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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Sexual Abuse Survivors/Spouses of SAB's
brokenhalo
♀ Member
Member # 14754
Default  Posted: 12:08 PM, June 8th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Hurts for you post. It really did help me to read it. I do have issues with the "I did not choose the A or the SA"...but it is here now and I have to deal with it and I am. Even if it just means I learn and grow and move on from it all.

It is encouraging and admirable that you are sticking it out with your wife. And to know in some ways we are not all alone with our daily struggles.

Thanks again.


Me (BS): 35 Him (WH): 34
Kids: DD 10, DS 6
WH/SA: EA with my Sister 2001-2003
EA then PA with sister's BF and his co-worker 7 months in 2002
D-Day #1 12/31/2002 our anniversary: Denied but stopped his A
D-Day #2 3/11/2007 Admitted A

Posts: 67 | Registered: May 2007 | From: TX
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, June 8th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

oops.. I posted in the wrong thread.. sorry about that.

[This message edited by beach at 11:09 PM, June 8th (Friday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
TwistedInside
♂ Member
Member # 6147
Default  Posted: 1:24 PM, June 9th (Saturday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think it's very dangerous to take general knowledge and apply it to SAB's across the board.

Agreed. I've posted multiple times that each of our situations is unique. We have commonalties among us, but ultimately we're each on our own in finding our way in our individual situatons.

My comments to Hurts were based not on general knowledge or assumptions but on the many things he's said regarding his W. I do believe she is aware of what she's doing. Perhaps she's not sure why, or how to control it.

But with the counseling she's been getting, the discussions they've had, the letter he wrote to her (if I recall correctly), it seems likely she understands that she can keep Hurts at bay with comments or actions, so he doesn't get any closer to her or so she doesn't have to open up any further.

Perhaps the word "aware" can be parsed, since there are different levels of awareness.

Trust and believe when I tell you it is tremendously difficult to learn how to be intimate when you absolute survival depended on insulating yourself as a child. It can be done, but being a partner to someone walking that journey is not perhaps for everyone.

As the ex-spouse of someone who decided to divorce instead of allow intimacy, I understand this fully. The problem with my ex, and perhaps Hurt's W, is the resistance to "walking that journey." My ex chose not to walk it at all. Hurt's W is fighting it.

Smoke, your situation is different from ours. You are working to overcome your demons. Hurts' W is reluctant to acknowledge how much of a problem her demons are. My ex simply decided she didn't need to bother with them, that she was as functional as she needed to be.

Believe me when I say I admire you for doing battle against your demons. Not every SAb survivor is up to the fight.


Me: BS; divorced Nov. 1, 2005, after 23 years of marriage
Incredible kids: Two
Current status: Remarried! 11/28/09
------------------------------------
So often times it happens that we live our lives in chains, and we never even know we have the key

Posts: 2049 | Registered: Jan 2005 | From: Illinois
smokenfire
Member
Member # 5217
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, June 9th (Saturday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not as "up" on the scenario of the people who post here, for a lot of reasons that matter very little.

It's not a fun path, and it's even worse when you have to through weird/bad therapists to get help.

I'll choose to trust your judgment if I can throw out one thing.

Not every therapist CAN help a SAB. I mean really you are going in there with your bloody battered heart in your hands and saying, here show me how to make this work.

Not every therapist can do that - and some even do more damage (not abuse, just bad therapy).

This probably messes with me because I'm always afraid people will give up on me five minutes before the miracle. No one ever has, but sometimes I feel like the slowest runner in the world running a race in knee deep oatmeal.

Thanks for the gentle explanation, that's cool.


I have a very strict no returns policy - if you got him - you have to keep him.
Don't kick me in the mouth and then complain about how I bleed...

Posts: 5961 | Registered: Aug 2004
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 12:13 AM, June 11th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Not every therapist CAN help a SAB. I mean really you are going in there with your bloody battered heart in your hands and saying, here show me how to make this work.

Not every therapist can do that - and some even do more damage (not abuse, just bad therapy).

his is so true. I believe that this is wha we ae in the middle of. I is something that we are talking about.

Guys, I so enjoy all the perspectives, all comments are so important. Thanks.

I want to respond here, but I am reluctant because I am in kind of a turmoil inside. I am trying this new approach and I am getting a little frustrated because of some of the behaviors hat I know are closely related to the SAb. just ot sure how to approach them.

Mind you these are not biggies. Just annoiances. But they do bother me. Much has to do with her lack of value and her insecurity. It is like she is writing what happens to fit er need again.
Example - we finally had an interlude one afternoon. I was very nice. Positive on both side I believe. but a day or two later she comments that I got up and left real fast, and it bothers her. Well we layed there a bit, but then I needed to get up and feed the kids. (they were asking for food). It is not like I abandoned he, just had to take care of the kids. So now I am bothered because of her statement. I wasn't like I wanted to leave (that is the bend I get from it), I just need to attent to other needs in the house.

Another is her comments about me. Innocent and not meant to haem, but some are touchy and do bother me. I write them off, but she defends everything by turning it back to me.

I know hese are defense mechanisms, but how do I tell her without stepping al over her toes.

This is stupid i know, but I want it to work, but it has to be two way.

Sorry, just kind of geting it off my chest.


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
just tired
♀ Member
Member # 11609
Default  Posted: 9:49 AM, June 11th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hurts, my husband is a sab. And I only found out about ten years ago. Explains so much about his behavior and affair. He did so much to heal himself before he told me about the affair or his sab.

Now I am healing and changing things wrong in me. I found a book that is helping me tremendously. It is passionate marriage. What is is helping me see is that I am responsible for me and he is responsible for him. If we can become whole people we can then become one and have a better marriage. Whole new concept for me.

It is so hard to look at yourself(really look) and see who you really are. And then do something about it. It takes guts and hard work. And you add sab to that and it is even harder. But start with yourself and hold on to who you are and your beliefs and change what needs changing. Sometimes when an impasse is present someone has to step up and start the changing process. And guess what? Your partner sees the changes and begins to change too. Hopefully. I can not tell you all that was in the book. But it makes sense. When you have two anxious, scared people they feed off each other. If one can hold on to themselves and what they believe and not buy into the others anxieties, well changes occur.

Try reading the book. It is not about sab. It is about healing yourself, which in turns helps your partner. It is about self validating and becoming whole and strong. I need that to help him. How can I help him if I am so needy and weak and mixed up by this marriage?

So for me, heal myself, be the best I can be and so far, for us it is working. He can not heal me or make me feel better. When I get anxious and upset he does too. I use to do the same. I am learning not to let his mood affect mine so much. It is hard and a learning process.

You know what still bothers me? That he does not think of sex as showing love. It boggles my mind. But through that book I have learned something. Just because he thinks and feels that way does not mean I do or have to. My reality is that sex equates love. For me it does. That is why I won't or can't just have sex with anyone like he did and not love them. I was angry and wanted him to feel like I did. He can't. His life experiences and perceptions are so different from mine. Who is right? I do not know for sure. But I am okay with the differences now and know I can not change his reality just like he can't change mine. And I decide if the differences are too much for me to stay. Just how it is. And sometimes it is so scary.


Posts: 1008 | Registered: Aug 2006
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 9:54 AM, June 11th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks just tired, can you confirm the title and author.


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
just tired
♀ Member
Member # 11609
Default  Posted: 11:21 AM, June 12th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sorry took so long.

The book is Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch, Ph.D. Hope it helps.


Posts: 1008 | Registered: Aug 2006
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, June 14th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks.

i took a trip yesterday and spent time with Dd and her family. OK, i was there to help. The only time I hear from her is when she needs something.

But we were talking and she revealed to me that she had been what she believes molested during an overnight stay at a friends house when younger. She had talked to her mom about it but they did not tell me being afraid of my rewponse to him. (Probably a valide point)

but now I am bothered by this. I am seeing so much impact on peoples lives by this. It is staggering to me.

I think tthis is part of my downer today. I just don't know what to do or think and now I feel like I let her down by not being there to protect her and even more by them being afraid to tell me.

I know it is wrong, But inside me I do believe that sometimes a strong, and sometimes a very strong hand is needed with these kinds of people. They damage so much with no concern for the future implications.

How much more don't I know. (besides a lot)


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
Lonerider
♂ Member
Member # 9205
Default  Posted: 11:38 AM, June 14th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hurts,

I against the death penalty, but when I see the pain an abuser causes, and how it can cascade from generation to generation, I wonder if it would make humanity happier overall if abusers were killed, at least the cycle might be stopped.


BS me 43 years old
WS her 45 years old
married 14 years, together 20
2 kids
D-day 7/15/05

Posts: 4225 | Registered: Dec 2005 | From: western NY
s.squirrel
♀ Member
Member # 14742
Default  Posted: 10:07 AM, June 15th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It is about self validating and becoming whole and strong. I need that to help him. How can I help him if I am so needy and weak and mixed up by this marriage?

You are right this is so hard to do. I have had him in my head for so long (acting/reacting to avoid his moods, anger). Sometimes I wonder if I think my own thoughts! But I can, and I will.

It seems that both times his Sab has come up as a topic to deal with it has been in the context of an A. He says I don't want to listen.

Well hell! Bludgeon me with a sledgehammer (emotionally) and then ask for my support?

I did it the last time (10 yrs ago). Now it just seems like an excuse.

Some days I want it to work, and other days I think...why.

Right now I am trying to stay 180 and keep my head clear.

Not easy.
(((everyone)))


Me BS 44
Him WS 45
sons :17, 16
daughter: 13
dday1: 6/1996..separated 1.5yr, then reconciled 1/1998
dday2: 5/7/2007
Separated at last!~10/31/2008
heading -->divorce
But he lost his job in April..so pending, pending, pending.

Posts: 280 | Registered: May 2007 | From: ohio
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 10:43 AM, June 15th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

s.squirrel - welcome. hey i can hear you on the support thoughts. I know that I get the same way. I want to talk to her about this sometimes to help her figure the way. generally it is when the behavior reflecting the SAb is bothering me to a point of havig some kind of impact.

But it is always a delicate issue. She of course doesn't want to drag it up. yet I feel like I too need to find some kind of resolution. And I too feel like it is soetimes not worth the effort. The more I see the more i am ready to just give up trying. Iknow there is worse to come because her IC is finished in one more session. So then all IC/MC is gone. It will be interesting to see how long it lasts from there. I just fea the old habits coming back in and a progression of the symptoms that have created so much problem with me. I say me, because I seem to be the only one with issues concerning some of the behavior. I feel like I am the one who has to adapt, because as she tells me, I am the only one with a problem with it. Of course her circle is so small, there is not anyone else around to complain. Just her sister, who states that they know to just ignore it.

Ok, I digress. Just trying to say, yep, I so hear you....


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
s.squirrel
♀ Member
Member # 14742
Default  Posted: 2:06 PM, June 15th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I feel like I am the one who has to adapt

I ALWAYS feel like this. And I have to stop.

I am coming to believe that adapt=enable.

S.


Me BS 44
Him WS 45
sons :17, 16
daughter: 13
dday1: 6/1996..separated 1.5yr, then reconciled 1/1998
dday2: 5/7/2007
Separated at last!~10/31/2008
heading -->divorce
But he lost his job in April..so pending, pending, pending.

Posts: 280 | Registered: May 2007 | From: ohio
brokenhalo
♀ Member
Member # 14754
Default  Posted: 9:08 AM, June 19th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Update after MC session:

If anyone wants to know, my MC was singing a different tune after I read my anger letter about my husband and the SA he has put me through during our marriage.

First thing she asks after the lesson was: Are you going to stay? I replied I did not know. I still do not know. Then she asked if I loved my husband and I still said no. Then she explained how my actions show I care for him and how I can choose to love him. I said, I care because he needs to get better to for our kids sake.

Then somehow we got on to why I have stayed and I remembered an incident when my daughter was young. Hubby and I had a fight and I was leaving and was going to take her with me. He would not let me take her and that just triggered me to digress and always think...I can't take the kids, so I am staying.

Hubby starts to do his Passive Agressive downplaying and the MC stopped him. She boldly asked him, "Do you understand you do not make threats to a mother about their children?" He started skirting around the question and she asked him again. He backed down and said yes.

After all that and we had to go back and sum up the session. She reiterated how the letter I wrote was well done and I was able to create a picture of the abuse and show in my own words how I was strong again. Then stated how couples usually go to MC because they can not take it anymore in the marriage. And it is a last resort. Though all marriages can not be saved something positive can come out of the situation and we can grow from it. She had never said that before, it was always how much stronger we can become. I kind of got the impression she no longer sees a reason for me to stay and I am starting to see it too. I don't start IC with her for a month or so, so to actually sit her down and get her opinion will be a while. I am fine with that though, I am still learning about myself and my husband is still trying to figure out himself. In the meantime, I feel safe staying put for now and will enjoy the summer with the kids.


Me (BS): 35 Him (WH): 34
Kids: DD 10, DS 6
WH/SA: EA with my Sister 2001-2003
EA then PA with sister's BF and his co-worker 7 months in 2002
D-Day #1 12/31/2002 our anniversary: Denied but stopped his A
D-Day #2 3/11/2007 Admitted A

Posts: 67 | Registered: May 2007 | From: TX
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 12:10 PM, June 19th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BH - I am so glad that the session followed what seems tobe a rasonable course. I am also glad that MC finally saw he light as to whats happening from your perspective. It sounds like there might be a bit of travel on the path, but hopefully it is the path to healing.

Have a great summer.......

(((((brokenhalo)))))


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
shoulditrust
♂ New Member
Member # 15011
Default  Posted: 2:33 PM, June 19th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

To those out there your words are encouraging. I am a BS of a WW that has SA as a child and as an adult. I want to make it work with my WW. I found out about the OM's (4 in the last 3 months)last week. my WW say's it was just sex and nothing more. Looking for advice. I am feeling better sort of, she has been in counciling since she started the A's(the time line is right) can we overcome or am i going to go through this again. if anyone can help with words, i look forward to it.
ps my counciling starts this week.

Posts: 2 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: arizona
Lonerider
♂ Member
Member # 9205
Default  Posted: 2:59 PM, June 19th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

shoulditrust,

Welcome to the SAB thread.

Based on my limited experience, you and your WW have a lot of work ahead of you, but it's encouraging that she's in counseling.


BS me 43 years old
WS her 45 years old
married 14 years, together 20
2 kids
D-day 7/15/05

Posts: 4225 | Registered: Dec 2005 | From: western NY
citpz
♂ Member
Member # 13505
Default  Posted: 12:37 AM, June 20th (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really need some advise. I am at such a loss. Let me give you the brief nutshell.

Five years ago my wife had a PA with a man. It was the day her cousin died. He hit on her at her uncle's house while she was there helping family out. She was very close to her cousin and was devastated by his death. He was young and died in a horrible car accident. She asked me to stay home and watch our daughter. Then asked me again the day of the wake, more PA. Then asked me again the day of the funeral, more PA.

I did not know about this. I suspected because I had been on the WS side in the form of a boyfriend before, so the warning signs were very familiar to me. I confronted, she denied. The guy never called her back so she dropped it.

Fast forward to November 2006. Married 8 years with two children. She started calling the same guy secretly and rekindled the flame into an EA. On December 1st 2006 my WW told me she wanted a divorce. I was devastated and surprised. I started to go away for the weekend to think about everything. I came home and found some correspondences on the computer between her and OM. I put the pieces together about five years ago from one sentence:

"i want you to know i'm sorry for the way i handled things"

I confronted and got the truth. We talked, decided on MC. In MC it comes out that she was sexually abused by her step father. This becomes the focus of therapy. First counselor is a nut job. Second counselor invalidates us both. Six months go by with two horrible MC and we finally find a good MC and IC for her.

I knew OM had cheated on his wife. I run across a link while searching for his name and find out he is in the sexual offenders database. I show WW. She has that same deer in the headlights look she had when I confronted her about the A in December.

She knew about his sexual offense (statutory rape, he was 24 and the girl was 15, there were drugs involved and took advantage of the girl). WW claimed he gave her a watered down version. WW knew of other times he had cheated on his wife. She knew that he had been in jail for assault. She knew many things about this man and none of them were good.

I am just finding out about the sexual offender thing. I knew this guy was a predator, but now I have legal evidence that he is. I am so confused right now. Why in the world would she pursue this man and possibly put our daughters in harms way? Why would she do that to herself? Why would she go from a husband that has never cheated on anyone he has been with to that? Why do we spend all our time in counseling dealing with her sexual abuse? Why can I not breath anymore? Is the overwhelming fear of this happening again rational? It seems so to me. So many question. I have so many questions.

I don't know what to do! On the one hand I can rip everything out from under her and move on with my life. On the other hand I can try to help her. She wont talk to me though. I have no room to heal. I fear for my children's safety now! She was going to put them in harms way. She was going to set them up to live just like she did!!! WTF? How could she do that? Why can't she separate her past from the present enough to see that? How do I help her see that? Can I help her see that?

Sorry for all the questions. That is just all I have now, questions, no answers.


Posts: 65 | Registered: Jan 2007
orchid
Member
Member # 7223
Default  Posted: 3:16 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Is it because of the sexual abuse or is my H just a selfish, self-centered ego maniac. He has never said he was sorry or expressed remorse over his affairs. I have tried to live with that. But, I do have emotional needs and physical our sex life ended when the last affair(that I know of)began. I asked him several months ago why he never Emails me anymore and he said he realized he could be anyone he wanted to when he Emailed so he quit. Seemed a strange thing to say but I let it go. Yesterday I sent him an Email and he mentioned this morning he got it. I said how about you sending me one. His response? Oh, they all know I don't send Emails!! WTF!! They all knowWhat kind of unfeeling idiot would say that to his BS. Oh he didn't mean what I thought he used a client for an example. She emailed another person in the office and said she knew Mr Orchid didn't send Emails so would they just give him a message. Get the shethere. Guess the friggen idiot doesn't know any men so he has to use women as examples. He has narcissitic tendencies and he is PA and he is emotionally abusive. Ask me why I even try. I am seriously considering finding a man to fill my needs cause I think I am giving up. That could be what he wants but I wish he would just say so and end this mess we are in.

[This message edited by orchid at 3:20 PM, June 22nd (Friday)]


You can't change the direction of the wind, but you can adjust your sails.

Posts: 229 | Registered: May 2005 | From: Western US
hurts
♂ Member
Member # 9444
Default  Posted: 6:55 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

shoulditrust - Hey sorry it is coming round on you.But I am in a like type sitch. As said, it is a long hard road and it can be so tough at times. But it can be done. If you love your W and you are willing to do it, then I would say give it a try. You will regret it if you just walk.

but the first subject on the table is transparency and a complete NC with anyone else. If she is not willing to cease the behavior then it has much more to do than SAb.

citpz - man that is a tough spot. In My poor opinion, I think I would try talking to the IC and MC. I guess I would fear that there is more out there and how much more can you take. As to the children, if she is hanging with this jerk, then you need to protect the kids. Take it to the MC and IC and be very upfront about how you feel.


Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?"
Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
--- Charles M. Schulz
SO if I check my pulse, and it is not there, do I get the day off?

Posts: 8381 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: At Home
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