poured his heart out to someone else?
I'm going through something similar. A lot of us are. Trust nothing he says, watch his actions.
Of course he's going to say he felt the marriage was suffering. That he was a stranger in his home. That he thought he was going to lose you.
Read the library, the stories there and the pattern of affairs was so helpful to me.


I'm strong again. That's the only reason you choose me.

Posts: 36 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Mi
SadInNC
♀ 42170
Member # 42170
Default  Posted: 1:01 AM, May 18th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi clueless1. Ugh, so sorry that you are dealing with this heartache. I would be concerned about the fact that she has his work number. They could still be communicating while he is at work.

None of this is your fault, so don't even think that. Trust your gut, it will be your best friend and so will this site.

Stay strong!


BS/Me WH/Him

"Your value doesn't decrease based on someone's inability to see your worth." -Unknown Wise Person


Posts: 345 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: North Carolina, United States
clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Helpless  Posted: 7:21 AM, May 18th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all for your words of wisdom and support. It helps to know I am not alone. I'm still on this emotional rollercoaster that I can't control sometimes. We had another long conversation last night. He insists he hasn't contacted her and she hasn't contacted him. I wanna believe so badly, but I can't allow myself to be deceived once again. Again he expressed remorse and added that he will do whatever it takes to fix this for me and for us. That's all I really have to say for now. Again, thank you all.


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
CantSeeInTheDark
♀ 43231
Member # 43231
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, May 18th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((Clueless1))
I'm sorry you had to find yourself on this site. I'm still a relative newbie here too, but the guys and girls on this forum have been great. They will tell you what they think is the truth, based on the years of experience on this site. If it feels hard to listen to it, come back and read it again the next day.

There were a couple if things that jumped out at me, things that happened to me...

He suddenly became very attached to his phone and laptop. Sometimes ignoring the fact that I was sitting right next to him.

Huge warning sign... You were so right to trust your gut.

We talked that evening when he came home from work and he told me he was not solely to blame for this. He felt invisible in his own home.

This is not your fault. If your marriage wasnt quite right, then yes, you play 50% role in that. But NEVER is a betrayed spouse to blame for another adult choosing to go outside of their marriage. Him trying to blame shift is him trying to cover his guilt because he a KNOWS it is wrong.

But something told me that there was much more to this so I did some more digging around. well, I found a separate e-mail account

Be prepared for other things to be hidden too. She has his work number and there are plenty of apps that let people talk without leaving records -that sucks.

He has been caught lying, and liars often keep on lying. Watch his actions, more than you listen to his words. His actions and behaviour will tell you if he is truly committed to making your marriage work.

[This message edited by CantSeeInTheDark at 7:55 AM, May 18th (Sunday)]


Me 35y
Him 48y
1 Awesome son 3y

DD1 May 2013
DD2 April 2014

Currently wondering how someone who vowed so much, can care so little


Posts: 110 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Gloucestershire
clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Default  Posted: 8:32 AM, May 18th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for your advise. does anybody know how to find out if such an infidelity app is installed in someone's phone?


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
CantSeeInTheDark
♀ 43231
Member # 43231
Default  Posted: 8:56 AM, May 18th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've heard rumors of one that will hide phone numbers. But any chat app, like what's app or google hangouts, for instance, will pernamently delete a message and not show up on phone records as it uses internet data. Sorry for not being much help. I really feel for you in this position, I've been there


Me 35y
Him 48y
1 Awesome son 3y

DD1 May 2013
DD2 April 2014

Currently wondering how someone who vowed so much, can care so little


Posts: 110 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Gloucestershire
NeverAgain2013
♀ 38121
Member # 38121
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think what bothers me the most is the UTTER swill he's spewing to you - that he did this whole thing JUST to be able to "open the lines of communication with you again and get you back."

OMG what a complete crock of bullshit. Talking dirty to some lonely, pitiful woman out in California and her claim that that she wants to 'suck his c*ck' is supposed to help get you back...how??

This guy can't even lie well.

...in the emails I saw there were plans for her to come to NJ in January. he insists that it never happened. though there were plans made they never came to fruition. And the reason being that he and I made a breakthrough in our relationship which gave him hope and lifted his spirits into getting back to us.

I wouldn't believe THIS crock of bull either. You can be sure he already got to her and told her exactly what to tell you LONG before you ever contacted her. So don't expect any 'truth' from her - he's already gotten to her. Would he really have you believe that some 'breakthrough' in your marriage kept her from coming to NJ in January but that same 'breakthrough' wasn't strong enough to curb their sex talk and the I love you nonsense? That's another crock of bullshit.

Tell him to own his SHIT, clueless1. All he's done is LIE and paint himself this poor, hapless, deprived victim that only wanted his wife and was driven to some vamp in California.

Jeez, tell him to at least be a little creative in his lying.

Don't be too quick to forgive this storyteller. For every rat you DO see, there are 50 you DON'T.


.

[This message edited by NeverAgain2013 at 8:02 AM, May 19th (Monday)]


Be careful - that 'knight in shining armor' may very well be nothing more than an assclown wrapped in tin foil.
ME: 50+ years old and cute as a button :-)
Ex-WBF: Just a lying, cheating, gravy-sucking pig - and I left him in 2012.

Posts: 1951 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: USA
Lalagirl
♀ 14576
Member # 14576
Default  Posted: 8:31 AM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((clueless))))

He denied it saying it was just friendly banter and that the woman was a lesbian and that she liked me more than him.

I've heard many lies that BS have said their WSs have told - that one tops the list...

We talked that evening when he came home from work and he told me he was not solely to blame for this. He felt invisible in his own home. I wasn't paying enough attention to him and that he'd felt this way for years. He said he'd tried letting me know by telling me all he wanted was to be loved.

This is more of the line that comes straight from the cheater's handbook.

As the other posters said, his cheating is NOT your fault...not one iota!

Read the 180 (in the Healing Library upper left-hand corner of the screen) - implement it (for YOU...not to "win" him back), get tested for STDs (cheaters lie, you cannot count on the fact that it was not physical), and talk to an attorney. This does not mean you have to D, but you need to know your rights.

And get the book "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass - both of you should read it.

Gently - now that he has been caught, there are ways for an A to to underground (secret FB, e-mail account, pre-paid cell) - stay in PI mode.

He claims that once he and I had a breakthrough in our communication those explicit emails stopped. they only spoke on the phone as friends, advise on work, home etc. he is willing to do anything to save our M.

Gently again...ending the A on HIS terms because of a "breakthrough"? Bullshit. He got caught. One thing that has to happen now is complete NC with OW - no more friendship with her...period.

Hugs...

[This message edited by Lalagirl at 8:32 AM, May 19th (Monday)]


Me - 49; FWH - 51
Married 31 years 9/2/14
2 grown daughters-30 & 27
5yo GS,2yo GD & 3 mo. GD (DD30) and 2.5 yo GD(DD27). D-day #1 - 1/06; D-day #2 - 3/07
Reconciled! Construction Complete.

Posts: 5173 | Registered: May 2007
clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Sad  Posted: 4:42 PM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you lalagirl and neveragain2013. Your advice is extremely helpful. We are going for our second visit of counseling tonight and am hoping that we'll make a break through. He continues to swear there was no physical contact and he'll profess it til he dies. He has admitted to being wrong in his actions and going down that road was totally his fault, not mine. I guess that's a start. My stomach is still in knots but I was able to sleep a little better last night (separate beds). I had a really good cry I think and felt better this morning after I "buried" my husband, figuratively. I wrote a goodbye letter to the man I thought he was and I buried it. That man does not exist. This morning I told him I was a widow in mourning having just lost the love of my life. I have to find myself and don't know where or how to get there, but I know I will. I also took off my wedding band. The man with whom I had a bond no longer exists. This will be perhaps the toughest battle of my life. I love him, but I can't allow him to mistreat me. Thank you all for your words of wisdom and support. I'll update you soon.


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
1Faith
♀ 38975
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 5:31 PM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dear Clueless

(((hugs)))

he told me he was not solely to blame for this. He felt invisible in his own home. I wasn't paying enough attention to him and that he'd felt this way for years

YES, he is. YES, he is. His choice to reach beyond his marriage and his choice alone. You own zero responsibility for the online affair with the OW. ZERO. He could have spoken with you directly about his feelings, asked for counseling, something. Yet, he chose the easy way out to find validation elsewhere. HIS choice. He is shifting the blame to justify his behavior and make you question yourself.

he'd told me that this was all role playing as he was trying to find his way back to me, back to the marriage we'd had

That is quite the detour to you through another woman. Sad excuse for his actions. Not buying for one minute. Simple calculus - the quickest way from point A to point B is a straight line. Not a detour through fantasy land.

this was all done so that he would find a way to communicate with me to get me back

Did you notice an increase in communication between you two when he was spending his time and energy on this OW? Something tells me you did not. A start could of been a dinner and a movie with him conveying his feelings and wanting to work on building a better marriage.

is he believable? do we have a chance?

Believable? No. He is not. He is projecting (look this up in the Healing Library) and blame shifting (look this up as well). Sorry doesn't quite cover his actions. He has broken trust and is not to be believed at this time.

Do you have a chance? Yes. I truly believe two people can make anything work but they both have to want it and they both have to be rowing in the same direction.

Your WH's behavior (actions) will convey when and if you can start to trust him again. Actions speak louder than words. He needs to own his behavior (and not blame you in ANYWAY) and do whatever it is YOU need to start to feel safe again. If he wants forgiveness he has to earn it and not bully you into giving it.

Stay strong, be honest and know that YOU matter. You have done nothing wrong. Regardless of the challenges in your marriage, there is never an excuse to cheat. EVER. Don't let him put this on you.

We are here for you. Keep posting and take one day at a time.

Good luck

[This message edited by 1Faith at 5:41 PM, May 19th (Monday)]


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1333 | Registered: Apr 2013
Edith
♀ 38337
Member # 38337
Default  Posted: 5:40 PM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Clueless,

I'm so sorry for your pain.

is he believable?

Absolutely not!! He is not being honest with you. The fact that neither of them is able to prove that they did not meet is very concerning to me. It might be worthwhile to seek a forensic analysis of his computer and/or phone. That likely would yield a trasure trove of information. And if he objects, then your answer is that those with nothing to hide will hide nothing.

And if he had recently scaled back the communication to decent talk, why was he being so secretive with his phone and emails? It does not add up, I'm so sorry.

My H agreed to MC immediately upon D-day, which in retrospect turned out to be a bad idea. He was lying to the therapist, as he was still in contact with the slob. It was a waste of time and money, not to mention it brought about more pain for me. I would cancel all appointments until you are satisfied that you have the whole story and he has gone no contact.

I would also read up on the 180 and put it to practice like yesterday.

Very good idea about the burial...it is really true. I would have to say most of us here would never have believed our spouses would betray us in such a horrific way, and they are not who we thought they were.

Hugs, my dear. Take good care of yourself and your precious child.

E.


Lies are manipulations. Always.

Posts: 423 | Registered: Feb 2013
1Faith
♀ 38975
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 7:02 PM, May 19th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Please read this link

http://www.infidelityhelpgroup.com/2014/01/31/rewriting-history/

I hope it shines light on his bs projections and excuses.

Good luck. (((hugs)))


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1333 | Registered: Apr 2013
clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Default  Posted: 5:26 PM, May 23rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to take a minute to post today. We went to our counseling session and he admitted that he went to far down the wrong road and that it was not my fault. WS said there were other avenues and he chose the wrong one. He expressed regret for hurting me and he wishes he'd made a different choice. He sent OW a NC email. I wish all these steps made me feel more secure, but the fact is that they don't. I'm still a rollercoaster of emotions. I'm better some days, worse on others. There is no telling what will trigger my emotions. Today he sent me a text and used the word "hugs" which I know is a word she used to tell him in her emails and texts. It sent me for a loop and I called him at work and told him so. I really don't want to hold any of my emotions in. I don't know if I'm right or wrong but that's just how I feel right now.


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
Allornothing
♀ 42354
Member # 42354
Default  Posted: 6:34 PM, May 23rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((clueless)))

You are allowed to express whatever it is you are feeling. Keeping all of your emotions bottled up is not at all healthy; it's like drinking poison and expecting somebody else to die, if you know what I mean. It only increases your hurt, and you're already hurting enough.

Your WH needs to hear what this has done to you, so you are absolutely doing the right thing.

I'm so glad that your WH has recognised that his A was in no way your fault, that's a good start. Acknowledging that he had other avenues and chose the wrong one is also good, but he has to figure out WHY he chose the path he did. He needs to understand himself enough to know what triggered this behaviour; what made him tell himself that what he was doing was okay, and that he wasn't harming your marriage. He needs to totally "get it" so that he remains on the path of never allowing anything like this to happen again.

Keep going clueless, you've got this.


Me- BS 43
Him- FWH 43
Married 19 years, Together 26
Kids- 23,21,15,14
D Day- 7 Sept 2013
OW- Irrelevant

Posts: 255 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Australia
clueless1
♀ 43460
Member # 43460
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So it's been about 6 weeks since D-Day for me and though I think I'm doing better somehow I feel this immense sadness, like the kind that comes from your soul. We have been to 3 counseling sessions so far and I think going is a good decision, at least for me. So far WH has been doing everything he said he would. He deactivated his fb account, he gives me access to his phone and he answers my questions whenever they come up. Why do I still feel like the rug is gonna get pulled from under me at any time? I am sad and even on those days when I think I am progressing, these emotions of this affair overwhelm me. How could he spend so much time pouring his heart out to someone and expect me to believe there is nothing more? I am so disillusioned right now. I feel like such a fool. I trusted him and he failed me.


sometimes love doesn't conquer all

Posts: 27 | Registered: May 2014 | From: NJ
Topic Posts: 19

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