He looked me straight in the eye and said, "I don't know what you're talking about."
I punched all the codes into his blackberry and held it up to his ear. I saw the color drain out of his face, and he said, "I made a mistake. Once. Right before we moved when we weren't having sex at all."
I just saw red. Everything we'd been through, how unbalanced our marriage had become, how much of the grunt work of our lives I was doing, all boiled up. I told him I never remembered a time when we weren't having sex at all and he should just find a suitcase and get the fuck out. That the two of them were welcome to each other.
That was the last time, believe it or not, that I head blameshifting or an excuse out of his mouth. He was supposed to leave for a business trip back to our old city the next morning and I realized that that was when he'd been seeing her--he'd been back approximately once a month since the move. I was seriously ready to send him to her, but he refused to go.
OK. Off to freeze my ass off at the beach. More later.
I can "hear" the anger in your "voice" right now. Breathe...RUN on the beach. Run as hard as you can and then dive into the ocean.
I will keep checking in...
For example...I was just vaccuming and was trying to figure out how old the rugs are....I had a hard time figuring it out and realized it was like 1.5 years ago....and it makes me say, OMG....that was half way through the A....this started (the A) SO long ago that I can barely remember what was going on then.....
It makes me so incredibly sad & amazed....like what could be left of our M after so much time? He spent 2.5 years focusing on his A's....he knew her just as well as me. It amazes me and makes me have that horrible hopeless feeling.
D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA
"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".
Does anyone else compare every memory in relation to the timeline of the A?
WhatNow...I do something slightly different. My Hs infidelities occurred throughout our marriage. In general, I can just dismiss the ONS and pros as they didn't impact my life as much as the LTAs. The two LTAs lasted essentially 10 years. I spend so much time thinking back over those years and remembering things that didn't make sense, times when he was irritable or just "not there" and now I know why. We took an amazing trip to California (all expenses paid) through my company. I had to go out a couple of days before my H for meetings. When he flew out, he was so distant and really mean...just being a nasty prick. I could not understand it. We were in paradise and all we did was fight. I now know that the two days I was gone, he EA with the first LTA went PA. He brought her into our new home, showered with her, slept with her in my bed.
When they say the two worlds were seperate and they "compartmentalized" it all away, I can scream BULLSHIT. Because when that EA went PA my H changed overnight. We have talked about it a lot. He said he knew he had taken another, more drastic step and he lost even more self-esteem. He hated himself (subconciously) for what he was doing so he focused that anger on me. Our relationship had been wonderful that summer and it turned into a non-stop bitching match after he went PA. He was in the process of rewriting history in the moment so he could justify his affair.
Sorry, very long and sad, but yes. I can look back now and "understand" moments that didn't make sense then.
I look back upon the times of specific events and how they correlate and that makes me angry too. We started having poker games with our "friends" the same month his 1st A started....We had poker bi-weekly for the 2.5 years with all the invovled parties there.
The A started with OW#2 around Valentine's day, the next weekend he has his 3/4 some sex thing, the 20th is my birthday, and the week after that our first son turned 1. It kills me to think of the effort & commitment I had at that time to our M and family and he was all focused on group f'in sex. He realizes more and more as time passes how much he "missed", although I don't think he really gets it yet....he gives me that, "it was separate" thing.
So valentines until D-day on 3/4 is going to be hell.
WhatNow...it is all hell..the rollercoaster just sucks completely.
How are you doing?
That was the last time, believe it or not, that I head blameshifting or an excuse out of his mouth
Still, reliving this now must so heartsore.How are you coping, IRL?
Does anyone else compare every memory in relation to the timeline of the A?
Like you wont believe.
From the time he first called me up (he was trying to get over her/make her jealous?)right through the whole M.
I guess thats why I try not to think about life before too much these days (great job I have been doing, huh?)
You know what I am reminded of now? The time when he bought me jewellery (for my bday)without even asking me what i wanted, from which shop and what coulour/size etc.
I was so chuffed, and told everyone about it. We had been going through a tough patch and I thought this meant we had turned a corner.
Gullible old me.
Found out that he had bought her the exact same thing for her bday except diff colour. HE gave her my colour of choice. I wonder if she knew; if that was her style of jewellery; whether she had pointed it out to him.
I am slipping again.
I am trying so hard here to turn the other cheek, to play nice. But he is being such an asshole.
I am going to bed and just stay away. Anyone read, "The Shack"?
Choked me up no end last night.
Cant finish it tonight so hopefully will find an escapism book hiding here somewhere.
Good night Tribe.
PS. Suitey, if you are lurking, jump in and say hi.
I guess thats why I try not to think about life before too much these days
The same for me...but why that kills me is that my oldest son is 3.5, so i have 2.5 years of his life...most every picture on my computer that makes me think...what was going on then?? I was just looking through pics again and every time I do I find more pics of the OW. Today I found 2 pics of her & DH on a fair ride, 1 of her bottom half watching after she gave my oldest son a new toy...and then I sadly deleted 22 pictures of pumpkin carving that she did with him. I thought I could look past the fact that she had done it with him and still keep the pictures....but that's one of the memories he still has today. If he sees a pumpkin he still asks about her.
Time, right? f'in time.....
Yes. And H does not understand at all.
In fact, I feel like we pretty much never talk about the affair now. And it is making thins very hard on me. I just don't know where to even start with him anymore Things seemed to be improving and now suddenly things feel very very distant. I am very up on where he is and such now so I think I would know if something was happening again and i don't get that feeling. More of a feeling like he thinks I should be over this. He has even said that he can't help hat he moved on faster. No shit idiot. I would move on faster too if I wasn't the one hit by a bus. He doesn't blame shift or make excuses or anything, he just genuinely does not get how much pain I was/am in. How do I make him see that?
This is sort of an antiversary exorcism. I'm trying to think of it as a rite of passage before moving on to the next phase of my healing.
I don't have more time right now, but will post the rest of the story later.
((hugs to all))
Actually 2 weeks ago was the anniversary of her death.
I didn't even think about that until now. The antiversary I can't help but remember since he's been talking about getting away and the camping trip is where he went while I did my skullduggery.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
For someone from my background, this type of personality development was unimaginable. And to Weepy's point, I gave most people the benefit of the doubt. So not only did I not know that NPD and sociapaths walked in my midst, I certainly would NEVER have believed that man I loved was one of them.
Today I found 2 pics of her & DH on a fair ride, 1 of her bottom half watching after she gave my oldest son a new toy...and then I sadly deleted 22 pictures of pumpkin carving that she did with him.
One of the saddest outcomes of my H's LTA is that I no longer feel the need to give people the benefit of the doubt, to look for their good side
fnf - yes, me too. Yet, I am not sure if it is a sad outcome. I think I was too far on one end of the spectrum and now, quite frankly, I am too far out on the other.
I believe the pendulum will swing back the other way and I will end up closer to the middle than I was. That is my positive spin on this.
I feel that I am now in the place you and others have said you were before d-day. A place where I am making sacrificies and concessions that I find difficult in order to save my M.
In what way? Did you read the thread in general about speaking your own truth? I posted the link back a page but can find it if you need it....let me know if you need to "talk".
I was in total shock. I'd obviously known things weren't perfect, but this had never occurred to me. Even as I was picking up that phone I would have bet millions that my H would never do that. Although m IC, who doesn't believe in coincidence, or so she says, believes I must have at least suspected on some level to have picked up that phone, which I'd never, ever done before. I think when I went to confront him, I was half hoping he'd tell me she was stalking him, crazy, etc. But, of course, she wasn't.
We sat on a picnic table, watching our guests and the kids play mini golf. I remember my H getting me a coke and making me drink it because he thought I was going to faint. I asked if he was in love with her. I vaguely remember that he almost laughed when he said no.
Even in the midst of the total annihilation of the shock I was surprised that if he was going to have an A that he would have chosen to have it with her. They'd worked together for a long time. She was very attractive but had, essentially, no redeeming personal qualities (big surprise, huh?). She was married--currently on her fourth husband. We had laughed together many times over how shallow she was and how she almost idolized my H. Over the next few days one of the things that I kept coming back to over and over was that I had not only spent hours on the phone, listening to her blather, when I called him at the office, but I had, in my good wife role, been the one to buy her birthday and Christmas presents. He had actually sat and discussed gifts with me for the woman he was fucking.
Over the next few days we coped with a house chock full of merry guests--friends and relatives--and I tried to cope with the shock. I couldn't eat, couldn't sleep, couldn't let him touch me. He had risked everything. His job (she was very subordinate to him), his marriage, our health (unprotected sex, of course), everything.
He said he was happy, loved me, loved the kids, had no idea why or how he had done this. I made him go for STD testing and he said that telling a strange doctor (we were still at our vacation house) what he had done made it start to hit him. He said that he'd rationalized it in some way that because he didn't love her it wasn't a real affair.
But I considered it very much an affair. Over the next few days I asked question after question after question. I had no idea what to do except gather as much information as possible. We stayed up almost all night every night while I drilled him with questions. I was pretty uncompromising about accepting "I don't know" and "I don't remember."
The A had been going on for around 2 years, maybe a bit longer. He honestly doesn't seem to remember when it began, a fact that boggles my mind but does fit in with a lot of other things. They had worked together for years, as I've mentioned. He always thought she was attractive, but didn't give it much thought.
More tomorrow. Sleep tight everyone.
And BT- we're pretty good now, but it's been a long road.
We argued and he says he doesnt want me or this M anymore. I am tired of this rollercoaster. I am tired of him putting himself/whatever in front of us. I am tired of being made the scapegoat for his issues. I am tired of this man and his moods and his issues. He doesnt want to even help himself; he just wants to wallow.
I am tired and I think I am done. I have been advised by an elder in the community, is this is what I realy want, then to initiate the D proceedings.But if its him that wants a D, then he shoudl do it.(this is for the religious M, not the legal one).Its a bit of a long process.
I want to clobber him hard. I want to run away.
I want to go back to where we were 2 months ago.
I put everyone in front of me. To the point where I didn't evern really matter to myself. That is not love, I know now, but a kind of slavery and one that causes an enormous amount of resentment in a person.
Yet strangely, before DDay, like most others here I DID like myself. I thought I was alright. I donít have a malicious or lying bone in my body and I thought my rule of ďdo as you would be done byĒ would hold me in good stead. And he saw that trait as something to be resented. Like BT said, it was something he just paid lip service to b/c he WAS just out for himself. And I donít see how that can change.
A WS may still have a certain fondness for their spouse while betraying them completely, but not love, at least not by my definition.
HE spoke her twice and refuses to tell me what they spoke about.Says its none of my business.
In what way? Did you read the thread in general about speaking your own truth?
Anyway, we went home. I was in a state of complete shock, but like all of us, I existed. Got the kids back to school and kind of drifted through life. I got further behind on work--my concentration span was somewhere under 3 seconds--lost weight, couldn't think about anything else, etc. I went for STD testing. H insisted on coming with me and said that hearing me tell someone else the story penetrated another layer of his self-defenses.
He was relieved the A was over--he'd been trying to get himself to put a stop to it pretty much since it had started. The big move was partly intended to be a clean break, but he must have known right away that it was going to continue on the monthly trips back. I was too stunned to be very angry at first, but this was one thing that pissed me off: I had had to end his affair for him. He couldn't even be man enough to do it himself.
The story of the A was basically that they had worked together all these years, nothing inappropriate. Then one day he went out to for a quick lunch and ended up grabbing a sandwich and taking it to the park near the office. She was doing the same, they sat together for 15 minutes, ate their sandwiches, went back to the office, end of story. Except that he never mentioned it to me.
They "ran into each other" a few more times over the next few weeks (again, he never mentioned it to me) and then it became a regular thing for them to have lunch a few times a week. Early on in the lunches she started talking about sex. An aside: who the fuck does that? Talks about sex with their boss? And on the slip side, what the hell kind of person talks about sex with a very subordinate employee????
The gist of the sex conversation was that she was very "European" in her attitude. She's a few years older than we are, and as I've mentioned, was on her 4th marriage. We'd both heard for years how unhappy the marriage is. The usual- he's controlling, he's older, etc. He's also quite wealthy. She always told us that she came from enormous background wealth (a story I'd been telling my H from day 1 was seriously suspect) and liked to imply that she lived sort of a fast jet-set life style.
Part of this, she told him, was that she liked to go to very high class orgies as a "voyeur." I mean, WTF is a high class orgy? I'd think the very nature of the even pretty much rules that out. Anyway, he was intrigued. She told him all about it and offered to take him. He got more and more intrigued. They spent more and more lunches discussing it. One day on the way back to the office, he says that he said, "I find you very attractive."
She didn't say anything for a few minutes and then said, "if we're going to do this, it's just sex, no falling in love. You book the hotel."
We have only joint credit cards and he's way too much of a straight shooter to shack up on the corporate Amex (oh the irony), so he booked a cash-only fleabag a few blocks from the office.
He found her attractive enough, but wasn't really dying to have an A with her. As I've mentioned numerous times, there is something repellant about her. I don't know that she really has histrionic personality disorder, but she has a lot of those kinds of traits. But he wanted to get to check out the orgy, and he understood that this was the first step.
He said that even as he was walking to the hotel, he wasn't sure he was going to go through with it. He got there and freaked out, but she got the job done. Afterwards, he left, telling her and himself that he was never going to do that again. Spent the night lying awake, thinking about confessing, but decided it was over and to put it behind him.