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User Topic: Long Term Affairs -V I I
Going To Make It
♀ Member
Member # 17010
Default  Posted: 11:09 AM, November 25th (Sunday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She was his wife too. I have never told him no or rejected him sexually. We have had on average sex 3-4 times a week even when he was having the A. So, he was honest, brutal, but he told the truth.

He is and has been my only sexual partner, so I don't have anything else to gage his preformance by.

Thanks, I really don't give a shit anymore. He knows it.

[This message edited by Going To Make It at 11:20 AM, November 25th (Sunday)]


BW 47
M 1982 4 Adult Children
2 Grandkids - the light & loves of my life.
LTA Started before we were married and lsted until 9/02 DDay 4/4/04, TT till 9/24/2011

Posts: 948 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Still Wandering in the Desert
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 11:10 AM, November 25th (Sunday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((Going To Make It))))


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 7:52 AM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Weepy:

Is this your first day as a lady of leisure? Come and tell us how you are doing?



D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 9:53 AM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

GTMI - Shortly after d-day my H told me the same thing. It was the most hurtful, painful and damaging thing other than the LTA itself. That was almost 2 years ago and just thinking about that still brings tears to my eyes. But let me tell you this. Once the "fog" lifted and we began to R, not to mention our period of HB'ing, my H developed an appreciation for our sex life that hadn't been there for many years. Looking back on that dreadful memory, I am convinced that it is their way of justifying in their warped minds, a behavior that they know is so wrong but, for whatever reason, believe at the time they say this to us that we will understand why they did it. Does this make sense? I believe it is in part an attempt to help us understand how they could do this (as if we would have an ah ha moment ) and in part the lie they had to tell themselves in order to justify it in their own minds.
There is also the element of getting away with something, the excitement attached to an A for them, the total lack of responsibility - no real commitment, no children to worry about, mortgage, bills, etc - just sex. No demands, no obligation other than sex. It's not real. It's fantasy. Of course it SEEMS better. But you know what, once they are outed and there is guilt attached to their behavior that they somehow were able to bury, the thrill is gone.
My H told me I wasn't spontaneous enough - well, let's see, I was raising 3 children and, no, I couldn't just jump in the sack while taking care of them. These OW, drop everything, THEY HAVE TO, in order to APPEAR spontaneous. If they were in a real relationship, how long do you really think it would take before the thrill and excitement were gone and replaced by reality?
You say she was his first wife. They are D'd. Well, my question then is, if it was so great, why is their M over? Maybe it's only great when they were able to conduct this fantasy relationship but in a real one, they just weren't good enough. That would be my bet!
I hope you're feeling better today. This is a tough one but like I said, once my H was out of his fog, he began to appreciate us in a way he never had before. I believe this will happen for you too.
(((GTMI)))

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 10:01 AM, November 26th (Monday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 10:30 AM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((GTMI)))
I also hope you are doing a little better today.
They (WH's) say a lot of mean and horrible stuff after dday, and sometimes for quite a few months after.

Try to not let him get to you (said the pot to the kettle ).

Its been a little quiet here.I am hoping this means that everyone is well and safe.

Things are somewhat off in my home. Usually I would try hard to get things to a better place, but this time is different.I am okay to sit in my corner for a while and lick my wounds. H is trying to reach me, but it just doesnt seem to touch me as much as it would have previously.

I think we just dont know how to proceed hereon with each other. I want to focus on myself now.I dont know what he wants.I dont even want to ask. He is stopping IC tomorrow, but says that he wants to find another IC.I hope that he does truely want to get himself together.But I will no longer push him.

Dday 2 is on Wednesday.This is when I found out about LTA#1,and that H had been a fake from the word go.
I was surprised when he asked me on Sat night what I want to do on that day.Dday 1 had gone by without a mention from him.

I had had plans for this antiversary before he ran out on us last week. Now I dont know what to do.
It seems apt that something should happen.Jeez...look at what that day represents for me/us!! But I just dont know what would be appropriate/useful/significant.

Any ideas anyone?


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
Going To Make It
♀ Member
Member # 17010
Default  Posted: 1:22 PM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks all. I really appreciate all the good vibes.

The other shoe fell today - this morning actually at 7.

3 times he used prostitutes while deployed on cruise with the Navy, he attempted intercourse with his exwife while I was pregnant with our first child, but couldn't maintain an errection because it was my birthday

He said he would go and see her on his business trips, hoping she would offer sex, she never came out and said it, just said you can stay (he said he always left), so on the last visit he asked her to give him a bj (while I was picking out the headstone for my parents gravesite), he said she turned him down. He said he was relieved and told her he wouldn't ever see her again.

I actually feel better, I know it sound crazy, but I've been waiting for over 11 years for this. I always knew it in my gut, but was to affraid to confront him.

Maybe now, we can attempt to rebuild what little we have to go on.

I hope everyone is having a peaceful day.

I think I've hit the anger stage btw, I threw my 3 carrot ring at him (the 2nd one he's bought me since 04, always after a new revelation) and got him square in the forehead I didn't realize I was such a good shot. At least I have something to laught about.


BW 47
M 1982 4 Adult Children
2 Grandkids - the light & loves of my life.
LTA Started before we were married and lsted until 9/02 DDay 4/4/04, TT till 9/24/2011

Posts: 948 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Still Wandering in the Desert
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 1:28 PM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have just finished reading all ten pages (it was light when I started, itís now 6.45pm!) and browsed some profiles to get a feel of where I fit in around here. I feel a bit of a light-weight compared to some of you! But itís the right place for me, I think.

Lost, why mark a Dday anni? What had you got planned? For Godís sake, isnít it an date you want to do something to forget? Is he aware of the significance of that date? Men can be incredibly dull when it comes to dates. Oh, they ďknowĒ alright, they just donít think any of them are that important. But, of course, they are to us. On my Dday anni, I had jumped into my car and was 250 miles away at the in-laws, about to enlighten them about their wonderful son and how he had decided to take up with the xGF to see if that path untrod would have been better than the one he walked with me.

I think if I had had some choice (which I didnít b/c I had that meeting with the OW a couple of days before and some things she said meant I had to go down and tell them), I would have gone off to a spa, like I did for my 50th bíday. Or gone shopping (always a good one). Or disappeared down south to stay with a friend, like I did over our 27th wedding anni. She and I had a lovely meal out!!

No. For me, Iíd rather just let it pass by. Spend the time being busy. See friends. You could let him know itís gonna be ďthatĒ day, and if he wants to do something nice (not expensive Ö.) then that would be appreciated. Him cook diner? Bottle of bubbly or something?

Just get through the day and the sadness of it all.

As for me, Iíve had a rough time lately. Nothing compared to most of you, but if Iím no better tomorrow, Iíll post for some help/support.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 1:37 PM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Folks, I've been in and out most of the weekend, not long enough to catch up.

I'm still at work. 3 more weeks. I don't know if I can stand it.

It's raining today and H is home. Always at least a mild trigger. We have MC tonight and other than a couple rough bumps over the weekend, he's been really sweet.

He brought a bunch of stuff into the basement from his aunt's garage. Stuff from the old house, stuff that was around during his A period, stuff I haven't seen or been through. Driving me up the wall. he said he was going to start sorting through it today while I'm here. I wish I had stayed home.

I also wish I had stayed home because his Christmas present got delivered today. Figures. They can't send anything I NEED on time, but this arrives in 5 days. And it wasn't even in an unmarked box. Says exactly what it is on the outside. He called to thank me, but now I wish I could send it back.

GTMI, I'm sorry you're getting this in dribs and drabs. Not fair. And good shot! I quietly put my rings away and that was it. Wish I had flushed them or something.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
Steelergal
♀ Member
Member # 13113
Default  Posted: 1:45 PM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I haven't had time to fully catch up either. Hope all of you US ladies (and gents if you're lurking) had a peaceful Thanksgiving.

Welcome to the new folks.

(((LTA Gang)))


Posts: 701 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: No Cal
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, November 26th (Monday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

GTMI, all I can say is that his XW must have felt really rather used if he never even stayed. Sounds like she wanted him back, offering him sex/bjís (guaranteed to work?) and being ok with him going off when he was done. She must have felt like some cheap slut. He sounds one sad bloke and itís kind of his just desserts (but not fair on you) that he has performance trouble Ė it must be guilt related if itís not medical. And you know more as time goes on; he knows you know and there is nowhere for him to hide from what he has done. He feels bad about it (well, like all WSís, he feels bad that heís been found out). And she was not better at sex than you, thatís just him off-loading his guilt and his inability to perform. If he has been your only partner and he says that, all I would say to him is he didn't teach you very well! Besides, if they really had anything, theyíd still be together and the world would be a different place.

Anything is better than him admitting he has a problem, donít you see? There is also the possibility he could be depressed. But you have to remember, none of this is your fault. He has done this to himself. You are not responsible. He is.

Read you all tomorrow. A glass of wine is calling.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 5:41 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost,

I've been thinking about it and I don't really know what to suggest for you on the anniversary. It was such a bad day for me, I just spent it grieving.

What did your H suggest?


GTMI:

I'm glad he finally told you. Can't do anything without the facts.

How do you feel today?


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 7:24 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bt..me too.
H doesnt have any suggestions.He wants me to tell him what I want to do, and the he'll see if thats a possibility.

Just got off the phone with OWH#2. I wanted his email address so I could cc him on the letter that H wrote to the OW.

He cant believe that I am still sitting with this crap. Said after he confronted his W last year where she said that she and H were "just friends", he had decided to let it go and see how he behaved.He said that she has been a great W and M in the last year. He loves her so much that he has forgiven her any wrongdoings.The way he sees it is that if you really love someone,yes you would feel pain when they hurt you, but you will forgive them and move on.HE said that he loves her and their DD so much, they are his life, and he would lay his life down for them in a second.

I told him that I have had a hard time grappling with what happened.For me once or twice is a mistake, but deliberately engage in lies and deception for 2.5 years, is not a mistake.However I respect him for how he is handling it, and that OW is a very fortunate person to have him.BUT I am at the point now where I need to move on and shut the door on them, and for me, I needed this letter written. If we had lived in the same country, I would have had different options, but this is the best way I know of shutting this door without anyone innocent getting hurt.

He gave me his address,said that he is sorry for my pain, and hoped that my H is doing more than just this to help me and the kids heal ..."because you sound like a really good person."

So we wished each other well and thats it.
He sounds like a really good person too.

Phoned H right after to let him know and cried that the slut doesnot deserve a H like that. OWh obviously doesnt know about the men before H, about her profile on a dating site, or about the man during H.
But that is not my place to tell him.If he choses to live in ignorance, then so be it.

I am stressing about tomorrow, and feeling crappy already.

I am trying desp to think of the positives but its so darn hard.
UKgirl, how can I not acknowledge the day? No more then I would ignore the death anniversary of my DS.
Yes, H is fully aware of the day.He was honest and said that he would prefer to just treat it as any other day, but understands that I wont be able to do that.

This is more than just the day I found out about an A.Its also when I realised that everything from when I was 19, was a lie.That he had deliberately lied to me over and over again about who and what he was.
Coming on top of my childhood!! (which he knew about )
And then over the years, systematically making me and everyone else believe that I was crazy, paranoid and obsessive.I believed him.

\And vey fucking event after that, the kids births, me trying so fucking hard to prove to him that I was worthy.

God I cant believe that he did this.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
OneToughCowgirl
♀ Member
Member # 14817
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good morning ladies! Wow, I think this is the longest I've been off SI since vacation!

I'm finally getting back to one of my greatest loves in life - reading for pleasure. Since Dday I've only been able to read about A's and R's and M's, blah, blah, blah. I've really fallen behind on all the good books that have come out in the past couple of years. So now I'm reading The Kite Runner by Khaled Hosseini (which is FABULOUS! I've also read his other book A Thousand Splendid Suns just before this one which was equally wonderful) I came across a line in the book that so aptly describes what I feel is an incredible truth that is pertinent for all of us. This line is at the end of the book and is a reflection by the main character who, after a lifetime of suffering from an enormous betrayal,had a recognition that he didn't have a pang of emotion when he reflected on all that were involved in the betrayal. He said, "I wondered if that was how forgiveness budded, not with fanfare of epiphany, but with pain gathering it's things, packing up, and slipping away unannounced in the middle of the night." This line spoke to me so deeply as this is exactly how it's been for me. As we have done the work in IC on our selves as individuals and then in MC on understanding what had gone wrong in our M, this is exactly how forgiveness has come to me and I would say for my H as well in forgiving himself. Maybe it's just me, but this line really hit me today and I wanted to share it with all of you. I think when we're struggling we look for that epiphany (via an admission from the FWH) that will free us and allow us to forgive and move on with our lives. And of course our H's encourage this because the sooner they can squirm out of having to deal with the shame, guilt, etc., the better for them. But it doesn't work that way IMO. The way Mr. Hosseini so beautifully described it in his book is really the way it happens. It's a slow and quiet process which is so contrary to how it blew into our lives. I know I had an expectation for it to blow out the same way with a crescendo aha moment. More specifically, with my H laying out a complete meal of truth and remorse which would have given me a whole picture and a complete understanding. Instead the truth and the remorse came in sips and tastes that I had to add up and piece together over the years. It was not, by any standards, ever a complete meal! But somewhere in there I became nourished and forgiveness budded. Anyhow, I'm going on here, but wanted to share it with all of you.

SVS - Any word yet from the judge? Thinking of you.

Again, welcome to all the newbies. Sorry you're here, but it's nice to have some fresh voices and new wisdom.


M 20 years / together 25 yrs
6 yr LTA
Me 47
FWH 48
D-Day Jan. 2006
We're good and getting better every day!

Posts: 607 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Chicago
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost - I wanted to send hugs to you and to let you know that I've been thinking of you and what you're going through as this day approaches. I was wondering whether or not it would be possible for your H to take the day off tomorrow and just spend the day with you, comforting you and reassuring you that he is there for you, that he is so sorry to have done this to you and anything else that you need from him on this day. Even if he could just leave work early, order take out, sit and watch a movie, or one of the zillions of Christmas movies that are already on TV. I think quiet times, supportive people, preferably your H, a long, soaking scented bath, anything to help you to bring down the tension and pain.
I am with you in spirit and will check in with you tomorrow to make sure you are feeling better.
((((((LH))))))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 8:09 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"I wondered if that was how forgiveness budded, not with fanfare of epiphany, but with pain gathering it's things, packing up, and slipping away unannounced in the middle of the night."

OTC - thank you for posting this beautiful quote. I think in my case, my pain is packing up in smaller suitcases and moving out in increments. I still have a few more suitcases to fill(more than I'd like to admit) and I know I'm getting there it's just such a slow process.
I loved what you said that, "It's a slow and quiet process which is so contrary to how it blew into our lives." So, so true that something so filled with pain, emotion and upheaval just quietly has to find its way out of our lives and psyche. Seems like such a dichotomy. I guess though that if we can come to believe this, there is hope that one day each of us here will find the strength to move beyond our pain and find our joy again.

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 8:34 AM, November 27th (Tuesday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 8:33 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fnf thanks for the hugs.

but uhhh...I think that quote was by OTC, not BT!


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 8:36 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for that LH - I even had that second cup of coffee.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 8:42 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was wondering if any of you have heard the following justification for your H's LTA as I get every time I try to get my H to help me understand how he could have done this to us.
Generally, I'm crying or demanding an explanation - How could you do this to us, what kind of person are you. His response is always the same, "Men do this." If you don't believe me ask (MC). Ask him, he'll explain it to you, I can't.
Well, this morning I am still so upset (this argument happened again last night). Fortunately we have a MC'ing session tomorrow and this is what I plan to say in front of our C. Healthy, decent men DON'T do this, morally bankrupt men do this. I know my C will probably try to get me to tone this down because he thinks I sometimes beat my H down to the point of feeling so low that it is counterproductive. But I just don't understand how, after all this time, he can still give me this lame explanation and not want to find out why he is that morally bankrupt person. Any thoughts???

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 8:43 AM, November 27th (Tuesday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 8:43 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost. Poor you, youíre really going through it. Okay, it doesnít have to be a bad day. Try to make it positive. Things have changed. Youíre kicking that year out of the door and looking forward to a better one. You are in a better position of knowledge about yourself, your husband and your marriage than you were this time last year. You are not ignorant any more. Be kind to yourself and say that is one day when youíre not going to beat yourself up. If it helps to be with him, then ask him to do just that. What has happened to you is something very private, a grief no one can share because itís only you that has lost something. And, generally, itís not publicly known. How about asking him to write a few lines about how heís going to try and make next year a better one both for you, for him and for you as a couple?

And for me it was the same kind of thing. Just the day before my Dday, I had the meeting with OW and found out a whole lot more. Including that my H had been waiting for her to come back into his life ever since she walked out of it. That she had been in his heart for all those years. Not good, even when I tried to shrink down what she had bigged up. A masquerade of a marriage. I have a real problem with that one.

Donít worry, whatever you decide, you will be okay. Gotta run.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
zanny
♀ Member
Member # 13183
Default  Posted: 8:47 AM, November 27th (Tuesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Kite Runner is a beautiful book. It is a compelling read and you know you are in a better place when you begin reading fiction vs all the non-fiction marriage related material! How was his other book OTC?

I love the quote;thank you. Your interpretation is on the mark, slowly the grief begins to pack its bags leaving more space to breath and be filled with what will hopefully be other pleasures.

Lost, as far as the anniversary date, I have a funny story. As I approached the one year mark, I kept wondering what to do about that date. How would I feel; what significance would I give this.

Well, we were all on a family vacation and I woke up on the DAY. I said to H while we were lying in bed that this was the DAY. He responded with "no, it isn't". I said "what do you mean, today's the day." Response, "No, it's actually tomorrow." Well, he was right!! I had the date wrong this whole time. So, by the time the next day came, it just didn't carry any significance. Any significance was clearly what I attributed to it.

I have to laugh because it was the best gift I could have received, now, I can't even recall the date. Thank God! Don't give it more than it's worth. I know it's easier said than done, but like OTC said, the affair memories steal away in pieces that YOU let go. If it's tough to let go; at least try not to add on.


BS-Me
WS-Him
D-day #1 LTA
False Reconciliation then
D-day #2
In reconciliation


"Just when the caterpillar thought it was over, she became a butterfly."


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