Oh honey...I'm sorry. I just got on and you're probably going to bed.
Lost - I can just imagine how hard it is right now but from everything you are saying about your H's attitude and past history, it would seem that taking him back too quickly will only result in him being even more of a bastard than he has been (IMHO). He is bullying you, he doesn't believe you can do this. He is challenging you and if you fail (in his eyes) by taking him back, I really do think he will treat you with even more disrespect than he has been.
I TOTALLY agree with this. This is it, sweetie. Right now. The actions you take right now will affect the rest of your marriage. If you give in and don't stand your ground now, he will know you never will.
Face your fears.
Facing down your fears is the hardest thing you will ever have to do, but the rewards are beyond imagining.
I hear this exact thing ALL THE TIME. Over and over again from the people who did it. It's the answer, sweetheart. I feel it in my soul.
I also agree with brooke. Don't engage him anymore. State your boundaries and see what happens. You will be ok. We all will.
I'm sending you the tightest squeeze across the ocean, and I hope you read this before you go to sleep.
If you think the grass is greener on the other side, it's because it's fertilized with bullshit.
The best protection a woman can have is courage.~Elizabeth Cady Stanton
"Just when the caterpillar thought it was over, she became a butterfly."
I agree with the others. I'm two-plus years out and my H in the beginning did a bit of "bullying" and trying to manipulate me. I had him in a hotel part-time (all we could afford). He bitched about the $$, he tried to guilt me about the kids missing him, you name it. BUT in the end, I let him back after three months & that was AFTER I saw that he had engaged in IC and MC with me. Being in that hotel gave him a taste of what he was losing- his family. I truly believe in my heart of hearts that this was THE most instrumental changing point for him. But when I was waffling in those three months about whether to R with him, he tried the "I made a mistake, but you are making a mistake and ruining the kid's lives if you "give up" now".... UH, NO. In other words, he was still trying to control me using the kids as leverage. He stopped this behavior after engaging in counseling AND seeing that I was NOT going to give in to it. I told him I could not be with him for awhile. He had no choice about staying in the hotel and it was MY terms about when he came home. This was a complete back flip of what our relationship had been pre-A. Even though I am an independent person, in our relationship he was so anal-retentive, perfectionist, critical, etc. that I pretty much let him make a lot of the decisions. This was way out of his comfort zone. But you know what? The changes we made that first year he has adapted to, and we have more of that equal partnership that BT has been talking about.
Hang TOUGH. This is IMHO a turning point for you. And if he leaves, then that is his choice. But what is the alternative and what does he have to offer you if he doesn't change his ways?
Weepy, good to "see" you.
SVS- hope we hear more updates, and that you are kicking butt.
I'm in for a stressful few months training at the new job. I'm already extra stressed with H's health issues, but like everyone here on this board I am calling on that inner terminator to conquer it all.
just sunday night, i got so mad at my h for putting his feelings above my healing, that i threw a glass of water at him. i do this when i really want to strangle him. i think it is so much healthier and it makes me feel better. he got mad, yelled at me, and said he had enough- he was leaving.
my old behavior would have been to get scared, tell him not to, tell him that we are making progress, etc. that night i did not. i said GOOD. GO. BUT JUST KNOW- IF YOU LEAVE- YOU ARE NOT COMING BACK. I WILL CHANGE THE LOCKS TOMORROW . ( AND I MEANT IT)
he went to get me gas and called me to tell me that we would have to sell the house. i said no way- i will ask my parents for my inheritance now, i dont care- i am staying here with my kids. and hung up on him.
when he came back- he apologized and said that he had lost control of himself. i said i wanted nothing to do with him- to sleep in the basement and just stay away from me.
he saw he could not intimidate me- that i am actully thinking of telling him to move out - and his power went away. our therapist says that he shouldnt leave now, while we are working on the marriage, but i agree with heartbroken- having him leave for awhile would make him see what he would be giving up.
when we had out first d day, i had him move to his mom's. after 3 days, he begged me to come home and sleep in the basement. since our therapist said to do that, i said yes, but now i regret it. i should have kept him out longer and i still may kick him out again- if he cant get the putting my healing in front of his own feelings.
it sounds good to me that he should work on doing that, and when he can, i will start dating him again. the only thing is that i would miss all the work he does now around the house since d day- cooking, cleaning, wash, picking up the kids, etc.
He said that I needed to change my behaviours. If I carry on the way I have done, this M will def end.
As you can imagine the conversation went downhill from there.
This morning more of the same despite me smsing him that firstly he is confusing 2 issues..what needs to be done for him to come back, and what do we do moving forward.
I said that we could be better people if we BOTH work on our issues, and this will end in a better M. and the kids will be better off too.But we BOTH have things to work on, it will be hard, but altho I am scared, i am willing to try.
But that is totally separate from him coming back.He just took it as granted.We pissed each other off more this am, and I finally lost it, started crying, "Why are you doing this to us? WTF did I ever do to you".
Bad move I know but this hurts so much.And I feel like he's blaming me, this is my fault because of
how I am.
I just cant do this anymore.
I am broken.,He wins again
I feel like I have let you all down
My IC visit last night. She told me to quit asking questions. She said he will never produce what you are looking for. I already knew this in my gut. So I've got to learn to bite my tongue when I feel one coming on. Said it was like shooting myself in the foot. I know ahead of time that I'm not gonna like the answer and it's only going to cause pain. Quit it. If I'm ever going to heal I've got to move forward and quit wallowing in the past. I've been there too long now as it is.
SVS-thinking about you. Would love to hear from you. Hope all is going well and in your favor.
Lost, hang in there. It aint done till it's done.
If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?
We sit out here knowing only a tiny fraction of the picture and advise you as best we can based on our own knowledge and experiences. But you are the expert on you -- you are the one you should trust most completely.
If you think you have made a mistake, take action to correct it. There is very little in life that is permanent. As I told my younger son this morning, you can recover from any mistake and go on to thrive providing you do what needs to be done.
If you are doing what you think is right, then stick to it no matter what anyone says. Most problems have at least a couple possible solutions. You'll find yours.
It took a year of MC before I was even willing to think that I might have to change some of my behaviors and that was only to stop raging at him. It's taken 2 years of IC to see that I need to change a LOT more than that.
Be more gentle with yourself and don't let what he says get to you. Boy that's a tough one to learn too.
Why are you doing this to us? WTF did I ever do to you".
Try turning this around to "I did nothing to deserve this. This was YOUR decision. When you own that, we can talk about changes WE need to make."
You're leaving the door open, but putting the blame off yourself and onto him.
There is nothing wrong with you, nothing, ok sweetie?
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
You haven't let us down. It's not like that here...you know that.
The trouble with ultimatums is that unless you are prepared to go the distance with them, you shouldn't throw them out there. But that's hard not to do, I know. So, since it's out there...how far are you prepared to go? Will he be coming home without the letter being written? If he will not write the letter...are you prepared to stand by what you've said?
When an ultimatum is issued and there is no follow through, it sets things up for future behavior. I have a friend whose son is addicted to drugs. He keeps saying, "I'm going to kick it this time." and they keep saying, "OK, if you don't then...(this or that) will happen" and they never follow through. Her son continues to use drugs. He really has no reason to stop because his parents never do what they say they will. He's learned how to get around his promises.
You teach people how to treat you.
If I carry on the way I have done, this M will def end.
What does this mean? Have you still been raging? I know that had occurred frequently before. Is this what he's talking about? If not...ask yourself specifically what he means. Then ask yourself if it's true. Is he right? Do you need to stop doing whatever it is and is it "possible" for you to stop yet? (Right now just ask yourself the questions. You don't have to DO anything about it yet if you're not ready.) I'm not there, so I don't know...but I know there are things that I need to stop doing in order to move forward as well. (My H doesn't happen to call me out on it in the manner that yours does though. He's a little more compassionate.) But at some point, we do need to get honest and LISTEN to each other too.
He is trying to shift blame onto you though...but you have the power there, Lost. You can allow it and engage him, or you can call "bullsh**" and stop talking. "Call me when you're ready to acknowledge your part in this."
It's all back to that "face your fears" concept. He knows you. He knows your weaknesses. Is he going to be right this time?
I have been all over the place today emotionally.
I wish I could run away.I wish I could check into a hotel and shut everyone away.
Fuck this shit.
Can you do anything for yourself today? that has helped me so much,when i feel like you. can you call up a friend and go over? or go out for coffee or to a movie? try to do something for yourself- to heal you.
i let my H come home after only 3 days!!!I feel so weak when i think of that. You need to do what you feel is right for YOU. only you know.
the only advice YOU need to clearly know is that this is NO WAY your fault. HE made the choices to go outside the marriage - YOU DID NOT!!!
Stay strong- read on line or in a book on infidelity- this helps me so much too.
Had a little breakdown before my interview this am, and had to call H. there is just noone else. He talked me down and I got through the interview. Looks promising so we will see.
He just called now and asked if he could come home tonight. I asked him if he had done the letter, he hadnt.Still.So I said until that is done, then he cant return.
then got into another argument about his "conditions" for me.We just dont know how to communicate with each other. Each sees the other as attacking, each one wants to be right. I bet we even agree on the same things but we just cant get through to each other.
I know I cant take criticism well. For me it feels like I have failed, or I am wrong. I know I am not perfect, so its kind of hard to explain.
Re the kids...I dont know.
Why don't you both put your desires in writing and communicate that way for a bit? Email?
Enough of me.
How is everyone else?
I've talked before about my younger son, who has ADD and a mood disorder.
He is so much like my husband -- the "old" pre-therapy husband -- that it scares me. He's secretive and impulsive and P/A. He even scares my H sometimes. If I hadn't been through everything I have with my H, I would think he was just a good-off kid. But I believe that like my husband there is this whole part of him that he doesn't let anyone know.
Anyone else see anything in their kids that scares them?