my question for the LTA gang, how did you know when to sign up or give up on your spouses?
If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?
I'm sorry that you have suffered a false reconciliation. Other than the initial insult of an affair, I think a false reconciliation must be one of the more difficult crosses to bear.
That you have suffered both and are still standing signals to me that you are a woman of strength, probably more than you know.
Hang in there, and post here often. The collective wisdom and compassion of the members of this tribe are among the most healing forces I've ever encountered.
I do not think we are at the real R stage yet but maybe inching their. Just brutal to my heart and mind. Must keep patience. The next few months likely determine the path of the rest of my life.
He is still in the A if he is still in contact with her, IMHO.
I am so sorry that you are going through this...again.
You ARE an incredibly strong person. You WILL get through this, with or without Mr F*cktard.
How about you not make a legal decision to quit? How about you make choice to move on with your life, since he seems to be cake-eating through his. Dont allow him to do this to you Canbird.
The wise ones here refer to the 180 list. Have you checked that out? Move along for you. Build yourself up in small steps, and before you know it, you will be standing strong by yourself.
Many things can happen in the interim. HE could carry on with his A. He could snap out of it when he realises that his family is moving on without him. But you will be at a place where you will be able to manage whatever happens. You have so done so so far.
Thats my opinion Canbird, sitting here 100's of km away from you, without much more knowledge of you or your family.
What would you want to do?
Do you want to kick him off the fence now, and make him choose for definite?
Do you want to choose, and tell him that if he doesnot get his act together now, dont bother coming back?
I am sure there are other choices,but I am bit as have both DDs home from school ill.
Your dday#2 was so so recent. Its very difficult to think rationally at this time. Which is why I suggested the 180 for you to build yourself up.
I prob came across all jumbled Canbird. Please continue to post and the Tribe will hold your hand through this journey.
So, my question for the LTA gang, how did you know when to sign up or give up on your spouses?
Having done both, sometimes within hours of each other, I'm not sure exactly what it is.
My H had already made his choice by the time I found out. So there was no fence sitting, no false reconciliation. I don't know if I could have tolerated that. I'm barely tolerating that it ever happened and there's no chance of contact since she's been dead for more than 2 years.
And I know this is going to come out wrong so bear with me... He has to commit to you, he has to stop contact with her and rededicate himself to your life, show remorse, do whatever it takes to help you heal asap.
IF, and I say IF he does that. I'd look at a 2 year LTA out of 20+ year marriage and say ok, I'll try. Some here are dealing with all their marriage including a third party, me, almost half between the affair period and the continuing (non-sexual) contact, the porn addiction, etc.
I'd also say the affair should be outed to her H. Right now her only stake is in your H and keeping him.
You have time to work on yourself now, just like he's been advised. Do it. Don't worry about single friends finding you "someone". Don't fret about the single life now. If your kids are teens, they can take care of a lot of themselves. I know it will be harder to deal with them. But I was basically a single parent (he was NEVER available) for those 10 years and I managed. Both my kids are also disabled.
We are strong, mighty women and deserve a lot more than we've gotten from these men. Remember that.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
Sucks doesn't it?
Yes, Canbird it does.
You have come to the right place for help and advice. Most on here will tell you not to make any major decisions right now. Give it time.
Do you still love your H? I had to really look at that question. We had been in such a bad place for so long and I had no idea why. But I had to stop and think, "do I still want to be with him".
In the short time I had between discovery of the A and confrontation, I realized that I wanted to be able to say to my kids that we/I tried to make it work.
We had so many years and I was not willing to throw that away so quickly. He on the other hand was not so sure. He said he wanted R but he did have a VERY hard time giving up OW. Says they stopped seeing each other right away. I have my doubts. I know phone/email contact continued (and may still be) for quite awhile.
He loved her and she was his best friend for 4 years. There A went way beyond sex and I am finally coming to terms with that. He was unable to lose her cold turkey, but he is definitely coming out of his fog.
Rather long winded here, (very unusual for me), but the wise ones are right when they say "give it time". Go to the healing library and read, read anything you can on A's and keep posting.
My husband is not rededicating himself to me or my life right now. He is rededicating himself to himself. Like so many others he works with her. :eyes.
I am trying to be the strong woman. My job is actually working with kids with special needs. That is an area I am good and and proud to be a part of. Now I have to work at finding something else in my life that I can look forward to (god knows the stress of raising teens could kill us all !)
I will keep posting I need to know that I am not the only one in this big wonderful world who can't seem to find a straight line but gets really sick of the roller coaster, round and round, yellow brick road that seems to be leading to the Wicked Witch of the West (otherwise known as OW!).
Your H is still in a deep fog. It is hard for them to break away from that when they work together.
My H had totally compartmentalized his life. Work life and Home life. Went so far as to bring home all photos of me and kids he had at work. Even the kids weren't part of the work life.
Glad you have not allowed him back into the home yet. He needs to decide what he wants and you should not have to "share him". My H also felt he needed to talk with OW sometimes. to make sure she was OK.?. WTF?
OWH has to take care of himself now. He knows and will believe what he wants.
You need to focus on you.
Continue to take care of yourself, are you in IC or MC?
You are a strong woman and sometimes teenagers can be the distraction we all need. My kids, my job and SI are what has gotten me through this so far.
It is day to day, but most days are looking sunnier. Just hate the roller coaster ride of pain and anger! You are not alone.
One of the reasons H has given me for being able to go nc was because I finally knew everything (so he says) which enabled him to finally break the hold she had over him in a sense. If you liken it to Shirley Glass he had opened all the windows to me and had built the wall to ow. He still had to decide it for himself but by me knowing everything, when ow was trying to contact him, some nice messages and then horrible ones, he was able to share with me and that helped him stick with nc.
Up until this point he had not been able to make the final cut. Although looking back he now admits that he was always going to stay with me he really was cake eating just like other SI users say.
At about 4.5 mths we separated for two weeks (agreed in advance) during which time he had to make a decision. He was supposed to be NC with us both, but he had text contact with me and had sex with her - perfect world! He came home telling me he was committed to me and our false R started for the next 6 weeks.
I suppose the reason I'm saying this is that each of our stories never turns out the way we expect them to. I know I find it really hard not to imagine every scenario under the sun, but even though I've spent hours doing this at each point along the line, not once have I been right. Sometimes reality has been better, sometimes its been worse.
So, what I'm saying in the most long winded way possible(!), is that the ONLY thing we can do is concentrate on ourselves, try and make a life for ourselves that reflects our strengths and values and enables us amongst all the shit to say that we lived up to our own expectations. It is incredibly hard especially with children, I don't envy you teenagers because I don't suppose it is possible to hide the truth from them, at least with my younger ones they still don't know anything about this. So I guess that adds an extra layer of difficulty.
I would suggest that perhaps you are asking too much of yourself to make a decision, you do not yet know all the facts and until you do it will be very hard to make one. What you can do, is survive and survive well, you can get showered every morning, you can be there for your children, you can go to work and you can show the world and yourself that life does carry on. You will survive this. Honestly, it's hard, probably the hardest thing you've ever done, especially when you know that in a sense you're waiting for your H, but that's ok. I know for me, it has actually been a bit of a lesson to learn how to live with uncertainty and let go of control. It's hard, but it has its benefits. I know now that I can do a lot of things I didn't know I could before. And one of them is that sometimes it is better to wait and see what happens no matter how hard it is.
By the way I agree with Weepy. It might be worth thinking about letting MOWH know if he doesn't already. However, only you know the specifics of your situation so you should weigh this up for yourself. I chose not to tell SOW's parents (who she lives with still) for all sorts of reasons and although I had a significant amount of pressure on me from all sorts of people to tell them (At one point my Father and my father in law were talking about paying a visit (together) to her father!) I made everyone promise not to do it and now I am glad we didn't. I have my own reasons for this and they are about being able to live with myself and my own values, but if she had been married I'm not sure what I would have done. I think a H deserves to know, but I do know that for some this may not feel like the right thing to do, it is something you need to weigh up carefully for yourself. The most important thing is that it is the right thing for you.
I also agree with the others that until NC is actually maintained there is no reconciliation. You will know if there is NC because your H will be different. Knowing what I know now I can see that we were in false R for those 6 weeks. Hindsight is such a wonderful thing.
This all takes time your H is not making decisions quickly and nor do you need to, treat yourself gently, take the pressure off, treat yourself in the same way that you would treat your daughter if she were suffering through a severe emotional trauma.
Take care Canbird.
ETA: Sorry didn't see you'd already posted that you had outed OW!
[This message edited by mumto3sat at 10:06 AM, February 5th (Tuesday)]
sorry to be a post hog, but just saw this discussion in The book club forum - about the book, "getting past the affair". Might help.
On a brighter note my H is now completely fog free and although it is hard I am glad we are where we are. I can't say the pain is worth it, but I can say I have a H who is a changed man.
So, what I'm saying in the most long winded way possible(!), is that the ONLY thing we can do is concentrate on ourselves, try and make a life for ourselves that reflects our strengths and values and enables us amongst all the shit to say that we lived up to our own expectations
This is exactly what I finally realized.
I can only be the person I want to be. IC kept telling me I was the only one who could make ME happy. She was right.
I can't control what H does or wants to do. I can only do what I want and live the life I want.
WH knows I expect NC and he is doing everything I have asked.
I know the A is over, but I also know if he wants to "check in" on her, I can't control that.
I can only control what my reaction is to that. Then he has to live with the consequences.
To me that is what R is. Knowing the expectations and living up to them. We both have to live up to our expectations of this M and if we aren't, we aren't in R.
Went so far as to bring home all photos of me and kids he had at work.
OMG I had forgotten about this. One day during the A I found all the kids' pictures he used to carry in his wallet on the bedside table. I asked him why and he said they were out of date. So I gave him new ones and they went on the pile too.
His second explanation was that if his wallet was ever stolen,he didn't want the "bad guy" to know he had kids at home.
Dday I asked the question and got the "silence" (which means I got it right but he couldn't admit it) "Did you take these out because you couldn't bear looking at your kids faces when you took the money out to pay the whores?" ( I didn't know about the LTA at this point yet).
I had no one to "out" the OW to since she was single and apparently estranged from her family. (Gee wonder why? ) But I thought about calling her parents, still do at times, to find out if they knew about her "special friend".
Now completely O/T.... I just went shopping to get a new dark shirt for the funeral and I can't believe what size I'm wearing now. Hanging out in my scrubs and sweat pants for 6 weeks hasn't helped root reality.
I've now decided to give up eating all together and I'm headed to the gym.
If I don't log back on here by 3 PM, someone send the paramedics to LA fitness....
Yes, I know it's not about me, and in some aspects I've come full circle.
Still, it takes a long time to get over an LTA....as you all know.
"The term “mistake” infers a level of ignorance, innocence and naivety. And a lack of intent and planning." - Craig Harper
I have now gained officially 40 lb since Dday. On Dday I was about 20 lb. over my ideal weight. So now I'm 60 over. 20 more and I'll be right back to where I was while he was cheating.
And I hate to admit that he was right about anything, but I am not interested in being naked with him. I'm sure I'm sending out those signals, like he said I was. And honestly, I can't blame him for not being interested, especially with the corral he had. Yes, I know they were hookers. But they were young, 130 lb. hookers with perfect little bodies. (Because they HAVE to he says).
No offense to the men here, but c'mon ladies, would you REALLY rather have your 350 lb. H crushing you? or some young hottie who can contort and do lots of positions?
If you were single, which would be your first choice? Honestly I know what mine would be and I know what my H gravitates to, what he stares at on the street and has taken to bed.
I know his A had nothing to do with whether I weighed 130 or 230 but I'm sure he would prefer me the former.
So I'm starving and I was good and ate grapefruit. But of course today I started ribs at like 8 AM and they smell so good....
But I do not and have never judged my love or attraction to him by his weight
Neither have I, but I know my H has. He told me a lot of the hookers looked like I USED to. That's what made him attracted to them. He's said he would love me no matter what, but attraction is a different thing entirely.
My H's weight hasn't fluctuated more than 20 lbs since I met him. And he has a small frame so, those 20 lbs. showed. I told him I didn't see it because I looked in his eyes and they were the same eyes I fell in love with. But he's said with guys it's different.. they like the package.
PS: Nobody warned me anything about grapefruit... what's up with that?
[This message edited by weepy at 1:28 PM, February 5th (Tuesday)]
I've come to the conclusion it's about taking care of us Weepy, we just can't be bothered because it seems to have so little point when life is so crap. I even said to IC this week that I do wonder whether I don't want to give H the gift of a gorgeous thin wife as punishment because he seems to have got everything his way, but her response was but if he has a gorgeous and thin wife that means you get to BE gorgeous and thin. Is his punishment more important to me than myself?
Your weight is nothing to do with your H Weepy, it is to do with you. My H has also told me he prefers me thin (and he could never tell me in the past) I hate being naked in front of him but I do force myself. I also know deep down that actually my self image is affecting our sex life more than my mind movies now. I'm not bashing you here Weepy, because I don't know how to sort this out for myself. I know that when faced with the option of eating healthily or eating those brownies, the brownies always win and have for months on end and dammit I don't want to stop either. So, if you manage to find out how to sort this one out you could let me know.
I've just ordered a book about addictive eating and learning how to change our relationship with food, so I'll let you know if it's any good. I think this is actually the crux of my recovery. Seriously, I think that maybe the whole of this LTA mess may well be solved by me dealing with this demon that has been with me since my mother fed me full cream cows milk on doctors orders at 10 days old!
The one thing my h does say now is that he still chooses me, whatever my size and that he knows it is an issue for me and he will support me however long it takes for me to work it out for myself. That might be the rest of my life then.........
ETA: LH also thinks that my lack of anger may be because I am eating it and stuffing it down quite literally, I wonder if that's what you do too? I told LH I couldn't really face that one yet, the prospect of delving into that seems a bit too scary at the moment.
[This message edited by mumto3sat at 1:57 PM, February 5th (Tuesday)]
Nobody warned me anything about grapefruit... what's up with that