Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same.
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.
- Robert Frost
UKgirl - It was my H who finally came to terms with the fact (after much IC and discussion between us) that he was trying to hurt me. Hasn't drilled down deep enough to determine the complete answer to why. However, it looks to be mostly about getting back at his mother.
My H is not nearly as literary as yours (whose prose is quite good even though you may no want to know that). Anyway, he said he always thought about the above Robert Frost poem and always wondered to himself - what if I had taken a different path. I think clear, decisive decision-making is nearly impossible for these individuals. How do you make a decision when you can't even decide who you are?
If you are there I am sending you buckets of white light.
[This message edited by hurtshirley at 6:33 PM, January 16th (Wednesday)]
Well, not 100% satisfied, but it was a positive talk.
MC had warned me that guys aren't like us and because it was so long ago, don't expect immediate admission. I had 3 pieces of info to check on. He was truthful on one. The other he was less sure on, and the third (contact), denied contacting her, so I tipped my hand, and let him read the proof that I had. Even then, he said he still couldn't remember. He explained that most of what he told her was lies, so he forgets. He did say that he wanted to run away those first weeks after d-day when I was in so much pain, and when she contacted him, he answered, and admitted that he may have even been hedging his bets in case I left.
But he did say some beautiful things, apologized for my pain and suffering, said he wishes he could remember so that I can find peace, but he doesn't want to make stuff up. He said he didn't want to know how I got my info, but he wanted me to keep going, keep checking.
He even said that maybe we should go back to MC, if that will help me. I agreed, of course.
Most important, I expressed a wish that OW somehow knew that it was all lies that he told her, and he said he will write me a love letter telling me exactly that, and if I want to forward it to her, I can. He doesn't want to send one directly to her because it has been 21 months of NC.So thanks for all your help and advice.
[This message edited by IMstrong at 9:16 PM, January 16th (Wednesday)]
Much love to you. Wishing you strength of will and clarity of thought. And wishing the same for your husband.
I would NOT forward a love letter to her though. Remember that she is a nothing. It doesn't matter whether or not she knows what he told her were lies. It just doesn't matter what these women think. The truth is that they could have been anybody--as long as they provided their "service" and continued to "pet" them with words. They could have been totally faceless--or all wore the same face. It wouldn't make a bit of difference. They're all the same. They're all nothings.
And it just doesn't matter what they know or do not know about how our marriages are now.
If you think the grass is greener on the other side, it's because it's fertilized with bullshit.
The best protection a woman can have is courage.~Elizabeth Cady Stanton
(((((Zanny))))), wishing you strength to get you through the day, the week, the month.
Another rainy day in the UK. But another day nearer to spring. Check in later.
[This message edited by weepy at 5:38 AM, January 17th (Thursday)]
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
Hiding behind themselves and what they were doing. A double life over which they had no control? Passengers? Self absorbed, selfish, self pitying crap.
IC and I were talking about this last night. I used to describe my H as a guy with a hard candy shell and underneath was all the gooey soft center. Now that hard shell has turned into a 4'thick concrete wall and I'm not sure the soft center is even still there. She said he has built up so many walls from disappointment or fear in life... from the kids' disability, to his unsuccessful business, from his mother and her "you'll never be anything but trouble" attitude that it may actually have turned his insides to stone.
She said my layer of protection was paper thin. That I feel, think, act, from the heart. That there's nothing wrong with that. But it makes me so vulnerable to the slightest hurt. And he really is oblivious, in denial about reality. Everything's fine with him because he can't access how he truly feels. That he has to be hit over the head repeatedly to get anything through.
I told her about an incident with our son... he's been legally blind since birth and I've worked with countless doctors, therapists, school officials over the years to get him what he needs. My H, on the other hand, has questionned his level of disability, repeatedly said things like "he can see that" and "he can do that, you're just enabling him".
One day (after his reawakening) he and DS were out riding the dirt bikes and DS ran into an overhanging tree branch -- he didn't see it. H came home and cried because he finally saw it, he finally realized what I had said all those 16 years was correct. I asked her what she thought OUR tree might be. Then she turned it around on me -- What did I think our tree was. I told her the end of our M. But that with his armor, he'd pretend it was ok, let me go, walk away because it would be too hard to admit he was the problem. Which is why I've never played that card. Because then I'd have to walk or be viewed as weak. And something I never wished for would happen.
I told her about the incident with the "friend". How disappointed I was, how angry, how I didn't handle it well at all. How he still at the end of the diatribe didn't get why I was upset.
She told me to write out exactly what I find offensive and tell him it's his job to protect me from it as much as possible, along with my vigilence. How I would never find any joke or situation like that funny. So I'm working on that to take to MC tomorrow night.
hefty you asked who was in full R and feeling better? Obviously not me.
Had a long talk with my wh last night. Seems he is pretty remorseful and just disgusted with himself. Talked abotu how he didn't let himself think how bad it was when it ws ahppening, but knows now. Said how sorry he was over nad over and that he was going to make it up to me and keep us together nad we woudl eventually get through it. Many of the things I needed to hear form him.
I am still haunted by it all.
FNF - okay, from a newbie, it sounds like your Cing is bringing out supressed rage. Perhaps you buried some of this soon after dday in an effort to survive on a day to day basis and it is just now coming back to the surface. I think the good news is that your H is still bearing the brunt of that anger and telling you the truth. He is not lying to make you feel better and he is not telling you to get over it. I would keep with the Cing as maybe this is the last blast of pyroclastics before the volcano dies?
I can see where you would want to have a nice weekend away. Maybe postpone your next session until immediately after your return when you can use it to reflect on the nice time you had together or bitch about what an asshole he was!!!
I would keep with the Cing as maybe this is the last blast of pyroclastics before the volcano dies?
I think if you notice that you get all worked up, you probably should reschedule the one before your anniversary if you want to start the weekened off on a good note though.
Have you spoken to your C about what happens to you when you leave? Maybe he/she could 1) help you work through that, or 2) alter his/her style so that it doesn't fire you up as much (since you are working toward R).
"Why didn't you stop? Why did you have to get caught?" His answer, "I felt responsible for her." Oh that just sent me into a rage. Now the dilemma is that that was the truth. But I just couldn't handle it. "Responsible for her, what about your responsibility to me, to our children???" "When I told you I loved you, how happy I was, what a wonderful life we had, didn't you feel guilty, couldn't that help you to stop?"
Ugh. That is a very familiar conversation to me. Very painful.
If I come home from IC upset, it helps me if my H just sits on the couch with me and lets me cry on his shoulder, he doesn't have to do anything but hold me for a while.
Maybe write down whatever it is you are angry about right after your C session and try to bring it up when you're less emotionally vulnerable.
PS: Wouldn't mind some input on my letter to H in General. Read the second version.
[This message edited by weepy at 8:50 AM, January 17th (Thursday)]
IM and So Lost - It does sound as if your Hs are remorseful and are trying. I know it is hard for us to remember that this is hard for them too. They are being forced to confront how heinous their actions were and what that says about who they were as a person. Personally, I am glad that I don't have to confront that in myself
I think this is very true. I don't want to remember that, but it's true. I think particularly the past few days when I have finally reged adn said all the hateful things I think. He sort of sat back and said, fuck, I hate me for doing all that too. And when he gets defensive when we talk about how it started and all, I think again he feels like a complete idiot.
I even said to him last night. It must be impossible to let yourself believe you were the kind of person who woudl do such horrible, awful things.
I was thinking the same thing about 2 hours sessions. 1 hour wears me out. I don't think we could handle much over that. I tend to feel good after the MC ones adn more upset after the IC ones. Not sur why that is.
Wh is at IC right now. I wonder if he will tell me anything when we get home. I think I am going to ask a little bit. I want to know if he talked about eveyrthing that has been happening in the past week.
On my good days, I cognitively therapize myself with--look at today, who he's with, how he's trying--don't dwell on what his feelings were during the LTA, look at them now--all that stuff. And I think, for me anyway, that those facts that are so haunting for me will ALWAYS be haunting and rage-inducing for me, cuz I will never really get them.
My H was also the responsible for her type, or in his words, "I didn't want to hurt her" and "I thought I would end it gradually" and all that unrealistic crap. And it will forever hurt that not just my pain that would erupt when I found out, but our kids pain--wasn't enough to make him stop. One of the many things I have to swallow and go on with.
As our MC once said, it turned out that H is the kind of man who can have an A--and my bubble that he wasn't that kind of man is forever shattered, and all the details are little shards of glass that will always be in my head--sort of like a bullet that can't be removed, but the patient goes on living quite okay!!
I'm starting to ramble, but I could relate to your feelings. Hope your getaway is good and the MC is afterwards!!