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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Sexual Abuse Survivors/Spouses of SAB's
tputer
♂ Member
Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 9:17 PM, March 14th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The SAb and sex avoidance

We are now almost to 3 years post DDay. And yet, even this far out, FWW and I are still having some very heart to heart, honest conversations. You'd have thought we'd have had these conversations earlier in the path to R, but with a SAb, you must approach subjects on their timeline. Even then, it's dicey at best. One never knows what areas are safe to discuss, and which ones hit a raw nerve.

Tonight, I hit a raw nerve. It's been no secret to me that FWW has no libido whatsoever. Zilch. Nada. Tonight I addressed this issue with her. She finally admitted to having no libido, and not missing it one bit. Doesn't want to do anything about it like seeing a doctor for hormonal suplements, etc (she's 47 and perimenopausal, so lower sex drive is to be expected).

I finally had the realization that the problem with her is twofold: natural decrease in libido due to life changes, and added to that, the complications of SAb. Specifically, her sexuality has always gotten her into trouble, so in order to avoid trouble, stay away from sexuality.

Her IC has talked to her about making a distinction between good sex and bad sex, but she has yet to make that connection. To her, all sex is more trouble than it's worth, so let's just not even go there.

The big problem is that I'm a very sexual person. So we now have a major conflict. I either reconcile myself to a sexless marriage, or she suffers through what she percieves as "servicing me" - neither one of us satisfied.

I'll be honest - this one scares me. I was able - for the most part - to overlook her infidelities. But I don't look forward to a future of perpetual sexual conflict.

I'm asking her to go back to IC. She obviously has some major work to do in this area. But the problem here, as I see it, is that she's not real enthusiastic about going back to IC.

I love her tremendously - absolutely, completely with all my heart. She also loves me very, very much and is terrified she going to lose me. I told her I'm in this for the long run. But this issue needs some resolution.

Anybody have any words of wisdom? We sure could use them.

[This message edited by tputer at 9:26 PM, March 14th (Saturday)]


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
Chipmunkie
♀ Member
Member # 21653
Default  Posted: 9:56 PM, March 14th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aww..damn...
There are just too many issues at play here.
The thing with Sab? the self blame.
Doesn't matter how many times we are told it's not our fault. We hear it and agree.
But, does that make it go away?
No, it doesn't. We all identify in our own way and unique time.

I'm sorry that you need more than is offered. The fact that you are willing to admit to your love for her openly is a big thing.
There is no shame in a love given freely. There is no shame in a love without expectations.
There is no shame in admitting that you need more.

What my Dad did to me has forever changed me. Can I explain the subtle nuances of what happened? NEVER.

I love and miss my Dad. I don't know that I totally forgive him for what he did, but I have some sort of love for him.
That is a very difficult thing to reconcile in the grand scheme of things.
I hear your frustration.. at the same time I understand the other side.
There is no easy answer. I wish I could give that to you.
The only and best advice I can give.. love her unconditionally, understand when there are things that can't be explained.
She knows.. yes, anyone in this situation has internalized and questioned this endlessly..
Give her the space she needs without letting her feel abandoned.

I know... so very difficult and frustrating, but in the end, the pain is something that must be dealt with on our own terms.

It's great that you wish to help her with this, but ultimately she has to be the one to cross that river.
It's a biggie and hard to hear..
But, this is her issue. She has to decide to either let it go or let it decide her fate.

Tough words, but..spoken by someone who lives this neverending nightmare every day of my life.

Sorry.... I wish it could be more.


Me: BW
Him: Irrelevant Bastard

About ~C.? I hear she even keeps a bottle in her desk at work. Not in an alcoholic way but in a kick ass Humphrey Bogart kinda way.


Posts: 494 | Registered: Nov 2008
tputer
♂ Member
Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 10:28 PM, March 14th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you Chip. I get what you're saying, and don't believe this is the end of the road as far as our sex life is concerned. This just isn't going to be a quick fix. This is going to take a while to resolve, and as of now, we don't really have a clear roadmap. We're both frustrated, and of course her being a SAb, she feels like I'm pressuring her.That in turn frustrates me. We're speaking different languages at this point.


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
Chipmunkie
♀ Member
Member # 21653
Default  Posted: 10:46 PM, March 14th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We're speaking different languages at this point.

Yep.
And neither one is completely understood.

It is a sad thing. The damage done is indeterminate.

Keep doing what you are doing.
I can't really speak for any other Sab's but as for me?
All I ever wanted anyone to tell me is that I am worthy and at the least lovable.

You love her. That speaks volumes. Whether she admits to hearing or not. She feels it.

To someone like us. There really is nothing better. That to us is golden.
Don't give up. The person you need is in there. It's just a question of breaking down the self-imposed barriers.
It really is all about feeling worthy.
Are we really worthy of such a love? That is the million dollar question.

p.s. I'm probably projecting my own idiosyncrasies here. Maybe I shouldn't be giving advice when I don't even have my own stuff together.


Me: BW
Him: Irrelevant Bastard

About ~C.? I hear she even keeps a bottle in her desk at work. Not in an alcoholic way but in a kick ass Humphrey Bogart kinda way.


Posts: 494 | Registered: Nov 2008
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 11:17 PM, March 14th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

i'll second what chip said.

sab forever changes who we are, and forever affects our self-esteem and gives us a fear of intimacy.

you are right that there is no quick fix. things will get better though. just remember, this is not personal against you. someone else 'broke' her a long time ago.


(tputer)


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
tputer
♂ Member
Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 12:04 AM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

p.s. I'm probably projecting my own idiosyncrasies here.

I think you're dead on accurate.

this is not personal against you. someone else 'broke' her a long time ago.

its, that would be her bio father

[This message edited by tputer at 12:05 AM, March 15th (Sunday)]


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
feelinginthedark
♀ Member
Member # 10933
Default  Posted: 4:54 AM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good to have this column. so far in my life it is the not finding people to talk about this that was harder than the actual incident. This was a one time incident, not when i was a child etc but it was hard enough.Was someone saying SAb and infidelity go hand in hand? I will have to read from the beginning. Hope I have the time. The Sab wa snt with my H (but its complicated)

Posts: 606 | Registered: Jun 2006
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 3:38 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Are we really worthy of such a love? That is the million dollar question.

this is something that goes through my head on a daily basis, and i think other survivors as well. when i think about it, i know i am worthy, as is any other human being. however, the heart and emotions seem to take control of thinking. they are stronger.


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
Chipmunkie
♀ Member
Member # 21653
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know its. Maybe they aren't really stronger. Maybe they are just more persistent. We all know the honesty of our value, it's just extremely well hidden under the scars.

My very first memory is of being molested by my Dad. I was probably all of three at the time. It continued until I was around 13 or so and finally found the strength (God knows from where) to put an end to it and say no more.

I do believe that all those years played into me allowing myself to not only marry but spend 22 years with an abusive narcissist.
It was what I knew? Right?

I never told anyone about it until sometime in my thirties. It was best left alone.

My Mom knew. Oh, yes she did. She actively encouraged us (my sisters as well) to "go and make your daddy happy"

I tried to talk to her about it years later. That ended badly. How dare I even attempt to pass judgement on her and so on..whatever.. Thanks Mom.

My biggest struggle with all of it? I still love my Dad. I feel like I should hate him, I just can't.
Makes no sense I know.

I do have immense anger for my Mom though.

Enough rambling.. so its?
Are we worthy? Yes.

The bigger question is how do we not only allow it, but embrace it?


Me: BW
Him: Irrelevant Bastard

About ~C.? I hear she even keeps a bottle in her desk at work. Not in an alcoholic way but in a kick ass Humphrey Bogart kinda way.


Posts: 494 | Registered: Nov 2008
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Doesn't matter how many times we are told it's not our fault.

right on. doesn't matter what we (cognitively) think, what we hear. there is still the deep down knowledge that we are to blame. now, again, cognitively, i know it's not true.

but, somehow, it's impossible to believe that.


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
Chipmunkie
♀ Member
Member # 21653
Default  Posted: 4:44 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yep.
That's what I was referring to by mentioning scars.
You build up years of it doesn't matter and eventually it turns into a shield. It deflects everything coming at you externally.

It's the internal stuff that kicks your ass.


Me: BW
Him: Irrelevant Bastard

About ~C.? I hear she even keeps a bottle in her desk at work. Not in an alcoholic way but in a kick ass Humphrey Bogart kinda way.


Posts: 494 | Registered: Nov 2008
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 5:09 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

chip, i think i was typing my reply as you were typing yours...

My Mom knew. Oh, yes she did. She actively encouraged us (my sisters as well) to "go and make your daddy happy"

i am so so sorry. so, so sorry.

i think my mom probably knew. she just ignored. she was so overwhelmed and beaten down (emotionally, not physically) by my father that she was powerless to do anything.

i am working on forgiving her. i still have love for her.

but for my father?

no.

not only no, but hell, no.


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 5:20 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it IS the internal stuff that kicks your ass.

i'm so tired of my ass being kicked.


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
GreenEyedMe
♀ Member
Member # 21452
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

***content edited to protect my privacy***

[This message edited by GreenEyedMe at 10:30 AM, April 4th (Saturday)]


Me - BS
Divorced

Posts: 109 | Registered: Oct 2008
GreenEyedMe
♀ Member
Member # 21452
Default  Posted: 6:05 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Safe warm hugs to all of us


Me - BS
Divorced

Posts: 109 | Registered: Oct 2008
TwiceTorn
♂ Member
Member # 13895
Default  Posted: 6:36 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I dunno where else to post this, but it seems like the place.

A little history maybe needed, My XWW was SAB from the time she was 5-12 years old from her father and her cousin. I didn't learn this till after the second DDay. Course my XWW never delt with it, and has later progressed into the way she is today.

My SO of 21 months was also SAB by her grandpa. She was very upfront about it. She told her mother right after it happened and was in IC as a child dealing with it. She is a survivor on all accounts. Her libido is very much in sinc with mine.

So now straight to the point. My Adopted Daughter was SAB when she was 5. She told her mom right away. She 13 now, has been to IC to deal with it. The SOB that did this to her is dead now. He got sentanced to prision because of 3 others he touched. So yesturday I get certified mail asking my Daughter to testify in a trial. Apparently the SOB killed himself on a OD of drugs while in state custody, and the parents are sueing the state.

No Fucking way am I putting my Daughter through that again. Shes a happy 13 year old, finding herself. The SOB killed himself, plain and simple. The parents of this creep trying to sue the state!? Yes my Daughter was his 3rd conviction and put on the stand at 6 years old. I will not as a parent make her relive this.


You've got to trust your instinct
And let go of regret
You've got to bet on yourself now star
'Cause that's your best bet~311 All mixed up


Posts: 3597 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Minnesota
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 9:08 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tt, have you talked to your daughter's ic about this?

my initial instinct is to say, protect her from it at all costs.

but then i second guessed myself.

there is a possibility it might provide closure she needs.

but, then again, it might not.

i would definitely consult her ic about it. see what is best for HER.

(((((hugs)))))

[This message edited by itspjw at 11:50 PM, March 15th (Sunday)]


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((((((hugs for all)))))))


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
itspjw
♀ Member
Member # 21268
Default  Posted: 11:51 PM, March 15th (Sunday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

okay, so...

my h has to call our c tomorrow to change our mc session. we use the same c for mc and ic.

i think i am going to ask h when he calls to make me an appointment for ic to talk about my father.

please pray for me.


no, I can't take one more step towards you...cuz all that's waiting is regret...

there's just too much that time cannot erase

dday 9/11/08

And the more I know, the less I understand

Because of you...I am afraid...


Posts: 14786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Texas
Lonerider
♂ Member
Member # 9205
Default  Posted: 11:19 AM, March 16th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tputer,

I hear you brother, I could have written that, except I'm not to the point where I ask DW to ask her IC about it.


BS me 43 years old
WS her 45 years old
married 14 years, together 20
2 kids
D-day 7/15/05

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