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User Topic: Long Term Affairs -IX
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 1:26 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't want to double post, but I think I finally came up with the list of things my H has yet to apologize for.

This was a 14 page list of specifics when I did the exercise for my IC. It was supposed to "purge" the resentment. Didn't work BTW.

See what you think?

Mari, I'm glad you're feeling a little better. Please don't put yourself down for "still" feeling hurt by all this. I can't imagine a time when I won't twinge or trigger at something. And remember our motto

LTA = Long Time Recovery


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 1:47 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't even want to think of upcoming 'celebration' days except that I'll be spending Easter with my sister and her family.

Donít start me on Easter. We were staying at the in-laws last year. Thatís when OW and I started texting Ė all b/c HE couldnít remember when HER bíday was (the last time he was with her), so I asked her outright. HER 50th the day b/f our DS#3ís 18th Ė AND I had been away the w/end b/f b/c it was MY friendís (4xM and shares the same name as OW) 60th. Oh he KNEW alright. Fuckwit. And there was the big ďfamilyĒ thing with my parents, my sister, her son and his W and their baby. OMG. What a time that was. Oh, when I said to OW that he didnít do dates and prob didnít remember the first time he shagged her, she said she remembered it v well, it was Easter Mon 34yrs before. As if I was interested in his/their adolescent fumblings. Huh!!
*****
Weepy, what specifics? And if you have a fourteen page list, may I suggest the non-negotiables are to be tabled first? Or do you just want your H to read it? And does he have any for you?


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 2:08 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UK - Its more like the specific lies I know he told like one day I saw him driving home from "work" and I mentioned that I'd seen him and he denied even being on that road (because he was on his way home from OW's house). or the fact that he went to her after my mother died because he needed to tell her why she wouldn't be able to reach him for a few days.... he TOLD her my mother died and that's why he couldn't FUCK her that week, we had a funeral.

Those kind of specifics.... so I just lumped them into "lies" and "time spent away from family where he was needed".

His "compartmentalization" skills have those years all wrapped up into one big "I was cheating on Weepy" box. To me it's thousands of little hurts, not just one big one.

TG answered me and my therapist said the same thing "would two little words solve anything?" And the truth be told, YES. Because he can't say them. He really never apologizes unless cornered. I think after saying it a thousand times, it might get easier.

I'm having a rough moment which is why I posted that list. I'm still cleaning out files and I found the check he cashed on one of his "whore date" days. A date the corresponds with a motel receipt I have.

This just sucks.

And like with LH's H, if I'm upset when he calls or I bring up "that subject" again, I'll be "punished" in one way or another.

This is probably all coming on because we got cut off this morning when he called and he didn't go back into a cell zone to call me back.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Donít start me on Easter.
I'm so sorry UKgirl. I didn't mean to trigger such an awful memory trigger for you. What a jerk your H has been! How could he forget when there were so many other reasons to recall the occasion. {{{UKgirl}}}

Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 6:20 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't want to double post, but I think I finally came up with the list of things my H has yet to apologize for.
Weepy did you post this in another forum? Or some time back here in LTA? I could use an exercise to purge the resentment. I am really Sorry to read that it didn't work in your case. You have so much more than I have to contend with in R with your FWH.

I have tons of paper/paid bills/whatever that needs to be gone through and shred but it all dates from the beginning of my H's EA and I can't make myself sort through it. This has been a stumbling block for me in getting settled in this house. IMO moving back here should have been reason for the EA to end but it didn't. He continued for 2 more yrs, ending it only because I found out and confronted him. Damn... don't want to go there. Major vent halted.


Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 8:29 PM, March 1st (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lost, this has been the hardest thing for me to do... sort through this paperwork. I'm shredding everything through 2000 which means that there is only one more year of the active affair era to go. And I can't do that until next year (in case of IRS audit).

I posted the list of apology items in General. But everyone's right, it won't fix everything. I just feel like there's a hole that needs filling with his words of remorse and apology. His deep remorse period was so short and I was such a basket case I really couldn't absorb anything he was saying because of the anger, the hate, the pain.

Now when I can "hear" him, he says he's done it and said all he's going to.

The rat bastard hasn't even called me back since we were disconnected this morning.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 2:14 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Happy Mothers Day Ukgirl and Mum and others observing today!

This day, for some reason, doesnt trigger me. He is just not that much a part of it. I have mentioned before that as the M and LTAs progressed, he cut himself off from me and the kids. Mothers Day became, for me, about the kids. I would either take them shoppng and let them choose what they want to get me (taught them budgeting v early!), or he would take them to them to the local supermarket and choose the usuals, a magazine, box of chocs and flowers and each child would book what they wanted to gift. It wasnt the money, he just didnt give a damn.

2 years ago, I didnt get anything, and the kids were so upset. So last year, he made a real effort, and it was nice.

How awful that we make such a big deal out of Fathers Day and their bdays.

Uk, I also stopped doing his family's days. Mainly because they dont recognise my kids or my days.

You know, when you think of all the issues our H's have with their mothers, it's almost as if they project their anger at their mom's onto us and what better day to do that than Mother's Day.

Yes Fnf!!! I get more and more convinced of this with every passing day.

Tell me, do any of your H's talk of their issues with their mothers, because for us, that is a taboo subject. He WILL NOT talk about her to me.

The other night, once again he said it was a ďmistakeĒ. I told him it wasnít. It was NOT a mistake and stop calling it that. It. Was. Not. You donít make a mistake that lasts for five years.

For me, adjust that to 12 years, and I will say, Uk, stop it! You have been running around in my head recently and its getting a bit creepy.

LostS, good for you having some goals! It does help taking the focus of the LTA and remembering that there is more to our lives than this. Try to think up some specific actions to achievng them, for eg. make new friends, how about joining a club or group that shares a similar interests.Good luck!

***
(((Marigold)))
Just hugs for you. We get it.

***
((((Weepy)))
I hope that iro whether he called back or not, that you were able to sleep well last night.

Now stop! You are doing well. Dont let this get you down, ok. He prob had a good reason, and if he didnt, hes a jackass, but we know that. Disengage Weepy. You are doing so very well.We are so proud of you.

***
Have a good day All.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
mumto3sat
♀ Member
Member # 14336
Default  Posted: 2:41 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mothers day - a bit of a trigger for me because last year was exactly one week after dday (it's a bit earlier this year - dday is 16th March) and H did nothing. He didn't even make sure the children gave me the cards they had made at nursery/school. I went to my mum's.

But that's actually ok. We were only a week after dday and he still was convinced he was leaving, that to me is just 2007. What I am actually feeling incredibly sad about is that this is my first mothers day without an ow in it. My seventh mothers day and first with my H all present and accounted for. Sad sad sad. Not angry just sad.

Anyway, already had a piece of very good news this morning, my sister has had a positive pregnancy test!

It is only the next hurdle in the many more to go (apparently up to 50% of positive pregnancy tests miscarry between now and the 6 wk scan they do, so we can't get too excited) BUT as she said she has never got this far before, this is her first positive test and she is very excited in a guarded/shocked sort of way. So hooray for that, maybe her baby can mark my rebirth or something like that. I need a nice analogy for me to hold onto to. Something meaningful.

I don't mean to sound really down, I'm not actually, this doesn't feel like the down on the roller coaster.

******

Lost good luck in your job tomorrow. I am sure you'll wow them. Don't worry about the clothes and don't stop eating, that isn't the answer either . Concentrate on forgetting about H, he's not going to change until you do. Not fair I know, but it's true. These are weak men with strong women, they need to be led by the nose, like a bull. don't do the work for him, but if he sees you moving on Lost, he'll have to follow otherwise he knows full well he'll get left behind. YOU YOU YOU, that's what it's all about.

H was screaming at me last Sunday "Just sort yourself out" (during the biggest fight we've had in 18 years started by me) He didn't mean get over the affair he meant he can't bear to see me like this, and the truth is neither can I. I got very angry with him at first for saying it and then I thought more about it and realised I agreed with him. I'm doing this to myself now. Yes, I still have all the hurt etc. but besides that I am the only one who controls whether I put make up on in the morning or not and it's just not good enough to say, he did this to me so I'm going to slob around like a pig. Sometime I have to take responsiblity for me and be the person I want to be. Maybe tomorrow...... No, really, I think I may be about to be able to do this, I feel something stirring that I haven't felt for a long long time. So I can only hope.

I hope everyone has a good Sunday.



Me (BS): 38
Him (WS): 38
3 children, d 6 s 4 s 1yr
D day #1 03/16/07 8 mth ea
D day #2 07/13/07 turned into 7 year long term affair, pa/ea 08/18/07 Got final info - is that it?

Posts: 284 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: UK
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 4:15 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have a lovely Motherís Day LostH and Mum and anyone else from the British contingent. Relax and enjoy your children. Iím going to ring my Mum after this post, assuming she hasnít already gone to church.

Anyway, already had a piece of very good news this morning, my sister has had a positive pregnancy test!

Wonderful!! Oh wow, a little one by Christmas! What lovely news to give us this Mother's Day. Early days, tell your sis to take care.

"These are weak men with strong women,"

Part of the shattered illusion. I thought he was the strong one. Itís a bit like finding out your house is just a cardboard front from a film set. That nothing is as it seemed.

Three Times a Lady is on the radio. It used to be one of ďourĒ songs, then he referred to it somewhere in his poetry about her. Now it makes me cry for the wrong reasons.

ETA the quotation marks - forgot the quote box again!

[This message edited by UKgirl at 4:17 AM, March 2nd (Sunday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 4:30 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

my sister has had a positive pregnancy test
So hooray for that, maybe her baby can mark my rebirth or something like that.

Yay Mum and Sister!!!!

And yes, I can totally see this as as something affirming for you too.

Its my second Mday in 12 years with an OW too. It does get easier.
One of the many ( ) presents I got today, was a bottle of massage oil from H. However it had OW#2' name on the label and it was the first thing I saw. I just felt sad. I made him peel it off later.

UK,

Part of the shattered illusion. I thought he was the strong one

Now you KNOW that it was you who was the strong one!

And change the channel whenever a trigger song comes on. It just makes it worse. Which is why I only listen to fast songs now , "I want to be a rockstar!"
No triggers in that one.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
mumto3sat
♀ Member
Member # 14336
Default  Posted: 5:04 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you UK and Lost.

A cardboard house, that's what i have too. I feel like folding it back up and putting it up on the shelf with the other books most days. Unfortunately, whereever I go now it all comes with me, new house or not!

I think today we should just do as Lost says, focus on the children, ok they are biologically H's as well, but at the end of the day the A has not made us different mothers to our children, so this day is to be celebrated.

Have a nice lunch with DS No. 4 UK. (which BTW four sons - wow! how do you cope?) try not to think about H, try to concentrate on DS and how even with all this shit you have four beautiful children and you did this, it's worth celebrating.

Lost glad to hear you got lots of pressies. I mucked up H's plans because I got out of bed way too early! But still at least I got cards this year (first time I think in all 7 years - I don't remember getting any before other than nursery ones - I might be rewriting marital history though ) He even told me to go and spend some time on SI as a special treat (I rarely do it when he's around because that's our family time and he's out of the house for long hours during the week). I know that was quite hard for him, because he worries about what I do on here!



Me (BS): 38
Him (WS): 38
3 children, d 6 s 4 s 1yr
D day #1 03/16/07 8 mth ea
D day #2 07/13/07 turned into 7 year long term affair, pa/ea 08/18/07 Got final info - is that it?

Posts: 284 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: UK
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 5:44 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good morning UK gals!
and anyone else who is up at this hour. I've been awake for 2 hours - jumping from forum to forum - don't know what else to do since I couldn't go back to sleep since waking at 3:30a CST. Wierd dreams again... H isn't here to wrap his arm around me... I miss him... I wish I didn't.
I want out of this black hole. But I seem to be digging myself deeper in.
Good news - I've lost a pound and a half since Wednesday.

Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 5:50 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

went back to email and a friend sent this link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sleep/sheep/

played the game... I'm an ambling armadillo (slow)


Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 7:30 AM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tell me, do any of your H's talk of their issues with their mothers, because for us, that is a taboo subject. He WILL NOT talk about her to me.

I knew about H's relationship with his mother, I witnessed it for 5 years before we married. He was the rebel son. I kind of admired that. I too thought it meant he was strong... the only one to not take a penny from his parents, to not live off them, to not use them even as babysitters for our kids.

Of course now I see his fierce independence as a refusal to let himself depend on anyone for anything. He didn't NEED anybody.

The dichotimy being he depended on me for everything, emotionally, financially, for organization, for everything. Guess he really deep down made him angry that he'd put himself in that position. And it played in to my low self esteem. He needed me, so now I was irreplaceable. No one could do for him what I did... Great relationship from the start, eh? One of our post dday issues is that I don't "need" him. See he needed to feel valuable too.

Ow needed him. She had no one else.

mum, so happy to hear the news. I have my fingers and toes crossed for Sis.

LH, he does have a good "excuse" for not calling. He has to drive into town (and he says it hasn't stopped snowing up there), sit in his car once he gets the cell signal and then he can call.

He did call about 10 and we talked for a whole 3 minutes and 40 seconds. When I asked him what he'd done all day, he said "sat around the cabin and watched movies". (Oh, the pictures that conjured up ) DS was on the slopes all day and he asked what I had done. I told him DD and my plans for today and he rung off. No I love you, miss you, nothing. I can understand him not doing that in front of his buddies, but... he texted me after we got off the phone with "goodnight, I love you". 2 1/2 years of therapy and he still can't say it out loud. No mention of how the food I'd cooked worked out. I started to ask, but he cut me off and said it was past his bed time.

I didn't sleep well because DD was out until 4 AM! She's going to hear about that if she ever crawls out of bed today!

The good news is that I spent all day cleaning our our back room. With H gone, I can safely throw away things that he always has an excuse to keep. Today I tackle the closets in there.

Have a great Mum day UK ladies. I truly know that my kids saved my life 2 years ago. Without them I don't know how I would have kept putting one foot in front of the other...


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
So Lost
♀ Member
Member # 16801
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I posted this in the R forum...

Well, after feeling like the wind was knocked out of me for a few days, wh and I finally talked.
He had just been honest, but it had triggered me something terrible. He said it felt worse than when I first found out, b/c this time I wasn't talking much and I think that scared him. I just told him how much it all hurt, physically hurt, and that he can never imagine.

I told him that I knew I was smart and pretty and funny and interesting and cared a lot about people but that he had me now feeling ugly and stupid and naive and undesirable and I hated that I felt that way and I hated him for making me feel that way.

He said

I am so, so sorry that I have hurt you so much. You are beautiful and intelligent and a great mom and you care a lot about people and I still find you sexy. I am so sorry I made you feel otherwise. I am going to somehow find a way to make it up to you.
He has never, ever said anything like that to me. I honestly think my heart stopped. He said I really know we can make it, we just have to keep fighting.

SO here I am still fighting. Trying really really hard and praying that he continues to do the same.

I was having a really hard itme for a few days. And he says I love you many times a day but that is the most romantic thing he ever says for the most part. SO to hear that was important for me. And he didn't do anything wrong that was 'new'. Just all the old crap. This is truly such a roller coaster. I feel like I will never get off of it. I think in some ways it gets easier but in other ways it gets much harder.


Me: BS
Wh: WS
Dday 10/28/07
LTA with coworker
Attempting Reconciliation
he is remorseful, I am willing, we'll see what happens

Posts: 671 | Registered: Oct 2007
25wimsey
♀ Member
Member # 7816
Default  Posted: 3:50 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SoLost--
I am so, so sorry that I have hurt you so much. You are beautiful and intelligent and a great mom and you care a lot about people and I still find you sexy. I am so sorry I made you feel otherwise.

H said pretty much that to me too, not that far after d-day, and repeated the theme in a few cards he sent or "love letters" I'd asked for. And I treasure those words, since I still need to hear those sentiments. And I'm 2 and a half years out! Glad you heard them too!

I think in some ways it gets easier but in other ways it gets much harder.

That's so true for me--life is pretty regular, though we're still doing some IC--but the hard part (partly from the OC issue I know) is that some part of me really doesn't believe it all. Still wondering in another shoe will drop, all appearances to the contrary. And so it's harder to just accept the good parts of life, harder to see whatever conflicts we have over regular life things not leading to--does he really want to be here, is this the best I can get, all that stuff.

I often think that if there hadn't been any infidelity, our lives at age 60 would look like it does now, and I'd think it was grand. Pretty good--still enjoying doing stuff together, enjoying sex, enjoying our family, work, etc. All the ordinary things in life. The A changed my perceptions in so many ways, I still second guess EVERYTHING, and the roller coaster goes down again.

As they say, infidelity is the gift that keeps on giving.


Posts: 695 | Registered: Aug 2005
25wimsey
♀ Member
Member # 7816
Default  Posted: 3:57 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was merely sharing that I think it is equally important for a wayward to evaluate their definition of a life partner as it is for the betrayed. And that a wayward may be inclined to commit to R without benefit of that evaluation because they are motivated by fear, shame, a need to "make-it-up" to the Betrayed and/or an inability to define a life different than the married one they've known for years.

I copied this from a wayward post--cuz I think this is the "other shoe" that I'm so afraid will drop--again, I have no evidence for this, it's just that I still have trouble understanding why H would have a LTA with "feelings" if there weren't some of these sentiments lingering in him, despite his commitment to our M. That blow to the self-esteem is long-lasting in my case-- And I just pray it's all my own issue, and not his--I still feel pretty fucked up by this.


Posts: 695 | Registered: Aug 2005
So Lost
♀ Member
Member # 16801
Default  Posted: 5:14 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow, Whimsey, you and I could go out and hae a chai adn talk for hours! lol That was exactly what I was feeling.

I even said t him last night. I have been the same person all these years. But suddenly getting caught made you want me again. put me number one again, be dedicated to me again? I don't get it.

He said it just did. (he said all this in counseling as well). Said it gave him a wake up call, made him realize that he had to face up to what he was doing.

His counselor was very focused on what was lacking that made him have the affair in the first place. Do we still know how to have fun together to replace that time he had wth her. That sort of thing. Which is great adn we plan to delve in to more.

It's all such freaking hard work. Sometimes I get tired of being th good person,. the forgiving person, the one who alwasy does the right thing. I want to say fuck you and go have my own affair. But it could never feel the same for him, adn it woudln't ake me feel any better


Me: BS
Wh: WS
Dday 10/28/07
LTA with coworker
Attempting Reconciliation
he is remorseful, I am willing, we'll see what happens

Posts: 671 | Registered: Oct 2007
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 6:44 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SoLost... Wimsey,
I wish my H would write those things to me. I'm still waiting for the letter he promised me, over a year later.

Another meltdown today. I have never felt such anger. Guess I've hit that stage. Not just hurt but angry. I am full of venom and rage towards him and OW. Since I can't vent at her, I vented at him. Now I feel worse. My words are ringing in my ears. What's up with that?


Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 8:00 PM, March 2nd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost Heart:

I wanted to chime in here to wish you good luck today at work. I know without a doubt that you will be great.

If you feel any doubts today at all just think of the tribe standing behind you and cheering you on.

Go get 'em.

BT


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
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