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The more I am here on SI lately, the more I see the predictable patterns in so many posts... sometimes it seems obvious who should be RUNNING for the door...

Yet we stay.

But WHY?

I keep moving my own line in the sand farther and farther back to accommodate my WS's many failures along the way as he "heals himself" and "grows as a person" and "learns not to lie" and "learns what is and isn't appropriate behavior" for a married person. And I feel more and more foolish with every new line I draw.

WHY have we given these people who so carelessly and selfishly hurt us another chance? Chance after chance, in many cases! It's not like they just wrecked our car, or even just negligently burned our house to the ground - they mutilated our SOULS. They made a conscious choice to savagely destroy something that we can't just simply replace with an insurance policy. We can't just MOVE OUT of our souls. They forever altered something that was not theirs to alter.

I have not doubt I'll recover from this someday. I just still can't decide if it would be easier to heal from the damage with him OUT of my life, or IN it. I wanted to be married for the rest of my life, but I didn't know I was signing up for THIS when I made my vows...

So: why are YOU staying? What keeps you going - keeps you BELIEVING it's worth the incredible pain and effort?

I didn't. I saw no reason to stay with my X so we went our separate ways. I knew we had no future, no hope so what was the point? We weren't happy, and the changes that needed to be made weren't realistic so we parted. No regrets.

Why are you staying? Why are you settling for this craziness? I understand you want to be married but there are so many other better, trust worthy and honest men (and women) out there.

I stayed because I love my husband, plain and simple. His A was over before I discovered it, so I do have a bit of a different story, but I stayed because he was trying. Was he the 'perfect' remorseful spouse? Hell no, not by a long shot. Still, I knew I wanted him by my side. As long as he was trying and wanted to be here, I wanted to try and be here.

Why are you moving your line? Do you love him, or are you afraid of a life without him? There's no shame in the latter - a change like that is scary as hell. If that is why, however, you're in for a lot of misery.

Also, what is he doing that's causing you to move your line? Is he breaking NC? Is he still actively in the A?

I am attempting R with my WH and there are many reasons. I think that many of our reasons will be different and that is due to the fact all of our relationships are different. For me, it has been a hard decision on make, but with the help of IC I am learning about me and my needs. It has helped me see what is really important in my life and that is my WH and my kids (who are young adults). I too have given him chance after chance.

I felt that I wanted to give my WH the opportunity to show me that he can change. He is in IC as well and seems to be making progress in the month that he has been going. We both are sharing more than we ever did and it is nice to see the man I thought I married so many years ago. Not the grumpy quiet guy he had become. I have not seen him smile like he has in the last 2 weeks in many many years. It is encouraging. Just taking it one day at a time.

Since we all have different FOO issues we have to find what is best for our life. No I do not think I am settling and I am not afraid to be alone, but I really do love him and have given him this one last chance of R. So far it is going well, but we will see in a few months or years how it is going.

I was in False R.. .
But I stayed for years, I have moved out, moved back in and now moved out yet again by his request. He isn't having a an A but he doesn't want to do the work and he feels it is easier if we go our separate ways. I am conflicted with peace and grief.

I understand about moving the line and it is all based out of fear at least it was for me. Fear controls more than anything. Fear of losing what you know, the life you had or have, the man you love and vowed to, fear of them being with someone else, fear of never being loved again, fear of money.. ect..

I had to make a move or I would have been living and fighting the same fight that we have been fighting.. Rug sweeping the A and what I needed from him.

I tried to for the kids.
Then when I was really pissed I stayed for spite and money (it was the easiest thing for me).

After 6 months and she realized I was making plans for an exit, she started to work on her and realized that she was the broken one. To see a person change for the better, to see them transform is pretty rewarding. I am not convinced there are a ton of other great women out there. I am very convinced I can work with the one I'm with.

That's why. Are you? Ultimately that is the only thing that matters.

take care...

Perfect timing....I was asking this today after a less than good evening that is giving me doubts.

For me some background - my WS and I have everything together (except one thing).....

In the beginning we were friends, lovers, and companions. We think the same things and are very compatible partners. I believe we had "chemistry" in the beginning, but maybe not as much as she may have wanted later. Over the next 20 years, we became parents (good ones with kids that are turning out great).....but something started to be missing....we became more distant and the physical part started to fade. Instead of communicating, we both kind of figured it came with the territory of being "married" and let this inattention to our relationship grow which grew the depression for each of us.

This is when our paths diverged....she decided to take the "easy" path and rekindle her romance with another man rather than the path of more work me. 100% of her sexual energy and desire went to this OM for the next several years while I wondered why things were not getting better. Needless to say, not one ounce of WW effort went to fixing our physical relationship.

My WW still believes her own delusions that this was "love" and that "he" was the only one that could have chemistry for her (even though he also cheated on her and did some other despicable things to her)..

So to the question....why stay....
1) For my WW - I think even with all her faults and the betrayal she is someone worth the effort to be with if we can fix things and rebuild trust and safety. Do I love her? It is really hard to say that at the moment - but I loved her once and I do care for her VERY deeply.

2) Family and Kids - we don't fight and have fun - my kids have been in a good environment even through this nightmare and they are not quite independent enough yet - and I do not want to throw this all away.

3) Financial / situation - divorce is hell and the finances and living situation. I know this is not the top priority, but it means something.

4) 20 years of history and the opportunity to make a better future (turn this A into a wake-up call and make a bad thing good) if we can.

5) The ability for me to look at myself in the mirror and say I gave it a real try and just did not take the easy way out (even if it eventually does not work out).

6) The ability to work through some of the issues and anger in the event we do get a D. Any D would have to be amicable for the kids and family sake as well as our sake. This gives us a chance to fix some emotions and make rational decisions later.

7) A couple of other smaller things unique to our specific situation

[This message edited by Hopefuldad468 at 7:39 AM, August 16th (Saturday)]

Truthfully, the only reason Im still here is b\c I promised no big decisions for one year. DDay was, we will say Easter, even though I knew weeks before that. Otherwise, I would have left immediately. Some days I feel leaving without trying would have been a mistake. Things are actually going really well. He says he has always loved me (funny way of showing it). We have built a great life together (but it could be ruined now). But I truly believe my WS is very motivated to R. I know some are not. I would not be able to accept him if H had any attachment, ambivalence or residual feelings for OW. Id be gone in a heartbeat, but that is just my situation. Kids are grown, I am able to be independent. But who knows? I now live in a world where ANYTHING is possible.

There's a reason why I chose her 24yrs ago. I'm trusting on the young me did the right thing because the old me is ready to leave somedays.

We have a history together.
We're great together.
We have built a family (kids)
Financially I couldn't afford to split. It would be a financial mess and I'd have to be 100% determine to trigger this event. Otherwise, at the break everything would crumble and we'd probably be talking R anyway. So I'm skipping the drama. However, that being said I wish I could see her fight for me.

Do I love her? It is really hard to say that at the moment - but I loved her once and I do care for her VERY deeply.

This sums up my feelings for my wayward. I know I loved the trustworthy, loyal man I thought he was.

Now, knowing that he is not that man, I don't know the answer to: "do I love him."

I love him, but I can't really say that I am in love with him because of all the damage the betrayal has caused to my soul.

I used to look at my husband and get this squishy warm feeling inside my chest.

Now, I look at him and I see a stranger. A man who will stab me in the back to fulfill his own pleasures.

So Why do I stay?

2) Family and Kids - we don't fight and have fun - my kids have been in a good environment even through this nightmare and they are not quite independent enough yet - and I do not want to throw this all away.

This ^^^^^ is a very strong reason. My children are too young to understand the issues. Also, I would rather have my wayward home spending time and money on the children, then be distracted by dating.

When in his LTA, he totally ignored our children.

.... years of history

Yes, we have a history and have been through a lot together. Both making sacrifices for careers that would benefit the family's future.

5) The ability for me to look at myself in the mirror and say I gave it a real try and just did not take the easy way out (even if it eventually does not work out).

This is another reason I stay. That's not to say that I am not thinking of divorcing eventually.

Seriously, I think about it almost daily. I also wonder what my life would be like, if I simply filed and walked away?

I leave the divorce option open, without guilt, because I tried reconciliation and because he broke our wedding vows.

The continued lying and hiding and trickle truth after dday, did even more damage.

Wow.

There are a lot of reasons to stay or go.

Stay because: I do love her, the kids need me, the family needs my stability (none of that with WW), the kids need a good example of how to live so they don't grow up with just her crazy influence, I want her to heal, I want our family unit to survive intact.

Reasons to go: She is(was) unfaithful, an alcoholic, addiction personality, won't get help for herself or listen to us when we encourage her to, always short tempered, constantly angry, irresponsible, she has destroyed the sanctity of our marriage, I could be happier without her or with a woman whose values are more in line with mine, oh and by the way she broke my heart.

Ain't love grand?

I am staying, because in spite of all the pain he has caused me (and it is more pain than I think I can bear sometimes), I still look at him and think he is the most beautiful person I have ever seen. I still love his smile - especially when it is directed at me. I love how he holds me so close when I need a hug. I love how very sorry he is for hurting me and that he plans to make up for what he did the rest of our lives. I love the many ways in which he is following through on those plans. I love his voice. I love being with him. Yup, in spite of it all, I love him - always have. And I can't imagine my life without him.

[This message edited by needfriendshere at 3:44 PM, July 28th (Monday)]

I'm 5 months out. I have not left up til now because:

It will be hard on the kids
I promised to wait 6 months until making a decision
I am afraid of life after D
I'm pretty sure no one else will ever want me
It's going to be difficult financially
He's doing the work
It's foolish, but I still love him

BUT, we are going to S next week, because the bottom line is that he is a liar who betrayed me, broke my heart, burned my life to the ground, and left nothing special or sacred for us to share going forward. No matter what happens in the future, those facts will always be true.

I stayed because:
1. We have children, and my one great hope for them was that they would not have to experience the life altering pain of a broken home.
2. He confessed the A to me and gave me full disclosure within a relatively short amount of time.
3. I found I had the unexplained capacity to forgive him; I stayed because I wanted to stay.
4. He did not tell the OW that he loved her.
5. He did not bring her into our home.
6. I did not catch them in the act.
7. He was remorseful. He recognized that the A was deeper than just "an A"... there was something seriously wrong with him and he was going to work to fix it with or without our marriage.
8. I was a SAHM and had no income of my own.
9. I was not going to let OW "win".
10. I did not want to be divorced because of a stupid fricking mid-life crisis. If we were going to D it would be because of US, not because of something as cliche and pathetic as THAT.
11. He quit his job, turned his back on the OW, threw her under the bus and told me he wanted me to stay.
12. He never once blamed me for the A. He never tried to justify it. He said from the beginning that it had nothing to do with me or with her. It was not my fault, I didn't do anything to cause it, and there was nothing that I could have done to prevent it.
13. By the time I figured out that I had been in a co-dependent abusive marriage for 18 years, we were so far into a whole new relationship and marriage that it didn't make any sense to walk away. That man who had had the A didn't exist any more.
14. My NPD mother hated my WH and hadn't wanted me to marry him, and I didn't want to give her the satisfaction.
15. I loved him.
16. I believe in a God of grace, forgiveness and redemption, I believe in repentance, I believe it is possible to overcome evil with good, and I believed that in our great brokenness God was great enough to heal us and make all things new.
17. I took vows and I meant them and I wasn't going to break them just because he did.
18. I knew I had the strength to walk away.

The reasons why I stayed changed and varied moment to moment, day to day, even still. We are a year out and I am glad I stayed. But it is always fragile, and I won't ever say to my WH, "I will never leave you". I told my WH that he doesn't have to have another A for something still to be a "deal-breaker".

I stayed because I have no where else to go. Directly related to money. I don't make enough to support myself.

As soon as my ducks are in a row - my money situation improves - I'm gone.

I stayed because I love him. R has not been perfect and we've had a few small setbacks, but he has been remorseful and he's taken all steps necessary in his part of building back the us we once had. Absolutely would I have rather not gone through this, but we've learned a lot through this. We've learned the importance of not making any decisions in times of high emotions, we've learned about our own as well as each others emotional needs, to make sure we make time for each other/"us" (date nights), and are learning to center our marriage around God.

Yes, there are times I absolutely doubt...but I know we both have to be INTENTIONAL about the R. Sometimes it may seem a little forced, but then this is how we create new habits, right? On D-Day, in a "meeting" with fWH, OW, and her BH, all I had to do was ask him if he did all he could, gave his 100%, in working on us. He knew he didn't and realized it's not fair to throw our 18 years plus the life we built away without giving that 100% first. Now we're both really, truly working on giving 100% EACH...not 50/50, to this marriage. Everything is INTENTIONAL! He texts me throughout the day, we have gym dates 4-5 days during the work week, we've planned together and gone on camping trips, we're planning regular date nights, reminiscing about the things that brought us together and our early years, sharing marriage tips we come across like ones I get from a great FB page I came across, we cook dinners together, pray together, and greet and leave each other with a kiss always. If you want it, it has to be INTENTIONAL.

Yes, the hurt for me is still there and I still have never been so insecure in my life. I see HER face every day and have some sort of conversation with her in my head every other day. I know this will get better over time...because I want to be with my husband. I know he's truly sorry for the EA and wants to be with me and wishes he could undo it all he did (and didn't do) and take the hurt away. I see love and happiness in his eyes and in his smile when he looks at me, when we laugh, and when we wake up next to each other.

It can be harder done than said at times, but what happiness is there wallowing in my hurt? I have this man I vowed to share my life with, until death do us part, who wants to make it all right, by me and God. Trust is so hard when we've been hurt, but my love for him and my faith say to stay and for us to work on it and let him have the chance to earn my trust back. This is just my experience and story thus far....

Originally I offered R because he was starting to do the right things. He was giving me transparency, and he was facing his demons.
But then, when he decided to back out like a coward, I had to pull R off the table and filed.
I don't regret offering R, because now there will never be those "what if" questions plaguing me. I know that I did everything I possibly could to save the M.
If it were to happen again, with another SO, I don't think I will be so willing to offer R though. It became a deal breaker after all the shattered hopes I started having again for us and our M.
I think each case is different. Yes there are some that the outcome is pretty predictable, but not every situation is the same and I've seen some folks successfully R. I wouldn't ever advise cutting and running unless the WS was abusive and the BS was losing themselves in the process of R.

Hopefuldad nailed all of my reasons. Is it what I had hoped my marriage would be? Nope. Is it better than the pre-a marriage? Absolutely.

I enjoy the life we are able to have as a family. I don't want to share that with anyone else.

That said...I've never moved my line since d day. It's full transparency, complete accountability and not a single lie. These are my absolute deal breakers. There is no negotiating here. Do not pass go, do not collect $200, go immediately to divorce.

You have to figure out what your line is, and related consequences...and then follow through!!

Love is why I stay...he got into IC....has and is figuring out his crap...knowing that he could loose me scared the shit out of him ....limbo never happened ....this is hard work and not for the faint of heart....

1. Kids, kids, kids!!! I would have left after first sign of false R if it wasn't for the fact that we have 4 kids together and 2 step kids who I love dearly. I would have left and never looked back ( after tending to my broken heart)

2. Love: Yes.. Okay I do love the SOB. :-)

3. He works his tail off to make it up to me. He does more things than I can list to be transparent and prove himself to me. I would not be here if he did not do all he does to make it up to me every day even though I would hate to split up the family.

Toward the end of false R I was completely ready for D. I could not allow him to continue to abuse me. It was killing the kids to see me like that finally he did pull his head out of his ass and now does everything right. Overall, my thoughts are that it would be easier to heal without him, but not if I would have had to send my babies to be with OW every other weekend. That would KILL me.

[This message edited by lilflower1000 at 8:49 PM, July 28th (Monday)]