Shirley!Jeez, you had us worried!
I am so relieved that you are ok. Welcome back.
Last night was a bummer. Had a heavy IC session, and came out feeling very low. I know that this is how it has to be for a long time, esp since we are working through EMDR. I just pray that I am tough enough to handle this, because I have been feeling so overdrawn lately.
What started out as a fairly innocuous discussion with H rapidly descended into a hurtful one. I know I am to blame as I was v sensitive and I should be more accepting of his truth, but damn! it hurts and I just cant handle it sometimes.
I was saying how overwhelmed I have been feeling with work and home life, and I miss the alone time I used to have as a SAHM.
And he put his thumb up and said he knows what I mean, he feels the same.
So of course I want to know what alone time he is talking about. He said that he feels that all he does now is work and family, in fact he has spent all these years right from the time we married till now with little or no "alone time", as compared to before when he was single.
I saw red!
From the start of this M till last year, he has made his alone time non-negotiable; he took his time whenever, however, irrespective of mine or the kids needs.And lets not even go into how he spent that alone time.
He has only been part of this family for 1 year, and he is already missing his alone time!
So lets examine briefly how he spent that alone time: on married women; playing pc games and watching tv, whenever.
So what is he missing?
He said he doesnt miss the women, but he does miss the others.
WTF?? He does spend alot of time on games and tv now.I checked the pc log and he spent over 3 hours yesterday playing games and surfing, instead of working. And he does that almost every day.So he says he just feels different now, he doesnt feel like its alone time.
I was so hurt and angry.
And desp sad.
If I had done half of what he did, I dont think I would never miss alone time again, knowing how I had wasted the last 20 years of alone time; I would grab every moment with my family knowing how precious this time is.
I guess he feels differently.
Thank you all for your support regarding my DS.
HB, that scene with your DS at the park is so touching.
My kids dont know about DS#2. I discussed telling them with IC, and she said that theres alot going on this week and it wouldnt be the best time.
My plan (H of course was never a part of this)was to tell them when they were adults, but lately I have been thinking that I have done them a disservice by protecting them. Look at how your DS handled it.My DS is a part of my family, and by holding him only in my heart, I think, was selfish of me.
We are off this afternoon for a 2 night break. The kids are soooo excited. A cottage on the beach! Our backyard is the sea..yay!
Of course English beaches cant be compared to the beaches of South Africa and Australia, but we are going to love it anyway.
Now lets hope that we dont get any of the famous English weather.
Ukg, How are you doing?
He said that he feels that all he does now is work and family, in fact he has spent all these years right from the time we married till now with little or no "alone time", as compared to before when he was single.
Don't you just love it? Where were they? What happens, does the past just disafuckinpear? or rewrite itself?
When I hear H make statements about the kids's schooling or their activities or anything at all about what he "did for this family" during that period, I want to smash him with a shovel. Hopefully the next time it happens I can just turn to him and say "Oh, is that how YOU remember it?" He remembers taking time off when the kids were sick.... maybe once, twice. And probably if it was already raining and I knew he wouldn't be working. Even then, the kids (if I asked) would tell me that dad left them alone for a while at home. (Guess he figured they'd be ok while he tore off a quick one) He doesn't "remember" any of those time though. NEver made a teacher's meeting, a PTA meeting, a meeting with the vision support people, but always had something to say about how we all weren't handling everything right.
(((hb))) and (((LH))) I've never been in your place, but my dearest friend has. Her baby would have been like 18 now. I think I'm going to give her a hug next time I see her because I forget... I'm sure she doesn't.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
If we were the type to be that way, then we would have been the ones having the affairs, not them.
Oh and the contact with the new GF through the family would have to go. I think somehow I'd makes sure the new GF knew about this OM's past too.
I did suggest to WS that she give the full unshaded story to her best friend that she used for recent support.. I am sure she told her the high level, airbrushed version and I wanted to punish her by having to tell her best friend the unvarnished truth.. as you might guess. she balked at that idea asking what good would it do.. to which I replied it would punish you and make your friend see you for what you really are.... nasty? mean/ vindictive? all of the above...she told me that I could tell her if I wanted to...but that wouldnt be the same..I wont demand that she do it.. at least not yet
As to your H and the personal time - he just has to understand that the rules have changed. That what he had before was not a balanced relationship - he had all the free time he wanted and you had none - not healthy. Can the MC explain that this is a new marital contract, one that is balanced and, therefore, sustainable?
My DS is a part of my family, and by holding him only in my heart, I think, was selfish of me.
Nooooooo, not selfish at all. You were trying to do the best for your whole family under the circumstances. Maybe someday when the kids are older, you can share your loss with them and they will be able to understand. But little ones really don't understand the concept of death and loss and it just would have been confusing. I am thinking of you during this rough time.
I did suggest to WS that she give the full unshaded story to her best friend that she used for recent support.. I am sure she told her the high level, airbrushed version and I wanted to punish her by having to tell her best friend the unvarnished truth..
This isn't a bad idea but not to punish her. She needs to communicate the unvarnished truth often to allow herself to come to terms with what she has done. I asked my H to write a letter to the second LTA telling her the truth about the relationship (he didn't love her, he loves me, he used her for his own sick sexual fantasy, etc). I think it was very cathartic and healing for him to go through the process. I actually took him a couple of months to draft, redraft, edit, think about it, what was really, really the truth, etc.
She needs to face head-on what she did, what that says about who she was before she can take the steps to change. Has she read "The Slippery Slope"? If not, she should....
Perhaps shading it that she needs to face everything she's done and who she's used to do it, make it about HER healing instead of your wishing her harm might be more productive.
I had the "advantage?" of my H not telling ANYONE about the A. He was so ashamed that he had to "pay for it" and of his OW that he didn't want anyone to know... not because it was wrong, but because it would reflect on him badly. He has and had this big thing with needing to look "perfect". Prostitutes and a drug dealing alchie toiletscrubber are not ones to get you elevated to the "hey, you're the man" level with his buddies. I've actually heard his degenerate friends making comments about not having to stoop to using pros, that even the barflys they took home with questionable looks/hygiene were better than that. SO, oh no, he doesn't tell a soul.
I agree this woman doesn't need the added issue of her new BF's past right now. But if it becomes serious between them, I still think someone's got to give her a heads up. She doesn't want to go all through this leaning on him only to find she's leaned on an cypher.
NEver made a teacher's meeting, a PTA meeting,
And acres, I’m with weepy on this. At some point, it’s only fair that the woman knows about this unpleasant side to her partner’s character. I think you should enlighten her friend to the facts and leave it to her whether or not she tells her sister at this sensitive time. Who’s to say he won’t go off if he can’t cope with her illness?
Hi Shirley!! Thought you’d gone walkabout! Glad to hear it was just the laptop misbehaving. As to the history on the main pc, I just wipe it when I’m done.
"He was an adolescent until last August never accepting or, at minimum, resenting, his responsibilities. Is he addressing this in IC?"
He’s still minimising and lying by omission. He only ever confesses to things I put as fact (with some evidence), the rest is “it didn’t happen” until I find out otherwise. So he will be addressing his issues – all of them – in IC in a couple of weeks. It seems he is being a martyr to my pain and focusing on my healing and moving on without sorting his major problems first. It’s like he’s pretending it never happened. I have a bottom line and that is the truth – all of it. If he can’t or won’t do that, then sadly there is no hope for us.
eta - quotey box!!
[This message edited by UKgirl at 1:41 PM, May 30th (Friday)]
So he will be addressing his issues – all of them – in IC in a couple of weeks. It seems he is being a martyr to my pain and focusing on my healing and moving on without sorting his major problems first.
You are so right on this front. After dday#1, I was running around, emailing him snippets off of SI, buying and reading books and telling him about what they said, talking through his "needs" with him, blah de-fucketing blah. Well with dday#2 it was get your fucking ass out of the house and don't even think about coming back until YOU have come COMPLETELY clean with me and are willing to admit that this is ALL about YOU and your broken self. He took the IC to 2x per week and really focused on himself while I started exercising more, doing more for myself, reading books that helped me. (listening to advice here) Anyway, he has/is doing the work, no minimizing and it really makes a difference for him AND for me. Soooooo, I wish you both luck with this. I hope he does the work to face the truth of what he has done.
I hope he does the work to face the truth of what he has done.
I think, for once in his life, he doesn’t know what to do. This fuck-up is just too big for him to even acknowledge fully, let alone deal with. Just tell me the truth you fuck wit!! Honestly, I could slap him so hard sometimes. One day I just might.
So he will be addressing his issues – all of them – in IC in a couple of weeks.
Now that is some good news.
It seems he is being a martyr to my pain and focusing on my healing and moving on without sorting his major problems first. It’s like he’s pretending it never happened.
I don't see the lying as being a martyr to anything. I maintain that a liar always lies to protect himself/herself. They may not be willing to admit that even to themself, but I think it is true.
Martyr's are really not much good to anyone emotionally speaking. So it is good that he leaves that role behind.
I think, for once in his life, he doesn’t know what to do.
It is simple. He needs to tell himself the truth. It sees incredibly overwhelming, but he will feel better after. I can put him in touch via PM with Empty One. The answer is tell the truth and live in the "now". God I wish I had learned all of this years ago instead of learning how to manage billions of dollars.
The answer is tell the truth and live in the "now".
I truly wonder if he is capable of telling the truth. IC thinks he has buried facts and events so deeply that he is unaware they are there. And when there is the danger that they might bubble up, he simply pushes them back down again.
The trouble is he has always lived in the now. Meaning to take opportunities while they are there. That you should have no regrets about the things you have done, only the things you haven’t done. Which is a good slant to having had an affair. And his version of living in the current “now” is to move on with me, but do it in a way that leaves the wreckage of the affair behind so that it doesn’t intrude anymore. It is forgotten and in the past. That the affair will no longer be mentioned.
He may view those five years with her and all that it entailed in the same way as he does his career moves. Some he has taken have not been the best of decisions - moving us to the middle of nowhere so that he could be where she used to live and her dad used to work was such a bad idea …. but then I probably wouldn’t be living where I am now, which is a very attractive part of England. But I digress. His aim when leaving a company is to retain goodwill, contacts and possible future business. He sees no point in falling out big time b/c you never know if and when you might have reason to deal with people again. The nice guy who wishes everyone well on their travels through life. And it’s probably the same with the affair and her, as a person. He really did not want to leave on a bad note, he really did not want to hurt her, he really does want to keep those fond memories sweet. And I don’t think he will ever see it as a selfish and sordid infidelity like I do.
much the same for my WS... thats why she never told OM that she was sorry for what they did, why she could stay "friends" with him for all these years.... now, of ocurse, she emailed him that she hates him "for what he did to her".. note the passivity.. she had taken responsibility for this now.. but it was ver very difficult.. in fact, after reading these forums, I am amazed that we have come this far this fast.. something must be wrong here.. or I am just damned lucky
The nice guy who wishes everyone well on their travels through life. And it’s probably the same with the affair and her, as a person. He really did not want to leave on a bad note, he really did not want to hurt her
Which is why my H referred to the end of the affair as "breaking up" with her. Man how that just burnt my butt when I heard that, all the while DENYING she was his GIRLFRIEND. Well, who the hell do you break up with but GF/BF? He continued to see her on a non-sexual basis, they were a "crowd". No wonder it took him so fucking long to get "over" it. Three years before he walked away totally.
I'm not in a good place today. Tense. Anxious. We have DD's graduation luncheon, 45 people. I'm doing it at a restaurant, so no big fuss, but I'm just on edge. Spent a lot of yesterday searching on google maps for the places he visited. I look up the addresses from the City Paper and the buildings are restaurants, or plain looking office buildings. I would never have known. How the fuck did he?
Now he's off to IC in a good little mood... I'm sure his "shower" had something to do with it. And I'm the witch in the "bad mood". and why don't I just "get over myself". I mean I accidentally dialed a wrong number at 7 this morning. Woke someone up, I apologized and went on with my business. HE had to "scold" me and ask my why I felt it "necessary" to check and see if there was dictation work today, this morning. Fuck him. (That's what I said to him too, guess that's what gave him the hint I wasn't in the mood.)
Just let me get throug today. There's no "celebrations" or holidays or whatever for me to "ruin" with my bad moods after this until July.
I might just have to get drunk at my brother's party tonight. Haven't done that in a long while.
she emailed him that she hates him "for what he did to her"..
We have DD's graduation luncheon, 45 people. I'm doing it at a restaurant, so no big fuss,
searching on google maps for the places he visited
And I had MIL on the phone this morning. I helped her through an upgrade on her computer and then heard about her holiday with her SIL and then "And how are you? No, how are things really?" FHW tells her nothing other than what he says to bf, "good days, bad days" or "we're getting there". So I told her as it was. He can lie to her if he wants, I won't. FIL always told her she had my H on a pedestal.
I think she got very frustrated and had to lash out at him.. I actually started this by contacting him, via email to let him know that I was considering divorce... I also asked him when it had ended ( he lied a bit) and what was WS' motivation.. he said he didnt know..
WS got concerned about what he might have said.. I wouldnt tell her the answer to the motivation question(she was struggling with that herself)
so she emailed him.. she told me she was going to... and he told her the truth about his answer and that he wished her luck.. that pissed her off. thats all she gets form him,.. good luck kiddo.. so she lashed out.. he likely felt that I was pressuring her and she had to do something.. so he still gets off easy
We trust that you will respect our client’s wishes and accept his kind regards for the future
I think your FWW got the same kind of slap-in-the-face message.
Yep. Out of the fog time.
Hang on in there. Hugs for you. You're doing fine. (((((acres)))))
when I spelled it our very plainly for her just like that.. she broke into pieces.. said something like "well, I never really saw it that way before"
As UKGirl said, sounds like the fog is starting to lift. The "good luck kiddo" message was, frankly, the slap in the face she needed to see the affair for what it was - cheap and ugly. She just got thrown under the bus by the OM after risking it all for him - can't feel very good at all.
If she is serious about R she needs to face the awful truth about who she was and what she did.
Good luck tonight.
(((weepy))) jeez he is an ass. How do you tolerate it? I guess he has never dialed a wrong number in his life??! And, if I was hosting a grad party for that many I would be stressed to the max even if it was at a restaurant. Give yourself a break hon.
(((UKGirl))) I am glad you told the MIL the truth. There is no way to broadbrush over the pain and sacrifice that you are going through to try to make your marriage work. Only by telling those close to you the truth can you get the support you need.
So my mom has a GREAT sense of humor. We were talking about a topic that came up in H's IC. He realized that he does not have any hobbies. He has interests but did not ever take the time to pursue them. I snidely commented that is because all his parents and their friends did in their spare time was drink. Then I realized that it was true. That was his role model. Work, drink, fight. Start again. I don't know how he didn't turn out worse. Anyway in relaying all this to my mom she said (dripping with sarcasm) "well, he clearly DID have one hobby"!!!! She is 85!!! God, I am glad that I could laugh with her. Guess the "Power of Now" is working.
[This message edited by hurtshirley at 5:02 PM, May 31st (Saturday)]