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User Topic: The cheaters Fog
steppingup
♂ 42650
Member # 42650
Default  Posted: 11:51 AM, June 27th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I won't take credit for this, but for some of you like me, the WW or WH is in a fog, here are some excerpts I've found about this... Enjoy.

The fog refers the fantasy built by the cheater. The affair partner is the most wonderful person in the world, while the loyal spouse of many years is terrible in every way. Life would be great with the affair partner, there would be no problems, life is terrible with the loyal spouse, there is not one thing to be happy about.

With the affair partner, none of life's unpleasant realities encroach. There are no bathrooms to clean, no chores to do, no grocery shopping, no cutting the grass, no wiping little butts, etc., nothing but I love you's and talk of sex and a happily-ever-after future together. With the loyal spouse, all of life's unpleasant realities exist. The cheater doesn't recognize this. They see the affair partner a few times a week and the affair partner always looks and acts their best. They live with their loyal spouse, and see all of the loyal spouse's blemishes. Also, the period of infatuation in any relationship lasts at most a couple of years. The cheater doesn't see that and believes that the "butterflies-in-the-stomach" feeling they have with their affair partner will last forever (even though it didn't last forever in any other relationship they ever had, including with their loyal spouse).

That is the affair fog that people refer to cheaters being in.

Also, the cheater becomes addicted to the hormones/drugs secreted by the brain when a person is infatuated. They become addicted to the extra attention showered on them by the affair partner and find it very hard to stop seeking that out, even after they do realize that it's not really real, that it will fade with time - they still have a hard time giving it up. That also is part of the fog.

That is the truth. The Fog makes it sound like your loving loyal and long term partner is in temporary insanity, like they are not in control of their life. In fact I hear it all the time now..
"It just happened"
"I fell in love and I'm only human"

The truth is that they damn well know what they are doing, they just hope to get away with it and you will give them a free pass for their "mistake." It is up to the BS what happens when the ****ty life choice they made comes and bites them.

Even those who suffer from very low self steem and feelings of unworthyness feel the need to protect thier egos. It's a human thing, not a wayward thing. We all have a sense/image of ourself as basically good people so when we behave badly we need to justify ourselves. It's not necessary done consciously or coldy. We need to protect our own image, normaly blaming things "out there". Waywards justify themselves the cheating by demonizing their spouse, rewriting the marital story, pointing out extreme circunstances becuase they are not like to those "selfish" cheaters, they are specials, they argue unique circunstances...
Then they also "somehow" feel bad about what they are doing; WHo is to blame; of course the dump the blame squarely at the one who make the "feeling bad" possible; thier betrayed ones. After all if we were just nice enough to dissapear they won't fell bad about themselves for cheating on us, right? Our mere existence is not only an obstacle to hapiness but a reminder they are cheaters.


Her (WW 40s) Me (BH, 40s) very young DS & DD

An excellent wife is the crown of her husband, but she who brings shame is like rottenness in his bones (Proverbs 12:4)


Posts: 754 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: CALI
brokengirl2
♀ 43898
Member # 43898
Default  Posted: 11:58 AM, June 27th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

great post. I completely agree. My ex kept telling me it was because we weren't spending enough time together that he wanted some space. Of course space means date other girls. It is always the victims fault and it is always the victim that has to pick up the pieces.

Posts: 13 | Registered: Jun 2014
tfkeel
♂ 19517
Member # 19517
Default  Posted: 12:22 PM, June 27th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it is always the victim that has to pick up the pieces

I suppose that is why our "pieces" remained strewn.
Because I refused.

She did the dropping and scattering, it was therefore her responsibility to "pick up" and "clean up".

The truth is that they damn well know what they are doing, they just hope to get away with it and you will give them a free pass for their "mistake."

Right. It ain't no "mistake", and it ain't no "fog". It is a deliberate choice on the part of a self-absorbed person.


[This message edited by tfkeel at 12:24 PM, June 27th (Friday)]


Posts: 687 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Pennsylvania
BaltimoreBlues
♂ 43845
Member # 43845
Default  Posted: 6:43 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've read about the fog here and in other places, but I was hoping some of you could share your firsthand experiences with it.

How long did it last?

Was there anything you did to snap WS out of it?


Me: 40
Her: 38
Married for 15 years
Two kids (4 and 5)
D-Day: June 16, 2014

Posts: 36 | Registered: Jun 2014
shiloe
♀ 1224
Member # 1224
Default  Posted: 6:59 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't agree with the fog theory either. It is thought out choices. Getting cake and ice-cream too. And BS don't have these super-powers that "make" the WS cheat.


But remember, good love is hard to find . . -Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers
BS - 54
Cheater -54
Married 26 yrs
DD - 21 DD -19 DS-17
A#1 2000 with married ho-worker/neighbor ow#1
A#2 2007-? OW#2 LTA with yet another married ho-worker. Kicked h

Posts: 667 | Registered: Mar 2003
NeverAgain2013
♀ 38121
Member # 38121
Default  Posted: 6:59 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've never believed in the 'fog' and have never used that expression here on SI.

I believe EVERYONE is responsible for their own behavior - good, bad or ugly. While people tend to view their affair partners through rose-colored glasses and imagine that life with them would be so much more idyllic than their current lives, I don't blame that on 'fog' at all.

I blame it purely on being a dumbass.

I think affairs can be intoxicating for a lot of people because a lot of it is "fantasy land" for them; but the bottom line is that cheaters know exactly what they're doing and that's why they spend so much time and effort keeping it a secret from their BS. There's nothing 'foggy' about that at all - it's very cold and calculated malicious behavior, sneaking and hiding and gaslighting and all the other cruel things they do to avoid detection in order to save their hides.

I see the term 'fog' or 'foggy' as some kind of excuse or label to describe what really amounts to nothing more than just plain shitty, selfish, self entitled, self absorbed, self serving behavior. My ex wasn't in any 'fog,' everything he DID was calculated to serve HIM and he knew exactly what he was doing, every step of the way.


Be careful - that 'knight in shining armor' may very well be nothing more than an assclown wrapped in tin foil.
ME: 50+ years old and cute as a button :-)
Ex-WBF: Just a lying, cheating, gravy-sucking pig - and I left him in 2012.

Posts: 1958 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: USA
tfkeel
♂ 19517
Member # 19517
Default  Posted: 7:02 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, yeah. The AP was the greatest thing since sliced bread, and I was the least-desirable man alive.

The "fog" dissipated quickly, however, when I called the APs wife and told her, and packed my bags and moved out of the rental house. Wrote a letter to the landlord and told him that I didn't live there anymore and after the current month, I wouldn't be paying the rent.

My ex wasn't in any 'fog,' everything he DID was calculated to serve HIM and he knew exactly what he was doing, every step of the way.

Exactly. The "fog" does not excuse the behavior, any more than a judge would excuse murder because the perpetrator had PMS.

In my case, my WW was a former victim of adultery in her first marriage. She KNEW what this would do to me, and she did it anyway.

[This message edited by tfkeel at 7:08 AM, July 3rd (Thursday)]


Posts: 687 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Pennsylvania
KatieG
♀ 41222
Member # 41222
Default  Posted: 7:16 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Our mere existence is not only an obstacle to happiness but a reminder they are cheaters.

I think the "fog" is sometimes a term used to describe their behaviour and in a way it does tend to soften the blow. Like, "they didn't really know, they were in the fog" But I use it not to soften the blow but to describe a period of time, the period of time before they take responsibility for their own actions.

Of course in the absence of "fog" but with the same behaviour it just means they don't take responsibility for their own actions. So "fog" describes a temporary state not the state itself.

When we talk about the fog clearing, it just means when did your WS change? Its not an excuse. Its like when we encounter people with additions we sometimes recognise addict behaviour, as in; I was speaking to the addict. All of the behaviour is the person themselves just in different states.


DD#1 - 6th Oct 13 - TT
DD#2 - 9th Nov 13 - Full disclosure
DD#3 - 12th May 14 - FOG lifted and in R
7 week A, 2 weeks together, rest phone and email - PA and EA

Posts: 514 | Registered: Nov 2013
nomistakeaboutit
♂ 36857
Member # 36857
Default  Posted: 7:38 AM, July 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Excellent.

"The Fog" is talked about a lot in posts, but I don't believe I have seen an explanation like this before. IMO, it should be placed near the top of the FAQ for BS (and possibly in the FAQ for WS, too).

I would only add to what you've posted, the fact that "The Fog" can last for YEARS. This is critical information, because I get the feeling from reading various posts on SI that some Recently BS's are hopeful that their WS will come out of the fog quickly. That's why NC and exposing the A is so important - to help facilitate snapping the WS out of their fog.


Me: BH 58.........Her: WW 45
DD: 8..........DS: 5
Married for six years.
DDay: 12-25-11 Divorced: 7-15-12
...................................
"It's like a nightmare within a nightmare, which in and of itself is a nightmare!"

Posts: 968 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: U.S.A.
steppingup
♂ 42650
Member # 42650
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can see the fog lifting as the 180 I am doing starts to go into place. I asked her the other day where she was at, she just said she was "struggling" and had been "struggling" for months and months.

Why the struggle? Why can't some people grow up? I am headed for D or S, not sure which, but for the sake of our future Co-parenting, and getting along, when or how is the best way for a WW to grow up?

I mean seriously, life and family is far more important than feeling like a teenager who just got asked out to a dance by the homecoming king no? WTF!


Her (WW 40s) Me (BH, 40s) very young DS & DD

An excellent wife is the crown of her husband, but she who brings shame is like rottenness in his bones (Proverbs 12:4)


Posts: 754 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: CALI
strengthandhope
♀ 37907
Member # 37907
Default  Posted: 3:28 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Great post. I understand why some reject this term, it is viewed as an excuse for damaging and wrong behavior. I feel it is more of a way for BSs to make sense of what is going on with the WS they have loved. If you JFO and don't know how this couod happen to you, or why, the fog kind of spells out that it is an issue of the WS and not you. Some with low self esteem, or someone vulnerable may blame themselves. That is unfair and totally wrong in every instance of cheating. The fog takes some of the burden of "why?" away. It explains what happens to a WS when they are involved in cheating. No way an excuse.


Me: BS 30s
Him: SAWH, 30s sexting, pic sharing & phone sex with men & women
2 kids, M 8 yrs
DD#1 3/08, DD#2 7/11, DD#3 10/12 DD#4 2/14
OW #1 PA from 6/13-8/13 CL Troll
OW #2 EA from 11/13-2/14 online/phone sex A
Taking R 90 days at a time.

Posts: 195 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Mid west
TimeToGo2014
♀ 43909
Member # 43909
Default  Posted: 3:34 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for this post. I agree that it helps make sense of different stages people involved in infidelity go through- not that it's an excuse.

Posts: 130 | Registered: Jun 2014
seethelight
♀ 43513
Member # 43513
Default  Posted: 3:44 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

With the affair partner, none of life's unpleasant realities encroach. There are no bathrooms to clean, no chores to do, no grocery shopping, no cutting the grass, no wiping little butts, etc., nothing but I love you's and talk of sex and a happily-ever-after future together. With the loyal spouse, all of life's unpleasant realities exist. The cheater doesn't recognize this.

They see the affair partner a few times a week and the affair partner always looks and acts their best. They live with their loyal spouse, and see all of the loyal spouse's blemishes. Also, the period of infatuation in any relationship lasts at most a couple of years.

The cheater doesn't see that and believes that the "butterflies-in-the-stomach" feeling they have with their affair partner will last forever (even though it didn't last forever in any other relationship they ever had, including with their loyal spouse).

Steppingup:

The really frightening part is that an affair is not EVEN A NORMAL DATING relationship.

It's always rainbows and sunshine, and absolutely nothing but sex and fun for that once per week they meet.

That is why so many of them turn into long term affairs. I have read that some affairs lasted ten or 20 years or more, if the waywards do not get caught.

Some spouses only find out about an LTA when the cheating spouse dies and then find hidden evidence.

At least in a normal dating relationship the early lustful feeling wears off and the two daters begin to see the real person with realistic eyes.

But since an affair never lives in the reality of a marriage, or never even is a NORMAL dating relationship, the honeymoon phase MAY never wear off.


“If two people truly have feelings for one another then they don’t have an affair. They get a divorce and they sort out their feelings. You are accountable for the people you hold hostage in a marriage when your mind and heart refuse to fully commit

Posts: 1516 | Registered: May 2014
steppingup
♂ 42650
Member # 42650
Default  Posted: 6:11 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

an affair is not EVEN A NORMAL DATING relationship.

Totally agreed SeeTheLight!!!

The sneaky behind everyones back stuff, the hiddeness the exclusive admittance to "thier sex party", yes all that stuff only adds gasoline to the fire and makes it all the more attractive (I think..).

Having never had an affair I really dont know but from what I read and have heard, the intoxication is addictive to those who would be lead around by their emotions and gonads.

Me, never, the grey matter between my ears wouldn't allow it (assumption of course...not bragging).

Its really amazing...what all this is.


Her (WW 40s) Me (BH, 40s) very young DS & DD

An excellent wife is the crown of her husband, but she who brings shame is like rottenness in his bones (Proverbs 12:4)


Posts: 754 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: CALI
cosmicjoke
♀ 39159
Member # 39159
Default  Posted: 7:10 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Amen Neveragain...!! (your last post.)
I just love the alcohol excuse too.

Posts: 252 | Registered: May 2013
Tickingtock
♀ 41411
Member # 41411
Default  Posted: 7:37 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have sort of a unique first hand experience with the fog, which is why I believe in it.

Years ago, me and DH (6 years before we got married) broke up. He didn't deserve to be with me. I ended it; I thought permanently. He and I were neighbors and after I broke up with him I started sleeping with one of our other neighbors.

I new it was wrong and that he would be pissed if he found out (and would have every right to be, even though we were broken up).

One time in particular I was actually in the act of having sex with neighbor G when xbf/futureDH got home, and I was thinking about what xbf/futureDH would think if he found out (yeah, the sex was terrible so this is what was going through my head during the act).

Anyway, on a rational level I knew he would be mad, but I didn't feel it, for lack of a better word. Simultaneously, I also knew that if he found out I would be shocked at how much it upset him . And my brain felt fuzzy while I thought about this.

To try to explain is succinctly: I knew he would be hurt while at the same time I knew that I didn't fully know how much he would be hurt.

It still makes no sense to me but I remember thinking about this and how fuzzy my brain felt while I tried to figure out this dissonance in my head. I remember how strange it felt to feel this way and knew it made absolutely no sense.

That being said, the fog in no way excuses any behavior. But it may help explain a delineation in a WS between A feelings and post-fog feelings. That's just my opinion.

ETA: I can haz spelling.

[This message edited by Tickingtock at 7:41 PM, July 17th (Thursday)]


Posts: 242 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: West Coast, USA
FightingBack
♀ 34770
Member # 34770
Default  Posted: 9:38 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH used the term "fog" soon after dday, long before I had found this site and even before either of us had begun reading about affairs.

But he didn't use it in the context of being swept up in a feeling of being in love, he used it to describe how, during the affair, his judgement was impaired. He purposely pushed away any feelings of guilt or conscience. The affair continued for so long that it became "normal" for him. He was never worried if I would find out. He kept his AP at work, and his family at home. He didn't even spend time or energy considering the fallout of possible discovery. He was so wrapped up in his own little world and felt safe that it would remain undetected, that it was like a fog had enveloped his normally reasoning and logical self.

He also used the words "fantasy bubble" and described how for a period of time each week, he would live in this bubble, sure that it had no impact or threat to his home life.

He snapped out of the fog immediately at discovery. There were things he said in the days that followed that were out of character and which conflicted with things he said later. When reminded of these things, he asked "did I really say that?".

Perhaps that could have been described as "foggy" in terms of being in his own form of shock.

I feel fortunate, if you can call it that, that he never ever exhibited any sights of missing his AP or grieving the end of their LTA. In fact, he was very relieved that it was over. He swears that he never felt that he was in love with her and has remained NC from day one.

So, to him, the fog was not about feeling limerance or infatuation, but a period (a long one) of stupidity.


Me 53
WH 58
Married 25 years
4 children S30,D24, S23,S21
D-Day Nov. 29, 2011
15 year affair with married employee.
Together trying to make sense of it all!

Posts: 829 | Registered: Feb 2012
Uhtred
♂ 40392
Member # 40392
Default  Posted: 9:48 PM, July 17th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If there is such a thing as "the fog" then I "Deffogerized" the shit out of my WW and the OM the day I found out. He found out what shit taste like just like me and my wife found out she'd been abusing the wrong person. I really hate the term fog because it lets some of the betrayed lay blame on "it" instead of their pathetic excuse of a human that promised them fidelity. The fog lends excuse to "slip ups" and accidental breaks in no contact because they are still coming down off their high. Fuck a bunch of fog, if my wayward wife ever used that excuse with me she really would've found herself in the fog out on a winding road with her bags packed. This term gets me riled up!


Me: BH 32years old DDay 4-29-13
Her: WW 33 years old
“Yet each man kills the thing he loves
By each let this be heard
Some do it with a bitter look
Some with a flattering word
The coward does it with a kiss
The brave man with a sword”

Posts: 633 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Houston, Texas
seethelight
♀ 43513
Member # 43513
Default  Posted: 10:42 AM, July 18th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Totally agreed SeeTheLight!!!

The sneaky behind everyones back stuff, the hiddeness the exclusive admittance to "thier sex party", yes all that stuff only adds gasoline to the fire and makes it all the more attractive (I think..).

Having never had an affair I really dont know but from what I read and have heard, the intoxication is addictive to those who would be lead around by their emotions and gonads.

Me, never, the grey matter between my ears wouldn't allow it (assumption of course...not bragging).

Its really amazing...what all this is.

Agreed, stepping up. The grey matter in my head just led me to forsee the consequence of having an affair, and how it would hurt my husband and family.

I think every married person at some point in their lives is attracted to someone else that they meet, but the logical ones put the brakes on.

I kind of agree with those who say the fog is just a convenient excuse. I won't allow my husband to use it as an excuse.

Thinking about having 20 million dollars makes me feel excited and happy. The thought puts me into a little bubbly fantasy world, but I still would not rob a bank to get it.

I still know, no matter how much the thought of having 20 million dollars excites me, it's wrong to steal it.

[This message edited by seethelight at 10:43 AM, July 18th (Friday)]


“If two people truly have feelings for one another then they don’t have an affair. They get a divorce and they sort out their feelings. You are accountable for the people you hold hostage in a marriage when your mind and heart refuse to fully commit

Posts: 1516 | Registered: May 2014
amanda123
♀ 43207
Member # 43207
Default  Posted: 4:31 PM, July 18th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I dont believe my H was in any fog whatsoever, the fact that he was so secretive with this A proves that he had to be on the ball so to speak. The OW who was also my friend sent him her underwear in a birthday card, he showed me the card which reeked of perfume but hid the underwear!! After Dday she was the one who told me about the underwear so I went looking for them and I found them. He wasnt in the fog, he was on a high. Now I know the great uplifted sound of his voice when I called him from work wasnt his excitement of hearing my voice it was because he was talking texting skyping or sexting with the OW. They had planned or at least he had considered leaving me and my girls to be with each other. For what ever reason when SHE gave him the ultimatum he couldnt do it. I dont know if he would have ever told me about it, if she hadnt sent me a FB message exposing the whole A. Even though he told her he wasnt leaving his family she tried to then get me to react and make me break up with him, by saying that they loved each other and that I was in the way I should step aside. I think reality set in when I confronted him with all this shit. I know he was also going through a whole set of emotions because he was so up and down with his behaviour towards me, actually it was more down than anything he was angry he was mean he was very cold he said hurtful things, and why? because i was the best wife he could ever ask for. This has changed me forever I can never be the trusting person that I was before, and although I still love my H with all my heart there is definitely something different in our relationship and the way I look at him.

Posts: 320 | Registered: Apr 2014
Topic Posts: 26
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