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User Topic: N.P.D. Thread Part V
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 11:49 AM, March 24th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In many ways it really doesn't matter what the diagnosis is. Alot of times there are multiple diagnoses if you can get them to see someone. There are some serious debates about the disorders and one doctor might say it is one thing and another will give it a different name.

I seriously don't care what the diagnosis is because I know what kind of damage they can do when they are disordered. Much of the time it is difficult for the professionals to see the disorders because the signs are more visable in close relationship and they are able to play act in the appointments with the doctors etc. Many of them would consider it a game to pull one over on the pros just to prove they are better.

CJ my ex has done things like your WTF. My ex will do the ask thing with my kids. He expects them to call him and ask for visits. The kids are expected to call him if they want to talk to him. He pretty much won't do anything for them unless he is asked. It is a form of control.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
veritas
♀ Member
Member # 3525
Default  Posted: 9:19 AM, March 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

NPD's and children: Mine told me last night that he wanted to build a shed out in the backyard so that he could do some work when he got home because taking care of Lola was too much for him; he needed to get some work done. I was speechless; he spends at most, if you add up all the times he spends with her in the evenings, 1 hour. Most of the time, it's not even an hour.

BUT... he's got a project that he might not be able to finish. Better to blame it on the baby than to blame it on himself and his own laziness.


Actions unmask what words disguise.
Love many; trust few; and always paddle your own canoe.
When you win, you teach; when you lose, you learn.

Posts: 10164 | Registered: Feb 2004
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 12:55 PM, March 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mine did that as well. He spent so much time caring for the kids. He didn't. Heck I have found I have alot more time with him gone because he created so much more work for me.

Now mine says that I keep him from seeing the kids because I am such a bitch. Whatever floats your boat.

I half wonder what all he tells the fiance about me because she asked the kids if I was smart. LOL This was when I was in university. I wonder why she would ask that because obviously I am smart enough to have college and univerity degrees and she has a 1 yr diploma. I met the ex in college and he would have probably failed a few of the classes if I had not helped him. I am sure he didn't spin it that way for her.

Veritas the worst part of that is when they start blaming the kids directly. Mine has told the kids that they caused him to have his temper tantrums and has even gone so far as to refuse to take one of them on visits if they don't behave for him as a way to punish them for pissing him off. He hardly sees them as it is and in his mind seeing them on visits is a "reward". So much for his responsibility to care for them and parent them. psycho.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, March 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The freak is pretending to be wonder-dad these days. The sad thing is the kids really want to believe it is true. Of course, the truth will come out and that will be heart-breaking for them. The worst thing of all for me is seeing the effect his behaviour has on the kids. It is sick.

Not much to say of any use at the mo - having one of those quiet reflective times. But thinking of you all.


Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
janedoe99
♀ Member
Member # 17083
Default  Posted: 11:55 AM, March 27th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey guys! It's been awhile since I've posted -- and I see that the last few posts are about N's and kids, so my timing is perfect!

I need help with some divorce settlement wording.

Here is some background first –

My stbxn and I are still in the process of our divorce. We just had our Temporary Relief Hearing. Despite my stbxn’s (and his attorney’s) attempts to make me look bad, I was awarded Primary Residential Custody, child support, and the judge ordered First Right of Refusal. My stbxn feels that all I am after is his money. I feel that the only reason why he wanted Primary Residential custody of daughter is so that he doesn’t have to pay me child support. My N is all about money and his entitlement to his money.

With a good amount of advanced notice, I asked my stbxn to switch our days for visitation with daughter this week – my Tuesday for his Thursday. I had a meeting on Tuesday, and although it wasn’t going to take up the entire night, just felt that a switch of nights would be the best for everyone. He was fine with the switch. But then on the Tuesday in question, my stbxn said that he made a mistake in his scheduling and did not want to give up his Thursday night with daughter. He said that he would watch daughter while I was at my meeting. So I had a choice of either changing my plans, or just going ahead with allowing stbxn to have daughter for some extra time on Tuesday. I opted for the latter.

It wasn’t really that big of a deal, except that I see this as another way for stbxn to try to control me. Of course, if this was a normal person – again, no big deal. But with my N, he feels that it’s okay to inconvenience me, even though we already agreed to the switch. Plus, I feel that if he made the mistake in the scheduling, he should be inconvenienced – but again, I working with an N, so that’s not how he sees it.

I have a feeling that this is going to be a theme for the next 15 years with daughter. I will anticipate schedule changes, give him sufficient notice, and then he will do a bait and switch at the last minute. So I need to set some boundaries to ensure that doesn’t happen on a regular basis.

I know I can put something in the divorce settlement that says at least 24 hour notice for any visitation changes – but do you think that is strong enough? Plus, this recent mishap was a change to a change (if you catch my meaning). I made the initial change in visitation, and then he just changed it back to the original agreement – with him getting an extra hour and a half with daughter.

Maybe someone here has another suggestion on wording. I’m trying my best to think of everything since I know that with N’s things have to be spelled our crystal clear in the divorce settlement, otherwise they will take advantage of things.

Thanks – and I apologize for the long post!

JD


Me BW 36 Him WH/XH 32
DD - 4 y/o; DSS 11 y/o
M 4yrs/ Together 8
D-day#1/2 - Sept. 2007, Nov. 2007
Divorced 4/08

Posts: 156 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Florida
landabear
♀ Member
Member # 15046
Default  Posted: 12:23 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

JD - the wording of the document likely won't matter anyway, but I think 24 hours notice is standard. It's in mine.

At any rate, I can tell you that in the past two (!) years of divorce from my ex, the N, I have learned to:

1) Not request a change in schedule if at all possible

2) Deny a request change if it in any way, shape or form inconveniences me.

Let me explain.

I tried, at first, to make it as easy as possible for him to see his children. This lead to him taking every inch I even *thought* about giving, and I was once again in the position of being a doormat.

I also tried to operate under the proviso that if switching days worked for HIM, it should work for ME, in return. This rarely worked, in that most of the time I needed to switch days for work - he was suddenly unavailable. But if he needed something, boy, it was EXPECTED I be available.

So I started saying no to his requests. For many reasons, not the least of which is because dammit, he signed the agreement and custody schedule - hell, he and his attorney drafted it - and he should be accountable to it. Also because it wasn't fair to the kids to have a constantly changing schedule.

For my own sanity's sake, I also now won't ask for a switch - to depend on him for childcare, in any way, shape or form kept him tangled in my business far more than I cared to have him.

So if something won't work with my schedule? I don't do that something, or I find another way for the kids to be handled - either bring them with, find a friend they can playdate with, or exchange a couple of hours with Auntie and Cousins and take her's for a few hours a couple of days later.

The best thing you can do is tell those you are doing business with that Tuesday and whatever other nights you have her are unavailable for business. Period.

edited for clarity, miss scatter-brained here

[This message edited by landabear at 12:26 PM, March 27th (Thursday)]


BS
Divorced: March 2006
Married to a wonderful, FAITHFUL man: October 2009

Posts: 728 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Midwest
janedoe99
♀ Member
Member # 17083
Default  Posted: 1:57 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Landabear! I will heed your advice

Luckily the Tuesday thing will be over at the end of April, and I will NOT be scheduling anything more on that day.


Me BW 36 Him WH/XH 32
DD - 4 y/o; DSS 11 y/o
M 4yrs/ Together 8
D-day#1/2 - Sept. 2007, Nov. 2007
Divorced 4/08

Posts: 156 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Florida
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 7:20 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I tried to be accomodating with my ex N as well. It was a painful process because I if I ask him for anything he made sure I "paid" for it later in making my life difficult. In my case there was not a specific schedule so he now sees them less and less and only when it is convenient for him. I am to the point where if he sees the kids then it is bonus. He has screwed it up so many times that I depend on him and I won't do it.

What I have noticed with many N is that they feel parenting is optional. Children benefit from consistent schedules and having a parent they can depend on.

As for the wording, I don't think that you can adequately express flexability in scheduling in a way that would get a N to cooperate and not twist it to have new meanings you never intended. Put it in writing and stick to it like it was in stone. Anything else will probably lead to grief and disagreement.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
DD123
♀ Member
Member # 13369
Default  Posted: 8:33 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My lawyer told me when dealing with an NPD to always have a plan "B".

Even if it is his weekend to take the kids he can and will cancel at the last minute.

The only two out-of-town trips I did have scheduled during his visitation weekends I had given him written warning in ADVANCE and he gave WRITTEN approval. It didn't matter, he went ahead and canceled last minute anyway.

In December I had to take my oldest girl to a soccer tournament out of town and he agreed to take the other two (in writing) that weekend. He ended up taking his OW to NYC for her birthday and I had to make last minute alternative plans for the other kids. It was a nightmare.

Then in February I had a trip planned for Lake Tahoe with friends. It was his weekend with the kids. He cancelled last minute and I had to pay for childcare for the other two. Another nightmare.

Neither of these events had an ramifications for my N. He got away with it. I document it in case of court action down the road, but that's all I can do.

Their time will always be more important than your time.

I asked my lawyer what to do and he said always have a plan "B". I do.

I would love to take another trip, but I know it will cause me stress, so I don't. Another thing he has taken from me.


Married 16 years
Kids - 16, 15, 7
D-day 12/4/06.
Many add'l d-days; many false Rs
Separated 3/18/07; Divorced 2/20/08

"Women are like tea bags...you never know how strong they are until they are in hot water!!!"


Posts: 667 | Registered: Jan 2007
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 12:54 AM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Tribe))),
All this talk about the NPD Freaks and divorce stuff, I'll toss in a couple of bits...

The Ns are always gonna screw something up, negate their commitments and generally "forget" stuff, just as always. And it will be your fault, just as always. LOL.

I got lucky as the mediation and court stuff went in my favor. STBXPDW has the kids one day a week and everyother weekend. She still screws it up by leaving the kids elsewhere even though there is a first right of refusal. I guess she "forgot."

Kids were to see their counselor yesterday. STBXPDW was notified awhile ago and responded confirming the date via email. Kids were home late yesterday. I guess she "forgot."

It never ends. Document. Try to get as much of the proceedings into your realm of responsibility, as the "Freaks" are not able to take care of things.

Plans B, C, and Q will help also. LOL.

These aberrations will always screw crap up. It's their perverted nature. LOL.

And they suck. LOL.

Your the sane, er... not Personality Disordered parent. Kids need ya. That other "parent" was but a donor. LOL.

As best you can, rely on the Fucktard*Asshat (SI lingo for not very nice person. LOL.) for nothing. Especially money. I know it's hard, but they will screw if they can.

Be self-sufficient and count what they do come thru on as an added bonus. They are three after all. LOL.

Hope this helps.

You guys (gals) ROCK !!!

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 1:36 AM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Same here! I make alternative plans and I don't rely on him for anything - no childcare, no money, no support with issues the kids have. Nothing.
If I have no expectations then I have no disappointments. The freak stopped following the court's arrangements for children within a month of it been written.
My kids has a parents evening at their school last night. They were expecting him to show up, I told them not to get their hopes up - who do you think was disappointed?
I guess he had more important things to do like licking the fluff out of the ow's bellybutton!

Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
janedoe99
♀ Member
Member # 17083
Default  Posted: 8:25 AM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Lied, DD, BoB, and Itsa -- I really appreciate your advice and feedback!

Right now, my N is acting like the father of the year because of the whole divorce proceedings thing (gotta look good for the judge, you know?). I have a feeling that once everything is final that things will change -- he won't exercise his right to visitation, etc.

I like the idea of having no expectations -- I'm going to start practicing that.

I'll keep you guys posted on the proceedings. Mediation is in a couple of weeks -- I have NO expectations that it will go well.

Hugs,

JD


Me BW 36 Him WH/XH 32
DD - 4 y/o; DSS 11 y/o
M 4yrs/ Together 8
D-day#1/2 - Sept. 2007, Nov. 2007
Divorced 4/08

Posts: 156 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Florida
juli
♀ New Member
Member # 18791
Default  Posted: 10:04 AM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was just reading threads here & wondering now if my H is NPD. Here's some examples: He is teaching 1 class at a local college and we went to my mom's house and at dinner table he asks my mom "did Juli tell you I am a college professor now?" He also told our 3 year old to tell her friends at daycare that her daddy is a college professor. He spoke at some meeting last week and came home and said "I rocked out with my cock out. They loved me. Everybody was complimenting me" Or after the second night of his class he had been home for a while and says "aren't you going to ask me how my class went?" Before he leaves for work he gives me a hug and then gets mad and said "you didn't even tell me to be careful today". But actually I did say it, he just didn't hear me and why do I have to say that line every morning anyhow? When he was going to school working on his masters, he would spend countless hours reading and rereading his text books and he is a smart man and got 4.0, but he would really suck up to his teachers and they would write praises on his papers and he always showed me and everyone else in his family. He taught a class last semester and took his class evaluations to Christmas dinner and passed them around to family to read the things his students said about him. He really, really wants and expects praise. Maybe that 's why he had an A too? Anyway, does he sound NPD?

Posts: 9 | Registered: Mar 2008
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 12:52 PM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hi juli!
Tough call, don't really know. He might be just a graden-variety insufferable ass. I hope for your sake that's it.

ON page 2 of the ICR forums, you can go back and read the first NPD thread (& on) - they're loaded with info...

Keep posting at SI, come back if the crazy-lightbulbs go off too! I'd be a jibbering idiot if not for the folks here...
jj


Posts: 5996 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
dreamlife
♀ Member
Member # 8142
Default  Posted: 4:23 PM, March 28th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

juli~ he could just be extremely emotionally "needy"...any other things bother you? Temper, etc.??

After my N started teaching a variety of grades in the midwest, he called to tell me a 3rd grader had written him his very first "FAN Letter"...a freaking FAN???
Like he was a ROCK STAR?!!
When I saw this "letter" later, a mere 2 line "thank you", the student was obviously COACHED by her mother.
UGGGGGG

Imagine, getting N supply off of students and parents.


~XWH told me what I wanted to hear but he always did whatever he wanted to do~

Posts: 25351 | Registered: Sep 2005
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 9:18 AM, March 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tough lady. New to SI. BS.
I don't know, could maybe use some helpful advice from experienced Tribe on divorcing the N...

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=224455&HL=17484


Posts: 5996 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
StungAgain
♀ Member
Member # 13283
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, March 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Tribe, it has been ages since I have posted. I think before I had to move, wait did I tell you all I had to move?

So I am living in a hotel with WHNPD yes you all read right, and it has been VERY difficult for me. I told him the other day that I swear I am grieving the relationship I USED to have with him, as what we have now will never compare to that.

The anger I feel at times is so intense I swear I don't know where it comes from. I know it comes from within but it just feels like madness. See it seems to get triggered when the topic of lawyers comes up. I am suing OW for my share of the property (I went and saw my lawyer 3 weeks ago) to retain him, but my frustration with him is he is too busy to attend to my matter. So I called my motor vehicle accident lawyer to see if he can refer me to someone as I dont' have time to waste right now.

Are you all sitting down for the next part????

WHNPD is suing OW!! Apparently his lawyer told him that he is entitled to the equity in the property that he transferred to her. I said "ummm did ya happen to mention that you were common law with me at the time this shit went down?" Well of course he didn't! I said I am thoroughly disgusted that you are strictly in it for the money. He looks at me and says "how do you know I am in it just for the money?" I said "because that is how it appears!! Also you haven't even told your lawyer about me etc!!!!! My lawyer knows EVERYTHING, and he even told me that having my asshat WHNPD'er on my side will work in my favour as he will be able to back up that we were living common law at the time he transferred the property (that used to be our home) to her!!!

I journalled last night, first time in months. I wrote 6 1/2 pages of stuff, I knew I had stuff within, but it was amazing how much. Today I wrote another page... just so much frustration inside.

With not being able to find a place we are living in a hotel with our pets, trying to ind a place that allows pets has been very difficult.

I hadn't seen my therapist in over 5 weeks so he closed my file, and the day he closed my file a few days later I called him to set up an appointment, figures right? So I am on week 2 of probably a 3 week waiting period to see him *sigh* but he is worth the wait. I was givin a number to call if I need to vent in the meantime or continue journalling.

I was working at the clothing store but quit due to problems with my neck and arm. I was about to take over a company of my g/f's. She ran a house cleaning business but yesterday she fired me via photocopied letter I was never more humiliated in my life. Now I just have the janitorial job at the high school perhaps that is for the best right now anyways.

Hmmm, oh saw my specialist as I have been having some problems with tingling in my arm and between my shoulder blades. It seems that the diagnosis is that it is coming from my neck and I now have to see a neurologist to be tested on my responses to things that relate to my right hand. I also have to see an Anathestatist about alternate therapy options and what level of severity I am looking at.

Well the drama train just keeps chugging along..... *sigh*

Stung


BS 41 (me)
H 42
'GOOD FRIENDS ARE LIKE STARS...
YOU DON'T ALWAYS SEE THEM,
BUT YOU KNOW THEY ARE ALWAYS THERE.'

Posts: 822 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: British Columbia,Canada
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:30 PM, March 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((Stung))))
Good to hear from you!
Stay strong!
How incredibly difficult that is, I really can't even imagine...

You're reminding me of that Mother Theresa quote - about how God doesn't give you more than you can handle, but "I wish He didn't trust me so much."

Many hugs and prayers for you!


Posts: 5996 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Heartless Bytchh
♀ Member
Member # 12347
Sad  Posted: 8:08 PM, March 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I guess I belong here too.

I've 42 pages of the first NPD thread and fucktard pegged on so many of the symptoms.
I'd wondered for years if he was some kind of bi-polar or what.I knew something wasn't right, just not what it was.

JJ, great snark on page 38 of this thread.
I loved it!

I have a bad feeling y'all will be seeing more of me on this thread.
I've been posting down in the FR thread, but this explains maybe why I had those FR's.
Those still frikken' hurt.

But the N 'thang" sure puts them in a different light.


Woodchipper pretty much trumps everything.-Rufus Turner
Sometimes I feel like SI is that person who says... "if you can't say anything nice... come sit by me!"-rumorhasit

Posts: 6061 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Another day in Paradise
Heartless Bytchh
♀ Member
Member # 12347
Default  Posted: 9:34 PM, March 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, some days I just revel in Heartless Bitchdom.

Dreamlife on page 6


Woodchipper pretty much trumps everything.-Rufus Turner
Sometimes I feel like SI is that person who says... "if you can't say anything nice... come sit by me!"-rumorhasit

Posts: 6061 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Another day in Paradise
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