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User Topic: Double Betrayal
Lookingforpeace
♀ Member
Member # 13872
Default  Posted: 9:48 AM, May 11th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Flipper. Thank you. What I am or am not feeling has to do with my sister. I have forgiven my husband and we are trying to R with the expected bumps in the road.

My reason for asking the question is that I am trying to figure out if I have really forgiven my sister. I think I have, however she no longer means anything to me. Not my sister, not my family. I do not have ill feelings toward her or wish her any harm. I don't care. My mother sent us all a letter/email a day or so ago and it caused me to really look at what I feel for her and it really is nothing.

I know my husband carries alot of guilt because he feels he is responsible for this. I know deep down he hopes that she and I will reconcile. There is no anger or hurt when I say I am 99.9% sure that will never happen.

Knowing how much my mother is also hurting from this whole mess makes it hard for me to know the way I really feel. So I have been trying to figure out if I have really forgiven her.

My mothers letter is below.


To X, X, and X

MY Message

I feel compelled to write this as it seems the only answer to a prayer I have prayed since that ugly day in February, when my heart was ripped apart by two people whom I loved. X, I am sure the pain I feel cannot compare to that which you have endured. As no one can know the pain of family betrayal until they walk in that persons shoes. Nor can they so easily forgive no matter how much they may want to.

I know I can never have back the family I once had. One that I felt would always stick together no matter how rough the going got. But I do know this: I want to be able to trust again to put this all in the past and to know the joys we used to share together. In saying this I do not expect miracles. X I know that you and X will never be the sisters you once were again. The most I can hope for is that someday you may find a way to forgive her, and I know what I am asking here because I am not there myself.

I only know that because I do believe in a greater being and I know him as Jesus, I do believe he died for my sins and yours. I also believe that in order to truly be forgiven you must be able to forgive. And that is why I cannot relieve myself of this pain and hurt that I feel. I also believe that because we forgive does not mean we have to accept that whatever happened was right. Nor do I believe that because I have forgiven I will be able to trust, to me that has to be earned. I also believe that once you truly love as a mother you cannot ever stop that love no matter the situation. Because I feel this way I know that I have to be able to forgive both X (whom I love as a son) and X who is my daughter. I do not accept what happened as anything other than a lustful thing that is immoral and wrong. If this offends those who are involved then so be it but at least you know how I feel.

I only hope with all my heart that you (X and X) can work things out as I believe
that after all you have been through together, together is where you belong. And X I still love you.

X you are my daughter, you always will be I don't have to like you. But I will always love you.

I WANT MY FAMILY BACK.

All my Love

Mom


Untouchable

Posts: 349 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Michigan
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 9:57 AM, May 11th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

stl2betrayals - I am so sorry that you are going through this. You have gotten so many great responses to your posts and I agree with each of them. I just wanted to add from my own perspective that there are many times I have wished my FWH would have left after d-day so that I could have moved on with my life. It is very painful to stay and try to work things out. You are never really sure if they are serious about R and you can never fully trust them again. So you work on the M and you work on rebuilding trust, but you know that to truly let go and give them the 100% trust you had before the A would be to put yourself at risk. This is a very tough way to live. So, in answer to your question, is this God's way of having you avoid more pain? Well, I don't know whether it's in God's plan but I can tell you from personal experience that R is a painful process and if you should find yourself faced with the choice to R, be prepared for one hell of a ride. There is a lot of satisfaction in having a WS tell you they are ready to R but too many of us struggle througout the process with doubt, fear, more lies, uncertainty and lots of other emotions that make the process unbearable at times. I'm not saying it's not worth it, I sure hope in the end that it is, but it is a painful process and a daily struggle. So if it is easier to move on with your life maybe this is the right thing for you at this time. Only God knows! I am glad that SI can give you the support you need. It is so comforting to come here and know others are with you during these painful times. (((stl2betrayals)))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 10:29 AM, May 11th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lookingforpeace - I am near tears after reading your mother's beautiful letter. It never ceases to amaze me the extent of destruction an A causes. Her pain is so raw as is yours. I am so happy for you that you and your H are working things out and I wish you both luck with your R. I do want to add that your feelings of numbness toward your sister are not surprising. I recently posted an article about Post traumatic stress syndrome and emotional numbness is a definite, normal response to a traumatic experience. It is something our system does for us to help us survive a very painful shock. And learning that your sister had an A with your H is one of the greatest shocks anyone can encounter.
Years ago, I had suffered a shock (not A related) as a result of my sister's behavior. It affected our relationship for years. I am happy to say today that we are as close as we once were and that her remorse and commitment to change her life played a huge part in the renewal of our relationship. I know this is very different since her betrayal was an A with your H and that is no easy thing to overcome. I don't know what it is I am trying to say other than I hope you do find the peace you are looking for' and that you and your mother find comfort in one another.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lookingforpeace
♀ Member
Member # 13872
Default  Posted: 2:10 PM, May 11th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FNF

Thank you. I am not sure of anything as far as our own defense mechanisms go. Believe me I was very upset with her, hurt by her, angry with her. That has all passed. My H cannot understand how I can forgive him and want to work things out with him and not do the same for her. I cannot explain it myself. I go over this often in my mind.

These are some of the conclusions I have reached. Donít know if they are right, but make some sense to me. As far as forgiving, for my husband it is two part

A. I have been down this road before with him.
B. Even if I had not been down this road with him before, the POSSIBILITY of an A is always there.

When it comes to my sister Ė the POSSIBILITY SIMPLY DIDNíT EXIST!!! At all. Plain and simple. I know it was very naÔve of me, but in my mind, my realm of possibilities, FAMILY DOES NOT DO THAT. It was not a ďno-noĒ or a forbidden thing. It didnít exist.

Do you know whatís even worse than being that naieve? A mother knows her children. My mother warned me about exactly what happened. Not long after I moved here and she saw how my sister was towards my husband. I knew how she was, but again in my mindóNOT A POSSIBILITY.

To me, the first time she ever touched him, my sister died. That was a long time ago. Then there was this woman (the other woman). That is what she was. Taunting me with happiness right in front of my face. I was though, still a sister to her. Didnít want to believe what was staring me in the face.

Anyway, as I said. I am past a lot of that now. Now I find that I am asking myself a lot of questions because of my mothersí letter. Do I think she is sorry for what she did? I donít know, donít want to know. Would it help if she tried to explain herself to me? I have no interest in what she has to say. Is she miserable having lost both a man she thought she loved and her entire family? Donít care. Honestly that is the sum of every question I ask myself.

As far as finding peace -- I hope so too.

As far as finding comfort with my mother--she is truly my best and only friend. However, I can only imagine what it must feel like for her when I have opened up, vented about this person who is also her daughter. Therefore, I have really limited what I say.


Untouchable

Posts: 349 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Michigan
k94ever
♀ Member
Member # 11176
Default  Posted: 8:38 AM, May 14th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dear LFP,

Sometimes it takes years to fully forgive someone.

And that's OK.

Be comforted with the thought that you are in the Forgiveness Process with your sister. After a betrayal like this, you really shouldn't expect to forgive her "just like that" and for your Mom to have her happy family back.

And you know, even when you can forgive your sister, it is perfectly fine to not want her in your life. Sometimes you have to realize that you can forgive someone and just not want them in your life.

It's kinda like saying to them "I forgive you, and wish you the best in life but I'm letting you go out of mine".

k9


BS: 56
WS: 53
Betrayed: 23 years
Affairs: 14 (2 lasted 3 months. Rest were ONS)
WS died: 16 May 2011
Do not stay in your hurt forever. Choose to move out of it.

Posts: 6330 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: Wisconsin
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 12:57 PM, May 14th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LFP - Thinking of you and letting you know that I understand exactly what you are saying. I agree with K9 too that you can completely forgive someone but choose not to have them in your life. Sometimes that's all we can do. I once heard a saying, one that I applied to my situation with my sister, my twin. It went something like this, Sometimes there are people in our lives who have hurt us deeply and we forgive them but move on without them. But then there are others who we cannot live without. Those we forgive and choose to keep in our lives. No one can decide who those people are for each of us. It is not an easy decision especially when it is family. I wish you peace as you come to terms with this choice. (((lookingforpeace)))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
flipper
♀ Member
Member # 12425
Default  Posted: 5:27 PM, May 16th (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tore_up,

I know today is a bad day for you.

Just sending you strength to get through it.

Take care

flipper


Me: 40
FWH: 40
married 17 years - no kids
DD: 14th Oct 2006
DD2: 18th Feb 2007 - Full details disclosed

Both giving our best to R.


Posts: 311 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Australia
tore_up
♂ Member
Member # 9171
Default  Posted: 4:51 AM, May 17th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you Flipper for thinking of me on this day. It is hard this time of the month. The fact that he has been unable to call or try to contact me in anyway to say that he was sorry or that he totally screwed up just makes it that much harder to get thru. My wife told me a while back that she thinks that if Iwant him to say he was sorry, That I would have to go get it and I REALLY just dont see that happening. Yes it has been two years and things have gotten better. The imiages of the two of them together have faded down alot but the thoughts of the whole thing are still there and I dont think that will ever truley go away.

I do thank you ever so much for thinking and seeing that it is the THAT day for me.

Thank you,
Tore_up


Me46bs
her46ww
4 kids
married 26 years!!!
working on 27
24/20 girls
15/14 boys
Grandson!
d-day#1 5/2/04
d-day#2 5/16/05


Posts: 124 | Registered: Dec 2005
k94ever
♀ Member
Member # 11176
Default  Posted: 4:15 PM, May 22nd (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey Guys,

Throwing this thought out because it's just bugging me.

I wonder if any of my so-called "friends" used something about me to justify them having sex with WS. I mean..."She's snotty so it's fine to have sex with WS" or "She said "X" to me so I'm going to have sex with WS to pay her back" or "She's way to busy and forceful so it's fine to have sex with WS".

Seriously...what DID they tell themselves to make it OK to betray a friend?

Anyone ever get a straight answer?

k9


BS: 56
WS: 53
Betrayed: 23 years
Affairs: 14 (2 lasted 3 months. Rest were ONS)
WS died: 16 May 2011
Do not stay in your hurt forever. Choose to move out of it.

Posts: 6330 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: Wisconsin
Lookingforpeace
♀ Member
Member # 13872
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, May 23rd (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

K9

No answers. Mine was my sister and you know the more time I have thought about her (and the others) reasons for letting themselves do it, the more you know there is no sane answer, no excuse. It's funny I heard a line in a song the other day that really struck a note with me on this exact subject. "I'd rather ask forgiveness than permission".

It is only an extremely self-centered, non-moral human being that can allow themselves to do this. I mean your friend or my sister likely knew the troubles you may have endured during your marriage. They knew how certain things may have hurt or upset you (in my case that my husband had affairs before her). They knew pains you had endured and went there anyway. The more you try to understand the "why" of someone like that the less you understand. It is just one those things where in my case I had to ask myself, did I really lose a sister? The answer I have found is no. A sister would not do this. In your case, a friend (a TRUE friend) would not do this.

Ironically I have found in my case that I believe more responsibility was on the shoulders of my sister than my husband in this case. She had a responsibility not only to me but to the rest of her family. And more responsibility because she knew from a womans perspective the difficulties of your marriage as I mentioned before. I believe your friend falls in the same category. I think this because we know as women that no matter how much talking we do with our husbands in a good relationship or reconciliation they will never understand our pains from our perspective.


Untouchable

Posts: 349 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Michigan
Autumn leaf
♀ Member
Member # 13987
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, May 23rd (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

K9,

The only answer I got from my FWH is that my ex-friend said that " I know its wrong but I dont care." So I am left to guess that she probably told herself that I didnt deserve my husband after he had aired his complaints about me to her. But she had also been working up to the A for at least a year with subtleties towards my H, so I dont know. Except that I was very good to her as a friend so i dont know why she would have felt wronged.

I think maybe some people are just out to get what they can get and walk over anybody to do it. The fact that she had so little friends and so much constant drama in her life even with her own family that just about disowned her should have been a clue to her true character.
I am more careful now in choosing friends and aquaintences.


Me: BS 41
Husband: WS 38
OW:now ex-friend 49 deceased
D-Day #1 02-10-2007
D-Day #2 when he fessed up who he was really with: 02-18-2007
Started reconciliation 2/25/2007

Posts: 102 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Massachusetts
Dreamboat
♀ Member
Member # 10506
Default  Posted: 1:32 PM, May 23rd (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

K9,
OW was very critical of me, but not to my face. She was ooooh so sweet to my face. She told my X that I was not right for him because I was not Indian. She called me "gora" which is a derogatory name for white people. She criticized that I did not cook dinner for X every night, despite the fact that I worked full time and got home after him. She criticized my house keeping. You name it, she said it. And she used all of it to justify the A. Because she was Indian, she was right for him. And I was such a bad wife anywayÖ


And it's hard to dance with a devil on your back
So shake him off
-- Shake It Out, Florence And The Machine

Posts: 17291 | Registered: Apr 2006 | From: A better place :)
Pennico
♀ Member
Member # 10724
Default  Posted: 2:50 PM, May 23rd (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

K9,

I've also questioned how the former friend OW could have justified having sex with my H. What thoughts were going through her head when she was enjoying a summer evening on my front porch, watching our children playing - only hours after she screwed my husband in my bed. H m m m - there's something missing in their brains - it is absolutely compartmentalizing at it's best. In my sitch, there was nothing I did to her that was bad. I was nice, enjoyed her company, shared our days. I totally hope that each time she sees me, her guts clench. I'm obviously still very bitter.


BS - 50
FWH - 50
D-Day - 4/9/06 (with next-door neighbor/friend)
Married 18 years
2 girls (16 & 13)
Update 8-26-11 . . She MOVED!

Healed after five years and with God's Grace.


Posts: 172 | Registered: May 2006 | From: West Coast
stl2betrayals
♀ New Member
Member # 14442
Default  Posted: 3:01 PM, May 23rd (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I also posted this in the general forum and the divorce/sep forum, so I apologize, if it is a duplicate for anyone.

Below is a letter I have prepared to send to my XH and his OW who happened to be my brother's fiance - yes, it was a double betrayal by all means. I am not sure if I should send - about 95% of me wants to send it, but need advice. I will warn you it is long, but I felt like there were many things I needed to address. Read my profile for more on how deeply this has affected families. B is my XH, Jen is the OW, R is my brother and Justin is my nephew caught in the middle of this. Should I send....???
B,

(and Jen too, since she makes you show her everything and keeps such close tabs on you, I knew you would forward her this anyway, so I decided to just CC her).

As you already know our divorce is final. I am sure you are rejoicing in your new freedom. You walked out on me and never looked back. I have so many unanswered questions, but I really donít think you could answer them honestly at this time anyway. You have given little explanation on how you could do this to me and our future. The pain and hurt you caused is the worst thing that I have ever felt in my entire life. I trusted you to love me, respect me, protect me for my entire life. I have stood by our vows everyday. I loved you more than I loved anyone else, and I would have done anything to make you happy and to have a full life together. I have always been 100% committed to you and our marriage. I can take responsibility for not having a perfect marriage and contributing to problems throughout our years together, but I will NOT accept responsibility for you committing adultery. All of those mean, ignorant things you have said to me and that Jen has said -- there are names for that behavior it is called blameshifting and rewriting marital history. If either of you would have spent time in counseling you would know about all of this. See, the beauty of your behavior (acting like life with me was so horrible) is so that when you look in the mirror, you don't have to see the ugliness in yourselves and the hurt and devastation you have caused, so you transfer all that over to me, to ease your guilt. It's all part of your justification process and defending your actions. I live by the saying that ďthe truth needs no defenseĒ as long as I tell the truth and am honest, then I donít need to defend myself. Which is why you and Jen are always defending yourselves, b/c you never tell the truth.

After the initial shock of your affair wore off, I was able to take a long look at you Ė you are weak, you gave in to temptation, you never had a problem with me or our marriage until Jen started flaunting her body around in front of you. You are weak and broke marriage vows, you have a low self-worth Ė you think her ego boosts and the sex are love, that is not true love, and if you loved yourself more, you would have stood by your values and morals of knowing what true love is. You have no capacity to act like a real man, and I would not want a man like this in my life.


This has caused me to re-evaluate my life and do some soul searching. I have realized that I was spending so much time attending to your needs, that I let my needs go. I sacrificed part of myself for you. I have reached a great turning point in my life and now I am concentrating on myself. I have already made several life changing decisions. My future, my career and my personal life is on the forward track. I have closed this chapter of my life and I am starting a whole new book. I am excited about my choices that I have made and I feel greatly empowered. If this is me on my high horse, then I am glad that my successes and happiness bothers you both so much. I now understand what I want and need in a man. Brian, you have been the biggest disappointment of my life and I will never again want a man like you. I want a man who can provide emotional support, support of my personal goals and career goals. A man who will share in the responsibilities, instead of it always resting on my shoulders. I want now to be a wife to a man, not a mother to a husband. I spent the last 6 years worrying about your career and supporting you on moving up, instead of focusing on my career, and now that we arenít together my career moves forward, and yours backwards, because I spent so much time nurturing you and not enough time nurturing myself and you certainly didnít nurture me. I wish I could leave this marriage with very fond memories and knowing that you loved me as much as you said you did, but I donít. I leave believing that it was all a fraud, and you were not the person you pretended to be with me.

I was very sad as first, and struggled with the hurt and pain for a couple months, then I got very angry. Now the hatred has set in. You threw everything away for sex. I hope that is enough for you. You have told me several times that you never felt good enough for me. You arenít good enough for me, but youíre good enough for Jen? That is not saying much about either of you, that you place yourselves below me. Instead of going forward you are going backwards. You are trying to act and dress like you are 24 years old again. I guess you are trying to recapture your youth, instead of being an adult. Look at you now, B, you are smoking, drinking more, moving backwards in your career, doing unethical things at work, including sex in the back of cargo vans while you are supposed to be on sales call, you have abandoned your beloved dog, you left a gorgeous house we built and you destroyed an 8-year marriage and 14-year relationship/friendship, lost many friends and family while doing it and walked away from the woman who loved you, cared for you, knew you better than anyone and a future that was so bright for you. You are to be pitied for the road you have taken.

The one thing about all this is that R & I will be able to hold our heads high and be comforted in the fact that we were loyal, honest and moral. That we did not tear apart families. You and Jen will have to live with that the rest of your lives. There is nothing you could say that could ever justify what you have done. Not one person believes your relationship is right, people may accept it in time, but no one will ever believe it is right. You will always have to live with that guilt; I hope you are prepared for how it will eat away at you. There was never a time that I didnít trust you, until this happened. But the fact that you and Jen both cheated on your partners, (Jen cheating more than once) will always leave just a bit of doubt in the back of both of your minds, ďIf she/he cheated with me, will they cheat on me?Ē You will have to live with that nagging question for the rest of your life. Even now Jen wont let you contact me, so you have to email me and call me all day while at work, since she checks your cell phone records all the time. I am sure she will worry about you Ė if you cheated on me after 14 years together where you loved and adored me, and I was the love of your life, certainly you are capable of cheating on her, who will always live in my shadow and never be the woman I was. Another thing I learned in marriage counseling Ė that men always ďaffair downĒ and that is certainly what you did. You chose a girl with no education, not in a professional job, very little friends, no relationship with God, no respect for herself, and no unconditional love from her family and someone who has never put her child first. Yes, you definetly downgraded. Jen has wanted my life, and to be like me for so long that it drives her crazy. But, she is uncapable of being the woman that I am, but I am flattered.

It makes me so angry that you have brought this drama into my life. I value a simple life where I am surrounded by family and friends that love me, and that I love. I never wanted this constant drama. I also hate that you exposed me to possible STDs. No one knows how many people Jen has been with Ėand that neither of you are bright enough to use protection. It makes me sick that you exposed me to that. And remember, she got pregnant with Justin using the pull-out method Ė not so smart on her part, and it will happen again if neither one of you are smart. You think she wont trap you with that? Just like she denied wanting you to take her to nice dinners and spend money on her. And she has sure gotten that out of you. And racked up a lot of debt.


My family loved you both. I treated Jen like my little sister. I had her wedding dress in my closet and was planning a big bridal shower at my house for her, the entire time she was sleeping with my husband. You now say that my family is now psycho and crazy. Then why didnít you both leave the family a long time ago. We werenít so psycho when B and I were trying to bring a baby into the family, and we certainly werenít psycho when my parents let us all live there rent free when we were building our houses or when they were paying for Jen and Rís wedding. Funny how we became psycho after your affair was exposed. Yet, again, another way Jen has manipulated you against everything you believe in. The poor girl wanted my life so bad, my house, my style and my husband. We know Jen never really cared about any of us, but we know you loved us B, for many years, so we know all these things you say is because you are a follower and Jen has the lead, you can never just stand up for yourself and what you truly believe and want. I was the love of your life for many years, and Jen will forever live in my shadow. You can paint me out to be the bad guy all you want Ė I am sure she tells you over and over how bad I was, but you know the real me B and you know what we had before the devil-like Jen entered our marriage. Oh well, she will always live in my footsteps, and those are shoes she will never have the ability to fill. She will always wonder if you regret your choices. And please save this letter to read in a couple years, it might be a whole lot clearer to you. She has to wonder if you truly want to be with me, but know that I would never take you back, or that too much damage is done, so she is the consolation prize.
How do you both sleep in the same bed at night with Justin in the next room and he sees the two of you together in bed when he has seen his mommy and daddy together in bed and also his Aunt J and Uncle B in bed together, then he sees Uncle B and Mommy in bed together. What kind of mother would do that to her child??? And what kind of man would not see how wrong that is for a 4 year-old to witness. He has slept in bed many times with us and also with R and J, and now he sees the two of you in bed together (many times while you were still married to me)??? Why has he asked me why Mommy kisses Uncle B? How do I answer that one? And yet you donít think that is confusing to him and wont have lasting results on him. Every therapist has said it would Ė the therapist even told Jen that. It is very very sad that you both care more about yourselves than you do that wonderful child Ė especially for her being his mother and protector.

B, you fell for her manipulation, and her ďsweetĒ talk to you. Remember I saw all the emails, and if you believe that it is all sincere, and not her playing you and saying all the right things, then you have a lot to learn about women and real, true love. You fell for the oldest trick in the book, Brian, and I just hate that my little nephew is anywhere near either of you. You have changed since last July Ė everyone has noticed, my family, your family, our friends, and me. You changed once Jen started manipulating you. I wish you could be strong and stand up for yourself to her. She is bringing you down, B, look at how much she has messed up your life. I pray that you will get the courage to stand up to her and not let her continue to turn you into this vindicitive, mean, hateful person. You were NEVER like that, until you got close to her. What does that tell you?? You never talked bad about me, my family, or stopped caring about your dog until she came along. She is like poison Ė she was to R and now she is to you. I hope one day you see this and stand up for yourself.

There will be a day, when you and Jen split and you may have a child involved. And you will have to see Jenís new conquest playing daddy to your child and her new and latest man when you go to pick your child up. You will then know how R feels; I only hope that you feel the hurt worse than R feels it because you will certainly deserve it after putting my family through this. The one thing I am most thankful for, is that we did not have a child together. I wanted a baby with you more than anything, but seeing you now, and the thought of having to have Jen anywhere near a child of mine, makes me so glad that we do not have one together. I cant imagine her having any influence around my children and am so thankful she never will.

There will come a day when Justin wants to know why my first marriage split up, and why his mommy and daddy broke up. He will look at Aunt Cís wedding album and wonder why you were with me. He will ask who his godfather is. And he will have to know the truth, that his mommy had an affair with his uncle/godfather and broke up his Aunt Jís marriage. He will see you, his stepdad, as someone who split his mommy and daddy up. As much as I will love that child for my entire life, adore and dote on him, and do anything in the world for him, he will sense, as all smart kids do, that I despise his mother for what she did to me, my life and my marriage, Jen (and you) will have to live with that the rest of your lives and face this innocent child who never deserved this. And although love may come naturally with Justin, and I have no doubts that she loves him and that he loves her, but respect will not come that easy and she will have to face her son one day when he asks the tough questions and he will see his mother for who she truly is and that makes me the most sad, that my beautiful nephew will have to deal with this the rest of his life. Even if you two donít end up together, he will still know what she did to his daddy and to his auntís marriage. You both have very immature views on parenting if you think this will not have some affect on him. I will be a mother one day, and the love for my child will be the MOST important love of my life, my child will be put before everything in my life, it will not be a selfish-love, I just wish she (and you) had the same views.


I have thought long and hard about G and letting you see the dog. When you are no longer with Jen, then you can call me, and I will be more than happy to let you see, play, walk and spend time with Griffey. I will even see you myself and have Griffey there, but only when she is out of your life will you be able to see your dog. You can never say I am keeping him from you, you have a choice that is all yours to make. I have a choice too, and that is to never see either one of you while you are still together. Your relationship is wrong, immoral, sinful and has hurt so many people. A relationship that causes so much devastation and pain, is not a real lasting love. It is a relationship built solely on deceit and dishonesty and lies. It is wrong on many, many levels and you are the only two that seem to think otherwise. I do not believe what you are doing is right or is the will of God. So, I will NOT be part of it, and that includes G, since he is a part of my life. Once you both realize how wrong your relationship is (especially for Justinís sake) then part ways, G will once again be a part of your life.

And do not email me back. That goes for Jen too, I know she has difficulty following those simple directions, unless it involves taking her clothes off and throwing herself at men to validate herself and to feel loved, she just doesnít get the simple things. I wont read any email that comes from her, I could care less what she has to say. She has no rights or privileges to contact me. All she is a low-life home-wrecker that uses herself for menís attention. Too bad she cant take all that effort and put it into being a mother. Like I said, she is poison, and I donít want that in my life, so I WILL NOT read anything she says, plus if she and you are so very happy, then you will read this letter and hit delete without bothering to respond. If you are both so happy, then you wont care what I think and wont even try and respond to me.


Posts: 30 | Registered: May 2007 | From: St. Louis
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, May 28th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

stl2betrayals - I was wondering if you decided to send your letter. I hope that if you did, you were able to get through to your XH. I guess the only change I would have made was not to have spoken to the OW directly in your letter. I refuse to acknowledge the OW in my H's A. I feel this is the greatest insult - to treat them as if they are a non-entity. If she walked up to me on the street, I would not even acknowledge her presence. I know that's tougher though when it's family. Did you get any other replies on the divorce forum? Any good advice? It's always a tough call. We are all dealing with similar but very unique situations and it's hard to say what is best in someone else's case. I hope you are at peace with whatever you chose to do. Hugs to you.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
sweetgirl
Member
Member # 9928
Default  Posted: 7:02 AM, May 30th (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((((stl2b)))))

What a difficult situation. Your letter is good. I would guess that your WH is still foggy and it will likely not garner much of a response. But if it is to be a cathartic act for you, then go for it.

K9 - you wrote:

I wonder if any of my so-called "friends" used something about me to justify them having sex with WS. I mean..."She's snotty so it's fine to have sex with WS" or "She said "X" to me so I'm going to have sex with WS to pay her back" or "She's way to busy and forceful so it's fine to have sex with WS".

Seriously...what DID they tell themselves to make it OK to betray a friend?

I've been pondering your question. I even asked FWH. His response was that "desperate people do desperate things". Makes sense, huh? I suppose if I were so broken and desperate, I may not respect boundaries if I could get some attention from someone that I have a "crush" on. It sounds so....juvenile....but I think I get it.

I also remember something another member said to me when I first joined SI and was essentially pondering the same question - They told me that many times when an OW is friends with the BS, the A really *is* about the BS - at least from the AP's POV. In other words, they are acting out some jealousy or resentment against the BS. Again, this makes sense to me. FSOW wanted my life and she let me know it.

I hope this helps. It's so very hard to not only deal with the betrayal of a spouse, but then to have to deal with a friend or family member betraying you on top of that. I am very careful with whom I call "friends" these days.


Posts: 631 | Registered: Mar 2006
Dreamboat
♀ Member
Member # 10506
Default  Posted: 1:03 PM, May 30th (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sweetgirl

In other words, they are acting out some jealousy or resentment against the BS. Again, this makes sense to me. FSOW wanted my life and she let me know it.

EXACTLY!!


And it's hard to dance with a devil on your back
So shake him off
-- Shake It Out, Florence And The Machine

Posts: 17291 | Registered: Apr 2006 | From: A better place :)
k94ever
♀ Member
Member # 11176
Default  Posted: 9:55 AM, May 31st (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dear Sweetgirl,

WOW.

Yes, the last FB was lining WS up to be the next husband. He was already working at being the "father figure" to her kids.

I always wondered what significant event pushed her to file for a divorce from her alcoholic husband. She filed while living with us so I know there wasn't a confrontation with the husband. When I asked her she never gave me an answer.

Looking back at the time-line I'm assuming that it was because WS was willing to have sex with her, play footsies under the table, expose himself to her and kiss her while I was in the bathroom that was the tipping point for her. She must have figured that if WS was willing to do all that WHILE I was in the house with them that he must love her and would divorce me and move in with her.

Yup...she wanted my life. She didn't know that he was a serial cheater and that everything we have is through my hard work. WS just basically provided the paycheck.

Stupid C*nt.

k9


BS: 56
WS: 53
Betrayed: 23 years
Affairs: 14 (2 lasted 3 months. Rest were ONS)
WS died: 16 May 2011
Do not stay in your hurt forever. Choose to move out of it.

Posts: 6330 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: Wisconsin
hurtbyafriend
♀ New Member
Member # 14847
Default  Posted: 1:02 PM, June 3rd (Sunday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I caught my good friend and my husband being very close to intercourse. If i hadn't woke up it would have occurred. regardless they still crossed the line and it hurts them same. I told her to get out of my house. I haven't talked to her since. I kind of want to talk to her now, to get her version of what occurred. My husband said that ths was the 1 and ONLY time that he and the bitch were together like that. I want to believe him but my trust of anything was thrown out the window when i saw them. I have talked to bitch's husband and she told him the same thing that they have never been in that situation before. I think that i want to talk to her now but then i am scared that her version is going to hurt worse than what i know. My husband was so intoxicated on d-day that he swears he doesn't remember how it started or who started. He hasn't given me a why. Which i know everyone says that i shouldn't take any blame but i just feel like a failure ...that i was not giving him what he wanting in our marriage for him to stray. I am mad as hell at the bitch. So honestly I know there wouldn't be much talking... just yelling at her But it would feel so good to get it out to her how i feel about her. Any advice? do i call her? do i just write a letter and mail it? D-day was May 20, 07

Posts: 3 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: CLT NC
flipper
♀ Member
Member # 12425
Default  Posted: 4:28 PM, June 3rd (Sunday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dear hurtbyafriend,

I'm so sorry you are in this place.

I understand that you need to speak/write to the OW but I truly believe you should wait. here's why...

My FWH & SIL were caught together, kissing and fondling. They both swore it was the first time this had ever happened. After much crying, questioning and screaming at both of them I foolishly believed thier story.

For the sake of the family my brother and I tried to put it all in the past and continue as a normal family. ie christmas, birthdays etc..

Fast Forward 4 months...

I couldn't believe they were unlucky enough to be caught the first time they did this. I wrote my husband a letter telling him how I felt and gave him a copy of the book "Not just friends".

He finally realised that our marriage had to be based on the truth. It had been a 6 month PA. They had sex 5 or 6 times.

Now I can't get past the fact that I actually spent family events trying to be nice and even gave her a christmas present.

There was no way she was ever going to be truthful with me and to this day still denies everything.

Focus on your husband and get the truth. Your former friend has no place in your life now. Sad but you have to pretend she doesn't exist.

Take care,

((hugs))

flipper


Me: 40
FWH: 40
married 17 years - no kids
DD: 14th Oct 2006
DD2: 18th Feb 2007 - Full details disclosed

Both giving our best to R.


Posts: 311 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Australia
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