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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: For Those That Love An Alcoholic
contrail
Member
Member # 30152
Default  Posted: 9:28 PM, January 30th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So what do you do when the OW is an alcoholic and your stbx seems to have turned into one, or at least you believe he has?

The thing is, I really do not know what has happened, or what is happening. He just vanished. He disappeared and all communication stopped. He blamed me for the NC, but the only reason I stopped talking to him was because my counselor told me to. Why? Because talking to him was like talking to a lunatic. I walked away feeling like *I* was the crazy one. Every conversation left me more confused, guilt ridden, depressed, panicked and unsure of what in the hell was going on. I could go from completely sure of myself and the world to having no self esteem and no idea of anything in the course of one conversation. It was and is pure lunacy.

So, for my own mental health and because there is no benefit, I have gone NC and we now only speak through our attorneys and occasional emails and phone calls when I have to.

When we do talk, there is NO discussion of his girlfriend, the affair, the divorce, anything. It is like nothing is going on and nothing is wrong. It is... bizarre.

Everyone I know who sees it, who interacts with us together and watches it, they all say how insane it is. It is like being in an alternate universe where everything is the same except you know it is not real. It is a nightmare you cannot wake up from.

But I suspect, because the OW has made comments on Facebook, that he either was a functional alcoholic and I never knew, or he has become one since he was with her.

Considering his family history of alcoholism, he is primed for it, genetically. My grandfather was a horrible drunk, so I really hate the thought of having to deal with two of them for the rest of my life, let alone for my kids to have to deal with it!

UGH!


Me (BS): 39
Our children: 9 & 6
Married 16 years.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
WH:40 ; OW: 37
(Two drunken peas in the same pathetic pod.)
The OW has children that live with them.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Nov 2010
MzMagoo
♀ Member
Member # 30978
Default  Posted: 9:48 PM, January 30th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Because talking to him was like talking to a lunatic. I walked away feeling like *I* was the crazy one. Every conversation left me more confused, guilt ridden, depressed, panicked and unsure of what in the hell was going on. I could go from completely sure of myself and the world to having no self esteem and no idea of anything in the course of one conversation. It was and is pure lunacy.

I can relate to this so much that it is scary. I feel like this every time we have a conversation, whether it is in person, text, or call. And it is awful.

I'm so sorry you are going through this.

(((contrail)))


BS (me) 37/WS (him)37
M 13 years/together 18
DD 1~ 8-10/ DD 2~ 11-10
3 kids~ S 14, D 10, D 10
Filed for D: 11-10
R: Trying to trust it is real
If you walk around the pool long enough, you are bound to fall in.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: At the moment? Hell.
phoenix_vs
♀ Member
Member # 29193
Default  Posted: 11:09 PM, January 30th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree. I avoid him when he is really drunk because it is like you say, being in a bad dream where everything is crazy and you can't wake up. And everything is your fault.
But I know better. Since I've been reading and posting on here, I've become so much better.
Except I'm in limbo right now. I don't know what is going on, really. Only that I'm trying to work on myself.
Hugs to all of you.


I'm not sad that you lied to me. I'm sad that I can never believe you again.

Well, I'm sad that you lied to me, too.


Posts: 371 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Great Falls Montana
betrayed1012
♂ Member
Member # 26112
Default  Posted: 11:54 PM, January 30th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((contrail)))

I never knew how far along my xWW was until I threw her bottle away and she went into DTs a day or so later. She was a closet drinker using every opportunity to drink behind my back. She was quite functional for a long time, but her job performance was spiralling down. It is quite possible for WS to have been an alcoholic and you never realize how bad it was.

Because talking to him was like talking to a lunatic.

Stick to NC as best you can. It will do no good to try to have a rational conversation with an irrational person-an active alcoholic. He will blame all his problems on you, the phase of the moon, anything but what it really is-him. I made the mistake of thinking I could reason with my alcoholic, make her see the insanity. I would lose my temper with the lies and her accusations and that was just what she wanted. I had justified wht she was doing and she could say "You are angry and a risk to my sobriety". She would also say "he accepts me and is my support network, you can't ask me to give him up." of the OM that she met in detox. She could never see the insanity of her statements and actions. It wasn't me who was relapsing with her for days and weeks, but the OM, yet I was the risk to her sobriety? Please continue NC for your sanity. Anything you say won't help and will be turned against you.

What can you do? You can only control what you do. Not what he'll or the alcoholic OW will do. Their problems are their's to own and their's to fix. Until the alcoholism is under control, he can't work on the marriage. What can you do? Take care of yourself and your children.

[This message edited by betrayed1012 at 11:56 PM, January 30th (Sunday)]


BS 52
WW 41
Dday 10/12/09
Filed Divorce Complaint 2/1/10
Together 18 year
M 14 years
Children: 11 & 7

Divorced 10/14/10


Posts: 1010 | Registered: Nov 2009
contrail
Member
Member # 30152
Default  Posted: 8:07 PM, January 31st (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks everyone. I am glad to find some people who actually understand.


Me (BS): 39
Our children: 9 & 6
Married 16 years.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
WH:40 ; OW: 37
(Two drunken peas in the same pathetic pod.)
The OW has children that live with them.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Nov 2010
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 10:23 AM, February 2nd (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

contrail-
It's very possible that he was a functional alcoholic and was drinking a lot more than you realized.
I know a woman whose husband is now sober (and he also had an LTA) ...but, during those LTA years his drinking got really bad and the wife had no clue.
The OW was also an alcoholic and they would travel for work functions and drink there.
But, at home-this guy was so sneaky. He was a smoker and would go out on the porch for his cigarette. And, he had a stash of beer in the garage and elsewhere...would drink it on his smoke break and kept a secret recycling can under the porch for all of the beer cans!
The good news in that case is after d-day the guy did get sober and the couple did reconcile.
But, when they are in the grips of their addiction it is insanity. They are not thinking logically at all. And, they often do behave in incredibly selfish ways.

All you can do at this point is to take care of yourself and your children. Do what's best for you and detach from his addiction.
Do not beg or plead.
He has to hit bottom before he 'wakes up'.
The trouble is you never know what 'bottom' is.It's different for all of alcoholics.
For some its a DUI, or losing their marriage, losing their job etc.
Others... don't stop drinking until much worse hapens.

Have you gone to ALANON?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
plzwakeme
♀ Member
Member # 30645
Default  Posted: 1:38 PM, February 2nd (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Help!

I am feeling so confused. FWH and I are in R, which is going really well, all things considered. H quit drinking 10/21/2010. He travels for work and did most of his drinking on the road, totally hiding how much and how often he was really getting totally hammered. His second A started as a result of heavy, heavy drinking at his sales meeting last year, so I made it a condition of R that he had to stop altogether, especially because in the early days of R he told me that the A happened because of how much he was drinking, etc. Not an excuse, per se, more of a "this is where I was mentally," statement.

So we've been stuck on him addressing his issues that led to his As. He refuses to say that he is an alcoholic, instead calling himself a "problem drinker." He will one day tell me he knows he can never drink again, and then the next tell me that he thinks if he gets his underlying issues (which he hadn't identified because he's dragging his feet into IC) that he'll be able to be a social drinker again.

I am trying very hard to not preach, nag or judge so as to now give him any reason (in his head) for something to rebel against (I know this is part of his issue, though not identified in MC or IC yet). I have been trying to be supportive of him but taking care of myself.

So here is my major problem. Last night he was out of town and called me when he got back to his hotel room. He was kind of funny on the phone for a while, making me nervous. Finally he said, "I have to tell you something." I guess you can imagine how my heart stoppped. He went to say, "I had a glass of wine at dinner tonight. It wasn't a big deal, I only had one." I didn't say anything because I was in total shock.

He then rushed on, "There were a whole bunch of people from work and all of the customers around the table so they ordered two bottles of wine. Everyone had a glass in front of them, so I felt awkward asking the waiter to not fill mine. But it's ok because I didn't have another one, I am not going to have a glass tomorrow with dinner, and I'm not thinking this means I can start drinking socially."

I was totally speechless for a long time. Then I told him that I was hurt because it was a sneaky, crappy thing to do. Also, blaming it on "peer pressure" was so juevenile and one of the things he's supposed to be identifying as a weakness, his need to please and look good in front of others. It's how he got into the PA mess with OW.

I am seriously confused about what I feel and what I should do. This is also coming off the heels of him telling me after his first IC meeting that he doesn't think I need Al-Anon. He said the same thing to our MC last week who told him that it's selfish for him to say what I do or don't need ( ) and that Al-Anon has nothing to do with him, it's a support network for me.

So should I make a big deal out of this or let it go with my discussion that I've already had. Should I press the point when he gets home from traveling or let it go? I am so confused!


Me BW 37, Him STBXH 38
Married 13 years, hoping to NOT make it to 14
DDay 1 10/21/10
4 MOW & many ONS attempts
Heading towards S/D NOT SOON ENOUGH!
"What the caterpillar calls the end, a butterfly calls the beginning." ~ Lao Tzu

Posts: 574 | Registered: Jan 2011
contrail
Member
Member # 30152
Default  Posted: 7:05 PM, February 2nd (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have considered AL-ANON. Once the divorce is over, I am going to look for a group in the area so I can learn how to help the kids, I think.

I really do wonder about whether he was hiding a drinking problem. He did always have meetings for work and sports leagues and the like... but I never thought to suspect. Hindsight, as they say.

Now, with the clearly alcoholic OW and all the posts about them going out and partying, which we NEVER did, and her stating on FB that he is becoming a lush... I can only wonder.

It really makes me want to cry, not for myself, but for the kids. How selfish can you get?


Me (BS): 39
Our children: 9 & 6
Married 16 years.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
WH:40 ; OW: 37
(Two drunken peas in the same pathetic pod.)
The OW has children that live with them.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Nov 2010
phoenix_vs
♀ Member
Member # 29193
Default  Posted: 9:44 AM, February 3rd (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he doesn't think I need Al-Anon. He said the same thing to our MC last week who told him that it's selfish for him to say what I do or don't need and that Al-Anon has nothing to do with him, it's a support network for me.

Who is he to tell you who to be?

Al Anon is for you. Not sitting around bashing alcoholics. It's for you. To learn to detach with love, to let him own what is his, and you own what is yours. You can benefit a tremendous amount from Al Anon. Look around and find a group that meets at a convenient time for you, and that you feel comfortable with. They are welcoming, comforting and totally nonjudgemental. You also will have the opportunity to help others, and that in itself will help you in return.

I feel you guys. When I discovered the man I lived with was (is) an alcoholic, I was stunned. I was right there with him, and he hid it so well, I never knew. Never even thought it was possible. I never knew a person could be so sneaky right in front of me.

Plz, they totally minimize what they drink. They all think it's not that much, it was only one, and they will stop. But they can't and they don't. So disregard the self-assessment they give you. If they drink at all, they're actively drinking and the quantity doesn't matter as much as the fact that they are drinking, and they are in no mental position to evaluate how much. We need to detach from their minimizing, their excuses, and take care of ourselves. So, don't say anything else about the wine. One other thing alcoholics are is guilty. They feel overwhelming guilt. Inside they know what they do. Outside they minimize it.

How selfish can you get?

Contrail, I haven't seen the limit, yet. Unbelievably selfish. Take care of yourself, they aren't going to.

(((Hugs to all)))


I'm not sad that you lied to me. I'm sad that I can never believe you again.

Well, I'm sad that you lied to me, too.


Posts: 371 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Great Falls Montana
betrayed1012
♂ Member
Member # 26112
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, February 3rd (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Contrail,

You need Al-Anon for you.

Once the divorce is over, I am going to look for a group in the area so I can learn how to help the kids, I think.

It's not for helping the alcoholic or your children, it's for you. You need need help yourself so you can help them. It is hard to realize the damage that has been done to you over the years by his disease. To take care of others, you need to first take care of you using Al-Anon, IC, or whatever.

For me it all hit in a short amount of time, from July to October. I went from trying to help my wife and care for my children while doing so to having her disappear for days on a drunk with the guy she met in detox. I suddenly realized I was a single parent with an alcoholic WW who had found her new love. I needed a lot of help to deal with that.

Do take care of yourself.


BS 52
WW 41
Dday 10/12/09
Filed Divorce Complaint 2/1/10
Together 18 year
M 14 years
Children: 11 & 7

Divorced 10/14/10


Posts: 1010 | Registered: Nov 2009
contrail
Member
Member # 30152
Default  Posted: 7:36 PM, February 3rd (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yea, I suppose you are right. The last six months have been really surreal. It is hard to have a twenty year relationship just... vanish overnight. Well, in three weeks, anyway. That is how long it took him from telling me to serving me papers and moving out. Yeah.

There has been so much chaos and insanity surrounding the divorce. Even the attorneys cannot believe how bizarre it all is.

I guess I am downplaying it all.

I wonder if I will ever know exactly what happened and what the truth is. There is no communication between us and he has not once been willing to tell me anything.

[This message edited by contrail at 7:39 PM, February 3rd (Thursday)]


Me (BS): 39
Our children: 9 & 6
Married 16 years.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
WH:40 ; OW: 37
(Two drunken peas in the same pathetic pod.)
The OW has children that live with them.

Posts: 271 | Registered: Nov 2010
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 7:41 PM, February 3rd (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Plzwakeme-
Definitely make a big deal of it!!!
He is an alcoholic.
He needs to be 100% sober-no in between.
It's like being pregnant...you either are or you're not....

he has been cheating on you.
he's blaming it on booze...
which may or may not be true but the two often go together.
You do not deserve to be treated this way.

What kind of marriage do you want?
Tell him.

You need to lay out your demands for reconciliation and stick to them.

It sounds as if he is still in the 'fog'.
He doesn't get it.
He is in denial.

What did your MC say to him?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
plzwakeme
♀ Member
Member # 30645
Default  Posted: 11:20 AM, February 8th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal: We go to MC tomorrow. I've brought it up with him again and he seems to realize now that having that drink WAS significant. I told him that be did exactly everything that terrifies me: he snuck it while he was traveling on the road and he did it impulsively so that he didn't "look odd" to his peers. It's so high school I can hardly stand it sometimes.

He says he knows he needs to work on things, but he's being passive about getting help. He was supposed to have his second IC appointment yesterday but scheduled himself out of town and didn't reschedule his appt. I'm not going to bring it up. He knows that IC is a condition of R, but he also seems to think that as long as he shows me that he's changed that he'll be able to get out of that one, I think.

Should I put a time table on it? I am trying to help myself to stop being codependent, so I don't think I should be reminding him to reschedule and stay on track with it. Should I bring the whole point up in MC?


Me BW 37, Him STBXH 38
Married 13 years, hoping to NOT make it to 14
DDay 1 10/21/10
4 MOW & many ONS attempts
Heading towards S/D NOT SOON ENOUGH!
"What the caterpillar calls the end, a butterfly calls the beginning." ~ Lao Tzu

Posts: 574 | Registered: Jan 2011
Why??
♀ Member
Member # 18132
Default  Posted: 2:31 PM, March 4th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

*bump*

I had a dream last night involving xwh. We were together in some form but I don't know how and I called him on my old cell # and he was getting liquor and I was like you've been sober xx, why are you doing this...what drama...I do not miss waiting for the other shoe to drop at any moment. I do pray he is ok and not relapsed. Can't believe after all this time he pops up in my dreams


"Don't let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

Posts: 1828 | Registered: Feb 2008
socold
♂ Member
Member # 17400
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, March 4th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Why??)))

I don't have any advice or knowledge to share, but I too had vivid dreams like this in the years after. It's been a while though, but I also would be waking up wondering "Why the hell did that just happen?".


(me)fBH 35
D-Day Dec 9, 2007
D final Oct 19th 2010

Posts: 2584 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: in a van down by the river
Why??
♀ Member
Member # 18132
Default  Posted: 5:42 PM, March 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi socold Thanks -I hope things are going well in your neck of the woods!

I think the upcoming 1 year anniv. date of my dog passing away (also the last time I spoke to xwh) is stirring up emotions. Hard to believe a whole year can go by and NC with x. I miss my dog


"Don't let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game."

Posts: 1828 | Registered: Feb 2008
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 5:53 PM, March 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So sorry that you are triggering one year later but that's very common. Whether you are reconciling or not recovery takes a long time.
Watching all the craziness with Charlie Sheen it makes me realize how totally out of control addicts can get.
Your husband is most likely living an extremely toxic life.
Amazing that you have no clue as to where he is and how he is.All you can do is to take care of yourself and pray for him.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
Crushed1
♀ Member
Member # 6449
Default  Posted: 11:35 PM, March 10th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

O.M.G. !!!!!! I just went into our bedroom to get my robe. There was a large puddle of liquid on the floor next to our bed and at first I thought the toilet had overflowed or something but there was no trail of water, just this large puddle. And he is DRUNK!!!! OMG, he has urinated on the floor!!!!!! That's all it can be.

He was passed out and I woke him up and asked him what that was on the floor and he said he doesn't know, it looks like water, and he doesn't know how the 'water' got there. Then he said son or I must have poured the water on the floor and forgot about it!!! OMG. ##*#$&%%^!*(#&%$&&%(%(!@!!!!!!!!

Youngest son, 16, said he heard H get up from the bed and he heard the sound of something dripping on the floor. There is no other answer except that he urinated on the floor!!!

Freaking hell...I guess I'm going to try and go to Alanon for help for son and I. H will not get help. Of course, he doesn't have a problem, he can handle the drinking.

I'm at my wits end, I don't know what to do anymore. I'm sick, I mean really, with a rare blood disease and just underwent bone marrow biopsy four days ago. I can't deal with this.

I've got blood work again tomorrow, and doctor next week...and God help me make it through this nightmare. I just don't know what to do. Help....


~~"You can't run away from yourself"!!! Me to my H when he descended into adultery insanity.
~~Prov.15:13 "By sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken"
~~"The day breaks-your mind aches"
~STRENGTH~PEACE~HOPE~FAITH

Posts: 9623 | Registered: Feb 2005 | From: Texas
hopefulmom
♀ Member
Member # 23556
Default  Posted: 5:09 AM, March 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((( Crushed1)))

I feel for you.
Been there.
Take care of yourself.


me-44
WH-45
married 22 years
Dday 10/08
Divorced!

Posts: 257 | Registered: Apr 2009
MixedUpMess
♀ Member
Member # 15256
Default  Posted: 7:09 AM, March 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((( CRUSHED1 ))) Hugs from me, too. He must have been pretty loaded to have peed on the floor. Do you have anyone who can go with you for support for the tests/doctor's visits? It helps. Been there, done that through my health issues.


D-Day: 5-28-2007
Married: 26 years
Me (BS): 48 (Cancer survivor!)
Him (WS)(Alcoholic): 48
DD: 17
False R for 1.5 yrs+
He moved out 5/10. In limbo.

I was sad because I had no shoes. Then I met a man who had no feet.


Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: MD
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