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My Father's Day Conversation

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Dadtryingtocope posted 6/16/2014 11:51 AM

So some background for those who don't remember this:

Aside from my basic data in my profile information concerning the A. My EWW and her now husband were visited by the police in Jan 2013 on a domestic call. Although he looked like he took most of the damage, he was arrested and taken to jail. Posted bail, fought the charge and got off with a lesser charge. She claimed it was a misunerstanding and blown out of proportion. She even said "it was a domestic call so the police have to arrest someone". I can't even imagine that is true. He at least had to be a mouthy jerk to the cops which probably at least happened.

Also in 2013 late winter, her now husband (and AP) took my son's Xbox he had received for Christmas at her house and smashed it on the floor after my son had been warned about throwing tantrums and putting holes in her walls. He is 12 and an Aspergers kid. So he as tantrums sometimes and they can be a challenge. Apparently after having a number of holes in her walls she finally decided that she would enact and eye-for-an-eye justice system and have her AP carry it out.

Fast forward to yesterday. My son is not allowed video games at her house. She thinks they are too addictive and she says (key word she says) she can control him better when not battling him over video games. When he is with me, he never wants to go to his mom's house. He is bored, he hates it, etc. I know a lot of this comes from being able to play at my house but not at hers. While I recognize the issues of trying to get him to put down the games, I won't outright penalize him and not allow it. I try to minimize it when I can and manage it. Plus she sends him to her parents house on many of her days and when he is there he get to play anyways so not sure how she thinks this is in line with her position on his video game time.

So we were talking about this last night. Mom is mean and she won't let me. She'll never let me have them again. So on and so on. His is visibly upset and I have to de-escalate him in the restaurant. What does Mom do I ask? She yells, she is mean, she won't listen to me. Some of this he has brought on himself no doubt. But note that she has a short temper and so does her AP (now husband).

So I continue to ask questions. Does the AP get involved? Yes he yells too. I look at my nine year old (because she will serve as validation for him if anything is true). She agrees, he yells at them. Usually at him. He is mean they say. (Blood starting to get a little warm).

My 12 year old then says that is he has a bad tantrum that the AP will come over and grab him from under the arms to pull him up from the floor. He says that it sometimes it hurts him. He squeezes me hard he says. I look at my nine year old and she agrees that this does happen. So now you have put your hands on my kid (blood starting to boil). I realize that your mom may not want to try and deal with you physically in your state, but sending in the AP to do it will not help. These are my thoughts.

As we continue to talk about the AP, my 9 year old says. I am scared of him dad. (blood boiling but now my heart has sunk). So there it is. I now have 2 scared kids of the AP who I already know is a bad person.

So I ask the next question. Do Mom and AP fight? Yes. They argue in their bedroom. 12 year old says I don't think 9 year old was awake but one night I heard them arguing and a lot of banging around. 9 year old says I heard it too. Mom talked to me about it the next day. I don't prod for any details on that conversation. It doesn't matter at this point. 12 year old thinks he heard what sounded like a smack. But then is not sure. Take his stories with a grain of salt. Sometimes embelished. 9 year old can't confirm that. But a lot of banging around and arguing.

Conversation also includes conversations between mom and AP that AP says something along the lines of "You are always spending time with your kids" (overheard on phone call - why she had it on conference call who knows). My 12 year old says it's not that way. She spends most of her time with him not with us. It's the other way around not what he says it is. Ugh. Guess the grass isn't all that greener is it?

So I tell the kids. AP cannot touch you, if he tries to hurt you or your mom you need to call 911. Then try and call me. If you can't call me right away don't worry, I will find out very quickly and I will be there. Please don't try to do anything to the AP, call 911 first. They will help you.

This is how I spent my father's day dinner. With two kids pouring their hearts out to me. Scared about a man who has already changed their life with his actions and could damage them physically and mentally even more. I left there sick to my stomach. He has already in my mind crossed the line. He put his hands on my kid. He carries out discipline on my kids. I'm spitting venom as I even write this. I have heard rumors of him having spousal abuse issues with his previous wife. I don't have the proof but why would I not believe it at this point. If he is abusive to my ex, with their anger issues and the way they use alcohol it will get worse. With my sons Aspergers issues, he could also see more and more of the AP's anger directed at him. If I try and approach the EW she will either deny it and/or take it out on the kids for telling me. So I am in a really bad place right now. I have real concern for my kids and they have put their trust in me. I am limited in action legally and I can't speak to her.

I put a call into my attorney. At least I can discuss the legal paths available if any. I slept 3 hours maybe last night. I was afraid of what could happen with that guy with the events of 2013. Now I'm even more concerned. I certainly don't want their mother hurt. I never want my kids to have to see that happen. I can't even imagine my feelings/reactions if one of my kids ends up in the crosshairs. In many ways this feels worse to me then the actual A.

Dreamboat posted 6/16/2014 12:44 PM


This is completely heart wrenching.

Do the kids have their own cell phone? I know they are young, some will say too young for a cell phone. But I consider it a life line. I got my DD a cell phone at 9 because of the antics my X and ILs would pull during visitation. You can get them a cheap one that only allows call or calls and texting -- no data and not internet (and thus no games). They can keep it in their bag when they are visiting their mother. It might make them feel safer.

[This message edited by Dreamboat at 12:47 PM, June 16th (Monday)]

StillLivin posted 6/16/2014 12:45 PM!/

Dad, you really need to report this ASAP. It needs to at least be documented.
I'm so sorry for your kids and your stupid EWW makes my blood boil.
(((Dadtryingtocope and kids)))

SBB posted 6/16/2014 12:54 PM

And that my friend is what true heartbreak feels like. I can taste bile in my mouth just reading this.

Who the fuck lets their new partner rough their own children up? This guy is a fucking parasite - picking on a 12 year old kid just so he can feel superior.

I honestly don't know what I would do if anyone touched my kids. I really don't.

Talk to your L, perhaps get the kids school and therapists/counsellors involved too so that you have a wider net of support and advocacy for your kids. If there's a child abuse support group get them involved - they would be well versed in what your options might be.

Document, document, document. Unfortunately something bad has to happen before the legal system intervenes.

Abusers thrive in darkness. Shine a light on that fucker.

Deep breaths and maybe some get some punching bag action to release the rage. I too would want to stomp him until he is just a stain on the floor but that isn't going to help your kids. You'd be in jail and XWW would just shack up with her next abuser.

I'm so sorry DTTC. I can feel your heart shattering and your rage building like a tsunami.

I am horrified and want to rip his and her faces off all at the same time. Anyone with even a passing knowledge of Aspergers knows how damaging and toxic this behaviour is for your boy.

Keep your focus razor sharp - especially now.

I'm so angry for you and your sweet kids I could spit.

Dadtryingtocope posted 6/16/2014 12:56 PM

Thanks StillLivin,

I'm definitely on a slippery slope with this one. I can't sit back and see what happens. If I make the call, she'll know it's me. She'll know the kids told me the stories and that could be a problem. But I can't sit back and wait for something to happen. Waiting on my attorney to call as well. I have the kids tonight so they are safe.

StillLivin posted 6/16/2014 13:06 PM

I totally understand. But it shouldn't matter that you made the call.
Might make her think twice if she knows their father is willing to put both of them in jail for hurting his kids.
If you truly don't feel it is enough to report, then practice with your kids calling 911.
Both children can put the phone up to the wall if the idjats are bashing each other in and the police record 911 calls.
Also, with Asperger's, your son should be seeing a counselor. Definitely bring this up with his counselor and with the school.
Whatever your attorney advises, go with it.

southsidecali posted 6/16/2014 13:27 PM

definitely have them call 911 whenever they start, if they have a domestic call on record it will help with papertrail of the environment and threat to your kids safety their relationship poses.

Gemini71 posted 6/16/2014 15:58 PM

Holy crap I feel for you. My oldest is boarderline with the Aspergers, so I understand the meltdown/tantrum cycle. Yelling just makes it worse. Reacting emotionally just makes it worse.

Yes absolutely document everything, especially your 9 yo's verification that AP starts the physical part of the altercation. Your 14 yo is getting to the age when parents can't handle tantrums physically, and it sounds like your XWW and OP never bothered to learn how to do that. What's going to happen is that they are going to start calling the cops on your DS14 as "unmanagable." You do NOT want that to happen, especially with him putting holes in the walls.

So I tell the kids. AP cannot touch you, if he tries to hurt you or your mom you need to call 911. Then try and call me. If you can't call me right away don't worry, I will find out very quickly and I will be there. Please don't try to do anything to the AP, call 911 first. They will help you.

I think you instructed your kids perfectly. The only thing I would add is to get a medic-alert bracelet or pendant for your 14yo that lists his condition. That way if the police respond to a call and 14 is acting 'off', they will understand why.

My thoughts and prayers go out to you.

lieshurt posted 6/16/2014 16:09 PM

Who the fuck lets their new partner rough their own children up?

Unfortunately, stories like this are in the news all of the time.

newlysingle posted 6/16/2014 16:24 PM

I'm so sorry. This makes me physically I'll to read. I think talking with your lawyer might be a good start.

devistatedmom posted 6/16/2014 16:35 PM

If school is still in session where you are, go talk to the principal. Tell him the facts. Just the conversation you had with the kids. Ask him if the counselor on staff could talk to one/both, and see if they get the same story. Tell him you are trying to not be the one to call it in, as she will know if you do, and take it out on the kids. You would prefer first contact be the school calling, as they are mandated reporters. Takes that first report out of your hands.

Telling them to call 911 is good. If you didn't tell them they can do that when they hear them fighting and banging around at night, you should specify for them. They need to know they can call if they hear them and feel scared.

Hopefully your lawyer has something up his sleeve too.

Kajem posted 6/16/2014 20:33 PM

Please make a call to your local domestic violence shelter. They have so much information on dealing with these complicated situations. They understand about repercussions to the innocents to punish those not complying.

It may give you (your kids) another avenue for support.

I'm praying for you and your kids.


Dadtryingtocope posted 6/17/2014 09:57 AM

Thanks for all the advice. I have talked to my attorney. A number of options available. My first move is to put her on notice that I know. She will get an email with all of this information and a direct order that in no way should the kids be punished or even have a discussion concerning this and that they told me. She will be told that if I continue to hear these things I will take legal action. She will be advised that the kids should receive counseling at her cost. She should consider family counseling. My attorney will be copied on the email. The protection of my kids over this is priority one. I'm not sitting back and waiting for bad things to happen. She is on alert.

Dreamboat posted 6/17/2014 11:25 AM

Can you have the L send her a letter instead of you sending an email? I think that will have much more impact on her. It send a clear message that the L is already involved.

I recommend this because during the D my X would ignore requests from me to sign papers and send them back (he lived in another state) or he would lie to me and say he already did it. But when my L called him, he did not lie and immediately complied. He did not respect me enough to comply, but he feared my L enough to comply.

(((more hugs)))

ArkLaMiss posted 6/17/2014 11:54 AM

I agree with Dreamboat on this one. Have your attorney send it with a threat that DHS will be made aware of the situation if you hear anything else. Also let your lawyer know abt the domestic violence issues. He can throw that in, too. Your kids need a safe haven at BOTH homes. I'd insist on counseling, too.

[This message edited by ArkLaMiss at 11:55 AM, June 17th (Tuesday)]

PurpleRose posted 6/17/2014 16:04 PM

This just sucks. I've been thinking about it since I first read your post. :(

I agree that she needs to be "on warning" that this behavior must end immediately. I'm so sad for you and your kids. What I don't understand is why she allows another man to put his hands on her child??

PurpleRose posted 6/17/2014 16:04 PM

Double post

[This message edited by PurpleRose at 4:04 PM, June 17th (Tuesday)]

Dadtryingtocope posted 6/17/2014 17:56 PM

I had already sent the email. She has my daughter the next few days and I didn't want this to wait. So here is what I sent her and I cc'd my attorney who already knew all this (note names have been changed to protect the non-innocent:

Crazy Bitch:

I have been made aware of concerning events over the last weeks. First by a third party and then by both kids themselves that the situation at your home has become tumultuous at best. To use their language, DD9 is "afraid" of Asshat and DS12 has been physically restrained by him to the point of it "hurting" him. Both children have come to me with this information - this is not a situation where DS12 is simply being unhappy due to his living at your home and not getting his video games and working at being dishonest. Both children have said these things - separate occasions to separate people. And both children shared this information on their own, in other words it was not solicited by me.

We have already discussed the utter inappropriateness of Asshat's involvement re: smashing DS12's Xbox. Though it may have been directed by you, nearly all would agree, no one but the biological parent(s) should ever engage in disciplining their own children. Having said that, we have an agreement with school where they are allowed to physically restrain him for safety purposes. Which then they also must report to us by law. Outside of that, it must be known here and now I will not tolerate, in any fashion, anyone (as would you if the circumstances were reversed) to put their hands on, yell at, intimidate in any way shape or form: our children. This however is not the case as I have heard it. I have been privy to information where Asshat is, in my opinion, on an escalating scale of discipline with DS12. It started last year when he destroyed DS12’s Xbox right in front of DS12 by smashing it on the ground. While this might have been at your direction, it was completely inappropriate with respect to what it shows DS12 AND it should of never been carried out by Asshat. Since then I have heard that Asshat yells at both kids. I find no reason why Asshat should be yelling at either of our kids. Again this is your discipline to carry out, not Asshat’s. He is over stepping his boundaries as a step parent. Finally it has now come to my attention that Asshat has been putting his hands on DS12. While it might be to pick him up off the floor to drag him to his room during a tantrum, it is completely out of line. DS12 has indicated in his own words that Asshat is “hurting him”.

Sadly, I must also note that the children have brought to my attention that they witness/overhear you and Asshat fighting in your bedroom at times and hear 'banging' noises. This causes concern for them and for your safety, because unfortunately they are aware of the domestic incident back in January '13. An incident that occurred while DD9 was in your custody. No child (and certainly not mine) should be privy to this type of environment. I'm hopeful you are safe, and I encourage you on the advice of my attorney to seek therapy for our children and for yourself (whether it be individual or family counseling). If I can be part of this therapy in any way to help the process (for them) I would make myself available.
My expectations going forward:

• None of this will be discussed with the children. No repercussions to them in any way for having shared their concerns with anyone; they should feel free to have open communication with those they trust without fear of reprisal.
• Approval of both parents for any counseling services; and all therapeutics will be paid for by you.
• Again, let me reiterate that I am very aware of what is going on. Any physical or psychological abuse, punishment, discipline by Asshat or anyone for that matter will not be tolerated. If I continue to hear that these things are occurring I will take whatever legal action I need to that ensures the safety and well-being of our kids. My attorney is aware of the situation and is copied on this email.

I require no response from you on this and will not respond to same. You have been informed of my position. The steps moving forward are up to you at this point.


So there it is. No response today so that is good. Hopefully she (and he) get the message.

[This message edited by Dadtryingtocope at 5:57 PM, June 17th (Tuesday)]

Dreamboat posted 6/17/2014 18:17 PM

Good letter. Very business like and on target. I hope for your kids sake that this will provide them a safe environment.

Dadtryingtocope posted 6/18/2014 09:31 AM

As expected the response came in and she was not happy. Claimed I was out of line, denied what the kids had told me and then spun it back onto me. Nothing new there. It always spins back to me. She copied her attorney as well. Didn't even address the fighting incidents with her AP/now husband. Also didn't respond in any way to the suggestions for counseling for the kids. I won't respond back just as I indicated in my letter. My attorney is aware of everything. We will see how things go from here I guess. You can bet the kids and I will be having discussions over dinners just to make sure everything remains safe for them. I'll keep in low key when they return from their days with her. Just ask if everything went okay, any issues, do anything fun, etc. etc. Keeping my fingers crossed.

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