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User Topic: Long Term Affairs V I I I
hurtbuthappy
♀ Member
Member # 14539
Default  Posted: 9:43 AM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Morning tribe!

I haven't been around lately and find it hard to find the time to catch up.

So many postings, so much pain!

Hugs to all.

I have to say I HATE VALENTINES DAY!!!!! All the mushy adds, and looking for cards is impossible. Hope someday I will enjoy this time again, but for right now it sucks!

Other than that, things are good. Ha!

Just checking in and getting this off my chest.


M-25 years
2 kids

Posts: 131 | Registered: May 2007
up2me
♀ Member
Member # 10681
Default  Posted: 11:48 AM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

thanks run, i needed that tight squeeze.
as i said 2 yr anti coming up and i'm assessing my life.
i'm trying to stay out of the victim mode and live my life, but i'm so afraid FOO can't be overcome by my husband. sure he can step out of it for a time, but who is it he really wants to be. does he even know?
when he has gone to therapy in the past he gave the correct answers lulling me into a false sense of security then BAM!!!!
i don't want to be in a marriage where i'm the parole officer/his mother.
FOO sucks!! why not grow up? why repeat a bad scenario?
thanks for listening tribe.
hugs all around

[This message edited by up2me at 11:51 AM, January 24th (Thursday)]


Posts: 690 | Registered: May 2006 | From: ny
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 12:49 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BT: Did you guys work through the workbook too? I have both. Haven't even looked at them yet.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

OK. Looking for some advice here. Sorry, no time to catch up on posts. Please just read this whoever’s got time. I’m fucked.

I was looking through finance records about boiler servicing and repairs (don’t ask, new boiler and now have hot water and heating again) and I came across, yes, you guessed it, a trigger. The date was 10 days before he told me, 19 July 06 when he had made a purchase for easyjet from Luton. £94. Could have been a single or a deal for two. He had a company credit card and I know it wasn’t for a golf trip b/c there’s nothing in the diary (sad woman checked).

Had he arranged a trip with her and not gone? Is that why she was frantically phoning the house, trying to get hold of him? Is that what brought all of this to a head and led to his confession? Maybe he couldn’t get away, having booked it. What should I do? It’s driving me nuts and he knows something’s up. He said, “Your Friday day is starting early”. If I put it to him, he’ll know I’ve still got all the phone records, diaries, etc. Shit. What to do? Fuck. Help, please. Gotta go, back soon.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
up2me
♀ Member
Member # 10681
Default  Posted: 1:12 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ukgirl
no advice from me because i wear my heart on my sleeve. i'm sorry you're dealing with this... i know "that place" all too well.
so just a hug and good thoughts

Posts: 690 | Registered: May 2006 | From: ny
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 1:18 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UKgirl, I don't know if this is the advice you're hoping for but I can tell you that when I find something like that I confront him immediately. There are times when, to my utter relief, it turns out to be nothing and I am glad that I have eased my anxiety. In other cases it might mean that something was planned and fell through but the fact is, it fell through and he came clean.
My H was scheduled to go on a trip with OW 2 months after d-day. The fact is, HE DIDN'T. He cancelled it immediately after d-day. It was scheduled for the weekend before Valentine's Day (you can imagine how furious I was). But HE DIDN'T GO AND SHE WAS THROWN UNDER THE BUS!
That is what we need to keep in mind. They were trashed like the garbage they are. We can never forget that. It's what makes R possible.
(((Ukgirl)))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ukgirl, breathe slowly and deeply. That was then. Thats over.You are in the now.You are safe. You are ok.

Now talk me through this.
So what if you have all the records still? So what?
Dont worry about that. You will get rid of it when you are ready to.

Then sit him down and tell him you need to talk. You want him to tell you about the weeks just prior to dday. Cast his mind back and tell you what was happening to him/them. You listen, ask questions if you need to clarify,but listen to him. Ask him open questions like, "How did that make you feel?""What happened then"

If he omits the flight (and wiat till the end of him talking), then ask him straight out, "H, you booked a flight on XXJuly. Tell me what that was about please."

Uk, dont be emotional. LISTEN to him. This could be a chance for you both to connect.
I know your thoughts are going to be running around like crazy, but if you can, just go through the options in your head first.
1. He booked it for both of them. But he didnt go.
2. He booked it for himself

That was the past Uk. You will be ok.

((((ukgirl))))

[This message edited by Lost Heart at 1:38 PM, January 24th (Thursday)]


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 1:26 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Having the same issue right now and talked to IC about it last night.

She suggested I go to H with the attitude of "Can you help me with this?" Like "Even after all this time some things just grab hold of me and I can't let go until I get to the bottom of them. How would you like me to bring this stuff to you? I'm not accusing you of anything, it's just like a scab that itches until you scratch it. I don't WANT this to bother me forever and if I can just get it off my chest I know I'll feel better."

Hopefully he'll be in an agreeable mood after an approach like that. Then tell him you found this, remind him you weren't LOOKING for it and ask him what it was.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
unabletocope
♀ Member
Member # 11730
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She suggested I go to H with the attitude of "Can you help me with this?" Like "Even after all this time some things just grab hold of me and I can't let go until I get to the bottom of them. How would you like me to bring this stuff to you? I'm not accusing you of anything, it's just like a scab that itches until you scratch it. I don't WANT this to bother me forever and if I can just get it off my chest I know I'll feel better."

Excellent advice from Weepy's IC. That's a great way to approach it, UKgirl.

(((((UKgirl))))

Those triggers that slap you from out of nowhere are so rough. But LH and FNF have a really good perspective on this. That was then, this is now and your marriage is completely different, as is your WH (hopefully).


me-LTA BW


Posts: 2598 | Registered: Aug 2006
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 1:56 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi HbH!
I am glad that things are well with you. I was wondering earlier how the rest of the Tribe were, the ones who dont post often or just lurk. And then I saw your post.
I hate VDAY too. Should be banned for people over 21 IMHO.

So how are the Tribesters who we dont hear often enough. I hope that if they are lurking or do pop by, that they are all ok, and will call in if they need us.
Maybe we should do a rollcall?

(((up2me)))
I am sorry you are hurting.
My IC tells me that I should focus on my issues, heal myself, make me stronger.
If H does his work, he will be able to join me. But if he doesnt, I will be so strong that I will be able to stand up for myself and say, "H, no more. I will no longer tolerate your disrespect to me or this family." And I will mean it and I will be strong enough to walk away.
So she says.
I am starting to believe her.
I cant see that happening just yet, but I can see how that can happen if H doesnt play ball fair.KWIM?
I know this doesnt solve your dilemma, but I just wanted you to know that you dont have to replay the same scene over and over. You do have choices. You do have control..over you.

***
BT, I will start tonight.
Shirley... Get her an apple to wont ya??

****
I had a good IC session today. BT you are right. I am feeling stronger, so maybe thats why I am not crashing. H and I spoke a little today, and will continue later.
He is on his way home from his first IC session. He said he really likes her and wants to go every week.
I need to control my anxiety about him doing/feeling anything inappropiate with her or any female.... i need to do this for myself.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
unabletocope
♀ Member
Member # 11730
Default  Posted: 2:05 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HbH- Valentine's Day SUCKS!!! I remember breaking down crying in the card isle trying to find a card that wasn't gushy that I could give to WH. (((hugs))) YOu'll make it through this holiday.

(((((up2me))))) more hugs coming your way


me-LTA BW


Posts: 2598 | Registered: Aug 2006
Feeling so alone
♀ Member
Member # 14492
Default  Posted: 2:51 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi All,

Just got a chance to peep in and scan the last 2 days. Couldn't really read all word for word. Mr. and Mrs. Smurf?????? What's up in LTA?

Lost Heart, glad you're better!!!

For whatever reason....I'm great once again. And..... drum roll please...... No xanax in almost a week. If I remember right last Sat was the last time I took one. That has got to be a first in almost 2 years.

Work, work, work.

Later
FSA


Together we're working through an LTA

If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?


Posts: 1357 | Registered: May 2007
So Lost
♀ Member
Member # 16801
Default  Posted: 2:56 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FSA, that is awesome that you haven't needed the xanax! I have taken to taing one now and aain. At first I wanted to feel it all, knwo how awful it all was. IC has convinced me to giv myself a break form it once in a while and just breathe.

(((Heftysmurf))) Glad she is making some effort and communication has been opened a bit. Hang in there!

UKgirl, I have to agree. It is a terribletiggery trickle truth thing to find out. But it was before dday. That is the key. It was not the least nor the worst of what he did, it is all just terrible. For all of us. But breathe, have a cup of tea, calm yourself. He did it then, not now. Talk to him. Approach him withot accusing, just saying that you need to know if he had been plannign a trip. You need the info. But keep breathing and lookig at the now, not the then. They were horrible then, let him try to be a good person now.

I need to tell my wh that he did good last night. Especially with sittin gright up with me when I felt bad and offering to lie with me as I fell asleep. Reinforce good behavior and all, right?


Me: BS
Wh: WS
Dday 10/28/07
LTA with coworker
Attempting Reconciliation
he is remorseful, I am willing, we'll see what happens

Posts: 671 | Registered: Oct 2007
hurtbuthappy
♀ Member
Member # 14539
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ukgirl, breathe slowly and deeply. That was then. Thats over.You are in the now.You are safe. You are ok.

LostH had good advice. Also almost word for word what my IC tells me when I start looking back.

I also wear my heart on my sleeve and would have to tell him what was bothering me. Maybe try to omit from your conversation all the past evidence you still have.

Unable - found a very boring Vday card without much sap or lovey crap. I didn't cry in the aisle, mostly alot of "yah right" comments. The kids got mushy ones though. Maybe he will notice, but I doubt it.

I lurk alot, just don't have alot of great advice to give. Still soaking it all in. I will answer any roll call though.

We are coming up on Dday anniversary and I really don't feel anything yet. Can't believe I have spent the last year thinking about this 24/7. Wonder how much he does.

I think Vday is more of a trigger for me because I know they were still in contact then. I thought we had a good day last year, but DDay #2 was yet to come. I think that is why this year I am REALLY dreading that holiday. Thank goodness it is a weekday. Much easier to treat it like any other day. Am I the only one really bothered by this day?


M-25 years
2 kids

Posts: 131 | Registered: May 2007
numb and scared
♀ Member
Member # 9908
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((up2me))))

as i said 2 yr anti coming up and i'm assessing my life.

I understand completely.
Our 2 yr. is coming up too.
The night of D-day, I gave myself a year to "know" if I could do this. Then last year this time, I knew I wasn't close to knowing yet, once and for all if I could do it, so....I essentially signed on for one more year.

My H always has/had major FOO issues that were the underpinnings of his twisted thinking.

However, I do not credit his LTA to his FOO issues (not 8 years worth of lying and cheating)..but I do assign my (our)difficulties in going forward to his still unresolved FOO issues. He is starting yet another run of IC. Sure hope we have found a REAL one this time..instead of a well-paid head-nodder.

i don't want to be in a marriage where i'm the parole officer/his mother.
FOO sucks!! why not grow up? why repeat a bad scenario?

Interesting...I had a conversation about JUST this topic with a wise and "been there" woman today.

We both agreed that we do not want to be the voice of reason with an adult who is stuck in adolescent or even younger behavior.
Don't want to have to point out the obvious and don't want to be "the messenger"...since we all know what happens to the messenger.

I do not intend to become the bitter mother whose adult "son" resents her because he needs her to supervise.

I doubt my H (or yours) wants that either..if they would really "think" about it.

(((((up2me)))))


BS
LTA
"Lying is the strongest acknowledgement of the force of truth."
- William Hazlitt
"Let us move on, and step out boldly, though it be into the night, and we can scarcely see the way."
-Charles B. Newcomb



Posts: 3958 | Registered: Feb 2006 | From:
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 3:42 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yay FSA!!! And she is back on the beat!

SoL, yes your H did good last night, and yes they do need positive reinforcement.
Are you going to talk to him about his time on the PC? Can you both reach a compromise on it such that it doesnt interfere with "coupletime"?

***

I do not intend to become the bitter mother whose adult "son" resents her because he needs her to supervise

NAS, I had a similar conversation with IC today too.
I am prepared to work on my FOO issues and any other issues that got tagged on. I know I can do this.

But H on the other hand...

So my dilemma is that what happens in 2 years time when (God willing)I have moved up and have grown, but he is still more or less in the same place.

Her take was what I mentioned earlier...that I will be strong enough in myself to walk away.
I get that BUT wouldnt going through all this be a waste then?
And its not like during this time I would keep my heart locked up.

I guess its where up2me is now, right?
Darn! I wish there were books already about this stuff.

(((up2me)))


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
numb and scared
♀ Member
Member # 9908
Default  Posted: 4:00 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Her take was what I mentioned earlier...that I will be strong enough in myself to walk away.
I get that BUT wouldnt going through all this be a waste then?

It will be a waste if it turns out to be a bust....BUT...it could turn around too.
You know, after all this shit and grief....I am willing to risk some more time and try to see his flaws up close and ugly... and see if this "emotional acne" can be cleared.

And its not like during this time I would keep my heart locked up.

True..but there is a sense of "caution" that hopefully is protective, while needed.

Interesting how many of us are coming up on the 2 yr. mark.
Must be that without realizing it, we have instinctively allowed this frame of time to "wait and see."

This fact will surely be noted in "the book."

(((Lost Heart)))


BS
LTA
"Lying is the strongest acknowledgement of the force of truth."
- William Hazlitt
"Let us move on, and step out boldly, though it be into the night, and we can scarcely see the way."
-Charles B. Newcomb



Posts: 3958 | Registered: Feb 2006 | From:
ziggy
♀ Member
Member # 16086
Default  Posted: 5:09 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am a lurker I guess.But I gain lots of insight by lurking.

[This message edited by ziggy at 7:17 PM, January 24th (Thursday)]


Posts: 115 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: Pittsburgh
OneToughCowgirl
♀ Member
Member # 14817
Default  Posted: 5:30 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((((Up2me)))))) Your screen name says it all - the place you've been in all along. Holding it on your shoulders. At some point you have to step back and create a space for them to step forward into and become an adult. That means that things could get messy. I was a control freak in overdrive and my H was a child for most of our M. I see my role in playing Mommy now, (aka co-dependence) and the pattern was so ingrained that I didn't know if I could change it and I certainly never thought he could. But there came a point where I had to step back and let him step forward in our R as an adult without guidance or direction from me. I had to ALLOW him the opportunity to be the adult. Luckily he did just that without my interference and continues to be the adult. I on the other hand have become the one who has to be "watched" now as I have become forgetful and a lot less responsible because I no longer believe it's all up to me. I no longer believe my life is a house of cards where I'm holding every card in place all by myself. So opposite of what I was, I can't even begin to tell you. He is the one now that runs through the checklists of what needs to be done. He is the one who stays on things and follows through and up. He is the one who initiates what should be done in our home/life etc. For almost 20 years he was absent from all of this. A non-participant in his own life while I was Mrs. Atlas holding the world on my shoulders. Now we have a pretty equal partnership and it leans more towards him being the more responsible one. This was a process that started early on after dday. First, I couldn't function the first few mos. at all. He HAD to step in. Next, we had a MC who saw this right away and really put the screws on me to step back and see what would happen. Time and time again, situation after situation, we covered it in MC and in IC for me to give up control. And then one day I realized I was living with an adult for once and I could finally step back completely. After a few mos. of this I began to feel safe and began to trust. Now I am completely trusting he will be the adult in our R as well as me. But I can't tell you how much weight it's taken off of me to not feel like I'm holding both of us up. Now, I can tell you this was a big risk because in the 25 years I was with this man he had NEVER demonstrated he could be an adult in our R. This could have gone a completely different direction. My point here is that at some time you're going to have to take the risk of stepping back to see if he will step forward. You have to allow him to falter a little and know he's going to do things HIS way, not yours, and be OK with that. Or he's going to fail completely and things may get a bit messy but you'll know for sure he doesn't have it in him and perhaps it's time for you to make different choices. But if you don't step back, you will never know what you really have there in that man. I hope all this makes sense. I'm typing really fast. I know it's hard to be in this sitch. It's really hard. And it's really scary. Just sending you hugs ((((Up2))))


M 20 years / together 25 yrs
6 yr LTA
Me 47
FWH 48
D-Day Jan. 2006
We're good and getting better every day!

Posts: 607 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Chicago
OneToughCowgirl
♀ Member
Member # 14817
Default  Posted: 5:45 PM, January 24th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I get that BUT wouldnt going through all this be a waste then?

LostH, absolutely not! I always took the position that if I went through all this and we still D'd it wasn't wasted because understanding those subconscious attractors that draw us to a person to right the wrongs from childhood would be out of my way and I would be free from making a poor choice in the future for a lifemate. I also knew this stuff had deep influences in ALL aspects of my life - not just my M. And I knew that this was like emotional pilates where you build your core strength. Once built it would carry me to anywhere I wanted to go. Away from him, into nothing but good, if that was the case. I was fortunate, it wasn't.

Ziggy, I'm running short on time and have to run, but it sounds like you have only been given reasons to get angrier with your H versus to get past it. If he is not openly working WITH you to heal versus just being there and no longer humping the whore, that's not enough. It takes work. Working in MC, IC and lots and lots of dialog where he shows over and over again he is willing to be there and answer your questions and hold you while you cry. Getting past the anger takes his participation. Having a LTA, let alone second dday where he is still carrying on with OW shows he can't be trusted.It is up to him to work his ASS off to show you he can be trusted and it could take years. This is where the anger begins to dissapate. The anger doesn't magically go away with time. It's earned over time that is filled with lots of hard work. Hope this helps. ((((Ziggy))))))


M 20 years / together 25 yrs
6 yr LTA
Me 47
FWH 48
D-Day Jan. 2006
We're good and getting better every day!

Posts: 607 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Chicago
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